NT Alice Springs: 2024 Curfew

[Power Raid]

I watched the video about the aboriginal fathers raping their very young children and it was (I don’t even have a word). Is there anything we can do to help these children? Any legitimate charities? I don’t think giving money directly is the answer but if there are real support groups that would be great. The thought of how these young indigenous children are living is disgusting and how the government (all of them) can have this on their conscience I don’t know.

It is hard enough to read your post, let alone watching the video report or even worse..............imagine being the social worker, cop or health official dealing with the issue. Imagine being the magistrate listening to these stories every day and making decisions that have major implications for families.

heart wrenching

 

[Bloods86]

From my view we must have lower standards for Aboriginal children than we do any other child in the community.
Isn’t that racism?

I'm not sure what you're wanting me to say here. Australia, since colonisation and to current day, has been and is fairly racist.

I'm not saying there aren't problems, though I seem to be getting caught up in that blanket assumption.

I was just joining in the point about using anecdotes as evidence and how this is all being used for political purposes (responding to some insincere stuff being thrown about).

 

[Jello_B]

It is hard enough to read your post, let alone watching the video report or even worse..............imagine being the social worker, cop or health official dealing with the issue. Imagine being the magistrate listening to these stories every day and making decisions that have major implications for families.

heart wrenching

It makes you feel like going Dexter on these dads. Once Were Warriors I hope their outcome is. Forget the magistrate, imagine being the health workers that treat these children, their resilience must be off the charts.
That video of the nurse is being pushed all over LinkedIn so hopefully the unaware public are getting as ****ed off about this as I am. May create some pressure for change. Roll the army through there and start removing these rapist paedophiles.

 

[Kram]

Indigenous education strategy failing remote communities

 

[nut]

Indigenous education strategy failing remote communities

It should be opposite …. Schools should be a combination of Indigenous study’s and normal curriculum … in country, with kids from the cities boarding there…

 

[Kram]

I don't know what the answer is on the location. But you would think education needs to be tailored quite specifically towards and staffed by Indigenous Australians rather than being shoehorned into the white man's.

 

[kranky al]

I mean if you think the only quality post on here, when specifically talking about Aboriginal Australians, is to suggest "boarding schools" and "sterilisation", even with all the caveats, then I don't know what to say to you.

Its an absolute crisis. What people dont get is that brain damaged kids are growing up, succumbing to drugs and alcohol and having multiple kids themselves that are irreparably damaged. Its exponential. A huge percentage of these kids are taken into care from birth and require 24/7 care the rest of their lives. The ones that get out of the care system repeat the process.

These kids yet to be born have no rights as it stands. They are born without a chance in life.

As for the boarding school thing, go to kalgoorlie, have a look at the kids who live on mattresses at the local park and have to dodge drunken and drug affected folk whilst trying to get time to sleep. The only thing getting these kids to school is a feed and a chance to be safe for a few hours.

The stolen generation has meant that we try to tread so softly that we sit by and allow abuse to happen.

When the kids eventually do get taken into care, they are mentally damaged almost beyond repair. One of my fosters has seen his little sister raped multiple times. Hes been flogged to within an inch of his life, his mother tried to end it all by setting the house on fire with the kids in it.

I suggest the boarding school thing because i want a safe place for them. I want them surrounded by aboriginal folk who are role models and have succeeded in life. The current system waits till a kid is mentally ruined and then puts them in care with a white carer, who whilst giving the kid love, affection and a safe place, its not enough. They need to be aboriginal, they need to be brought up by people that know.

The folk at home are beyond help. No amount of money can fix them. I dont see another option.

 

[Bloods86]

Its an absolute crisis. What people dont get is that brain damaged kids are growing up, succumbing to drugs and alcohol and having multiple kids themselves that are irreparably damaged. Its exponential. A huge percentage of these kids are taken into care from birth and require 24/7 care the rest of their lives. The ones that get out of the care system repeat the process.

These kids yet to be born have no rights as it stands. They are born without a chance in life.

As for the boarding school thing, go to kalgoorlie, have a look at the kids who live on mattresses at the local park and have to dodge drunken and drug affected folk whilst trying to get time to sleep. The only thing getting these kids to school is a feed and a chance to be safe for a few hours.

The stolen generation has meant that we try to tread so softly that we sit by and allow abuse to happen.

