Setting the Bar High

[_RT_]

Been talking about the need for us to start looking towards the kids and having the step up and take the lead in shaping where this club is headed and thought I would throw up what sort of improvement I expect from the kids if the club is to start moving forward.

Thursfield - Came back from a serious knee injury well last year and although he played well needs to be able to stand up each week as a player we know will be very difficult to score on. Think with another preseason under his belt he may well become that type of player.

Deledio - if Wallace is going to persist with him up forward then I expect a return of 40 goals from no less than 20 games. Anything less and it is a waste of time playing him up there. If he moves to the middle then I want an average of 23 possies a week.

Raines - to get back to his 2006 form, while he averaged just under 20 touches a game last year, it means stuff all if most of them end up hurting the team instead of the opposition. Time to pull the finger out.

Polak - yes he was good last year but most of the time it was floating around the backline as a spare man. This year he needs to knuckle down and either take CHB and make it his or become the replacement for Richo up forward we have been searching for, a top 4 KP pick is wasted playing loose when we have others who can do that role.

Riewoldt - minimum return of 10 games and 20 goals. Yes I know KPP take a while to develop but they also should be expected to show something along the way. Not that hard to turn a goal a game average last year into 2 goals a game this year.

Edwards - 16 games in his debut season should be matched or bettered in his follow up season. Get him playing as often as possible because at least the kid showed something last year and should be given every chance to continue on with his development this year.

Polo - 25 games in 2 seasons needs to be up around the 45 mark by seasons end as it will do his development the world of good. The kid knows how to find the footy and knows how to stick to an opponent something we have been lacking for a long time.

McGuane - needs to become a reliable 3rd tall defender, did a couple of jobs last year under huge pressure but if he along with Thursfield and Polak can stand up down back it will go along way to solving one our weaknesses.

Morton - came to the club with heaps of wraps on him and has showed a little bit of that class but needs to knuckle down and repay the faith the club has shown in him, because there are also reports that he just expected to be given games at WCE. A return of 20-25 goals would be a nice return in his first year at the club.

Meyer - another one who needs to get out on the park for a minimum of 10 games and show us something to suggest he is worth keeping around. I know he has injury problems at the moment but once he is right to go get him on the park and leave him there until it is clear that he is no good.

Schulz - another one we have been waiting for and 08 is the time for Schulz to grab his last opportunity or he can be shown the door at seasons end. No more piss farting around if you haven't shown anything by 6 seasons chances are you never will.

Pattison - another 18+ games in the ruck and up forward to continue on the development hs showed last year. The kid might look ungainly but you can never question his determination, I only wish some of our more talented kids had the same.

JON - 7 games in 2 seasons is not great but injuries can explain that, however this preseason there have been reports that he is ready to show his potential, well if thats the case then I expect at least 10 games from him with an average of 12-15 possies. At least then the 'hype' can be somewhat justified.

Tambling - great to see Lids come out and support Richie in the paper, but it is time that Richie repaid the faith, I expect nothing less that 20 games with averages of 18 possies 6 marks 3.5 tackles and 1 goal. Anything less and the talk means nothing. As the players have said they want their actions to do the talking.

Hughes - same boat as Riewoldt 10 games/20 goals is the return I am looking for. Showed on more than one occasion last year he can kick 2-3 goals from CHF, with Richo not getting any younger we need to find kids that we can count on when Richo does pull the pin.

White - this kid needs a big year or I can see him being a prime candidate for the chop come seasons end, if/when he gets a chance needs to make the most of it. Probably battling Hyde for a spot on the list come seasons end.

Casserly - same as White above, if/when he gets a chance needs to grab it with both hands if he wants to still be here come 2009. Has struggled with injury but has seemingly got over that now and featured in a couple of the practice matches, reports are he has the potential to be a good player but if we don't see something this year it may be time to move on.

Connors - played 4 games looked good in a couple of them but really needs to knuckle down and make a spot in the 22 his. I believe he has the potential to make it but does he have the determination to fulfil that potential.

Moore - preseason form seems good and with question marks over McGuanes availability in the early going has the chance to stake a claim as the 3rd tall defender. If not then he could well be another one headed for the chop list.

