List Mgmt. COLLINGWOOD Trade and F/A Discussion 2023

[Mollythedolly]

The original intent of the rookie draft was to give prospects who didn't make the cut in the national draft a chance at still being picked up in the rookie draft. Now clubs are using it mainly to shuffle current players off their primary list temporarily to create additional national draft pick slots, whether it be for bid matching purposes as mentioned above or just to meet the requirement for the minimum of three additions to the primary list in the ND.

Not sure how you wouldn't call that exploitation tbh whether it be sanctioned or not, but it's all moot if the rumblings are to be believed about rookie rules being firmly in the sights of the new management at AFL house.

I think there's more than a little hyperbole in play here. What was there this year, 7 players redrafted to the rookie list by the club that delisted them. Add that 2 (afaik) of them (Melksham and Wingard) have long term injuries so it's as much about supporting the player through the injury recovery as anything else. There's a high potential neither of them play a senior game in 2024. Clubs leaving list spots clear for SSP and MSD has a more significant impact. Look at us, 3 list spaces unfilled following ND, PSD, and RD.

As I've said, you retain a player, whether that via demotion or retention on a senior list, and you deny yourself the opportunity of picking up another potential long-term player. There's a risk/cost either way.

Barring the relisting of Kelly, we haven't done it this year, we did the previous year with Murley. And really it was the AFL draft requirements that forced that on us. We needed a list spot and the only way to do that was delist a contracted player. The only way to minimise the impact of that was to redraft him.

 

[Mollythedolly]

Rookies used to have an age cap as well. I think it was 23.

Did they? How long ago was that? JPod was 28 when rookie drafted in 2009. Was he less worthy of a shot than someone under an arbitrary age limit?

Edit: answered by Partypie.

 

[Mollythedolly]

They may need to expand list sizes and make it minimum 2 rookie picks (not upgrades) per team per year.
Maybe first pick 2 year contract, 2nd-3rd pick 1 year contracts?


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Can't see list sizes ever being increased again, especially with another team on the horizon.

 

[DIDAIC0S]

Can't see list sizes ever being increased again, especially with another team on the horizon.

Maybe increase them for the years prior to Tassie team, then reduce them the year before? More players floating about!


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[The Phantom]

Maybe increase them for the years prior to Tassie team, then reduce them the year before? More players floating about!


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Actually not such a silly way to increase the talent pool

 

[Scodog10]

I think we'll take Teakle, as I do think we need ruck depth.

I don’t see Teakle as depth. He may be a bit older, but he’s only had 18 months and 1 AFL preseason so like Steene and Begg he’s not ready to be playing for a contender if injuries mount, IMO.

I agree though I’m fine with adding depth in that role, but it’s such a difficult role to recruit for because there’s so few senior roles available making it hard to offer opportunity. I think the depth option we were better off with was Sweet as soon as Port went for Soldo. Year end though I’d be making Moyle my number 1 trade target.

 

[Apex36]

Just get rid of the rookie list, and have one primary list. Wingard who's been in the system for 12 years, doesn't really fall under the meaning of a rookie!!

Wingard is sort of irrelevant to the conversation now given that Hawthorn took him in the PSD.

 

[sr36]

I don’t see Teakle as depth. He may be a bit older, but he’s only had 18 months and 1 AFL preseason so like Steene and Begg he’s not ready to be playing for a contender if injuries mount, IMO.

I agree though I’m fine with adding depth in that role, but it’s such a difficult role to recruit for because there’s so few senior roles available making it hard to offer opportunity. I think the depth option we were better off with was Sweet as soon as Port went for Soldo. Year end though I’d be making Moyle my number 1 trade target.

I don't really know anything about him. I just think Frampton needs to be settled in defence - I don't think he's one who has the smarts to be a jack of all trades. And Begg just doesn't seem a genuine AFL ruck option.

Hine announcing the plan to keep a spot open for the msd is an interesting one, perhaps we're looking at treating the msd with its initial intention - injury cover?

 

[Scodog10]

I don't really know anything about him. I just think Frampton needs to be settled in defence - I don't think he's one who has the smarts to be a jack of all trades. And Begg just doesn't seem a genuine AFL ruck option.

Hine announcing the plan to keep a spot open for the msd is an interesting one, perhaps we're looking at treating the msd with its initial intention - injury cover?

I know enough to be dangerous hah. For me the standout train on player is Sofronidis if he’s got AFL talent because he seems to play the Collingwood way. Playing it out if he’s got that talent then he’s a better KPD option than both Frampton and Dean who I think have flaws that make them NQR in our system. Bringing it back to Teakle we might be overegging the omelette by looking for ruck depth with Frampton more than adequate and possibly usurped as the next KPD in by Sofronidis.

None of that’s to suggest I think we have to go with Sofronidis or that if we chose Teakle instead that it’s a cross, but I just feel that’s the best mix for 2024. The other point for me is I’m a buyer of Bytel. There’s many on here that have talked up Macrae, but the fact is right now Bytel is both a better VFL and AFL footballer. With the loss of Adams and Macrae the next mid in that makes him a necessity to at the very least put pressure on Macrae to step up.

I think if you add two of those three then I agree the MSD very much becomes an injury cover draft because I don’t see many other roles to fill. Maybe small forward? With how we play your point last leek on sending HH back stuck and I think I’d like another option up our sleeve.

