Mega Thread Best 22/2013 Predictions and all that

[The_Wookie]

Take away the emotion and have a look at the facts of a player that's in his seven season and what return we have from an enormous investment. Extremely disappointing. You are basing your view on potential alone surely.

Actually have a look at the last two seasons before he got injured. In 2011 he was sent back to the Ants and dominated, resulting in a very good recall period in the seniors before he injured himself against the swans. He returned to the Ants near the end of the year, and was arguably one of the keys missing from our loss to West Coast. He kicked more than a goal a match, was labelled the leagues most improved before getting injured in round 15. It should be noted that many expected the resting ruck to kick a goal a match - and this he did consistently. No what we have here is the same problem we've had for the last two years with hammer, and that is people just dont want to believe hes improved.

Is hammer dropping marks, sure. Half of what he drops though are grabs that Warnock and Kreuzer have NO hope of being able to get to. He has huge vertical leap. If we actually had a crumber like Betts around him at all times when we go forward we'd be much better off

Dont try to use injury as an excuse for holding him out though, I mean how much game time have Warnock and Kreuzer had over the same period.

As always I leave you with this:

 

[BluStreak]

Big men take longer to develop but Kreuzer and Warnock playing at their best have shown a fair bit more then Hampson. If our midfielders kick the ball to Hampson 10 times and he only marks once while the other nine times the ball becomes impossible for our forwards to crumb then his role as a forward is detrimental to the team. We are better off giving Casboult and Rowe time in the forward line instead of trying to tinker around with Hampson who really struggles to even bring the ball to ground. This is my just my opinion of what I've seen from him over the last couple of years but I admit he may come out and surprise me this year. Until then though I can only really see Hampson struggling against any team with reasonable defense to the point that he becomes a liability.

All I am saying is that Hampson had an off night against Brisbane, given that it is generally accepted that the delivery into the forwards was average at best on the night small wonder. In the other preseason games he play well and everyone on this board had him as their second ruck ahead of Warnock. Also from memory in 2012, he was holding marks and was our only tall forward option until his injury in the early part of the season.
As to our other options, I agree with you on Casboult and Rowe needing more games in them. I think we should also be putting more games into Watson. I have no idea what way Mick will go with team selection but I believe we have the players to finals this year. If I had of found this site two years ago you would have seen me advocating the sakcing of carrots. He ticked me off royally, as he continually racked up possessions but they always put a team mate under pressure, always (worst than anything Lucas has done to date) This year I was voting for him to be captain. Opinions change so do players.

 

[Jock]

Jesus

Actually have a look at the last two seasons before he got injured. In 2011 he was sent back to the Ants and dominated, resulting in a very good recall period in the seniors before he injured himself against the swans. He returned to the Ants near the end of the year, and was arguably one of the keys missing from our loss to West Coast. He kicked more than a goal a match, was labelled the leagues most improved before getting injured in round 15. It should be noted that many expected the resting ruck to kick a goal a match - and this he did consistently. No what we have here is the same problem we've had for the last two years with hammer, and that is people just dont want to believe hes improved.

Is hammer dropping marks, sure. Half of what he drops though are grabs that Warnock and Kreuzer have NO hope of being able to get to. He has huge vertical leap. If we actually had a crumber like Betts around him at all times when we go forward we'd be much better off

Dont try to use injury as an excuse for holding him out though, I mean how much game time have Warnock and Kreuzer had over the same period.

As always I leave you with this:

Jesus Wookie if I highlighted every dropped grab that was swept down the other end for an attack that put Jamison and co under pressure I'd fill the bloody board V's a few flashy highlights. Anyhoo I admire your support regardless.

 

[The_Wookie]

Jesus


Jesus Wookie if I highlighted every dropped grab that was swept down the other end for an attack that put Jamison and co under pressure I'd fill the bloody board V's a few flashy highlights. Anyhoo I admire your support regardless.

yeah fortunately Im not here to trash players from my own team.

 

[BM123]

All I am saying is that Hampson had an off night against Brisbane, given that it is generally accepted that the delivery into the forwards was average at best on the night small wonder. In the other preseason games he play well and everyone on this board had him as their second ruck ahead of Warnock. Also from memory in 2012, he was holding marks and was our only tall forward option until his injury in the early part of the season.
As to our other options, I agree with you on Casboult and Rowe needing more games in them. I think we should also be putting more games into Watson. I have no idea what way Mick will go with team selection but I believe we have the players to finals this year. If I had of found this site two years ago you would have seen me advocating the sakcing of carrots. He ticked me off royally, as he continually racked up possessions but they always put a team mate under pressure, always (worst than anything Lucas has done to date) This year I was voting for him to be captain. Opinions change so do players.

