Coronavirus 2020 / Worldwide (Stats live update in OP) Part 7: This Thread is for Reasonable ON TOPIC Discussion

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In the peak fortnight of the outbreak to date (25 August to 7 September), the COVID-19 case rate among 2-dose vaccinated people was 49.5 per 100,000 while in unvaccinated people it was 561 per 100,000, a more than 10-fold difference. The rates of COVID-19 ICU admissions or deaths peaked in the fortnight 8 September to 21 September at 0.9 per 100,000 in 2-dose vaccinated people compared to 15.6 per 100,000 in unvaccinated people, a greater than 16-fold difference.
 
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Zidane98 said:
You should start up a career in strawman arguments, you really are a specialist at it. I've stated many times there are other ways getting your point across that don't breach our bullshit lockdown laws which the rest of us follow at a great cost to us all.

Anyone who isn't within a 5km radius of their home for a valid reason absolutely should be dealt with by Police.


There's nothing stopping all of these clowns gathering within 5km of their house and walking the streets protesting while following the rules the rest of us are forced to abide by, exercise, 2 hours etc etc.


Start petitions, get involved in politics. All measures that can be used to get your word across.


Suggesting protestors should be allowed to simply ignore all the lockdown laws is stupidity of the highest order. If you're going to allow protestors to ignore that stuff then cancel the lockdown.
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So you've no issue with the protest, just the breach of the public health orders then?
 
owen87 said:
So you've no issue with the protest, just the breach of the public health orders then?
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Yep. Go ahead with the protest if you can do it within the lockdown laws. The suggestion that protestors should be exempt is madness.
 

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Zidane98 said:
Yep. Go ahead with the protest if you can do it within the lockdown laws. The suggestion that protestors should be exempt is madness.
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But isnt the notion of protesting anti lockdown and masks and vax against public health orders ?
 
Zidane98 said:
if they can't follow the rules all the rest of us are being forced to then they can gagf.


Plus there are plenty of other ways to make your point without breaching lockdown laws.
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So im actually in agreement with the no protest rules (the PT cancellation and police barricading is excessive and pretty ugly) but im curious.

Given we cant go anywhere or gather in any sort of group what are the plenty of other ways to make a point? Do a change.org thing that no one will read?
 
phantom13 said:
So im actually in agreement with the no protest rules (the PT cancellation and police barricading is excessive and pretty ugly) but im curious.

Given we cant go anywhere or gather in any sort of group what are the plenty of other ways to make a point? Do a change.org thing that no one will read?
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Widespread local park socially distanced exercise carrying a protest sign within 5km of home at a coordinated time?

If you genuinely wanted to protest and weren't using it as a vehicle to be a douchebag and break restrictions that you believe don't apply to you and shout at cops, that would probably send a message of some sort.
 
phantom13 said:
So im actually in agreement with the no protest rules (the PT cancellation and police barricading is excessive and pretty ugly) but im curious.

Given we cant go anywhere or gather in any sort of group what are the plenty of other ways to make a point? Do a change.org thing that no one will read?
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Get involved in government. Petitions. Get involved with a media organisation who ask the tough questions. Social media is pretty powerful these days.


Individuals can protest within 5kms of their house while exercising, maybe focus on doing that.
 

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Zidane98 said:
Get involved in government. Petitions. Get involved with a media organisation who ask the tough questions. Social media is pretty powerful these days.


Individuals can protest within 5kms of their house while exercising, maybe focus on doing that.
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Get involved in government... Get involved in media...

You hear yourself yeh?
 
phantom13 said:
In this instance? That those are ridiculous suggestions.

Again, fu** the protesters ive got no time for them or their protest but youre saying there are plenty of other options for them to make their point and there really aren't.
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It's a bizarre point you are making. I think the current lockdown laws are bs but I have no interest in protesting them. You asked ways for someone who wants to protest, I suggested ways to make your point heard. If someone really is interested in making a change they will do whatever it takes. Simply turning up in a gathering, shouting at police while flouting laws everyone else abides by is certainly not the way to get your point across.

It's ridiculous to suggest the only way they can get their point across is by protesting.
 
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So you can disagree with the protests that are planned for this weekend without being against the right to protest.

The answer is never let the cops do what they want though

I'd honestly rather they put out a warning to people that this event was happening and to avoid the CBD if there were able but still let the PT run as its going to stop people going to work that we kind of need to have go to work or go get vaccinated etc

I'm not cool with how normalised police violence against protestors is becoming in Melbourne, like I said they won't stop with just the anti lockdown protestors it's going to mean the next time there is a legal protest that the cops don't like, you know like over deaths in custody that we will see more of this.

Like in Sydney last year where they pepper sprayed the crowds trying to get onto trains to go home after the BLM march.
 
Zidane98 said:
It's a bizarre point you are making. I think the current lockdown laws are bs but I have no interest in protesting them. You asked ways for someone who wants to protest, I suggested ways to make your point heard. If someone really is interested in making a change they will do whatever it takes. Simply turning up in a gathering, shouting at police while flouting laws everyone else abides by is certainly not the way to get your point across.

It's ridiculous to suggest the only way they can get their point across is by protesting.
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Im not saying its the only way but i cant think of another.

You said there were plenty and when asked suggested going into politics or going into the media. Like those are things you could just snap your fingers and do.

The social media suggestion is probably fair and frankly i think the lack of engagement they are getting is evidence that its not something heavily supported enough to warrant any real change but "just go be premier" or "just get into the media" are just ludicorus suggestions.
 
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Zidane98 said:
How exactly do you equate my post with loving cops? I'm against dumb protestors and against allowing them to do what they want when we can't do anything. It would be better off if the cops didn't have to be involved.

Might as well cancel the lockdown if we let protestors do as they please per your suggestion. I'm all for that.
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Your answer to anything you see as rule breaking is more cops

Cops should deal with the protestors, they should enforce compliance in the Western Suburbs, anyone breaking the rules should deal with the long hand of the law etc

You then call Dan a Dictator in the same post, so which is it? Is he a Dictator using the cops to enforce unfair rules on everyone, or is it ok for the cops to be used to enforce the rules just as long as its not on you?
 
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Zidane98 said:
EFA
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Radical idea I know, but stick with it for a minute.

Do you think that maybe we've had less cases in the Yarra Ranges than Geelong because of the restrictions that were in place?
 
phantom13 said:
In this instance? That those are ridiculous suggestions.

Again, fu** the protesters ive got no time for them or their protest but youre saying there are plenty of other options for them to make their point and there really aren't.
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Do they need to make their point?

There's nothing that they're trying to say or present that we don't already bloody know.
 
Follow the laws of the land and don't let your own actions knowingly be to the detriment of someone else in the community.

Do those two things and we should all get along famously.

Protesting in this climate should be strongly discouraged for the second reason (in that it would promote further spread of the virus)....it will be a real issue going forward if the inability to voice a view through peaceful protest is based upon it being unlawful.
 
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