Opinion Commentary and media

[Kanga Glory]

Someone might be able to post the Buckemara list summary on the Hun site.

In short...

Doesn't rate the list.

Unsure on Durdin.

Should have kept Boomer and NDS on...Drew cooked.

Wouldn't be surprised if we bottom 6.

Doesn't mention Preuss .which is odd...because he spends a bit of time querying the reliance on Goldy.

Can someone post Buckemara's assessment of North from the Herald sun this morning

 

[compass]

Can someone post Buckemara's assessment of North from the Herald sun this morning

Gary Buckenara analyses North Melbourne’s list after 2016 season

GARY BUCKENARA, Herald Sun
October 26, 2016 4:06pm

NORTH Melbourne is at the crossroads.
Their injuries this year showed a lack of depth on the list. They went from winning nine in a row at the start of the season to falling over the line and being the weakest team in the finals series.

To put it bluntly: If North Melbourne wants to win a premiership, it must completely rebuild the list.

The Kangaroos have been a middle-tier club worried about bottoming out but it seems as though, with the decisions made on those well-respected greats, they might be ready to go down that path. They’ve finally understood it and accepted it, which is a very hard thing to do for a middle of the road club that relies on being competitive every year to sell memberships.

From my experience, I have no doubt from board level through to the football department they’re in a period where they’re thinking: We’ve played finals, been close to a Grand Final, can we capitalise on this momentum? We might not have a list good enough to win a flag but let’s continue to play finals and gain that support and build our membership to keep the money rolling in with sponsorship dollars as well. That all comes as a result of playing finals.

But at the end of the day, all football clubs exist to win premierships. That’s the ultimate goal.

If the ultimate goal is just to play finals then to me that defeats the purpose of why you’re all there. You need to strive for the excellence required to achieve the ultimate success.

As list managers it’s our job to know whether the list is good enough to win a premiership and if not, what decisions are we going to make that will see us become a better team going forward? Have we got the patience and the resolve to rebuild through the draft and go through some hard years in terms of on-field performance and results for a long-term benefit?

The time is now to find out if these young kids can play at the level. For too long North Melbourne has topped up with players from other clubs and not exposed these draftees to senior footy. They must do that now.

I’m thinking of guys like Sam Durdin, Ben McKay, Corey Wagner, Declan Mountford and Ed Vickers-Willis. I do have my question marks on Durdin though, with his competitiveness and his football smarts.

Brad Scott needs to play them to find out if they’re players for the future and the ones who’ll be key parts of the rebuild. That’s all part of rebuilding the list.

Having said that, you still need experience around the club while rebuilding and that’s why I was really puzzled about the decision to axe Brent Harvey. He hadn’t lost his pace and was clearly still one of their best players, someone who has star power. And to a lesser extent Nick Dal Santo as well, I thought both of those had something to offer in 2017.

The Kangaroos made the right decision on Drew Petrie though. To me at the end of the year he looked cooked, whereas Harvey and Dal Santo didn’t. Firrito was a bit of a line ball call, probably the right one.

But the list is in trouble.

I was worried both last year and this year because I’ve felt the Kangaroos were one or two injuries — particularly to Goldstein — away from their side being severely disrupted and unfortunately for Scott and the club’s supporters, that’s exactly what happened.

It was no coincidence when Goldstein was playing injured and then missed a game, their form dramatically dropped away. That’s a major concern.

Todd Goldstein is North Melbourne’s barometer. If he plays well, the Kangaroos win. If he’s struggling, then the whole team goes down with him.

Majak Daw has committed to the club and the club has committed to him but is he the answer? Will he or is he capable of becoming that huge influence like Goldstein?

I look at the list and try to find another ruckman and really, Daw is it. Petrie helped out in that area but now he’s obviously gone and Ben Brown has done some of that work but they’ll need him to be a stay-at-home key forward because there is a lack of key position players.

The biggest concerns I have — even though they’ve lost a lot of experience with Petrie, Harvey, Firrito, Dal Santo and now Daniel Wells leaving will bring down their average age — if I go through the young players on the list I’m not sure how good they are. Which players will be their next stars and take the places of the departing champions?