That is fair enough and to be honest I'd rather he come out and play really well instead of seeing him struggle out there so hopefully things do turn out well for him just like they did for Carazzo. I also agree on getting games into Watson too because I'm really keen on seeing Carlton develop players such as Bell, Watson, Casboult and Kanes Lucas.

 

[Jock]

yeah fortunately Im not here to trash players from my own team.

As I said I really do admire your unconditional support. I give our players a good 3-5 yrs to show their stuff and I will give them even longer if they are the type to keep their head over the ball and hold their tackles and play well when the chips are down. If they can't consistently contribute after this time they are taking someones spot who should be given the chance.

 

[BlueTongue]

On Hampson - I guess it boils down to what is the best fit for the team.
To my mind (and in an injury & form Slump free world), having a large Tap ruckman who is hard to move off the ball and can kick straight, and a more mobile ruckman who can cover ground and plug holes at either end as required, would be my ideal duo. Throw in a couple of Key Forwards that can pinch hit and throw their weight around when we are down a ruckman, or playing against more agile Op ruckman, and you should have it covered. We appear to have these options already.

However, in this senario, I can't include Hampson. Kreuzer is our best mobile ruckman and Warnock, when in form, is an awesome tap ruckman who can compete with a big Sandilands/Maric type. Even If Warnock wasn't at the club, I'd expect that Kreuzer would still be taking Hampson's spot for the mobile ruckman. Hampson is too easily pushed off the ball (including in a marking contest up forward). I do however think he's better suited as a mobile ruck/forward than pure ruck, but is behind the other two IMHO. I'd like to see Hammer traded (as much for his sake as the clubs') at the end of the year while he is still young and has some cred. It is a waste for us to keep him and we'd get a good pick for him, and it'd also give him a better opportunity elsewhere (eg. Bris, or GC) where he has the potential to be a No.1 ruck. Next Draft we should be getting another Project ruckman who is much younger and will get more opportunity in a few years time, rather than have three who are all competing for a spot, and will likely retire or be delisted around the same time.

 

[Stamos]

B: Laidler, Jamison, Walker
HB: Scotland, Henderson, McInnes
C: Simpson, Gibbs, Yarran
HF: Garlett, Waite, Armfield
F: Betts, Casboult, Hampson
Foll: Kreuzer, Judd, Murphy

I/C: Carrazzo, McLean, Robinson
Sub: Bell

 

[Azzurro]

B: Laidler, Jamison, Walker
HB: Scotland, Henderson, McInnes
C: Simpson, Gibbs, Yarran
HF: Garlett, Waite, Armfield
F: Betts, Casboult, Hampson
Foll: Kreuzer, Judd, Murphy

I/C: Carrazzo, McLean, Robinson
Sub: Bell

Hard to fault this Stamos.

Makes me remember how vital Waite is - I've been looking at our current "Fit/Available 22" and it seems to be missing something... and while Scotland and McInnes are huge for us, we have some options available to cover them at least. With Waite, there is nobody on our list that compares to his ability and X-factor.

Casboult as the second / third target is a scary thought - instead of taking the opposition's best defender, their #1 will go to Waite, #2 or their taller option to Hampson, and therefore #3 to Casbah. If you look at our backline as an indicator, it means someone of the build of Walker/Laidler/McInnes having to worry about stopping the man mountain that is Levi.

No Duigan in there but I can deal with that I guess

 

[Sin City]

I reckon this will get a go at some stage during the year.

Laidler Jamison Simpson
Bootsma Henderson Walker
Murphy Gibbs Scotland
Garlett Waite Yarran
Betts Casboult Hampson
Kreuzer Judd Carrazzo
Robinson McLean Bell
Sub: Lucas

 

[I bleed Blue]

We need Laidler back in form.

Our defence is infinatly better with him in the side.

If he is simply out of favour with Mick I have no idea why.

Get Laids back in the team!

 

[sacamano]

Would be crazy is man of the moment Yarran being released by up and comer Tuohy.

 

[gbatman]

This is the state of our best 22 currently.

