The rankings (from best to worst) of the 118 VFL/AFL premiership sides.

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The Dice Man said:
In my memory hawthorn of 88-89 wipe anything I've seen since. But they regularly smashed us tigers back then.
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Exactly, in one stat dan says essendon 2000 had a better percentage against other finalists. He didnt expand on that but a final eight is half the competition, whereas not long a go a final four was only a third of the competition. Its an inbuilt bias
 
Pessimistic said:
Exactly, in one stat dan says essendon 2000 had a better percentage against other finalists. He didnt expand on that but a final eight is half the competition, whereas not long a go a final four was only a third of the competition. Its an inbuilt bias
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So expand to games against six and seven for the Hawks, or don't include seven and eight for Essendon in the mentioned stat.
 
I'm going to do something which has surprised even myself. I'm going to go into bat for Collingwood.

The 1958 premiership. Melbourne finished three games clear on top and were clearly the best team once again, they had also beaten the pies in the 2nd semi by 45 points. Melbourne were expected to overcome them again in the GF and equal their 4 in a row record. I obviously wasn't there but I've spoken to people who were, all demon fans. All of them said that the pies played out of their skins that day to stop us from equalling their record, each one of them gave everything they had to beat a much better team.

I'm not sure if win/loss and percentage record is the best way to judge what is a great team, I'd value the pies effort much higher than what dan has on his list.
 

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Pessimistic said:
And in the defining, you build in the bias. Just look at dan
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Which is why someone impartial should make it so there's no bias.

Here's my criteria:

For qualification:
Only teams that have won multiple premierships in a specific number of years. (Ie Essendon of 99-01 is NOT an era)
Must have either won consecutive premierships (therefore all back to back premiers are "eras") OR must have made it to a gf more often than not during the era.
To define the start of the era, teams need to have qualified for the finals from that year and every year throughout the "era" (for instance hawthorn of 2008-14 is NOT an era as they failed to qualify in 2009)
To define the end of an era a team needs to at least make a preliminary final.
 
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So I guess we can wipe out Richmond 1967-1982, one of the most famous eras of all time given they missed the finals in 1968, 1970, 1976, 1978-79, 1981

1967 - Premiers
1968 - 5th
1969 - Premiers
1970 - 6th
1971 - Preliminary Final
1972 - Runner Up
1973 - Premiers
1974 - Premiers
1975 - Preliminary Final
1976 - 7th
1977 - Semi Final
1978 - 7th
1979 - 8th
1980 - Premiers
1981 - 7th
1982 - Runners Up

To say that the great Tiger era started and finished in 1971 - 1974 is something of an injustice
 
Chopperdave said:
They got spanked in a final and had to use that stupid finals system to win it. That removes them from this discussion.
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Yes, strange finals system where a team who finishes top, loses a final and gets a double chance. Makes their season even greater as they rebounded to win the flag. Every other team in history is removed from this discussion as they were not able to get through a home and away season undefeated.
They were record breakers who still have some feats that have not been beaten. Clearly they are the Greatest Team of all.
First team to remain undefeated through an entire home-and away season (never matched).
First team to score more than 2,000 points in a single season.
First team to have a full-forward scoring more than 100 goals in a single season.
First team to have a player kick 16 goals in a single match.
Lost only 12 quarters for the season.
Gordon Coventry won the Goalkicking award
Albert Collier won the Brownlow
And of course this was the third of 4 premierships in a row.
Had an incredible percentage of 171.7
There were no neutral grounds like today. So to remain undefeated in 1929 Collingwood won away games at Glenferrie Oval, Corio Oval, Arden St, Junction Oval, Windy Hill, Punt Rd Oval, Lake Oval, Brunswick St Oval and MCG. An incredible effort considering the Home Ground advantage these teams had. The greatest team ever.
 