I’m left scratching my head a little bit when I do look down the list for these guys.
While there is some talent there, I just don’t see enough good players.

Jed Anderson is going to be a good player — he was a bit of a whipping boy this year but his body hasn’t been right for a while. But at least he played some footy this year so he’ll be better for that, he’ll be better next year.

I like Ben Jacobs as a player, Ben Cunnington has developed into a really good player, young McKay has some talent as has Durdin but will that talent come to the fore? As I wrote earlier I’ve got some question marks on him and I’m concerned that even though North will need he and McKay to step up next year, I’m not sure they’re ready in terms of their development.

Daniel Nielson was unlucky doing his knee but he’s not going to be a match-winner, he’ll be a depth player. Taylor Garner is a handy player, Ryan Clarke has some upside, Trent Dumont has shown some signs, Shaun Atley and Sam Wright and developing nicely into good regular 22 players, Luke McDonald was in and out and still finding his feet.

Mason Wood has potential, Jamie Macmillan had a good year, Kayne Turner is a bit injury-prone, Sam Gibson and Ben Brown have been serviceable.

But when you go through the list, they’re all nice players and depth players but are they going to win you a premiership?

They’re lacking star power. And that’s why they rely so heavily on Goldstein.
The Kangaroos recruited three players during the trade period and I like what they’ve done. Basically all three have joined for little in terms of trade deals and have cost North Melbourne in salary cap only.

Nathan Hrovat from the Bulldogs is an in and under player who couldn’t break into what turned out to be the premiership team despite solid VFL form. I liked him as an under 18s player so he could be a good addition.

Marley Williams arrived the cheapest, which leads me to question whether he may have been pushed out by the Pies? But Williams is like Hrovat in that he’s a player they desperately need given he adds pace. But while he’s handy, he isn’t a star and both are small/mid-sized players rather than key position which is a critical need at the Kangaroos. Williams also isn’t is a great kick either.

Paul Ahern from GWS is again a mid-sized player who can play both forward and in the midfield. He has some real talent but two knee reconstructions is a concern. Hopefully he has a change in luck at Arden St.

WHAT THEY NEED
North Melbourne definitely needs players with height and a back-up ruckman to Goldstein is the first port of call. I don’t think Daw is a ruckman, he doesn’t read the play well enough around the ground. If something happens to Goldstein and he’s their No.1 ruckman, then North Melbourne is in strife. They also need at least another key forward and key defender plus more outside pace. More generally, the Kangaroos need players who use the ball well.

I think there are too many players with average kicks on the list — even some of their better players like Andrew Swallow isn’t a great kick and neither is Cunnington or Jacobs. Jack Ziebell is a great kick and so is Shaun Higgins, while Atley is OK and so is Wright but McDonald isn’t a pinpoint kick. Players with good kicks coming off halfback is a particular need because when they look inside and are required to hit targets in the midfield, they need to do so in the modern game 9/10 times not 6/10. North Melbourne doesn’t have that and that’s why they struggle. It hurts them.

WHO’S UNDER THE PUMP
The Kangaroos have re-signed Daw so now he’s got to step up. He’s wanted the opportunities and now he’s going to get them so it’s time to deliver. No more “what if” or “I’d be in if Petrie or whoever wasn’t there”, there are no more excuses.

It shows me that there is such a lack of talls in the AFL landscape that other clubs were actually interested in trying to get Daw out of North Melbourne. He can do some brilliant things but he just doesn’t do them enough, he’s so inconsistent. But at the end of the day that’s probably why he survives, because he can do freakish things.
Aaron Mullett is one that’s been around a while but where is he going as a player? He’s had some injuries but even when fit hasn’t been a regular since he had that breakout season a few years back.

Ed Vickers-Willis hasn’t broken through so he’ll be needing to show a bit next year, particularly given it’s looking like more young kids will get their chance at senior level. He needs to be one of those.