When the kids eventually do get taken into care, they are mentally damaged almost beyond repair. One of my fosters has seen his little sister raped multiple times. Hes been flogged to within an inch of his life, his mother tried to end it all by setting the house on fire with the kids in it.

I suggest the boarding school thing because i want a safe place for them. I want them surrounded by aboriginal folk who are role models and have succeeded in life. The current system waits till a kid is mentally ruined and then puts them in care with a white carer, who whilst giving the kid love, affection and a safe place, its not enough. They need to be aboriginal, they need to be brought up by people that know.

The folk at home are beyond help. No amount of money can fix them. I dont see another option.

To be fair I think the "sterilisation" idea is worse than the "boarding school" one.

I think our history of mission and boarding schools, the stolen generation etc should make us very cautious.

I understand for the boarding school idea, there were a lot of caveats to ensure that it is voluntary and that it being staffed by other Aboriginal people is important. I think there's plenty of factors which would diminish the perception of it being voluntary, but I guess my main critique there would be - who would send their kids away voluntarily, given history? Certainly if there's parents that are not in a position to care for their kids or are causing them harm, probably wouldn't voluntarily send their kids away (especially in the latter scenario). You may have some parents who want to get their kids away from troubled areas, but that's not what people are really getting at here.

Re: sterilisation, I think the idea of offering people who have substance abuse issues or face financial difficulties, a financial incentive to get sterilised (which is not always reversible), is a very poorly thought through idea. And has no place to be applied based on race, although I don't know if that was the suggestion.

 

[ibd77]

I don't know what the answer is on the location. But you would think education needs to be tailored quite specifically towards and staffed by Indigenous Australians rather than being shoehorned into the white man's.

How do you integrate Indigenous Australians in an industrial world? Most people who live in the modern world need to integrate in some form an industry to support a livelihood. I don't how many Indigenous Australians who actively choose this lifestyle or would prefer to go back to either being hunter gatherers or simply live of off welfare.

There are only so many professional positions in Australia for artists, sports, charity & tourism sectors that seem to be a common occupation for Indigenous Australians. I rarely see them in manufacturing, construction, mining, retail or even hospitality sectors. Obviously they would claim discrimination as a factor however more industries are being proactive in hire Indigenous Australians into these sectors.

Clearly their needs to be cultural shift towards industrialisation which needs to be led by Indigenous Australian elders otherwise they will keep regressing into oblivion.

 

[Power Raid]

It makes you feel like going Dexter on these dads. Once Were Warriors I hope their outcome is. Forget the magistrate, imagine being the health workers that treat these children, their resilience must be off the charts.
That video of the nurse is being pushed all over LinkedIn so hopefully the unaware public are getting as ****ed off about this as I am. May create some pressure for change. Roll the army through there and start removing these rapist paedophiles.

My sister has the personality for this type of stuff. She has endless amounts of tolerance and ability to keep giving despite being no positive outcome.

For me, my personality is.......do work, generate outcome......happy or try harder for a better outcome. I would have to go a dexter only because I'm not big enough to go all "once were warriors".......but obviously not a real solution.



There are definitely people that need to be removed from communities as a starting point but long term the answer is "participation". Jobs should be the primary goal but even "participating" and giving people a purpose is a must.

Creating purpose/ opportunty where they are may be an option but also incentives for people to move to opportunity should be encouraged. ie here is $200 dole (or whatever the rate is today) if you do nothing......$300 if you participate and $500 if you relocate to this location.

I'd also encourage paying indigenous kids from the age of 10-12 $500 a week to start an apprenticeship. As I see more value in breaking the cycle and catching kids before they start to fail.

 

[South of the Yarra]

Wow some of what I am reading has rendered me speechless.

 

[kranky al]

To be fair I think the "sterilisation" idea is worse than the "boarding school" one.

I think our history of mission and boarding schools, the stolen generation etc should make us very cautious.

I understand for the boarding school idea, there were a lot of caveats to ensure that it is voluntary and that it being staffed by other Aboriginal people is important. I think there's plenty of factors which would diminish the perception of it being voluntary, but I guess my main critique there would be - who would send their kids away voluntarily, given history? Certainly if there's parents that are not in a position to care for their kids or are causing them harm, probably wouldn't voluntarily send their kids away (especially in the latter scenario). You may have some parents who want to get their kids away from troubled areas, but that's not what people are really getting at here.