 

[Harry O]

Listened to Collegians coach (and ex VFL pies coach) Jarred Rivers this morning on SEN about Sofa

Said he is very quick , can play on smalls and talls and compared him to Tom Stewart

Apparently Geelong and Adelaide were both interested but he seems to have chosen us as his preference

I think he has a god job outside footy so he will only leave VAFA for an afl opportunity

 

[ElliottsMaggies]

Listened to Collegians coach (and ex VFL pies coach) Jarred Rivers this morning on SEN about Sofa

Said he is very quick , can play on smalls and talls and compared him to Tom Stewart

Apparently Geelong and Adelaide were both interested but he seems to have chosen us as his preference

I think he has a god job outside footy so he will only leave VAFA for an afl opportunity

I was thinking about the employment they have elsewhere for these guys whilst listening to this, you'd need an understanding boss to take up this opportunity too. Dedication & commitment required all round.

 

[sideswipe]

I was thinking about the employment they have elsewhere for these guys whilst listening to this, you'd need an understanding boss to take up this opportunity too. Dedication & commitment required all round.

Not too big an ask for an employer to grant a 23yo a leave of absence between now and mid-Feb?

 

[Mollythedolly]

Listened to Collegians coach (and ex VFL pies coach) Jarred Rivers this morning on SEN about Sofa

Said he is very quick , can play on smalls and talls and compared him to Tom Stewart

Apparently Geelong and Adelaide were both interested but he seems to have chosen us as his preference

I think he has a god job outside footy so he will only leave VAFA for an afl opportunity

We need more deity types. Not sure what a god job entails but definitely adds to our Messiah (Nick) and hand of god (Pendles). Bodes well for the future.

 

[Scodog10]

Listened to Collegians coach (and ex VFL pies coach) Jarred Rivers this morning on SEN about Sofa

Said he is very quick , can play on smalls and talls and compared him to Tom Stewart

Apparently Geelong and Adelaide were both interested but he seems to have chosen us as his preference

I think he has a god job outside footy so he will only leave VAFA for an afl opportunity

What no way! A guy with a good job playing VAFA won’t leave for the VFL? I wonder how he managed to get that gig…

 

[Harry O]

One other thing to remember with SSP trials is we may give 2 of them a DCM at Xmas and look at another 2 in Jan / Feb

 

[Harry O]

What no way! A guy with a good job playing VAFA won’t leave for the VFL? I wonder how he managed to get that gig…

Probably just playing for the old boys team of the school he attended
I think 18-19 of the Collegians premiership team attended Wesley

 

[sr36]

One other thing to remember with SSP trials is we may give 2 of them a DCM at Xmas and look at another 2 in Jan / Feb

Had to google it. I hope we don't give them this:

Dilated cardiomyopathy (DCM) is a condition in which the left ventricle, the heart's main pumping chamber, is enlarged (dilated).

 

[ElliottsMaggies]

Not too big an ask for an employer to grant a 23yo a leave of absence between now and mid-Feb?

Well that all depends on where he works doesn't it & what he does for a job? It still requires a certain level of flexibility & understanding from his employer for this to work for both parties. If the club picks him up, he won't be returning to that employer. Does the club pay him whilst he's training with them? Not sure his employer would be if he's taking time off. So what does he live on?

I'm merely commenting on the logistics & how it all works.

Employer's could be perfectly fine with their employees having to take off days for training in these situations & that's great. It was just a query.

 

[sr36]

Well that all depends on where he works doesn't it & what he does for a job? It still requires a certain level of flexibility & understanding from his employer for this to work for both parties. If the club picks him up, he won't be returning to that employer. Does the club pay him whilst he's training with them? Not sure his employer would be. So what does he live on?

I'm merely commenting on the logistics & how it all works.

Clubs pay them $1000 a week according to an earlier report.

 

[ElliottsMaggies]

Clubs pay them $1000 a week according to an earlier report.

No way. Do they?

If that's the case, who cares what his boss thinks.

 

[Jen2310]

No way. Do they?

If that's the case, who cares what his boss thinks.

Triallists will be paid a minimum of $1,000 per week to train, with clubs also responsible for the cost of return airfares and accommodation if the player is invited to train with an interstate club.

AFL locks in dates, clarifies rules for pre-season SSP

The pre-season supplemental selection period will run from November 27 to February 19

www.afl.com.au

 

[barrackers]

Hine announcing the plan to keep a spot open for the msd is an interesting one, perhaps we're looking at treating the msd with its initial intention - injury cover?

Possibly a learning from last year when Cox and Cameron were injured, but we didn’t have a spot to bring in a mature ruck like Naismith

 

[ElliottsMaggies]

AFL locks in dates, clarifies rules for pre-season SSP

The pre-season supplemental selection period will run from November 27 to February 19

www.afl.com.au

Sounds like the perfect summer activity whilst getting paid.

I hope all their bosses are okay with them returning to their job if they don't get picked up by the club, lol.

 

[sr36]

Sounds like the perfect summer activity whilst getting paid.

I hope all their bosses are okay with them returning to their job if they don't get picked up by the club, lol.

Most of them would be pretty young and not in career jobs yet.

 

[Gabbo64]

Clubs pay them $1000 a week according to an earlier report.

You wouldn't want be trying to live on that would you. But I guess if your boss docked you for time off it would even out.