South of the Yarra said:
Yes, strange finals system where a team who finishes top, loses a final and gets a double chance. Makes their season even greater as they rebounded to win the flag. Every other team in history is removed from this discussion as they were not able to get through a home and away season undefeated.
They were record breakers who still have some feats that have not been beaten. Clearly they are the Greatest Team of all.
First team to remain undefeated through an entire home-and away season (never matched).
First team to score more than 2,000 points in a single season.
First team to have a full-forward scoring more than 100 goals in a single season.
First team to have a player kick 16 goals in a single match.
Lost only 12 quarters for the season.
Gordon Coventry won the Goalkicking award
Albert Collier won the Brownlow
And of course this was the third of 4 premierships in a row.
Had an incredible percentage of 171.7
There were no neutral grounds like today. So to remain undefeated in 1929 Collingwood won away games at Glenferrie Oval, Corio Oval, Arden St, Junction Oval, Windy Hill, Punt Rd Oval, Lake Oval, Brunswick St Oval and MCG. An incredible effort considering the Home Ground advantage these teams had. The greatest team ever.
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Smashed in a final.
 

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Lol, this OP is going to die a very bitter man/woman. Build a bridge champ, you won one premiership with a very dominant team. Then when you had a real challenger the next year you guys got bent over by an even greater team.

3 GF's in a row with 16 of the same players (3 of whom were brownlow medalists). It could have been a higher number if it wasn't for injuries. Essendon were our bitch during that time as well, so thank you for pointing out how great the Lions team was in tearing you a new one in the 2001 GF.

Premierships>>>>> premiership
 
South of the Yarra said:
Yes, strange finals system where a team who finishes top, loses a final and gets a double chance. Makes their season even greater as they rebounded to win the flag. Every other team in history is removed from this discussion as they were not able to get through a home and away season undefeated.
They were record breakers who still have some feats that have not been beaten. Clearly they are the Greatest Team of all.
First team to remain undefeated through an entire home-and away season (never matched).
First team to score more than 2,000 points in a single season.
First team to have a full-forward scoring more than 100 goals in a single season.
First team to have a player kick 16 goals in a single match.
Lost only 12 quarters for the season.
Gordon Coventry won the Goalkicking award
Albert Collier won the Brownlow
And of course this was the third of 4 premierships in a row.
Had an incredible percentage of 171.7
There were no neutral grounds like today. So to remain undefeated in 1929 Collingwood won away games at Glenferrie Oval, Corio Oval, Arden St, Junction Oval, Windy Hill, Punt Rd Oval, Lake Oval, Brunswick St Oval and MCG. An incredible effort considering the Home Ground advantage these teams had. The greatest team ever.
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Got smashed in a Final...
 
The annual troll...

Essendon 2000, the best oh please.

While they were good, their competition that year was not. Their performance in 1999 and 2001 in particular puts that claim where it belongs. You can pick any of the Premiers in that list in make them the best ever by concorting a criteria around it.

There are many arguments as to what were the best Premiers or the best GFs, no-one will ever agree but one thing I do know, when you read about this or have discussions among friends, the talk is about some of the Hawthorn wins, Richmond, the Lions three peat etc, Essendon 2000 rarely rates a mention.
 
Ron The Bear said:
Richmond's 1934 side was arguably its greatest and shouldn't be in the bottom half.
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Agreed. One of the greatest teams ever. There 27,28 and 29 runners up teams were also pretty awesome. Love Jack Dyers quote 'Richmomd from 27-29 was littered with champions, stars on every line. God himself could not have put a better team on the field. But he did. Bloody Collingwood. God I hated them but God I respected them.' Makes the Collingwood 27-30 feat even better. Richmond had some of the great teams and players of all time in that era.
 
Lehban said:
How could you get this list is so wrong the 1916 lions was the best flag of all time no won else has ever gone from worst to best in history of the game just suppose melbourne or the saints won the flag next year big footy melt downs just as well they didn't have the internet back then interesting the red black played the demons back in 2000 grand final
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The thread has nothing to do with how the team played the previous year :rolleyes:
 
Ron The Bear said:
Welcome to our comp, n00bs.
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Welcome to the finals...and you only made it because Sydney didn't care at all about the result of that game. Impressive performance you put up in the final as well.

And by the way, it's only because of the non VIC teams the AFL is in such a strong position money wise
 
Lyyynnnchy said:
Welcome to the finals...and you only made it because Sydney didn't care at all about the result of that game. Impressive performance you put up in the final as well.