Re: sterilisation, I think the idea of offering people who have substance abuse issues or face financial difficulties, a financial incentive to get sterilised (which is not always reversible), is a very poorly thought through idea. And has no place to be applied based on race, although I don't know if that was the suggestion.

I’d, apply it to anyone who is addicted to drugs or alcohol

 

[Bloods86]

Its an absolute crisis. What people dont get is that brain damaged kids are growing up, succumbing to drugs and alcohol and having multiple kids themselves that are irreparably damaged. Its exponential. A huge percentage of these kids are taken into care from birth and require 24/7 care the rest of their lives. The ones that get out of the care system repeat the process.

These kids yet to be born have no rights as it stands. They are born without a chance in life.

As for the boarding school thing, go to kalgoorlie, have a look at the kids who live on mattresses at the local park and have to dodge drunken and drug affected folk whilst trying to get time to sleep. The only thing getting these kids to school is a feed and a chance to be safe for a few hours.

The stolen generation has meant that we try to tread so softly that we sit by and allow abuse to happen.

When the kids eventually do get taken into care, they are mentally damaged almost beyond repair. One of my fosters has seen his little sister raped multiple times. Hes been flogged to within an inch of his life, his mother tried to end it all by setting the house on fire with the kids in it.

I suggest the boarding school thing because i want a safe place for them. I want them surrounded by aboriginal folk who are role models and have succeeded in life. The current system waits till a kid is mentally ruined and then puts them in care with a white carer, who whilst giving the kid love, affection and a safe place, its not enough. They need to be aboriginal, they need to be brought up by people that know.

The folk at home are beyond help. No amount of money can fix them. I dont see another option.

One thing I would clarify, is that if you're suggesting that replacing parts of the care/foster system for kids that have been removed involuntarily from families because of the proven harm being done to them, with what you're talking about, then that's a fair idea. I'd be surprised if it hasn't been tried. I just don't know how it would work if it were a voluntary boarding school as in the post you quoted earlier.

 

[CakeEater]

Its troubling.

The problem is a multitude of factors
-Lack of Social Housing
-Lack of decent jobs in the town
-Education is a challenge

• Tension is high up there with the Walker incident still rippling through communities out there
• lack of activities

 

[cartwright]

I’ve been trying to find some information on why so many people in juvenile detention/jail are indigenous.. what crimes are they committing.


I found this, from 2021

Australia's anguish: the Indigenous kids trapped behind bars

In a new series, Childhood in custody, Guardian Australia investigates the overrepresentation of Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander children in juvenile justice and examines how the system operates – by telling the personal stories of those who live and work in it

www.theguardian.com

Some alarming detail…

The study of 99 children in Banskia Hill detention centre found nine out of 10 kids had some cognitive impairment, and one in three had foetal alcohol spectrum disorder – the highest known rate in the world of FASD among any population in the justice system. Seventy-four per cent of the children in the study were Aboriginal.

 

[Gethelred]

Can we not learn from our history? Have we not learnt from the Stolen Generations? Boarding schools would work for some individuals and families but would be a drastic failure for most. Foster care has some very strong merits and there have been successes of removing children from families but there have also been tales of tragedy. The issue is that we do not understand what Aboriginal education is at many local community levels. Walking in both worlds works for some children but is a disaster for others.
Generation after generation have failed Aboriginal people. The issue much be addressed form the ground up at each community level. Many Aboriginal people are broken, beaten and 'know their place'. The Aboriginal people that are concerned for the violence are responsible for the horrors they cause but there is no fix at an individual level. We are on the brink of another broken generation.

If it's okay, can you provide insight into the changes you'd make to either:

- make education more friendly to indigenous students
or

- make wider Australian classrooms more friendly to indigenous methods of learning.

If not, I can remove this post at your discretion.

 

[nut]

To be fair I think the "sterilisation" idea is worse than the "boarding school" one.

I think our history of mission and boarding schools, the stolen generation etc should make us very cautious.

I understand for the boarding school idea, there were a lot of caveats to ensure that it is voluntary and that it being staffed by other Aboriginal people is important. I think there's plenty of factors which would diminish the perception of it being voluntary, but I guess my main critique there would be - who would send their kids away voluntarily, given history? Certainly if there's parents that are not in a position to care for their kids or are causing them harm, probably wouldn't voluntarily send their kids away (especially in the latter scenario). You may have some parents who want to get their kids away from troubled areas, but that's not what people are really getting at here.