Foley - can't ask for much more from Foley but the ability to run out games would top him off nicely. Expect him to continue on with his 07 form however he will need help as the opposition will have him targetted each week.

Graham - if Simmonds or Pattison go down the Graham needs to step up and fill the hole. Has the size to be an AFL ruckman, my doubt is whether he has the ability to be one.

King - fiesty little terrier down back and needs to maintain his 07 form as a bloke his size will struggle. Word is he is being looked on as a possible tagger, personally I don't like the idea, leave him down back where he can mind the oppositions small forwards who always seem to play well against us.

 

[Madtiger2006]

I think the first 5 players to be gone will be jon, raines, johnson, silvester and cartledge. It's hard too see anything big coming from any of those 5. I want to see Schultz, Hughes, Meyer, Hyde have a big year in 2008. They must lift because they have been around for a while and shown glimpses of class. I want to see that more often

 

[Bojangles17]

Been talking about the need for us to start looking towards the kids and having the step up and take the lead in shaping where this club is headed and thought I would throw up what sort of improvement I expect from the kids if the club is to start moving forward.

Thursfield - Came back from a serious knee injury well last year and although he played well needs to be able to stand up each week as a player we know will be very difficult to score on. Think with another preseason under his belt he may well become that type of player.

Deledio - if Wallace is going to persist with him up forward then I expect a return of 40 goals from no less than 20 games. Anything less and it is a waste of time playing him up there. If he moves to the middle then I want an average of 23 possies a week.

Raines - to get back to his 2006 form, while he averaged just under 20 touches a game last year, it means stuff all if most of them end up hurting the team instead of the opposition. Time to pull the finger out.

Polak - yes he was good last year but most of the time it was floating around the backline as a spare man. This year he needs to knuckle down and either take CHB and make it his or become the replacement for Richo up forward we have been searching for, a top 4 KP pick is wasted playing loose when we have others who can do that role.

Riewoldt - minimum return of 10 games and 20 goals. Yes I know KPP take a while to develop but they also should be expected to show something along the way. Not that hard to turn a goal a game average last year into 2 goals a game this year.

Edwards - 16 games in his debut season should be matched or bettered in his follow up season. Get him playing as often as possible because at least the kid showed something last year and should be given every chance to continue on with his development this year.

Polo - 25 games in 2 seasons needs to be up around the 45 mark by seasons end as it will do his development the world of good. The kid knows how to find the footy and knows how to stick to an opponent something we have been lacking for a long time.

McGuane - needs to become a reliable 3rd tall defender, did a couple of jobs last year under huge pressure but if he along with Thursfield and Polak can stand up down back it will go along way to solving one our weaknesses.

Morton - came to the club with heaps of wraps on him and has showed a little bit of that class but needs to knuckle down and repay the faith the club has shown in him, because there are also reports that he just expected to be given games at WCE. A return of 20-25 goals would be a nice return in his first year at the club.

Meyer - another one who needs to get out on the park for a minimum of 10 games and show us something to suggest he is worth keeping around. I know he has injury problems at the moment but once he is right to go get him on the park and leave him there until it is clear that he is no good.

Schulz - another one we have been waiting for and 08 is the time for Schulz to grab his last opportunity or he can be shown the door at seasons end. No more piss farting around if you haven't shown anything by 6 seasons chances are you never will.

Pattison - another 18+ games in the ruck and up forward to continue on the development hs showed last year. The kid might look ungainly but you can never question his determination, I only wish some of our more talented kids had the same.

JON - 7 games in 2 seasons is not great but injuries can explain that, however this preseason there have been reports that he is ready to show his potential, well if thats the case then I expect at least 10 games from him with an average of 12-15 possies. At least then the 'hype' can be somewhat justified.

Tambling - great to see Lids come out and support Richie in the paper, but it is time that Richie repaid the faith, I expect nothing less that 20 games with averages of 18 possies 6 marks 3.5 tackles and 1 goal. Anything less and the talk means nothing. As the players have said they want their actions to do the talking.

Hughes - same boat as Riewoldt 10 games/20 goals is the return I am looking for. Showed on more than one occasion last year he can kick 2-3 goals from CHF, with Richo not getting any younger we need to find kids that we can count on when Richo does pull the pin.

