1 Ruck or 2 ??? The Midfield Performance Misconception!

[AJARWA]

20 disposals is English’s lowest number for the year, he’s averaging 22 disposals a game. Meanwhile at the lower end of “3 or 4 goals” he would probably win the Coleman most years.

I’m all for comparisons but those are not close to the right numbers.

I figure he'd average 2 himself and creates at least 1-2 for others by drawing a key defender.

Do you prefer his 22 disposals and a forward line that doesn't threaten decent teams? Schache and Marra aren't the solution. And our season will be cooked by the time Bruce is kicking goals.

 

[doggiesin08]

I figure he'd average 2 himself and creates at least 1-2 for others by drawing a key defender.

Do you prefer his 22 disposals and a forward line that doesn't threaten decent teams? Schache and Marra aren't the solution. And our season will be cooked by the time Bruce is kicking goals.

I’d take an English/Schache combination over an Sweet/English combination every day of the week. I would then play one of Marra/Buku each week as the 3rd forward. I agree English/Buku isn’t the answer.

 

[Chops]

I’d take an English/Schache combination over an Sweet/English combination every day of the week. I would then play one of Marra/Buku each week as the 3rd forward. I agree English/Buku isn’t the answer.

English/Schache would be the least physical ruck combination in the league.
English/Sweet is only crap because English wouldn’t play forward and Sweet can’t

 

[_Mike_]

Not surprised that this thread and the sole ruck English argument hasnt been as heated as it was last Friday.

The 1 ruck strategy speaks for itself in this instance.

 

[BEaston]

Not surprised that this thread and the sole ruck English argument hasnt been as heated as it was last Friday.

The 1 ruck strategy speaks for itself in this instance.

One game either way doesn't prove either side really. Just like the WCE didn't prove 2 rucks is useless, Geelong game didn't prove it's a must have.

 

[_Mike_]

One game either way doesn't prove either side really. Just like the WCE didn't prove 2 rucks is useless, Geelong game didn't prove it's a must have.

My argument focuses on who is actually doing the ruck work in the 1 ruck setup. We dont have a S.Darcy, Grundy, Hickey, Stanley etc type that has the physical frame and tank to do it for 4 quarters. English is getting used because of his height and agility/athleticism however there's a strong argument that he is better used as a swingman KPP and backup ruck.

We just dont have any viable options at present who can do the tiresome 4 quarter stoppage rucking and make a contest out of every throw in, bounce, ball up etc.

 

[TiAn_]

My argument focuses on who is actually doing the ruck work in the 1 ruck setup. We dont have a S.Darcy, Grundy, Hickey, Stanley etc type that has the physical frame and tank to do it for 4 quarters. English is getting used because of his height and agility/athleticism however there's a strong argument that he is better used as a swingman KPP and backup ruck.

We just dont have any viable options at present who can do the tiresome 4 quarter stoppage rucking and make a contest out of every throw in, bounce, ball up etc.

We played our best footy under Beveridge with English as a forward and backup ruck and a rigamortis riddled Stef Martin rucking. We clearly don’t need a gun ruck for our midfield to succeed, just a competitive one with adequate support.

Sure, English might not get his same great numbers, but at this point it’s looking to me like this team would be better served by English playing forward alongside Naughton and relieving Sweet, instead of Naughton and English going one out in each of their roles. We’ve beaten one good side this year and we’re facing an uphill battle for finals. What we’ve been doing hasn’t worked.

Can’t see this issue resolving unless we get a Ladhams or Lobb type forward/ruck this off season.

 

[dogwatch]

Can’t see this issue resolving unless we get a Ladhams or Lobb type forward/ruck this off season.

Which senior-quality ruckman would want to come to a club where the coach usually selects only his number one ruck anyway?

He would need assurances they intend to play two rucks every week if he signed up. And even then having a developing 207cm #2 draft pick on our list might be enough to scare him off.

I doubt a Ladhams/Lobb type would agree to come for a “break glass in case of injury to Timmy” role.

 

[TiAn_]

Which senior-quality ruckman would want to come to a club where the coach usually selects only his number one ruck anyway?

He would need assurances they intend to play two rucks every week if he signed up. And even then having a developing 207cm #2 draft pick on our list might be enough to scare him off.

I doubt a Ladhams/Lobb type would agree to come for a “break glass in case of injury to Timmy” role.

Obviously only makes sense if they have a role in the forward line.

 

[Mr. Walker]

Just noting that Collingwood, a club that goes with a two ruck strategy (Mason Cox

46

Mason Cox

Age

33

Ht

211cm

Wt

110kg

Pos.

