Selectors

[Baz_hawk]

I'm not one to critise my own team, but i must say that the selectors have been poor with some of the decisions. Stokes should not have been in our side tonight, he pop up twice or so for the entire game and couldnt hold a tackle or cleanly dispose of the ball, he was probably in their for the run on the bigger ground and he proved that he isnt up to AFL standard. Murphy, who we all criticise, wasn't the worst of the bunch today but he has a long way to go to be AFL worthy. Dowler should be put into the side as he has shown promise and has been exceptional in the VFL. Taylor was really poor tonight, I don't mind him pushing the new junior players around (Mop head) but you have to actually do something on the field other than that. I'm not too sure on a few other players, Shoenmakers wasn't overly impressive but he is a new kid so it's understandable.

Anyway, this season is drifting away, I haven't lost faith but if we don't change our play we will be no chance come September. Over possessive, selling team mates into trouble and making stupid handballs which lead to turnovers is what we have been this year. Tonight's efforts were disgraceful

 

[grizzlym]

I've raised my eyebrows a few times over recent selections. I think we've got it wrong a number of times, tonight is a case in point I think.

What really stood out for me tonight is our badly we're delivering the ball into the forward line and how predictable our forward set up looks. Tactically we look bereft up there.

 

[Brown Blood]

I don't know about dowler being exceptional but I can't see how he didn't get in before shoey tonight - especially seeing gilham pulled out.

Stokes is also an interesting move - must have photos seeing he has done nothin this year.

 

[Bennycoff]

Schoey shouldn't play again this season, is way too slow. Bring in Dowler.

Stokes is so bad.

 

[SHAKESPEARE]

I think it is time that Morton, Kennedy, Tuck, Dowler and Shiels are given an extended run to see where they are at for next year.

I also believe that the selectors shouldn't treat us as idiots, with their constant selection of Gilham, only for him not to end up playing.

 

[randall boner]

for CHRIST SAKE drop murphy thats a 5 goal saving already

 

[Lethal44]

Were was Kennedy, he was named first emergency, was he even on the plane, can someone tell me how Stokes warranted a game ahead of him and how the conditions would have suited him better. And what of Schoenmakers, Clarko must really like this boy, because how he's getting a game ahead of Dowler is beyond me.

 

[oogac]

Schoemakers???????

I keep asking myself is this kid Clarksons Little Pet?
Why does he continually get a game?
Why do the selectors keep persevering with him?

Nothing against the kid, but he is not ready for senior football and that is so obvious. He continually gets caught, has terrible disposal and cant chase and tackle. Always looks like a fish out of water.

In time too come im sure he will be a great asset to the club but he needs time with Boxhill. And a quite a bit of time there. Dowler should be selected before him.

 

[mustardnugget]

Anyway, this season is drifting away, I haven't lost faith but if we don't change our play we will be no chance come September. Over possessive, selling team mates into trouble and making stupid handballs which lead to turnovers is what we have been this year. Tonight's efforts were disgraceful

I can't believe this is still going on???!!!

Been watching these handball sequences all year which go something like... Handball to teammate, handball to teammate under pressure, handball to teammate under more pressure, rinse and repeat until you get NAILED.

How the f**k has this not been "addressed" out of existence by now???

I'm just getting f**king sick & tired now of the same mistakes being made game after game.

 

[Dannerz]

Been watching these handball sequences all year which go something like... Handball to teammate, handball to teammate under pressure, handball to teammate under more pressure, rinse and repeat until you get NAILED.

This has been my biggest issue with the way we have played all year. And it doesn't seem like anything has been said or done to rectify the situation.

 

[Hawthorn4ever]

Selectors have their PETs and projects. Like any organisations. they defy the obvious in trying to prove themselves. Murphy is obviously one of the PETs ie. not AFL standard but the selectors love him.

For supporters this is riduculous.

 

[Manbearpigisreal]

Can't agree more with you all, Shoenmakers out, Stokes out, Murphy out, Taylor out.