B: Touhy Jamison Player1
HB: Scotland Henderson Walker
C: Simpson Judd Gibbs
HF: Armfield Player2 Yarran
F: Betts Waite Garlett
OB: Kreuzer Mclean Murphy
IC: Carrazzo Robinson Player3 Lucas

Player1 - The third tall. An unsettled role in our side. So far we have tried Laidler, Davies and White. Bootsma is a future option for this position too and has been tried as well. So far no one has starred here, some have struggled, White did ok against the eagles and Davies did ok against Geelong but no one has stepped up to make this role their own and play it in an "elite" fashion. So far White has looked the best marginally. McInness is a player who looks very suited to this position and I feel if fit may have been the player to have played all 4 games here. Happy for White to take this spot for now though.

Player2 - Is the second tall forward. We all Know Waite is the number 1 man at the club, but can he get fit and when will he play? So far we have tried Hampson, Casboult and Rowe as tall forwards and all have done the bare minimum with a few impressive cameos. Hampson and Rowe both look the best two options so far. Perhaps Rowe is a bit ahead of Hampson as he looks a bit more versatile and agile and maybe even a slightly better kick and mark. Mitchell is also progressing in the VFL for this position but has yet to show up his competition there but has been serviceable.

Player3 - Is a specialist inside onballer. Bell and Curnow have been tried in this position. Bell was ok but was exposed for pace, particularly off the mark and his defensive running wasn't good. Curnow was good against the eagles, collected a fair amount of the ball and did a good defensive job, just can't kick and his handballing is terrible. David Ellard is another option for this role and was going great in the nab cup before injury. In the past has been pushed around far too easily at AFL level and has failed to get enough of the footy but is he re-invented? We have good honest battlers in this role but we would be a vastly improved team if we added an elite player to play this role. Someone who has the body strength, running ability and defensive skills of Curnow but who can also find it a little more when freed up and who can dispose of it properly would be great. Cachia maybe but I feel he is a slightly different version of what we already have. I look at Menzel and Graham and they are two skilled players who can find the ball and are strong powerful blokes. When they are ready they will likely fit this mould but this is some time away yet. All last year and the first two games this year we were poor at clearing it from the center and clearances in general, I recon with the right player and of high quality here in this role we can resolve this problem a bit.

Players who are a bit borderline are Lucas, Touhy and Waite. They are best 22 and Touhy and Lucas are playing ok but I feel if they go up a level we will benefit greatly.

Waite - He is always injured and in the twilight of his career. Needs to get out on the field.

Lucas - That first quarter against the eagles where he refused to put his head over the ball 4 or 5 times and had no intensity or aggression was the bad Lucas. The rest of the game was mostly the good Lucas. He's a talent, but only when he attacks the footy and puts his head over it. Need him to find consistency and aggression.

Touhy - I've said for a while we have lacked a really good small defender. Last year a few little blokes got hold of us. Joseph gets exposed playing close to goals. Duigan is not going well at the moment and was always hit and miss on the real good small forwards. You think of guns in this position they are usually fast, can stop elite small forwards like Milne and when they have a chance to attack they can find plenty of it, run with the ball and deliver well. Heath and Rhyce Shaw types. A second Walker would be great too! Touhy is improving and he's close to the next level we want to seem him get too but he's not an elite small defender yet. Was good on LeCras the other night. Would be nice to see him lift his work rate and find a bit more of the ball himself but an improvement from him is a big improvement for Carlton and he is best 22 which is a good.
In saying this we were exposed with Scotland out and not match fit. Rotating Simpson, Gibbs and Robinson through the backline has been very good for us and closed a few holes. Having Walker back there to provide a hard edge and run has been a godsend. One thing is for sure, we are going to need Temay to be good because while we don't lack numbers, we are a little short on quality in this area and with injury or Scotland retiring we might be opened up here a bit.

 

[Big Sim]

Love your work Gbatman^^^^^^^^^

 

[Jeremias]

The bye week presents as a fantastic opportunity to revisit this thread. No doubt it opens itself up to some interesting discussion based on what we've seen thus far this season.

As I have stated on a number of occasions, I don't necessarily agree with the premise of a best 22. However assuming full fitness across the entire squad this is how I think we'd line up:

B: Zach Tuohy - Michael Jamison - Andrew McInnes
HB: Kade Simpson - Lachie Henderson - Andrew Walker
C: Kane Lucas - Brock McLean - Bryce Gibbs
HF: Jeff Garlett - Levi Casboult - Mitch Robinson
F: Eddie Betts - Jarrad Waite - Chris Yarran
R: Matthew Kreuzer - Chris Judd - Marc Murphy
INT: Andrew Carrazzo - Dennis Armfield - Heath Scotland - Ed Curnow

Despite using 35 players to this point in the season I believe we have a fairly settled side where most of the players pick themselves. However there are a number of positions up for genuine debate.