Re: sterilisation, I think the idea of offering people who have substance abuse issues or face financial difficulties, a financial incentive to get sterilised (which is not always reversible), is a very poorly thought through idea. And has no place to be applied based on race, although I don't know if that was the suggestion.

I suggest you get on a plane and see the situations with your own eyes…

Also Re: stolen generation, a lot of the stolen generation were half casts that were treated differently in communities … these kids were outcasts because they were not full blood, last to get feed etc… not condoning the removal of kids from parents but in some instances it was necessary and still is … in all areas of society.
The idea that we would leave kids in vulnerable situations because of backlash from past practice is a form of racism!!!!

 

[nut]

Wow some of what I am reading has rendered me speechless.

Yer is better turning a blind eye and ignoring it.

 

[Bloods86]

Yer is better turning a blind eye and ignoring it.

Making such simple minded comments isn't exactly making you seem like you have anything constructive to say.

 

[Bloods86]

I suggest you get on a plane and see the situations with your own eyes…

Also Re: stolen generation, a lot of the stolen generation were half casts that were treated differently in communities … these kids were outcasts because they were not full blood, last to get feed etc… not condoning the removal of kids from parents but in some instances it was necessary and still is … in all areas of society.
The idea that we would leave kids in vulnerable situations because of backlash from past practice is a form of racism!!!!

Why would I, a non expert, without proper training to assist, go act as a tourist, into some communities I'm not supposed to enter, and potentially make things worse. What a dumb suggestion.

If you bothered to read posts, you'd see that I am not advocating leaving kids in situations where they are being harmed.

 

[nut]

Making such simple minded comments isn't exactly making you seem like you have anything constructive to say.

Yer because the comment I quoted was so insightful!!!

 

[nut]

Why would I, a non expert, without proper training to assist, go act as a tourist, into some communities I'm not supposed to enter, and potentially make things worse. What a dumb suggestion.

If you bothered to read posts, you'd see that I am not advocating leaving kids in situations where they are being harmed.

Sorry if I offended , I just don’t think we need to be cautious at all. A child in danger is a child in danger.

 

[Bloods86]

Sorry if I offended , I just don’t think we need to be cautious at all. A child in danger is a child in danger.

No you didn't. If you read through the posts you'll see I was critiquing a voluntary boarding school idea at first, then it seemed like the concept got changed a bit, so I agree that if what people were talking about was a substitute for part of our existing care/foster system where kids are already removed involuntarily due to proven harm, then that's a fair idea. This seems like it could be in line with the local community-based suggestion from the poster you just slandered by saying they were turning a blind eye.

 

[nut]

I’ve been trying to find some information on why so many people in juvenile detention/jail are indigenous.. what crimes are they committing.


I found this, from 2021

Australia's anguish: the Indigenous kids trapped behind bars

In a new series, Childhood in custody, Guardian Australia investigates the overrepresentation of Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander children in juvenile justice and examines how the system operates – by telling the personal stories of those who live and work in it

www.theguardian.com

Some alarming detail…

The study of 99 children in Banskia Hill detention centre found nine out of 10 kids had some cognitive impairment, and one in three had foetal alcohol spectrum disorder – the highest known rate in the world of FASD among any population in the justice system. Seventy-four per cent of the children in the study were Aboriginal.

This why I am a strong supporter of dry communities.
We simply don’t have the resources to give people the support they need there.

 

[Power Raid]

Can we not learn from our history? Have we not learnt from the Stolen Generations? Boarding schools would work for some individuals and families but would be a drastic failure for most. Foster care has some very strong merits and there have been successes of removing children from families but there have also been tales of tragedy. The issue is that we do not understand what Aboriginal education is at many local community levels. Walking in both worlds works for some children but is a disaster for others.
Generation after generation have failed Aboriginal people. The issue much be addressed form the ground up at each community level. Many Aboriginal people are broken, beaten and 'know their place'. The Aboriginal people that are concerned for the violence are responsible for the horrors they cause but there is no fix at an individual level. We are on the brink of another broken generation.

if we want a solution all we have to do is look at what failed when indigenous people were kicked off the stations and given the dole.

Not to say these things were wrong but what went wrong and what could have been done better.

At least understanding this will give us clues to a better future.