Duck and Lift!!!

[danster168]

Dunno about that..Toby MClean ain't getting a high tackle free ever again. Its a stain that never washes.

well yeah, only themselves to blame. Same as Weightman and Hunter. Umpires are only human. They know which guys accentuate contact. And they rightfully won't get the benefit of the doubt.

 

[Zacs_Magic_Tooth]

Bunk knows more than the commentators. He knows everything.

Commentators think that spinning 360 is still a rule

 

[Lavender Bushranger]

And also that it should've been a free.

Don't worry, I saw some Carlton guy above is attempting the same backpedalling semantics that you are after being proven wrong!

“Ginnivan is responsible for the initial high contact however (Mason) Redman then continues with the tackle in an unreasonable manner, holding Ginnivan around the neck. In this instance a free kick should have been awarded to Ginnivan,” the AFL’s statement said.


Which part of this is unclear? Ginnivan was guilty of exactly what they're trying to remove from the game.

This admission from the AFL does not vindicate him. It literally just says that Redman trying to squeeze his head like a pimple afterwards should have been a Free Kick.

 

[Reg Grundy35]

Everyone whining about ginnivan. Dylan Moore has barely got a free for 2 months after being labelled a ducker, well before this mandate. Instead of sooking, he got on with it, and has shown he's a good footballer

who?

 

[Maze]

literally all the time. literally what's happening with Ginnivan now. What happened with Weightman too. There's certain players that flop around. The umpires wouldn't be doing their job if they didn't look into the tendencies of all the different players.

What are you, some kind of bed room lawyer?? Your post claimed "he gave up his right". Where in the rule book does it say this......

 

[Zacs_Magic_Tooth]

Makes no sense that all the discussion is about this 1 incorrect decision when bad decisions get made every week and the AFL and media lackies hide behind interpretation as a bullshit excuse. Fact is that was the most enjoyable, least frustrating, round of footy in years. The AFL finally makes a change the fans are desperate for and the media spend 3 days on the Ginnivan tackle

 

[Outback Footy]

For the last 15 years we have watched Selwood duck multiple times a game, and watched Rance flop about like a fish out if water and the media have bowed down like the cumrags they are and have barely said a word.
A blonde boy from the Pies who has upset the boomers starts ducking and the media pile in like Robbo does to a 30 piece bucket of KFC.

Every team has players who do this, yes i know that Shuey has done it in the past many times. Yet the media go nuts over this one.

Some players do this at times during games, Ginninvan appears to do it constantly. Hes taken the benefit of doubt away. Its his only response to getting tackled.

Joel and Toby and Shuey and Flea and a bunch of others would draw the high tackles at times during games but were genuinely, as their first instinct, trying to break the tackle, they could all also play, win their own balls and show skill. Ginnivan is skilful but seems to only have 1 approach when anywhere near a tackler, accept the head high and expect the free kick. Hes not genuinely trying to break tackles, hes deliberately seeking to draw the high tackle.

 

[Outback Footy]

Makes no sense that all the discussion is about this 1 incorrect decision when bad decisions get made every week and the AFL and media lackies hide behind interpretation as a bullshit excuse. Fact is that was the most enjoyable, least frustrating, round of footy in years. The AFL finally makes a change the fans are desperate for and the media spend 3 days on the Ginnivan tackle

Because Collingwood. Simples.

 

[JoondalupJ]

I played soccer all my life and love the game............but I simply can't watch it. Why? the flops, the dives and every other cheating element that prevails. Sadly though, the AFL has celebrated the introduction of the worst of soccer into the game. They've foamed over selwood for a decade and only just realised the staging is a blight on the game.


The MRP should hand out red cards on review of duckandlift, flops etc. With one and two week bans, with the official report being "cheating like a soft soccer player" and recorded alongside the players name, just like AA and BF.

Amen to that!

 

[Brackets]

It literally just says that Redman trying to squeeze his head like a pimple afterwards should have been a Free Kick.

 

[JoondalupJ]

Some players do this at times during games, Ginninvan appears to do it constantly. Hes taken the benefit of doubt away. Its his only response to getting tackled.

Joel and Toby and Shuey and Flea and a bunch of others would draw the high tackles at times during games but were genuinely, as their first instinct, trying to break the tackle, they could all also play, win their own balls and show skill. Ginnivan is skilful but seems to only have 1 approach when anywhere near a tackler, accept the head high and expect the free kick. He's not genuinely trying to break tackles, hes deliberately seeking to draw the high tackle.

I think with some players that is absolutely correct. What makes me angry about Selwood is that he was doing it regularly and getting one two frees from maybe more per week from gullible umpires, who to their defence, were and do read the rules to the umpteenth degree, that leaves the feel for football in the change rooms not where it should be. ON THE GROUND for fairness, some frees are simply not fair.

With Selwood I have no doubt he's a gutsy quality player, but as Power Raid says he could easily have a mark against his name in the history book of football records, for a player, who tried all the time to draw frees , I've said it before I'll say it again to me, its like cheating!

