Analysis The Rookies

[Buscemi]

So, what do you think? Who do you like? Who don't you like? Who should we keep? Why?

Me first.

Darren Minchington - Faces a stern test this week against the big, experienced bodies of Port.Melbourne. Has improved each year he has been on the list. Still only 20. Now plays exclusively on the ball, but can go forward. Fast, strongly built with a piercing accurate kick, i've seen enough of "minch" to think he should be upgraded.


Eli Templeton - The best of the lot. Think he should be upgraded. Clear the rookie list and start again.
Our list is not that good where a player of his talent should remain on the rookie list. Could play 15+ games next year.


Mav Wellar - I'm not as enamoured with Wellar as some on here are. I can understand the need to upgrade him because of the retirements of Hayes and to a lesser degree Jones. Adds a strong body to a brittle midfield, but i think he is a average footballer. Kicking is ordinary, but he's decent enough in close. The kind of guy who may play a bit in the next few years, but i don't see him being a long term player. May have value as a tagger. Upgrade.......just.


Cameron Shenton - De-List. Poor defensive skills, one-dimensional, little improvement in him. Sure his a goer, provides a bit of dash etc, but could you really see "Shents" playing in a top 4 team?


So that's 3 upgraded, 1 delisting. Obviously it depends on draft picks, trades etc, but we could trade Milera for Port's last pick to use on another rookie upgrade?

 

[L_W_P]

Id upgrade Mav and Minch, thank Shenton for the effort and give Eli one more year there just for list purposes.

Going to be very frustrating if Minch is let go after everything he has shown.

 

[Rors]

Upgrade Mav & Minch.... Leave Eli as a rookie for 1 more year, as no doubt we'll get another LTI or even if we don't, he can get upgraded for free mid-2015

Minch has really only played for 2 seasons due to his hip injury in 2012 derailing almost the whole season. He just started to really come into his own in the latter half of the VFL season. And considering he's still only 20 (turns 21 in Dec), he's very young & as a lot of upside IMO

 

[felsty]

Gotta leave Eli on there. Just saying that he is the best of the lot won't cut it in my opinion, it's gotta be a strategic decision based on how we want to form the list over the next 3-4 years.

We have seen him play, what, 7 games? He was good but I think for our sake and his, he is better off staying on the rookie list and setting himself a platform to build from in the VFL at the start of next year.

Mav should probably be upgraded, he has definitely shown enough, and I think Schneider will be shown the door to make way for Eli, Minch, Saad forward line.

Also Shenton to be delisted for the above reasons.

 

[sverik25]

I agree with the OP. I'd be disappointed if Minch didn't get a proper go at AFL level before being let go. I think he has shown he could be a useful player and is still young.

I think the limits of Shenton's game were shown up this year. Yes he provides run and dash, but he is poor defensively and he is 25 and I don't think there will be much improvement in his game.

Weller has proven he is capable of that tagging role and Eli looks to be a classy forward mid type. But at the moment there might only be room to upgrade one and I'm confident the club will do the right thing by these two.

 

[Half Back Pocket]

Minchi will be snapped up by another team very quickly if we delist him.

Shents was very, very poor yesterday. His vision is poor. Yes he takes the game on and runs hard, but we need a Grant Birchall type IMO. Someone who takes the game on, runs hard, is an excellent kick & decision maker.

We've been saying it all year. Seany, Fish, Luke, Wright, Gilbert, Bruce all average kicks. Robbo, Gwilt ok. Newnes is good. Web is very good.

We need elite kicking and decision making down back. Shents doesn't fit the brief.

 

[Jack Stevens]

I'll be completely on my own here, but I always see Minch as just missing that something to make it at AFL level. I don't think he's as creative as he's given credit here for, but I grew up watching Milne play so maybe I'm just being spoilt. I wouldn't upgrade him.

I see Panther as good depth. He's pretty much a big CJ with the way he attacks the contest, and I reckon is pretty versatile. I'd keep him on.

Mav is best 22, and needs to be upgraded. He's easily earnt the right.

I'd keep Eli on the rookie list for another year, though. The games that he played this year were a great bonus, but it was a nasty injury he got and it'd be good to let him settle into some VFL form. He'll still get his chances.

So, for mine, upgrade Panther and Mav, retain Eli, delist Minch.

We go into the rookie draft with 3 live picks.
Pick 1 - draft slider
Pick 2 - Ahmed Saad
Pick 3 - a project player? a state-league KPP?

 

[VDS66]

People have been easily seduced by Eli IMO.

That said, he will probably get upgraded and only kept back for strategic reasons.

With Saad, it's black or white for me... they either think he is a senior player or not. No point putting him on the rookie list and i doubt he wants to. Saad will want to play seniors footy. Not fair on the lad to rookie him.

No point rookie listing him either IMO.

 

[stkildathunda]

People have been easily seduced by Eli IMO.

+1 the hype was incredible compared to his actual performances.

 

[Half Back Pocket]

I'll be completely on my own here, but I always see Minch as just missing that something to make it at AFL level. I don't think he's as creative as he's given credit here for, but I grew up watching Milne play so maybe I'm just being spoilt. I wouldn't upgrade him.

Minchi is nothing like Milne. Granted, at AFL level he has played predominantly Forward Pocket, but going forward he will be a good-very good Rover. Penetrating kick & skilled off both feet.

 

[Half Back Pocket]

+1 the hype was incredible compared to his actual performances.

You've seen a lot of them ST...would you upgrade Minchi? Shents?

 

[VDS66]

+1 the hype was incredible compared to his actual performances.

whilst having no idea how the club rate Eli, I am more old school and prefer elevations to come via merit like TC and MW have done. For example, If Minch is worthy and done the hard yards for 3 years, then surely he should get the nod over Eli.