This constant handball, handball, handball, turnover, goal is so disapointing and frustrating to watch as a Hawk supporter. Can someone tell me why we have stopped running the ball forward and breaking the lines like we did so well and so successfully last year? We have the 2 best forwards in the league and wether or not Franklin is down he can't do much if the ball isn't delivered in quickly and to his advantage.
Hodge needs to be in our midfield and Browny needs to be down back they are good for us in the there rolls at the moment but we are better served with them in there original and preferred positions. Mitchell and Sewell can't keep doing all the work in the midfield.

Dowler and Kennedy need to be in the side.Simple, they're young talented and damn well deserve a fair go.

Renouf played in a Grand Final because he was playing brilliantly as a support to Campbell, were as Taylor tries and wants to be the number 1 ruckman but simply is not good enough, he worries more about the player than the ball and has a work rate of a sloth. I think the sooner they can get Max BAiley fit and with a few VFL games under his belt he should be in, he'll take his chance, just like Muston did, and he wont look back.

Alistair Clarkson well were do i start, exceptional coach and has done wonders at Hawthorn, but he needs to take a leaf out of Jeff Kennetts book and admit that he has the team playing with a different intent and style and stop using injuries as an excuse, he needs to at least give our supporters and members an honest excuse and stop thinking that everything will just happen coz it's rubbing off on the players and it's losing games of football.

Look at Hodge, Browny, Mitchell, Changa and Sewell very rarely do they get injured because they go at the footy with intent, toughness and a want to win the contest, as for the rest we're seeing them get injured more often simply becuse they hesitate at a contest and worry more about the guy coming the other way.

In my eyes Hawthorn do not like the idea of being the hunted and not the hunters.
Season 2009 all but gone!!! As well as the hope, belief and excitment for what was supposed to be a dynasty!!!

 

[timetochange08]

Can't agree more with you all, Shoenmakers out, Stokes out, Murphy out, Taylor out.

This constant handball, handball, handball, turnover, goal is so disapointing and frustrating to watch as a Hawk supporter. Can someone tell me why we have stopped running the ball forward and breaking the lines like we did so well and so successfully last year? We have the 2 best forwards in the league and wether or not Franklin is down he can't do much if the ball isn't delivered in quickly and to his advantage.
Hodge needs to be in our midfield and Browny needs to be down back they are good for us in the there rolls at the moment but we are better served with them in there original and preferred positions. Mitchell and Sewell can't keep doing all the work in the midfield.

Dowler and Kennedy need to be in the side.Simple, they're young talented and damn well deserve a fair go.

Renouf played in a Grand Final because he was playing brilliantly as a support to Campbell, were as Taylor tries and wants to be the number 1 ruckman but simply is not good enough, he worries more about the player than the ball and has a work rate of a sloth. I think the sooner they can get Max BAiley fit and with a few VFL games under his belt he should be in, he'll take his chance, just like Muston did, and he wont look back.

Alistair Clarkson well were do i start, exceptional coach and has done wonders at Hawthorn, but he needs to take a leaf out of Jeff Kennetts book and admit that he has the team playing with a different intent and style and stop using injuries as an excuse, he needs to at least give our supporters and members an honest excuse and stop thinking that everything will just happen coz it's rubbing off on the players and it's losing games of football.

Look at Hodge, Browny, Mitchell, Changa and Sewell very rarely do they get injured because they go at the footy with intent, toughness and a want to win the contest, as for the rest we're seeing them get injured more often simply becuse they hesitate at a contest and worry more about the guy coming the other way.

In my eyes Hawthorn do not like the idea of being the hunted and not the hunters.
Season 2009 all but gone!!! As well as the hope, belief and excitment for what was supposed to be a dynasty!!!

Incredible post so well said.Why is Renouf not playing? Injury? why is dowler never picked? (mystery) why are certain player s being favoured?
Why are injuries being used as excuses when clarkson's work should be scritinised? All these questions never get answered/

Turn on a match of hawthorn now they are unrecognisable.Its incredibly heartbreaking. Something has to be done.But will it?