White - this kid needs a big year or I can see him being a prime candidate for the chop come seasons end, if/when he gets a chance needs to make the most of it. Probably battling Hyde for a spot on the list come seasons end.

Casserly - same as White above, if/when he gets a chance needs to grab it with both hands if he wants to still be here come 2009. Has struggled with injury but has seemingly got over that now and featured in a couple of the practice matches, reports are he has the potential to be a good player but if we don't see something this year it may be time to move on.

Connors - played 4 games looked good in a couple of them but really needs to knuckle down and make a spot in the 22 his. I believe he has the potential to make it but does he have the determination to fulfil that potential.

Moore - preseason form seems good and with question marks over McGuanes availability in the early going has the chance to stake a claim as the 3rd tall defender. If not then he could well be another one headed for the chop list.

Foley - can't ask for much more from Foley but the ability to run out games would top him off nicely. Expect him to continue on with his 07 form however he will need help as the opposition will have him targetted each week.

Graham - if Simmonds or Pattison go down the Graham needs to step up and fill the hole. Has the size to be an AFL ruckman, my doubt is whether he has the ability to be one.

King - fiesty little terrier down back and needs to maintain his 07 form as a bloke his size will struggle. Word is he is being looked on as a possible tagger, personally I don't like the idea, leave him down back where he can mind the oppositions small forwards who always seem to play well against us.

all pretty reasonable RT, use up alot of MB though partner

 

[_RT_]

all pretty reasonable RT, use up alot of MB though partner

Yeah I did didn't I. Just goes to show how much improvement is needed for us to start moving forward.

 

[sante]

I think the most important from that lot are Tambling, Thursfield, Deledio, Polak, Polo and obviously Foley.

If they all lift another level in 2008 it will help us out a lot. We need midfielders and some solid defenders.

 

[wrightman]

Been talking about the need for us to start looking towards the kids and having the step up and take the lead in shaping where this club is headed and thought I would throw up what sort of improvement I expect from the kids if the club is to start moving forward.

Thursfield - Came back from a serious knee injury well last year and although he played well needs to be able to stand up each week as a player we know will be very difficult to score on. Think with another preseason under his belt he may well become that type of player.

Deledio - if Wallace is going to persist with him up forward then I expect a return of 40 goals from no less than 20 games. Anything less and it is a waste of time playing him up there. If he moves to the middle then I want an average of 23 possies a week.

Raines - to get back to his 2006 form, while he averaged just under 20 touches a game last year, it means stuff all if most of them end up hurting the team instead of the opposition. Time to pull the finger out.

Polak - yes he was good last year but most of the time it was floating around the backline as a spare man. This year he needs to knuckle down and either take CHB and make it his or become the replacement for Richo up forward we have been searching for, a top 4 KP pick is wasted playing loose when we have others who can do that role.

Riewoldt - minimum return of 10 games and 20 goals. Yes I know KPP take a while to develop but they also should be expected to show something along the way. Not that hard to turn a goal a game average last year into 2 goals a game this year.

Edwards - 16 games in his debut season should be matched or bettered in his follow up season. Get him playing as often as possible because at least the kid showed something last year and should be given every chance to continue on with his development this year.

Polo - 25 games in 2 seasons needs to be up around the 45 mark by seasons end as it will do his development the world of good. The kid knows how to find the footy and knows how to stick to an opponent something we have been lacking for a long time.

McGuane - needs to become a reliable 3rd tall defender, did a couple of jobs last year under huge pressure but if he along with Thursfield and Polak can stand up down back it will go along way to solving one our weaknesses.

Morton - came to the club with heaps of wraps on him and has showed a little bit of that class but needs to knuckle down and repay the faith the club has shown in him, because there are also reports that he just expected to be given games at WCE. A return of 20-25 goals would be a nice return in his first year at the club.

Meyer - another one who needs to get out on the park for a minimum of 10 games and show us something to suggest he is worth keeping around. I know he has injury problems at the moment but once he is right to go get him on the park and leave him there until it is clear that he is no good.

Schulz - another one we have been waiting for and 08 is the time for Schulz to grab his last opportunity or he can be shown the door at seasons end. No more piss farting around if you haven't shown anything by 6 seasons chances are you never will.