And I reckon , he practiced it too!
In fact I see the Cats as a great club but they too seem to have encouraged in their teams playing for free kicks , to a point that it looks like a cultural thing in the club,they forever appeal for things like Out on the Full , deliberate or at close quarters.

They seem and maybe its just me , but they seem to me, to make appealing for anything part of the run with of their plan.

I know all clubs do it, but they are the champs!

And I'd wonder if statistics were drawn up how many goals has Tom kicked from marks as compared to free kick-goals.

Its like the benefit of the doubt always seems to weigh in the Cats favour most times.

One comment, compare infringements paid to Buddy Franklin over the years for shots on goal,and then Toms stats for
free kicks for the same thing. Bud gets nothing! Tom gets every thing. That is statement of what I see, Tom Hawkins is one
of the best I've seen . I like watching him but hell he gets some frees.

Its like the umpires are almost locked into it by habit and I blame the concrete non feeling rules set up that the AFL have
imposed on the game these days. For reasons unknown, to me?

But footy is something inside the head and the heart and judgements have to be made with a feel for the game.

I would like umpires full time. And to train on and off season with all clubs, to understand that team thing and that tiggytouchwood is NOT PART OF OUR GAME!

BUT WE ALSO HAVE TO HAVE STRICT RULES FOR REAL..... I MEAN REAL..... HEAD HIGH INFRINGEMENTS.
But we can't destroy the essence of the game by over umpiring and some times ridiculous rules.

I bet the umpires are happy about the "duckanlift" being eased it is cheating!

And one thing I 've said for years, some instances because of the Hocking now Scott rule regime they have
set up a game where in certain circumstances a player trying to spoilor defend may as well not even contest.

That is what arm punching etc has done. Its lost the contest partially, give it back AFL. You don't own this game
YOU HAVE NO RIGHT TO MANGLE SOME OF IT..

 

[JyeDye]

Things like this don’t do Ginnivan any favours for getting free kicks now, he actively runs into Jake Kelly here with a free kick his only intention.

That is completely ridiculous. I know it was dead time but how anyone can watch that including Collingwood supporters and coaches and accept that. The kid picks it up and deadset runs 5m ducking into a tackler to try and draw a free kick. He could have done 50 other things instead that would have been more beneficial to the team.

 

[Outback Footy]

That is completely ridiculous. I know it was dead time but how anyone can watch that including Collingwood supporters and coaches and accept that. The kid picks it up and deadset runs 5m ducking into a tackler to try and draw a free kick. He could have done 50 other things instead that would have been more beneficial to the team.

Exactly right. He looked straight at Redman and ran at him and then dropped into the tackle as he saw it coming. He had open space to his left front he could have run there instead of at Redman on his right, he had another runner to his left he could have handballed to. The kid sought out the tackle coz hes always been rewarded with free kicks for this stunt. Dont want to see the insides of his brain pan in 10 years time.

 

[JyeDye]

Exactly right. He looked straight at Redman and ran at him and then dropped into the tackle as he saw it coming. He had open space to his left front he could have run there instead of at Redman on his right, he had another runner to his left he could have handballed to. The kid sought out the tackle coz hes always been rewarded with free kicks for this stunt. Dont want to see the insides of his brain pan in 10 years time.

Nah man I'm not even talking about that. Have a look at the post I replied to and it shows another tackle. It's dead time as there was already a free kick paid though. I think it's the most ridiculous one I've seen and I'd want to see how a Collingwood supporter would want there player doing that.

 

[peternorth]

There is another element. Someone called SEN stating that the AFL are bullying ginnivan, and we must stop the afl from doing this. Mental health.

 

[Cripps 'n' Blue Bloods]

I reckon Ginnivan would have to be one of the few players in the league who actually runs towards an opponent, instead of trying to evade them.
And with almost every possession. I'd be interested to see his possessions vs disposals, because I reckon a lot of his touches end up as either a free kick for, against, or a ball up and not an actual disposal.

1. Gets ball, looks for closest defender
2. Runs towards defender in a manner that makes it look like he's not, but never really tries to evade either.
3. Starts eying up defender (never seems to be looking for a teammate to dispose to) and adjusting his head height to the defender's shoulder height.
This is done in multiple ways; running at a weird angle like he's a Nascar at Daytona, lowering the hips, and/or bending the knees (sometimes all three).
4. Once he's lined up and he knows contact is about to happen, he leans the head, lowers the shoulder and tucks the ball under the opposite arm.
5. Contact! Time to immediately reef the arm up, whilst driving into the tackler and collapsing at the legs.
6. Look straight for the umpire to see if successful.

Players who are genuinely trying to evade the tacklers, usually run away from them, or try to keep their feet, while looking for options to dispose of the ball.

It's so extremely obvious what he does and why he's doing it. Now it seems like everyone is sick of it. The AFL, the umpires, opposition players, spectators.
Having said that, he's not the only one who does it, but he's currently the most prolific and the poster boy for it, so he's the one getting all the attention.

 

[Reg Grundy35]

I reckon Ginnivan would have to be one of the few players in the league who actually runs towards an opponent, instead of trying to evade them.
And with almost every possession. I'd be interested to see his possessions vs disposals, because I reckon a lot of his touches end up as either a free kick for, against, or a ball up and not an actual disposal.