 

[stkildathunda]

whilst having no idea how the club rate Eli, I am more old school and prefer elevations to come via merit like TC and MW have done. For example, If Minch is worthy and done the hard yards for 3 years, then surely he should get the nod over Eli.

Totally agree with you mate. No harm in keeping Eli on rookie list for another year. IT was pretty serious injury he sustained at end of day, let him earn it. Will make him better footballer long term.

 

[stkildathunda]

You've seen a lot of them ST...would you upgrade Minchi? Shents?

I'm still not sold on Minchi to be honest. If we could i'd rookie list him again, not sure he's done enough to warrant place on senior list with all high picks we will be getting. Shenton I think has earnt upgrade though. Not sure you want to be upgrading 3 or 4 rookies at once.

 

[Hayes4PM]

Mav and Eli must be certain to be upgraded. I would also upgrade Minchi but he would be a tough decision, but Shenton I would let go. That frees our rookie list up and gives our pick 1 in the rookie draft some very decent value and let's us have a look at a few early 20's aged players in the VFL (Beasley maybe) to fill a crucial age bracket of our list.

 

[hayes]

We'd be mad to upgrade three rookies given where we're at IMO. That's not what will get us to a flag, need to have as much room for draft picks as possible. I'd only upgrade the guys we have to like Minch if we want to keep him.

I'm with the OP on Mav, just not as high on him as others are.

Eli only played 5 games so won't get too carried away with him yet.

Shenton.... Would be a good depth player if we were playing finals but we're a bit off that. Could go either way on him.

 

[VDS66]

Have to admit that I feel very uneasy having a list stocked with players who have come from the rookie list.

 

[Buscemi]

+1 the hype was incredible compared to his actual performances.

I agree with this, but if we trade out a guy like Milera or Jones for a pick in the 80's, i would use that to elevate Eli. Would not use a pick in the 40's or 50's.

With Minchington, i would be happy to keep him on the rookie list but he has to be elevated or delisted so in my opinion he has shown enough to be elevated.

 

[Strahany]

Pending what picks we have, who we select, and any trades we make, it's difficult to suggest what direction to go in.

Assuming the list balance remains more or less as it is at the moment, I would suggest the following:

• Upgrade Weller - Losing Hayes and Jones makes this almost a necessity (unless we bring in other big bodied midfielders, which I doubt, given our long term ambitions).
• Leave Eli on the rookie list - There's no real need to upgrade him from day dot. Let him ease into the season and have him as first in line for any LTI or the mid-season upgrade (unless someone like Holmes needs to be upgraded for a Hickey/Longer LTI). Would rather have a main list position open for a PSD pick up, lest we risk missing out on someone as we wait for them to slide to the rookie draft.
• Upgrade Minchington - but only if his performances are as good as they are said to be by some VFL watchers. He doesn't seem like a world-beater, but having a "bottom tier" midfielder that can hit targets is necessary for a competitive team. Otherwise, de-list/re-rookie (if possible).
• Release Shenton - we need to spend time in these formative years of our list to build what we need to win premierships. Unfortunately, Shenton is lacking in key areas (namely disposal quality) that we need from even our worst players (as I mentioned with Minchington). I view Shenton as the type of player that we could acceptably have as a stop-gap if we were already competing. However, we've got complete flexibility in our list and the chance to build it as perfectly as possible, hence I cannot justify retaining Cam.

 

[Jack Stevens]

Minchi is nothing like Milne. Granted, at AFL level he has played predominantly Forward Pocket, but going forward he will be a good-very good Rover. Penetrating kick & skilled off both feet.

I agree that he's nothing like Milne, but I can't see him making it without him being able to be damaging in the forward line.

 

[Half Back Pocket]

Have to admit that I feel very uneasy having a list stocked with players who have come from the rookie list.

If we cut:

Hayes, Maister, Gwilt, Jones, TDL, Dunell, Schnides, Milera...and complete a trade or 2 (player & pick for Higher Pick for eg), could be 10 spots to fill. We might have to upgrade 3.

The draft doesnt run that deep!!

5 draftees
3 rookies
2 PSD's

 

[Stan_Darsh72]

Weller and Minch to be Upgraded.

 

[12Chill]

Cam Shenton -
Think we could trade/delist. Wouldn't get much for him but at his age he probably has very little improvement left. Ok player but if we kept him he would be more for depth.

Darren Minchington -
Would like to see him promoted, he's got elite kicking skills and a good size about him for a shortish guy. Could become a very good player and he's still young.

Eli Templeton -
Would like to see him promoted, will be a great player but we might need to keep him as a rookie for 1 more year, no doubt if next year is anything like this year we'll have injuries and he'll come straight back in anyway.

Mav Weller -
Definitely promote, need some big bodies and has shown he is a great tagger, liking his chances to become a good midfielder in his own right.

 

[Axcellence]

I thought Eli and Minch have the biggest upside.


Eli didn't have 30 possession games but he pressured hard and stayed in the contest in the front half which is hard to do. Quality over quantity for him.

 

[Periphery]

We'd be mad to upgrade three rookies given where we're at IMO. That's not what will get us to a flag, need to have as much room for draft picks as possible. I'd only upgrade the guys we have to like Minch if we want to keep him.

Ignoring the fact that there are plenty of seriously good players that have come off rookie lists:

Assuming Dunnell and TDL go we already have 7 empty spots on the list. Even if we upgrade 3 rookies we will be able to use our first 4 picks. You have to have picks worth using. There is no point using our 5th round pick on someone that is a worse prospect than one of our rookies.

Upgrading rookies wont stop us from getting talent into the club, not having enough good draft picks will.