Pattison - another 18+ games in the ruck and up forward to continue on the development hs showed last year. The kid might look ungainly but you can never question his determination, I only wish some of our more talented kids had the same.

JON - 7 games in 2 seasons is not great but injuries can explain that, however this preseason there have been reports that he is ready to show his potential, well if thats the case then I expect at least 10 games from him with an average of 12-15 possies. At least then the 'hype' can be somewhat justified.

Tambling - great to see Lids come out and support Richie in the paper, but it is time that Richie repaid the faith, I expect nothing less that 20 games with averages of 18 possies 6 marks 3.5 tackles and 1 goal. Anything less and the talk means nothing. As the players have said they want their actions to do the talking.

Hughes - same boat as Riewoldt 10 games/20 goals is the return I am looking for. Showed on more than one occasion last year he can kick 2-3 goals from CHF, with Richo not getting any younger we need to find kids that we can count on when Richo does pull the pin.

White - this kid needs a big year or I can see him being a prime candidate for the chop come seasons end, if/when he gets a chance needs to make the most of it. Probably battling Hyde for a spot on the list come seasons end.

Casserly - same as White above, if/when he gets a chance needs to grab it with both hands if he wants to still be here come 2009. Has struggled with injury but has seemingly got over that now and featured in a couple of the practice matches, reports are he has the potential to be a good player but if we don't see something this year it may be time to move on.

Connors - played 4 games looked good in a couple of them but really needs to knuckle down and make a spot in the 22 his. I believe he has the potential to make it but does he have the determination to fulfil that potential.

Moore - preseason form seems good and with question marks over McGuanes availability in the early going has the chance to stake a claim as the 3rd tall defender. If not then he could well be another one headed for the chop list.

Foley - can't ask for much more from Foley but the ability to run out games would top him off nicely. Expect him to continue on with his 07 form however he will need help as the opposition will have him targetted each week.

Graham - if Simmonds or Pattison go down the Graham needs to step up and fill the hole. Has the size to be an AFL ruckman, my doubt is whether he has the ability to be one.

King - fiesty little terrier down back and needs to maintain his 07 form as a bloke his size will struggle. Word is he is being looked on as a possible tagger, personally I don't like the idea, leave him down back where he can mind the oppositions small forwards who always seem to play well against us.

Champ some of your predictions l agree wih some l dont with regards to the ones i dont Casserly hasnt even played a game yet and ypou wnt to chop him at sesons end the kids need s 3-4 years to develop as does Riewoldt ,Polo Edwards ,Jon,Conners,White,Meyer, we must allow them to develop to their potential there IS not quick fix to the Tigers problems

 

[Rayzorwire]

No offense, but in several instances, these expectations are not just setting the bar high, they're totally unrealistic and you're setting yourself up for a fall if you think otherwise RT.

Reiwoldt, "minimum return" of 2 goals a game. FFS mate, he's only just turned 19.

Travis Cloke was kicking 0.3 a game at the same age, Nathan Ablett and Cam Mooney hadn't played a game...I could go on.

So *all* you expect "minimum return" from Reiwoldt, is to have a season which matches only the best handful of 19yo precocious forwards in AFL history, in a side which finished last the season prior?

Not only that, you're demanding the same or better from Hughes, Schulz, Deledio and Morton (and I presume you expect even more from Richo, Brown and Pettifer), so now *all* we need to do to satisfy your "minimum return" is have the best forward line in recent AFL memory, all firing at the same time - except those whose apparent reward for matching the returns of the best young forwards from the last couple of decades, is to get rotated back to Coburg!

8 consistent high return forwards in one forward line...last year Geelong had only 7 players kick over one goal a game, only three of them are permanent forwards, and they beat - or outright flogged - everyone. To expect anything similar from our young forwards as a "minimum return" is not even vaguely realistic.

Not that hard to turn a goal a game average last year into 2 goals a game this year.

If it wasn't that hard, more forwards would do it. Look at the stats - not many do, especially when they're not the prime focus of the forward line.

 

[Mario Speedwagon]

So all we need is to go from wooden spooners to the greatest team in living memory in the space of one season. Yeah right , no worries....speaking of memories...guess the '07 Cats will a distant one by the time this seasons over...shit... we should finish on 88 points and win the GF by 21 goals given those returns...can't wait!!