1. 3rd tall defender

I think it is fair to say that we have a number of options for this position.

Simon White: Has been a preferred option this season and has performed to a solid level. Not a star and never will be, but a good honest footballer who has a crack. Has a big frame and certainly is not afraid to use that to his advantage and really throw his weight around. Solid across the board with pace, disposal and defensive ability but decision making is an aspect he sometimes struggles with.

Josh Bootsma: Very talented kid who clearly is liked by the MC but the question remains - is he ready yet? Certainly not ready to step up to the plate as 3rd defender on a permanent basis but don't mind him being given game time as a learning experience. Beautiful user of the football and is probably the best spoiler of the football at the club. Unfortunately his frame at this stage makes it too easy for opponents to push off him and get to the contest unattended. Would like to see him further up the ground at times as he has the traits to be a very good player roaming the wings.

Jeremy Laidler: Clearly the unanimous choice of the supporters for this position prior to the season but he's now a long way back in the pecking order. Had a brilliant 2011 but his 2012 was destroyed by knee injuries and he hasn't yet been able to recapture that pre-injury form. Has been shifted into the forward line at VFL level and has been solid. Clearly not the player he once was whether that be due to injury, form, confidence or an amalgamation of those factors. Hopefully he picks up in the second half of the season as he's too good a footballer to be languishing in the reserves and he'll have offers to move to other clubs should he be unable to break back into the senior side. I hope it does not reach that point as he is a very good footballer but at this stage it does not look good.

Andrew McInnes: On the comeback trail from a knee reconstruction and is the player I believe is best suited to this position. Has now had 2 games back and has not missed a beat. I'll be very surprised should he not feature at senior level this season and he could well do so for our next game against Sydney. Just a solid footballer who does everything well. Good size, good skill, good speed, good defensive ability, good flexibility - he gets a tick in each department. I made the comment in the preseason that I believe him to be in our best side and I stand by that comment.

Marcus Davies: Was tried at senior level early in the season and don't think he did too badly. Unfortunately struck down by injury just as he was trying to build something and has been unable to recapture that form. Most believe him to be number 1 on the chopping block and in truth it is difficult to argue against that. Faces a huge second half of the season and has to pull out something special if he is to keep his place on the list. Aggression is fantastic and a real plus but there are unfortunately just too many negatives which cancel that out.

Matthew Watson: Certainly not the preferred option as he's far more suited to playing as a tall defender. Has talent but clearly behind Jamison and Henderson in the pecking order so will have to wait his turn.

Patrick McCarthy: Very talented kid who has been struck down by injury for the remainder of the season and as such his name can be crossed off for now.

2. Second tall forward

Levi Casboult: It is difficult not to love what he brings to the table. Huge body and he is certainly not afraid to use that to his advantage. Regularly launches himself into packs and is quite simply a beast on the contested marking front. Also very capable in the ruck despite being slightly undersized and can certainly hold his own as a chop-out option both in the centre and around the ground. Many have raised concerns over his mobility and inability to cover the ground but I certainly don't share that opinion. Is more than capable around the ground and busts a gut to get to contest after contest. That he is able to get to contests in the back half and take those contested grabs deep in the defensive 50 is a huge advantage and something he certainly has over those competing with him for a spot. Fades out at times but that will come with an increased fitness base. Kicking is obviously the major deficiency to his game. Just cannot be trusted anywhere in front of goals which is a huge disappointment and something which may well hold him back from reaching his full potential.

Shaun Hampson: Started the season in the senior side as our number 1 forward but was unable to stamp his authority on a position and now finds himself at VFL level. Has plenty of talent but for mine is not consistent enough either in his marking or his finishing to be a reliable option for us heading forward. Athletically excellent which allows him to get to plenty of contests but does not impact them enough for a player of his stature. In my mind is clearly a ruckman first and forward second but the opposite has been tried at senior level and as much as I want it to work it is becoming more difficult to justify. Very solid in the ruck but even then he's probably 3rd in line for that position.

Matthew Kreuzer: Terrific as the number 1 ruck and certainly my preferred option for that position but unfortunately not as effective when playing in the forward line. Can be very dangerous when drifting forward as a ruckman and can hit the scoreboard but seems to lose himself when playing as a permanent forward. His accuracy has also deserted him - a few years back he was money with the set shot but now he is struggling in a big way. Whether that be technique or confidence related I'm not sure but it does need to be ironed out as he's too good a footballer to miss time and time again.