F/R

Career

Season

Last 5

D

8.7

2star

K

5.2

2star

HB

3.5

3star

M

4.0

4star

T

1.6

4star

G

1.2

4star

D

6.0

1star

K

3.0

1star

HB

3.0

2star

M

2.3

2star

T

0.3

1star

G

1.0

4star

D

9.0

3star

K

5.4

2star

HB

3.6

3star

M

2.6

3star

T

2.4

4star

G

1.8

5star

, yes Mason Cox

46

Mason Cox

Age

33

Ht

211cm

Wt

110kg

Pos.

F/R

Career

Season

Last 5

D

8.7

2star

K

5.2

2star

HB

3.5

3star

M

4.0

4star

T

1.6

4star

G

1.2

4star

D

6.0

1star

K

3.0

1star

HB

3.0

2star

M

2.3

2star

T

0.3

1star

G

1.0

4star

D

9.0

3star

K

5.4

2star

HB

3.6

3star

M

2.6

3star

T

2.4

4star

G

1.8

5star

, and Cameron), has only one tall down back, Moore, and only one “tall” up forward in Mihocek at a whopping 192 cms. is continuing on its winning run. While the Dogs, with a one ruck strategy, is not.
Just saying.

 

[Optimistic Dog]

My argument focuses on who is actually doing the ruck work in the 1 ruck setup. We dont have a S.Darcy, Grundy, Hickey, Stanley etc type that has the physical frame and tank to do it for 4 quarters. English is getting used because of his height and agility/athleticism however there's a strong argument that he is better used as a swingman KPP and backup ruck.

We just dont have any viable options at present who can do the tiresome 4 quarter stoppage rucking and make a contest out of every throw in, bounce, ball up etc.

We do have a S Darcy LOL.

 

[ScragCity]

Just noting that Collingwood, a club that goes with a two ruck strategy (Mason Cox, yes Mason Cox, and Cameron), has only one tall down back, Moore, and only one “tall” up forward in Mihocek at a whopping 192 cms. is continuing on its winning run. While the Dogs, with a one ruck strategy, is not.
Just saying.

Just noting that North Melbourne, a club with a two ruck strategy (Todd Goldstein and Tristan Xerri) have only won 2 games for the year. Meanwhile, the Bulldogs, with a one ruck system, have won 6. According to this in-depth and faultless analysis, one-ruck is three times better than two.

 

[_Mike_]

We do have a S Darcy LOL.

Hopefully will be better than the Freo version

 

[Jeff 1975]

Just noting that Collingwood, a club that goes with a two ruck strategy (Mason Cox, yes Mason Cox, and Cameron), has only one tall down back, Moore, and only one “tall” up forward in Mihocek at a whopping 192 cms. is continuing on its winning run. While the Dogs, with a one ruck strategy, is not.
Just saying.

Watched the Collingwood v Melbourne game
Very good game, high marking good ruck work and excellent ball movement
The only drawback, I think Bevo was there giving out the best on ground votes

 

[RedWhite&Blue]

I'm all for playing Naughton as a centre half back and have him swing forward now and then.
Play Sweet and English and have them rotating through the forward line. Partner Bont with Sweet and Dunkley with English and they basically follow them into the middle and then into the forward line as the forward pocket.
Tell me that isn't the most brilliant idea you have heard this year..!!! it's hard not to see the genius isn't it?

 

[Jeff 1975]

I'm all for playing Naughton as a centre half back and have him swing forward now and then.
Play Sweet and English and have them rotating through the forward line. Partner Bont with Sweet and Dunkley with English and they basically follow them into the middle and then into the forward line as the forward pocket.
Tell me that isn't the most brilliant idea you have heard this year..!!! it's hard not to see the genius isn't it?

I would love to see Naughton and English sticking marks in the backline

 

[threenewpadlocks]

We tried to play English forward at the latter end of last year and in finals and it didn't work. We looked a better team the more that English rucked, and English hardly took a mark inside 50 across the entire finals series and in the losses and wins leading up to the game. Then given English's form in the ruck so far this year, it's kind of ridiculous that we aren't just picking our team by starting with picking our best players in their most ideal positions.

If a player in our forward line can ruck a bit in that there's a benefit in giving English slightly more rest - sure, that's a factor in their value as a forward, but we shouldn't be looking at accommodating rucking English less than what's necessary.

 

[BEaston]

Just noting that North Melbourne, a club with a two ruck strategy (Todd Goldstein and Tristan Xerri) have only won 2 games for the year. Meanwhile, the Bulldogs, with a one ruck system, have won 6. According to this in-depth and faultless analysis, one-ruck is three times better than two.

I think you're both making the same point.