And by the way, it's only because of the non VIC teams the AFL is in such a strong position money wise
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Getting off track a little. Interested in your thoughts on the merits or otherwise of Richmond's 1934 team...
 
Dan26 said:
Time to see where the latest premiership team fits in to to the list. I use my own knowledge from the time of have spent watching football combined with anecdotal, statistical, and written accounts from the early years to rank the 118 premiership teams. I use relativity, taking into account the standard of the competition at the time, so as to not disadvantage teams from the past who were not competing in a national competition, with the resources and professionalism of modern day clubs.

Hawthorn of 2014, were an even, skilful side able to withstand the loss of players through the season. Similar to the year before, they based their premiership win around precise, skillful football, with multiple players able to kick goals. Over the season, they complied:

- a 20-5 season.
- a percentage from 25 games of over 141.1%
- 3 finals wins by 36, 3 and 63 points
- 2nd on the ladder at end of H&A season
- the number one attack, 6th-best defence.

I have decided to rank them, as the 48th-best premiership side in VFL-AFL history. Not one of the most dominant teams by pure numbers, but a mature, skilful proud team, able to withstand the loss of their best player from the year before. I don't subscribe to the theory that they are a better team without Franklin - no team could be. However a spread of EIGHT players kicking 17 or more goal for the year shows how much goalkicking depth they have. They were a well-coached team, able to structure a gameplan around efficient use of the ball in the attacking half of the ground. Their ability to find loose players inside 50 is a testament to the coaching staff confusing the opposition defence and being able to create and efficient path to goal.

The list is as follows:

1.) Essendon 2000. This team earnt the right to be called the greatest in VFL-AFL history with a 24-1 record, a percentage of 163.9 from 25 games, winning three finals by an equal-record combined 230 points with margins of 125, 45 and 60 and a percentage versus the finalists of 160% - 20% higher than any other team in the modern era has managed. At no stage did they look like losing, with even their one loss being narrow, after having 27 more inside 50's, with the Bulldogs having to tactically change the way the sport was played. The Essendon team of 2000 did everything that you could ask, in order for them to be called the best ever. As close to being unbeatable as a team has ever been in VFL-AFL history, with the closest challenge being.....

2.) Collingwood 1929. This team went 19-1 over 20 matches with a percentage of 159.5. They had champions on every line, and were regarded as the greatest combination to have played to that point. The ONLY team to ever be unbeaten in the H&A season. Collingwood fans may label them the best ever VFL-AFL side – I put them at number 2 out of 118. A 62 point loss to Richmond in the finals costs them the number one position on my list. Gordon Coventry was the first to person to kick 100 goals (124) and the Pies completed the treble with Albert Collier winning the Brownlow.

3.) Melbourne 1956. The Dees were at their zenith this year with an 18-2 record and a percentage of 149.4%. Coached by the VFL-AFL coach of the century, Norm Smith and with champion players such as Barassi, Adams, Cordner and Beckwith leading the way, the 1956 Melbourne side was their best side in the most dominant era by one club in VFL-AFL history. A side that could turn it on at will. Many old-timers suggest this was the type of team who could have gone undefeated if they really wanted to.

4.) Hawthorn 1989. The Hawthorn side of ’89 was their best in one of the most powerful eras in history. The Hawks reached their zenith in ’89. They went 21-3, with a percentage of 149.5, had champions everywhere and at their best, were simply unstoppable. I rate them the 4th best of 118 premierships sides. However, unlike Essendon of 2000, or Collingwood of 1929, they didn’t quite have the aura of being totally invincible. Their loss to the Bears holds them back a spot.

5.) Essendon 1950. Tempted to put them higher, but number 5 is fair enough. Here was a team that was near invincible. Just look at their record: 19-1, with a percentage of 159.2. With Coleman at his peak, Dick Reynolds and Hutchison lurking, this was the best Essendon side in their golden era. At the time, many rated this side alongside the 1929 Magpies team as the best of all time.

6.)Geelong 2007. A fantastically dominant team in '07, winning the Grand Final be a record margin, having a percentage for the year over 160% from 25 games. Only great teams can do that. A team, who used skillful, attacking "corridor" midfield play, complimented with a group of players in the mid 20's who have played over 100 games giving them the perfect mix of youth and experience. 21-4, a percentage over 160% and three finals wins by a total of 230 points.