Sam Rowe: Sam has done well to play a few games but clearly not our preferred option and his time in the game I feel is limited. Just does not have enough tricks to ensure longevity. However he has to be admired as he does bust a gut and contest but he just falls short. Reasonable stop-gap option and has probably done enough to warrant another season on the list but clearly he's not in our best side and is a depth option only. Has been tried in the ruck as well but he isn't suited to that role at all.

Luke Mitchell: Last in line for now and I believe he will remain as such for the remainder of the season. Has been at the club for a few years now but has not been afforded any sort of continuity thanks to injuries which have really stalled his progress. Is not injury free and starting to feel good about himself and working his way into some form which is fantastic to see. Very much a power forward but he doesn't yet use his frame and his power to full advantage but that will come in time. Not particularly quick and as such is not able to get any separation between himself and his direct opponent meaning he is more reliant on strength which as I said just is not there at this stage. More than happy for him to play every game at VFL level as it is more important for him to get those games under his belt than to appear at AFL level.

3. Inside midfielder

Ed Curnow: Now in his third year on the rookie list and it is make or break for Ed as he has to either be elevated or delisted at the end of this season. Clearly rated internally as he is the nominated rookie and has been for a few years now on the trot. Thus far this season Ed has performed nicely playing as a tagger on what I consider to be 'hybrid' midfielders, those who are as comfortable in and under as they are on the outside. Has shut down some very damaging footballers and is rightly now very much a constant in the side. Knows how to blanket his direct opponent whilst finding plenty of the ball himself. Needs to work on disposal and decision making as he is not damaging enough going the other way. Right now I have him clearly in front for this position as I feel so much of his work goes unheralded by the general public.

Tom Bell: Very rough around the edges and has some way to go but the promise is there and clear for all to see. Don't consider him a tagger but rather a big body who thrives on the bash and crash inside stuff. Huge frame for a midfielder and he can use it to his advantage but more than that he is an athlete who can run a game out. Pushes hard forward to provide an option and knows how to impact the scoreboard. Excellent tackling technique unlike many of his team mates and if he tackles you you'll have a hard time getting out of it. Very much thrives on physical intimidation which in many respects is exactly what we need. However there are aspects of the game that Tom is yet to fully grasp and that is holding him back at the moment. Very average user of the football and not much better in terms of decision making. Must improve in both facets of the game to really make his mark and for now he's behind a few for a spot in the side but he's not too far off it.

Jaryd Cachia: Hard to not be impressed by what Jaryd is producing at the moment. Didn't quite make it in his first stint at the club but to his credit has come back significantly better and is having a real impact. I made the comment during the preseason that he's the furthest away in our squad from a senior game and how wrong I was. Has now played 7 games and is becoming more comfortable at senior level with every outing. Still has much to work on but his attitude is impressive as is his relentless attack on the ball and his willingness to impact the contest. Needs to continue to work on his skills but they aren't a glaring deficiency. May well find himself out of the side once Carrazzo is ready to resume but is filling in nicely in the interim. I certainly can't say he is best 22 but he'll feature at senior level throughout the season and he'll be able to fill a role nicely when he does play.

David Ellard: Furthest away from a senior game of all the candidates but believe that to be due to injury. Was impressive through the preseason but unfortunately has been halted by persistent injuries since. Another who doesn't and won't take a backward step. Not only is he able to play through the middle but also knows how to kick a goal which is a point of difference in his favour over the likes of Curnow and Cachia. Not hard to see that Mick is a fan but even then it is hard to say anything other than time is running out for him.

Injuries, suspension and form are likely to halter our progress at some stage but assuming full fitness that would mean we could have the following lineup at VFL level:

B: Simon White - Matthew Watson - Aaron Joseph
HB: Josh Bootsma - Sam Rowe - Nick Duigan
C: Dylan Buckley - Tom Bell - Tom Temay
HF: Troy Menzel - Shaun Hampson - Nick Graham
F: Jeremy Laidler - Luke Mitchell - Frazer Dale
R: Robert Warnock - Jaryd Cachia - David Ellard
INT: Andrew Collins - Rhys O'Keeffe - Patrick McCarthy - Marcus Davies

Some impressive talent at that level and plenty of development still to come. Looking at that our deficiencies are clear but contrary to popular belief we do run quite deep at this stage.

 

[dropdead1]

I predict the Blues to be 6 and 6 before the bye round. I also think we will win 7 out of our last 10 and finish 7th on the ladder.