 

[_RT_]

Champ some of your predictions l agree wih some l dont with regards to the ones i dont Casserly hasnt even played a game yet and ypou wnt to chop him at sesons end the kids need s 3-4 years to develop as does Riewoldt ,Polo Edwards ,Jon,Conners,White,Meyer, we must allow them to develop to their potential there IS not quick fix to the Tigers problems

My point regarding some of them is why should we just sit back and wait for something that might never arrive. If these kids play a handful of games and show something then great but if they don't manage to get on the park do we keep them around just in case something happens in the future.

Tell me if you were an employer and a bunch of your workers were constantly letting you down would you keep them around 3-4 years, no you would get rid of them asap, at the end of this year we would have put 3 years into Casserly, Hughes, White, Graham, JON & Howat as well as 4 years into Meyer.Now much longer should we persist with players that show nothing?

No offense, but in several instances, these expectations are not just setting the bar high, they're totally unrealistic and you're setting yourself up for a fall if you think otherwise RT.

Reiwoldt, "minimum return" of 2 goals a game. FFS mate, he's only just turned 19.

Travis Cloke was kicking 0.3 a game at the same age, Nathan Ablett and Cam Mooney hadn't played a game...I could go on.

So *all* you expect "minimum return" from Reiwoldt, is to have a season which matches only the best handful of 19yo precocious forwards in AFL history, in a side which finished last the season prior?

Not only that, you're demanding the same or better from Hughes, Schulz, Deledio and Morton (and I presume you expect even more from Richo, Brown and Pettifer), so now *all* we need to do to satisfy your "minimum return" is have the best forward line in recent AFL memory, all firing at the same time - except those whose apparent reward for matching the returns of the best young forwards from the last couple of decades, is to get rotated back to Coburg!

8 consistent high return forwards in one forward line...last year Geelong had only 7 players kick over one goal a game, only three of them are permanent forwards, and they beat - or outright flogged - everyone. To expect anything similar from our young forwards as a "minimum return" is not even vaguely realistic.

If it wasn't that hard, more forwards would do it. Look at the stats - not many do, especially when they're not the prime focus of the forward line.

All weekend I have been calling on the club to start showing less reliance on the older players and to start demanding more from their younger players.

That is why I said I wanted to see both Hughes and Riewoldt with 20 goal season, that is why I said I want to see 40 goals from Deledio if Wallace plans on leaving him up forward for the season, don't know about you but if I were going to leave a player at FF for the season I would be expecting at least 2 goals a game from them. If Morton can average a goal a game then surprise you have another forward line option with the potential to kick 20 goals as well.

See here is the thing for the betterment of the list going forward I would much rather see a season where Hughes/Riewoldt/Morton/Deledio combined for 100 goals between them and we finished at the ass end of the ladder than another season of Richo/Brown/Pettifer kicking 100 between them and we finish at the ass end of the ladder because at least then I could look at that and say well at least we have 4 youngsters moving foward who have shown they can take over when the older blokes move on.A perfect example is last year, we got 111 goals from Richo/Brown/Pettifer yet what did we achieve another spoon not to mention 2004 where we had 91 goals from Brown and Richo and result another spoon.

So once again we enter a season with the same question mark as last year, Who will we turn to if Richo/Brown/Pettifer goes down? Don't know about you but I would like to end 2008 knowing we have replacements for these guys ready to go when called upon, instead of just sitting back and hoping that it will be alright.

So all we need is to go from wooden spooners to the greatest team in living memory in the space of one season. Yeah right , no worries....speaking of memories...guess the '07 Cats will a distant one by the time this seasons over...shit... we should finish on 88 points and win the GF by 21 goals given those returns...can't wait!!

Please, if you bother returning to the board show me where I said we would be going from wooden spooners to greatest team in living memory.

I merely posted what I would consider as a step in the right direction regarding the kids. Sure it might be excessive but if you set mediocre goals you might achieve your goals but all you've done is achieved mediocrity, if you set a goal that seems excessive and you get close then you have more likely than not gone well past mediocrity.