7.) Geelong 2011 A dominant team who didn't have any flat-spots finishing 22-3 with a percentage of 157%. The second oldest premiership side in history meant a wealth of mature bodies and experience. 3 easy finals wins, and a tough defence. More of a long kicking game plan with a defensive edge to it than the flags sides of 2007 and 2009, but perhaps a little less dominant overall than the 2007 side which is ranked one spot higher

8.) Carlton 1908. Carlton’s first golden era produced three great sides, the best of which was the 1908 side. Jack Worrall became the first ever coach, and propelled the Blues to 19-1, with a percentage of 173.7%. Old timers still hold this side as the greatest, and if modern coaching techniques were applied, no doubt they would still be hard to beat in the present day.

9.) Melbourne 1955. Marginally behind the 1956 side, this Melbourne side went 17-3 with a percentage of 150.3%, and showed the makings of a team that would continue to dominate for years to come. The 1955 Melbourne side was heralded as one of the all time greats. A great even spread of talent with no reliance on individuals - a hallmark of the Melbourne teams of this era

10.) Hawthorn 1988. Only behind their ‘89 team due to their inferior defence which conceded 200 points more than the ’89 model. This great team was ruthless, skilled and efficient, and amassed a 21-3 record. Many believe they peaked in ’88, but I believe the Hawks reached their absolute zenith in 1989. Deserve their ranking as the 9th best out of 118.

11.) Collingwood 1927. After losing the Grand Final in 1925 and 1926, this side was ready to peak. They amassed a 17-3 record, with many superstars, proving they could be a champion team and a team of champions. With Coventry kicking 97 goals, and his brother winning the Brownlow, the 1927 side featured the Magpies greats close to their best.

12.) Geelong 1952. Although other teams have amassed superior records, this Geelong side was still one of the greatest in history. They won the premiership in the middle of an unbeaten run that would stretch to 26 consecutive games into the following season, and their attacking, free-flowing style of play became a Geelong tradition. Their 18-2-1 record (140.2%) was a testament to their greatness. Geelong’s best ever side until 2007.

13.) Carlton 1995. This great side had it all - experience, hardness, skill, and a willingness to win. Amassing a 23-2 record with a percentage of 140.6% they played with a professionalism that no club had previously matched. Incredibly, did not lose to a finalist all year. They didn’t quite have the same aura of invincibility as some of the sides in the top 10, but their almost unbeatable record alone ensures them a high ranking.

14.) Carlton 1979. With a 21-3 record and a percentage of 138.9%, and three narrow, spaced losses, this team didn’t have any obvious weaknesses. They nearly blew it in the Grand Final, but their performances through the year were worthy of one of the all time great sides. A rampant mosquito fleet, with a bevy of big name stars all over the field.

15.) Essendon 1985. Sheedy's team peaked to such an extent that they blew away the opposition with a 21-3 record, and were hailed as one of the grea sides of all time. With no apparent weaknesses, a top ruckman, onballers, options everywhere in attack, and a solid defence, this side ranks as one of the greats. Their three losses were all substantial which takes a little away from them, but I still rate them at number 15 out of 118.

16.) Collingwood 1928 Slightly behind their 1929, and 1927 sides the '28 side was one of the greats but perhaps not that far ahead of the other contenders that year. Finished with a 17-3-1 record, and a percentage of 132.5%. Right smack-bang in the middle of the Magpies most famous era. Won the Grand Final by 33 points. Gordon Coventry kicked 89 goals.

17.) Melbourne 1960 This Melbourne side amassed a 16-4 record but with the players at their disposal, that record arguably didn’t do them justice. This was a side that could have easily gone through the season losing only one or two games. In their 7th consecutive Grand Final, they kept Collingwood to only 2.2.14.

18.) Essendon 1911 Under the guidance of the first super-coach, Jack Worrall, who previously led the Blues to three consecutive premierships, the Same Old's as they were known at the time amassed a 17-2-1 record with a percentage (including finals) of 173.3%! The two losses were by 3 and 8 points. Unlucky not to be higher.