1. Gets ball, looks for closest defender
2. Runs towards defender in a manner that makes it look like he's not, but never really tries to evade either.
3. Starts eying up defender (never seems to be looking for a teammate to dispose to) and adjusting his head height to the defender's shoulder height.
This is done in multiple ways; running at a weird angle like he's a Nascar at Daytona, lowering the hips, and/or bending the knees (sometimes all three).
4. Once he's lined up and he knows contact is about to happen, he leans the head, lowers the shoulder and tucks the ball under the opposite arm.
5. Contact! Time to immediately reef the arm up, whilst driving into the tackler and collapsing at the legs.
6. Look straight for the umpire to see if successful.

Players who are genuinely trying to evade the tacklers, usually run away from them, or try to keep their feet, while looking for options to dispose of the ball.

It's so extremely obvious what he does and why he's doing it. Now it seems like everyone is sick of it. The AFL, the umpires, opposition players, spectators.
Having said that, he's not the only one who does it, but he's currently the most prolific and the poster boy for it, so he's the one getting all the attention.

bloody long way to say you don't like the kid.

 

[Alberto_Magnifico]

That is completely ridiculous. I know it was dead time but how anyone can watch that including Collingwood supporters and coaches and accept that. The kid picks it up and deadset runs 5m ducking into a tackler to try and draw a free kick. He could have done 50 other things instead that would have been more beneficial to the team.

It legit looks like an insurance scam clip...

 

[Mitchell Madness]

who?

The guy rated as the only elite small forward preseason

 

[Cripps 'n' Blue Bloods]

bloody long way to say you don't like the kid.

Bloody interesting way to interpret my post.
He's a Bendigo boy who played for my local team. I'd like to see him do well. He's just going about it the wrong way at the moment. On and off the field.
The club has had a few chances to get him to pull his head in, but instead, they've seemingly backed him every time, which seems like a green light to continue, so he has.

If he was at my club, I'd want the leadership group and coaches to pull him aside and tell him he's on the wrong path. Then for the coach to just say publicly that we've spoken to him as a group behind closed doors. I won't get into the details of those conversations, but we've told him how we want to portray ourselves as players and a club, on and off the field and that his actions of late aren't in line with that. We back him 100% and will offer him any and all support required to meet those expectations.

If he did it again, I'd expect him to be dropped and have to earn his spot back.
It's really not hard. I don't care who it is, or what team. I'd expect all clubs (including my own) to hold their players to similar standards. They are professional athletes, on big money. They represent the league, their club, their teammates and sponsors.
Fisher started doing the arm lift thing a couple weeks ago, and I called it out and said I didn't like it, but I'd hope the leaders pull him aside for it and I'll reserve judgement until I see whether it's the start of a new pattern for him. Looks like it's gone from his game already.

 

[ThatsjustDappa]

How many of his career goals are from frees?
I'm genuinely curious and don't know how to find out, must be a fair few.

According to the internets, 50% of Ginnivans goals are from frees paid....

 

[Reg Grundy35]

Bloody interesting way to interpret my post.
He's a Bendigo boy who played for my local team. I'd like to see him do well. He's just going about it the wrong way at the moment. On and off the field.
The club has had a few chances to get him to pull his head in, but instead, they've seemingly backed him every time, which seems like a green light to continue, so he has.

If he was at my club, I'd want the leadership group and coaches to pull him aside and tell him he's on the wrong path. Then for the coach to just say publicly that we've spoken to him as a group behind closed doors. I won't get into the details of those conversations, but we've told him how we want to portray ourselves as players and a club, on and off the field and that his actions of late aren't in line with that. We back him 100% and will offer him any and all support required to meet those expectations.

If he did it again, I'd expect him to be dropped and have to earn his spot back.
It's really not hard. I don't care who it is, or what team. I'd expect all clubs (including my own) to hold their players to similar standards. They are professional athletes, on big money. They represent the league, their club, their teammates and sponsors.
Fisher started doing the arm lift thing a couple weeks ago, and I called it out and said I didn't like it, but I'd hope the leaders pull him aside for it and I'll reserve judgement until I see whether it's the start of a new pattern for him. Looks like it's gone from his game already.

do you always have trouble getting to the point?

 

[Stax on the mill]

Think people need to chill on the Ginnivan hate. He’s a 19 year old kid playing his first real season remember. You can be critical on the rules and dislike his actions as much as you want, but actually wanting people to knock his head off is a little too far for me.

Well said. There are some real pieces of pond scum posting in this thread, wanting a player to be badly hurt.

Ginnivan could have been standing up straight on his tip toes and Redman would have still taken him around the neck. That was clearly his intention right from the outset, because he knew he could do it with impunity.

 

[Alberto_Magnifico]

Who is advocating for Ginnivan to get hurt?

 

[Cripps 'n' Blue Bloods]

do you always have trouble getting to the point?

Do you always have trouble understanding it, to the point that it needs to be dumbed down?