 

[turtle27]

My point regarding some of them is why should we just sit back and wait for something that might never arrive. If these kids play a handful of games and show something then great but if they don't manage to get on the park do we keep them around just in case something happens in the future.

Tell me if you were an employer and a bunch of your workers were constantly letting you down would you keep them around 3-4 years, no you would get rid of them asap, at the end of this year we would have put 3 years into Casserly, Hughes, White, Graham, JON & Howat as well as 4 years into Meyer.Now much longer should we persist with players that show nothing?



All weekend I have been calling on the club to start showing less reliance on the older players and to start demanding more from their younger players.

That is why I said I wanted to see both Hughes and Riewoldt with 20 goal season, that is why I said I want to see 40 goals from Deledio if Wallace plans on leaving him up forward for the season, don't know about you but if I were going to leave a player at FF for the season I would be expecting at least 2 goals a game from them. If Morton can average a goal a game then surprise you have another forward line option with the potential to kick 20 goals as well.

See here is the thing for the betterment of the list going forward I would much rather see a season where Hughes/Riewoldt/Morton/Deledio combined for 100 goals between them and we finished at the ass end of the ladder than another season of Richo/Brown/Pettifer kicking 100 between them and we finish at the ass end of the ladder because at least then I could look at that and say well at least we have 4 youngsters moving foward who have shown they can take over when the older blokes move on.A perfect example is last year, we got 111 goals from Richo/Brown/Pettifer yet what did we achieve another spoon not to mention 2004 where we had 91 goals from Brown and Richo and result another spoon.

So once again we enter a season with the same question mark as last year, Who will we turn to if Richo/Brown/Pettifer goes down? Don't know about you but I would like to end 2008 knowing we have replacements for these guys ready to go when called upon, instead of just sitting back and hoping that it will be alright.


Please, if you bother returning to the board show me where I said we would be going from wooden spooners to greatest team in living memory.

I merely posted what I would consider as a step in the right direction regarding the kids. Sure it might be excessive but if you set mediocre goals you might achieve your goals but all you've done is achieved mediocrity, if you set a goal that seems excessive and you get close then you have more likely than not gone well past mediocrity.

Given Brown's form, if he goes down, we're not loosing much. That will hopefully change soon - by round 1 would be nice.

And I hoenstly don't believe our younger forwards will kick 100 goals or more between them until the big lug retires, or he's used further up the griound, so he's not the 100% main focus when we move the ball into our forward line. Never thought I'd here my self say that, but sadly, I'm really starting to believe it.

 

[itsintheblood]

I think the first 5 players to be gone will be jon, raines, johnson, silvester and cartledge. It's hard too see anything big coming from any of those 5. I want to see Schultz, Hughes, Meyer, Hyde have a big year in 2008. They must lift because they have been around for a while and shown glimpses of class. I want to see that more often

Hyde won't get any better Im afraid. Too one dimensional with no right foot. A bit like tivendale.

 

[_RT_]

Given Brown's form, if he goes down, we're not loosing much. That will hopefully change soon - by round 1 would be nice.

And I hoenstly don't believe our younger forwards will kick 100 goals or more between them until the big lug retires, or he's used further up the griound, so he's not the 100% main focus when we move the ball into our forward line. Never thought I'd here my self say that, but sadly, I'm really starting to believe it.

Somehow I get the feeling that more and more Tiger fans will realise this as the season goes on.

 

[Roachy8]

Hyde won't get any better Im afraid. Too one dimensional with no right foot. A bit like tivendale.

This is a very salient point...

We have some excellent to good contributers who may not get any better, but they are excellent to good contributers.
We have some youngsters who are marginal contributers who however have a large capacity to improve.
We also have a bunch of mid-range "plodders".
Guys like Hyde, Tivendale, Johnson... perhaps Raines & even Tucky.
These guys have limited improvement at this stage of their careers and the only thing they can bring to the team is experience but do we need this type of experience?
I have not been a bagger of Tiv's or Hyde or Johnson but I struggle to see an advantage in playing them ahead of Morton, Edwards, Connors etc...

 

[lids2004roar]

One inconsistency is that you expect a 2 goal a game average from RIewoldt and Hughes... yet you expect our Marquee Star Brett Deledio only to have the same output (2 goals a game)?