 

[PatientHawk]

. Over possessive, selling team mates into trouble and making stupid handballs which lead to turnovers is what we have been this year. Tonight's efforts were disgraceful

I was in years past critical of Bateman bombing the ball down forward (this he has improved on, out of sight), and worst of the lot Vandenburge.
I am sorry if this statement may offend, it is just my opinion.

But the last few time I have watched the Hawks, Sewell has got his way out of trouble in the centre and has banged it as far as he could in our forward 50, and I have been watching and saying...That's how you do it!

The best I have seen us play is when the ball was delivered quickly into our forward 50, and we had Stokes, Rioli, Williams and Osborne crumbing goals....no mater how we got the ball forward, we had crumbers and forward pressure.

It looks like Williams may be out for a while with a knee injury, this may also be an opportunity for us...dam, I forgot Thorp is injured, Moss is injured, I won't mention Boyle, and our lead up forward Dowler is a wingman/backman. F@#k knows.
Our full back to be Listle sounds like he is playing as a forward in the reserves.
I guess when Rioli and Younge gets back, Osborne can fight for Williams spot, along side Moss and Sucko.

Surely all we have to do is change our coaching strategy from the centre, for this to re-happen, as Sewell and Mitchell get plenty of the ball.
This would also get the ball away from our vulnerable end of the ground.

 

[lethalselbow]

Selection has been woeful.

 

[Bosk]

Don't worry guys, we have some really good news for a change!

I heard that Gillham will be listed to play this week!

 

[lethalselbow]

Don't worry guys, we have some really good news for a change!

I heard that Gillham will be listed to play this week!

LOL

Did a guy whisper that to you from a grassy knoll?

 

[Chrissie90]

Can't agree more with you all, Shoenmakers out, Stokes out, Murphy out, Taylor out.

I agree that these guys arent much good. Who should have played?
REnouf for Taylor?
Dowler for Murphy?
Kennedy for Schoey?
Tuck/Shiels for Stokes?

Who is on the selection committee apart from Clarko?

 

[Goldnbrown]

Its easy to sit on your computers and suggest dropping players, but you cant drop a player unless a player in the same position can be picked in his place.

For example to suggest dropping Murphy for Dowler is simply ridiculous, its not going to happen, they play a completely different role, untill Gilham and Croad are back I very much doubt that Murphy will be dropped.

Also whilst I think Renouf has a great future and could well be our 2nd ruckman with Baily in years to come (after RC retirement) right now his ruck work is very ordinay, I forget what round it was, possibly 5, he had 2 hit outs to advantge after quite a few games.

 

[jd1991]

My issue is that the selectors have constantly not picked a structurally aound team.

For a number of games we have had no key position backmen, were either playing Murphy out of position or Robbie Campbell out of position which also lessons our ruck stocks.

I wouldnt be surprised if Murphy confidence is now shot because he keeps playing as a KPP when he wasnt trained or played that position before. For all we know he could be trying to play catch up by bulking up/getting stronger to take on these bigger players and thus he has lossed his mobility to play on the mediums where in the past he has shown something.

Why not take a leaf out of the hated enemy Essendon who are playing 2 19 year olds as there KPP backmen. At least that is depicted as there future positions. We need to bite the bullet and say, Dowler you are CHB of the future so here is game time for you in that role. Sometimes he will get flogged in that position but at least he will learn it. DO the same for Lisle as well. Shoemaker is meant to have some toe so if we play him in the side, play him as FB on certain opponents for short stints, to give him a tatse. If we do that for the last 10 minutes of quarters as the FF is tiring, at least we have some one with pace coming out of the position rather than Robbie Campbell.

It just seems consistantly we are saying we do not need KPP backmen we can get a group of mid size runners togeather to do the job. Which with the breakdown of the cluster has proven to be false.