19.) Melbourne 1959 Another Demons super-side from their golden era. Not talked about in the same breath as 1955, 56, but this side, along with 1960, were at roughly the same level. The team has a 15-4-1 record from 20 games, winning two finals by 44 and 37 points

20.) Carlton 1907 A great side that would become even better one year later. This side topped the ladder with a percentage of 155.7%. Coached by the first VFL coach, the great Jack Worrall, the Carlton 2007 side was one of the greats.

21.) Hawthorn 1986 Just when it seemed the era was coming to and end in 1985, the experienced ruthless Hawks bounced back in 1986 to finish minor-premiers with 18 wins, and crushed Carlton by 42 points in the Grand Final. The difference between a young Jason Dunstall kicking 77 goals from 22 games in 1986, compared to his 132 in 1988 and 138 in 1989, is essentially the difference between the rankings of where those teams sit compared to this one.
________________________________________________________
22. Essendon 1962
23. Geelong 1937
24. Fitzroy 1913
25. Fitzroy 1899
26. South Melbourne 1933
27. Collingwood 2010
28. Essendon 1901
29. Geelong 1925
30. Port Adelaide 2004
31. West Coast 1992
32. Richmond 1974
33. Brisbane 2002
34. Fitzroy 1898
35. Carlton 1906
36. Collingwood 1902
37. South Melbourne 1909
38. South Melbourne 1918
39. Essendon 1984
40. Richmond 1967
41. West Coast 1994
42. North Melbourne 1996
43. Hawthorn 2013
44. Geelong 2009
45. Hawthorn 1971
46. Richmond 1932
47. Collingwood 1930
48. Hawthorn 2014
49. Melbourne 1957
50. Melbourne 1964
51. Essendon 1946
52. Geelong 1951
53. Collingwood 1936
54. Geelong 1931
55. Collingwood 1903
56. Carlton 1914
57. Collingwood 1919
58. Carlton 1915
59. Hawthorn 2008
60. Brisbane 2001
61. Richmond 1980
62. Carlton 1981
63. Carlton 1972
64. Essendon 1949
65. Carlton 1982
66. Geelong 1963
67. Hawthorn 1961
68. Hawthorn 1983
69. Carlton 1987
70. Richmond 1934
71. Brisbane 2003
72. Richmond 1969
73. Melbourne 1939
74. St.Kilda 1966
75. Collingwood 1953
76. Carlton 1968
77. Hawthorn 1991
78. Sydney 2012
79. Carlton 1947
80. Richmond 1920
81. Essendon 1923
82. Essendon 1942
83. Melbourne 1926
84. Richmond 1973
85. Essendon 1965
86. West Coast 2006
87. Melbourne 1941
88. Fitzroy 1905
89. Fitzroy 1944
90. Carlton 1970
91. Carlton 1938
92. Richmond 1943
93. Collingwood 1935
94. Collingwood 1990
95. Collingwood 1958
96. Essendon 1924
97. Melbourne 1940
98. Hawthorn 1978
99. North Melbourne 1975
100. Hawthorn 1976
101. North Melbourne 1977
102. Essendon 1993
103. Collingwood 1910
104. Essendon 1897
105. Adelaide 1998
106. Fitzroy 1904
107. Fitzroy 1922
108. Adelaide 1997 (like any flag side they were good, but there were many better)
109. Sydney 2005 (workmanlike, needed everything to go right)
110. Essendon 1912 (stole it off South Melbourne)
111. Melbourne 1948 (stole if off Essendon)
112. Carlton 1945 (percentage of only 106% and came from 4th, as war ended.)
113. Footscray 1954 (a modest win-loss record in a very even year)
114. Kangaroos 1999 (Worst defence of the top-10 teams. Percentage of 115%)
115. Richmond 1921 (stole it off Carlton)
116. Collingwood 1917 (war years)
117. Melbourne 1900 (came from 6th and helped by finals system)
118. Fitzroy 1916 (war years. Won wooden spoon and flag)
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Who would have ever thought an Essendon supporter ranking his side as the greatest of all time... Give me a break
 
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