IMO Lids needs to have a better season than 19yo KPPs.

Otherwise very good write up RT, a great read and I agree on the overall thinking

 

[Madtiger2006]

Hyde won't get any better Im afraid. Too one dimensional with no right foot. A bit like tivendale.

Nah he's got a decent right foot. Hit's his targets. His main problem is fitness and strength. He seems to go missing a bit and you can see him struggling to chase in games. Either that or he is just not committed enough. He definately has the talent. I guess it is lack of committment if he hasn't worked hard enough on his size and fitness over the summer. Let's see what happens this year. Might be his last chance

 

[Rayzorwire]

All weekend I have been calling on the club to start showing less reliance on the older players and to start demanding more from their younger players.

That is why I said I wanted to see both Hughes and Riewoldt with 20 goal season, that is why I said I want to see 40 goals from Deledio if Wallace plans on leaving him up forward for the season, don't know about you but if I were going to leave a player at FF for the season I would be expecting at least 2 goals a game from them. If Morton can average a goal a game then surprise you have another forward line option with the potential to kick 20 goals as well.

See here is the thing for the betterment of the list going forward I would much rather see a season where Hughes/Riewoldt/Morton/Deledio combined for 100 goals between them and we finished at the ass end of the ladder than another season of Richo/Brown/Pettifer kicking 100 between them and we finish at the ass end of the ladder because at least then I could look at that and say well at least we have 4 youngsters moving foward who have shown they can take over when the older blokes move on.A perfect example is last year, we got 111 goals from Richo/Brown/Pettifer yet what did we achieve another spoon not to mention 2004 where we had 91 goals from Brown and Richo and result another spoon.

So once again we enter a season with the same question mark as last year, Who will we turn to if Richo/Brown/Pettifer goes down? Don't know about you but I would like to end 2008 knowing we have replacements for these guys ready to go when called upon, instead of just sitting back and hoping that it will be alright.

We'll know we have replacements if Reiwoldt continues to improve from what he managed at Coburg last year, Hughes improves at the lower level, and both of them plus Schulz manage to have a few good games at senior level. Bar Hughes' bad attitude which saw him end up in the Coburg ressies, they all did enough last year to be seen as being on the right track. Further improvement along the same lines (i.e. demanding a run in the seniors because you're doing very well at Coburg, then averaging a goal a game at senior level) is enough.

Brown, Richo and Pettifer are all still going to be permanent forwards this year, and so they should be. Wouldn't it be nice to for once let our forwards' bodies fully mature and for them to have the ingrained habit of kicking 2-3 a game against men at VFL level, before we expect them to do it at AFL level?

You know, bringing our players along slowly but surely like most other clubs who don't have glaring holes in their lineup do.

Nah he's got a decent right foot. Hit's his targets. His main problem is fitness and strength. He seems to go missing a bit and you can see him struggling to chase in games. Either that or he is just not committed enough. He definately has the talent. I guess it is lack of committment if he hasn't worked hard enough on his size and fitness over the summer. Let's see what happens this year. Might be his last chance

Hyde's one of the best endurance athletes in the game, just very one paced, so when he chases he looks like he's not putting in, but in reality, that's as fast as he can run. If he was chasing someone over a few k's he'd always catch up. He's a grinding stayer.

 

[_RT_]

We'll know we have replacements if Reiwoldt continues to improve from what he managed at Coburg last year, Hughes improves at the lower level, and both of them plus Schulz manage to have a few good games at senior level. Bar Hughes' bad attitude which saw him end up in the Coburg ressies, they all did enough last year to be seen as being on the right track. Further improvement along the same lines (i.e. demanding a run in the seniors because you're doing very well at Coburg, then averaging a goal a game at senior level) is enough.

Brown, Richo and Pettifer are all still going to be permanent forwards this year, and so they should be. Wouldn't it be nice to for once let our forwards' bodies fully mature and for them to have the ingrained habit of kicking 2-3 a game against men at VFL level, before we expect them to do it at AFL level?

You know, bringing our players along slowly but surely like most other clubs who don't have glaring holes in their lineup do.