 

[jd1991]

My issue is that the selectors have constantly not picked a structurally aound team.

For a number of games we have had no key position backmen, were either playing Murphy out of position or Robbie Campbell out of position which also lessons our ruck stocks.

I wouldnt be surprised if Murphy confidence is now shot because he keeps playing as a KPP when he wasnt trained or played that position before. For all we know he could be trying to play catch up by bulking up/getting stronger to take on these bigger players and thus he has lossed his mobility to play on the mediums where in the past he has shown something.

Why not take a leaf out of the hated enemy Essendon who are playing 2 19 year olds as there KPP backmen. At least that is depicted as there future positions. We need to bite the bullet and say, Dowler you are CHB of the future so here is game time for you in that role. Sometimes he will get flogged in that position but at least he will learn it. DO the same for Lisle as well. Shoemaker is meant to have some toe so if we play him in the side, play him as FB on certain opponents for short stints, to give him a tatse. If we do that for the last 10 minutes of quarters as the FF is tiring, at least we have some one with pace coming out of the position rather than Robbie Campbell.

It just seems consistantly we are saying we do not need KPP backmen we can get a group of mid size runners togeather to do the job. Which with the breakdown of the cluster has proven to be false.

 

[MadDawg]

Selection seems to be very ad hoc in its application!

Shoenmakers seems to be given a gig over the likes of Dowler due to his potential whereas Taylor is getting a gig over Renouf due to his experience

 

[play2win]

as far as i can see no posts in this thread have provided any specific times where the selectors have got it wrong. there all just having a whinge and crying in the corner like a sook, that is all you are really doing by criticising after the fact.

if you have a real gripe with selection, state your reasons when the teams are selected, not just when/if the team loses. do you ever give credit to the selectors when the team has a win?

in a perfect world more people would open up their eyes and see the longer term ramifications of some of the selections, and not just have knee jerk reactions when one thing goes wrong (ie. we f**kn lose!).

 

[ACTion Hawks]

as far as i can see no posts in this thread have provided any specific times where the selectors have got it wrong. there all just having a whinge and crying in the corner like a sook, that is all you are really doing by criticising after the fact.

if you have a real gripe with selection, state your reasons when the teams are selected, not just when/if the team loses. do you ever give credit to the selectors when the team has a win?

in a perfect world more people would open up their eyes and see the longer term ramifications of some of the selections, and not just have knee jerk reactions when one thing goes wrong (ie. we f**kn lose!).

Top Post

I remember reading a lot of posts in 2005 and 2006 about our game plan was stuffed, we selected wrong and the selectors/coach have no idea!!! History showed that to be wrong

This year our bottom six in every game has not been as strong as we like (as most players with less than ten games experience are not).

I don't mind constructive criticism and questioning, but don't try and disguise a good whinge as anything but that - a whinge.

 

[DannyJ]

I'm not one to critise my own team, but i must say that the selectors have been poor with some of the decisions. Stokes should not have been in our side tonight, he pop up twice or so for the entire game and couldnt hold a tackle or cleanly dispose of the ball, he was probably in their for the run on the bigger ground and he proved that he isnt up to AFL standard. Murphy, who we all criticise, wasn't the worst of the bunch today but he has a long way to go to be AFL worthy. Dowler should be put into the side as he has shown promise and has been exceptional in the VFL. Taylor was really poor tonight, I don't mind him pushing the new junior players around (Mop head) but you have to actually do something on the field other than that. I'm not too sure on a few other players, Shoenmakers wasn't overly impressive but he is a new kid so it's understandable.

Anyway, this season is drifting away, I haven't lost faith but if we don't change our play we will be no chance come September. Over possessive, selling team mates into trouble and making stupid handballs which lead to turnovers is what we have been this year. Tonight's efforts were disgraceful

Team selection is a worry. Like everyone they have there favouites.

On that list;
Murphy
Stokes
McGlynn
Schoenmakers

No on it;
Dowler
Dowler
Dowler
Dowler