WHO SHOULD GO
Brent Harvey, Drew Petrie, Nick Dal Santo, Michael Firrito, Robin Nahas, Brad McKenzie and Joel Tippett have all been delisted and Farren Ray has retired, while Wells has departed as a free agent and I think Mullett would be one to be moved on. The rest of the players just haven’t had exposure at senior level and they deserve a chance.

CRYSTAL BALL
I worry about North Melbourne. They could go from top eight to a bottom six club. It wouldn’t surprise me, if they do go down the full rebuild path, that they end up finishing really low on the ladder because there just isn’t a huge amount of quality coming through, nor have the young guys been exposed at all at senior level. They’ll be thrown right into the deep end.

 

[Firestarter]

Nothing no one has ever said about our list for the last 8 years.

 

[Kangaroos4eva]

I stopped at Ben Brown being just serviceable.

 

[Firestarter]

I stopped at Ben Brown being just serviceable.

I stopped at Gaso's summary.

 

[Benno_900]

And to a lesser extent Nick Dal Santo as well, I thought both of those had something to offer in 2017.

Firrito was a bit of a line ball call

I look at the list and try to find another ruckman and really, Daw is it.

Taylor Garner is a handy player, Ryan Clarke has some upside, Trent Dumont has shown some signs, Shaun Atley developing nicely into good regular 22 players, Luke McDonald was in and out and still finding his feet.

Mason Wood has potential, Jamie Macmillan had a good year, Kayne Turner is a bit injury-prone, Sam Gibson and Ben Brown have been serviceable.

Lazy analysis

 

[Kimbo]

Lazy analysis

Extremely.

North Melbourne needed a major rebuild and finally [sic] woke up to the need to do this with their delistings. Nekminnit, I would have kept Harvey and Dal Santo on the list for experience.

Rucks are really, really important and I can't see another one on the list beyond Goldstein. I mean, seriously, wtf?

Jed has been a whipping boy? I'd have thought he'd been reading this Board, except he'd be better educated if he had.

These sort of articles really grind my gears, not because of the comments about NMFC, but due to the sheer laziness of people paid to deliver insightful analysis. Or, is the expectation of insightful analysis a misguided reader expectation? Reminds me of:

"I came here for a good argument."
"No you didn't; no, you came here for an argument."
"An argument isn't just contradiction."
"It can be."

 

[Passmore]

Lazy analysis

It's a bit weird Very hit and miss. Like he's had trouble concentrating. In some parts he seems like he's analysed really well and in others not at all.

If you can't spend the time to do it properly, I'm not sure why you'd bother.

 

[shintemaster]

It's a bit weird Very hit and miss. Like he's had trouble concentrating. In some parts he seems like he's analysed really well and in others not at all.

If you can't spend the time to do it properly, I'm not sure why you'd bother.

Spot on. I find myself agreeing completely with parts and then the next minute thinking WTF? How does this guy even pretend to know anything about this team?

I love how the entire football world is now coming out and explaining how North need to reevaluate their list - 2 months after they have already acted on that reevaluation.

Going to enjoy us shoving it right up them all next year.

 

[ROORAGE]

Just add this irrelevant media hack to the list

Brian Taylor (like to ram my dukes through that smug pricks face)
Gerard Healy
Dwayne pipe russel
Daniel harford and that golfer knob who does the show with him on sen
Caroline Wilson
Fat prick smith the raving alcoholic
Tim gossage
Basil zemplas the raving coke head
Mud guts Hutchison
Mark 'fanboy' Robertson

I've barely scratched the surface. Take a listen to these flogs and witness just how impartial their commentary is.

I just wrote the words 'journalism degree' on a piece of toilet paper. Now I am as qualified to write afl endorsed pieces as these pathetic dregs of humanity.

 

[Arden]

Dogs breakfast of an article.

Had a go at Nielsen because he isn't going to be a match winner. A young full back who is coming into his third season and did an ACL in his first. But then he goes on to say that Atley is developing nicely into a best 22 player. The knock should be on Atley for not becoming a match winner.

Apparently we need McKay to step up next year. A 19 year old key forward. Who is he going to displace from the forward line, Brown, Wood, Waite or Daw? I hardly think our season depends on McKay stepping up. Tall forwards are our depth.