As I said in another thread a week or so back it is all well and good performing well at VFL level, but as you know that is a lower standard of footy. I don't want to read about the kids playing well at Coburg I want to read about the dominating at Coburg much like the Cats do at VFL level. Think back to last years VFL GF, the Cats kids against our kids and they tore us a new one.

My view is if they can come in and perform to somewhere near the expectations I want at AFL level, then aren't we in a much better position than we would be if they are doing the same sort of thing at VFL level.

While I am well aware that Richo and Brown will be the corner stones of the forward line this year the time is rapidly approaching when they wont be and as I said in my previous post I don't want to reach that time and be wondering who is ready to take their places, I want to get to that time and know that there is someone ready to do it. All in all I think we want the same thing, just want to get the answers in 2 seperate ways.

 

[surpstar]

The bar should be set high.

These are AFL footballers.. supposedly the bst players competing in the best competition.
No more room for guys that aren't upto it

 

[CoggaRules]

Given Brown's form, if he goes down, we're not loosing much. That will hopefully change soon - by round 1 would be nice.

And I hoenstly don't believe our younger forwards will kick 100 goals or more between them until the big lug retires, or he's used further up the griound, so he's not the 100% main focus when we move the ball into our forward line. Never thought I'd here my self say that, but sadly, I'm really starting to believe it.

just want him in form when we need the star to do his thing in the games where stars win it for you. Probably about 6 to 7 max. The rest need to do the rest in the games where we dont need a star to win them.
Comprende?

 

[nut]

The bar should be set high.

These are AFL footballers.. supposedly the bst players competing in the best competition.
No more room for guys that aren't upto it

Sounds easy..... who do we replace them with for #$%ks sake????? they are only 21 - 19 year olds..... GIVE THEM TIME.

 

[Rayzorwire]

As I said in another thread a week or so back it is all well and good performing well at VFL level, but as you know that is a lower standard of footy. I don't want to read about the kids playing well at Coburg I want to read about the dominating at Coburg much like the Cats do at VFL level. Think back to last years VFL GF, the Cats kids against our kids and they tore us a new one.

The Cats 'kids' which included King and a lot more seasoned players than what we had. And again, you're comparing us unfavourably to the best around, instead of focusing on the fact that Coburg were widely predicted to not get near the VFL finals, lost many players to Richmond because our seniors were so depleted, and yet still made the grand final. They did so partly on the back of very good form from our juniors.

My view is if they can come in and perform to somewhere near the expectations I want at AFL level, then aren't we in a much better position than we would be if they are doing the same sort of thing at VFL level.

Well, yes, of course, but if we're playing our usual 4-5 man forward line, where is the room for 8 forwards to reach these lofty expectations? For those there isn't room for, performing well at Coburg is all we can ask.

While I am well aware that Richo and Brown will be the corner stones of the forward line this year the time is rapidly approaching when they wont be and as I said in my previous post I don't want to reach that time and be wondering who is ready to take their places, I want to get to that time and know that there is someone ready to do it.

I think if 2-3 out of Schulz, Hughes, Reiwoldt, Gourdis and Putt are performing consistently well at Coburg or reasonably (i.e. a goal a game) in the seniors by the time Richo retires, our improving midfield will be enough to ensure these players fit fairly seamlessly into AFL level over the space of two seasons. Pettifer has another 4-5 years, while Cotchin, Morton and Collard are all candidates to replace Brown. Arguably, we don't really need to replace Brown because it would be better to add a crumber who can put more pressure on the defenders.

All in all I think we want the same thing, just want to get the answers in 2 seperate ways.

Yep.

 

[Crumden]

just want him in form when we need the star to do his thing in the games where stars win it for you. Probably about 6 to 7 max. The rest need to do the rest in the games where we dont need a star to win them.
Comprende?

Browny is the old fashioned type of star that cruises through the preseason and only gets interested when the four points are on the line.

 

[CoggaRules]

Browny is the old fashioned type of star that cruises through the preseason and only gets interested when the four points are on the line.

the equation is pretty simple. We were in winning positions going into the last quarter in how many games last year? He only has to seal the deal in those and we are good. Chuck in a few games where Richo goes crazy, a couple of cameos in othes from out of left field players and we have 7m or 8 wins before the rest of the comp wake up. By then we are mixing it in the 8, with half the comp tanking for draft picks.