 

[Le Grille]

Dogs breakfast of an article.

Had a go at Nielsen because he isn't going to be a match winner. A young full back who is coming into his third season and did an ACL in his first. But then he goes on to say that Atley is developing nicely into a best 22 player. The knock should be on Atley for not becoming a match winner.

Apparently we need McKay to step up next year. A 19 year old key forward. Who is he going to displace from the forward line, Brown, Wood, Waite or Daw? I hardly think our season depends on McKay stepping up. Tall forwards are our depth.

In terms of Key Backs, is there any that you would call match winners? even rancey boy. If they have a good game they do their job (as vital as it is)

 

[Le Grille]

on another note why the * are all these failed coaches considered "experts" ? * me drunk

 

[ROORAGE]

Cast your mind back a few years to when the talk was about how melbourne and the toothless Tigers' lists were better than ours. funny how that talk died off. Melbourne! That's how much stock we should put in what are effectively ill informed puff pieces. We've been bottoming out for the last decade apparently.

 

[big_e]

on another note why the **** are all these failed coaches considered "experts" ? **** me drunk

He at least acknowledges it. This is from his LinkedIn profile:

Senior Coach
Sydney Swans Ltd
October 1991 – May 1993 (1 year 8 months)
Senior Coach - (Trying to Forget)

 

[darko]

Need to completely rebuild the list yet he questions Boomer axing. Right.

 

[ViperR1]

I'm actually not sure if Buckenara got anything right in that article - and if he did he would contradict his own opinion.

Awful bit of researching and analysis.

 

[Hearts to hearts]

Footy clubs "existing to win premierships" is one of those truisms that ain't true at all. Footy clubs exist to exist - to sustain themselves and keep operating. Flags are great for everyone involved and for fans who feel they were, but a club exists regardless. If North Melbourne only won flags occasionally but played finals most years, that would be highly enjoyable and a bloody good effort. Not everybody - actually nobody else - does what the Hawks did, making themselves more crap for a few years and turning that into several premierships. The media all need to stop saying it's the magic bullet.

 

[blackshadow]

Footy clubs "existing to win premierships" is one of those truisms that ain't true at all. Footy clubs exist to exist - to sustain themselves and keep operating. Flags are great for everyone involved and for fans who feel they were, but a club exists regardless. If North Melbourne only won flags occasionally but played finals most years, that would be highly enjoyable and a bloody good effort. Not everybody - actually nobody else - does what the Hawks did, making themselves more crap for a few years and turning that into several premierships. The media all need to stop saying it's the magic bullet.

Richmond exist for lulz

 

[Contra Mundum]

I'm actually not sure if Buckenara got anything right in that article - and if he did he would contradict his own opinion.

Awful bit of researching and analysis.

None of them do the barest research - if they sat there with the Encyclopedia of AFL Footballers they might get some of the s**t right. It's all trading in smug cliches propogated by the army of unthinking clowns that are the AFL media

PS: when Bucky kicked that goal after the Siren in the SOO to sink one of the greatest Vic sides every assembled at the WACA - it was the closest thing to an organism I have had in polite company

 

[Gasometer]

It's a bit weird Very hit and miss. Like he's had trouble concentrating. In some parts he seems like he's analysed really well and in others not at all.

If you can't spend the time to do it properly, I'm not sure why you'd bother.

Its like Gary had to go for a drive (write) but got distracted every now and then...

 

[SonofSamsquanch]

Its like Gary had to go for a drive (write) but got distracted every now and then...

Either that or he's got some form of attention deficit disorder, and lost track of his thoughts midsentence.

Like Voss - could play a bit. Dumb as dogshit.

 

[ferball]

Its like he doesn't really care and would rather be fishing or something but has to write some crap to get paid.

 

[The Big O]

Our list is crap but can't recommend anyone to cut other than Mullet, and of those we cut he thinks we should have kept two and possibly spud.
McKay comment baffling.
Wood has potential! Imo he is one of the most exciting prospects in the Afl next year.

 

[muttley45]

"Ed Vickers-Willis hasn't broken through" bit of a tough call considering he hasn't even made his debut yet