Analysis How different would today's AFL landscape be if the 1989 merger between Fitzroy and Footscray went ahead, and would that club have been succesful ?

[Elmer_Judd]

One of the most and ignored sliding door moments of the last vestiges of the VFL era was the controversial proposal and merger of The Roys and Footscray in 1989 ..

There was still some very good players playing for Fitzroy at the time, and Footscray too


I often think Fitzroy fans would have been much better off with this team than the eventual Brisbane Bears merger (least they would have gotten to see most of their games live in Victoria

But the Doggies fans fought tooth and nail to save their Sons of the Scray, so I doubt many Dogs fans would have supported the newly formed club

If this went through, it's arguable that other Vic clubs mergers happened, so it's probably for the best it didn't.

 

[Power Raid]

It would have made more sense to merge Melbourne based sides rather than relocate

Western Roos
South Melbourne Saints
Melbourne Lions

it would have built up the supporter bases of the smaller clubs. Relocation has probably not resulted in South Melbourne support following the Swans, nor Fitzroy with the Lions.

The same failure would probably result with North moving to Tassie

 

[footyfan1978]

I do not think it ignored at all. Well not by us that followed footy for this long. It was just about the biggest story in footy after South relocation to Sydney. It went the right way. If supporters do not want a merger it should never happen and it did not as a result. North and Fitzroy is the one that seems ignored and Bears situation more ignored and lost in the wash of Fitzroy out of the league. I think mergers at local footy make more sense.
What happended to the identity of Woodville annd West Torrens in SANFL? Those names of clubs seemed lost much like University in this league is mostly lost in the wash and mentioned as a footnote in history.

 

[jabba5114]

The western lions. Would be interesting to see. Don't know if they get a threepeat like Brisbane did following there merger. Maybe more finals though

Sent from my motorola edge 30 pro using Tapatalk

 

[Feraligatr]

The western lions. Would be interesting to see. Don't know if they get a threepeat like Brisbane did following there merger. Maybe more finals though

Sent from my motorola edge 30 pro using Tapatalk

I don't think they would have 3 peated either but I think they might of snagged at least one or 2 GFs in the 90s.

I think a North-Fitzroy merger would have had a bigger effect on the AFL as we know it now if that had of gone through.

 

[footyfan1978]

I don't think they would have 3 peated either but I think they might of snagged at least one or 2 GFs in the 90s.

I think a North-Fitzroy merger would have had a bigger effect on the AFL as we know it now if that had of gone through.

Yes, it would have won some flags and clubs rebelled against them having a bigger list than other teams.
I think that one of reasons it never went ahead.

 

[footyfan1978]

I remember thinking in 1989 it would be better for Fitzroy to keep their own identity and join the VFA than be part of Footscray merged team.
As it turns out the AFL killed off the VFA anyway a few years into the next decade and made it a hybrid compeition with AFL Vic based reserve sides so if Fitzroy had gone there it would be interesting to know where they were today.

 

[Roylion]

But the Doggies fans fought tooth and nail to save their Sons of the Scray, so I doubt many Dogs fans would have supported the newly formed club

1989's proposed "Fitzroy Bulldogs" playing in Fitzroy's colours and jumpers out of Princes Park may have been far more palatable to Footscray's supporters had it been the "Footscray Lions", playing in Fitzroy's colours and a FFC logo jumper out at the Western Oval.

Footscray would have kept their name and the training base (possibly the home ground) at the Western Oval instead of Princes Park, while Fitzroy would have had the mascot and the colours. The jumper might have been Fitzroy's red and royal blue jumper with a white Fitzroy FFC (Footscray Football Club) logo and possibly white horizontal stripes to evoke Fooscray's jumper but still primarily in the Fitzroy design).

A gold Fitzroy Lion would have been added on the breast of the jumper.



Likely 1990 list of the Footscray Lions

Matthew Armstrong, Simon Atkins, Jason Baldwin, Darren Baxter, Paul Broderick, Leon Cameron, Scott Clayton, Glenn Coleman, Danny Del-Re, Matthew Dundas, Greg Eppelstun, Peter Foster, Michael Gale, Chris Grant, Doug Hawkins, Matthew Hogg, Mark Hunter, John Ironmonger, Darren Kappler, Nigel Kellett, Rick Kennedy, Stephen Kolyniuk, Tony Liberatore, Alistair Lynch, Ross Lyon, Brendan McCormack, Tony McGuiness, Stephen McPherson, Richard Osborne, Matthew Rendell, Brian Royal, Paul Roos, Brett Stephens, David Strooper, Terry Wallace, Stephen Wallis, Darren Whieldon, Jim Wynd, Scott Wynd


The "Melbourne Lions" proposal in 1986 and again in 1994 playing in the red, navy blue Melbourne jumper with the gold Fitzroy lion overlaid (in the manner of the current Brisbane Lions jumper) probably would have worked too for both sets of supporters.








Possible Melbourne Lions 1987 list


Matthew Armstrong, Jason Baldwin, Doug Barwick, Mick Conlan, Michael Gale, Leon Harris, Greg Healy, Ken Hinkley, Darren Kappler, Grant Lawrie, Gary Lyon, Ross Lyon, Scott McIvor, Richard Osborne, Tim Pekin, Gary Pert, Matthew Rendell, Paul Roos, Brett Stephens, Steven Stretch, David Strooper, Jim Stynes, Ross Thornton, Todd Viney, Sean Wight, Jim Wynd,

 

[Dogs_r_barking]

It wasn’t a merger it was a takeover, which the Dogs supporters recognised.

 

[Jim Prideaux]

Geographically it would’ve been a mess. If you were to merge Fitzroy with a Melbourne based team back then, the Demons are the only team that would make sense. Collingwood and arguably Carlton are closer, but in the 80’s and 90’s there was zero chance, same with Richmond. If the dogs were to merge, it would be North Melbourne or nothing.

As it was, I think what eventuated was the best solution. Having teams in Fitzroy, Richmond, Collingwood and Carlton was never going to work.

 

[PJGoDogs]

It was never a merger but an attempted take over by a terribly run club of an also terribly run club. The difference between us and Fitzroy was we stayed in Footscray while they moved from ground to ground , alienating their few supporters. I still remember the smugness of their President Leon Weigard thinking all their mismanagement would be swept under the rug with the merger money. We would never have mixed with their theatre going, inner city fans

 

[demondavey]

I do not think it ignored at all. Well not by us that followed footy for this long. It was just about the biggest story in footy after South relocation to Sydney. It went the right way. If supporters do not want a merger it should never happen and it did not as a result. North and Fitzroy is the one that seems ignored and Bears situation more ignored and lost in the wash of Fitzroy out of the league. I think mergers at local footy make more sense.
What happended to the identity of Woodville annd West Torrens in SANFL? Those names of clubs seemed lost much like University in this league is mostly lost in the wash and mentioned as a footnote in history.

But when would you have merged North & Fitzroy? Fitzroy merged with Brisbane about 1996? North Melbourne were huge in the nineties.

 

[BallaratBulldog]

I don't think they would have 3 peated either but I think they might of snagged at least one or 2 GFs in the 90s.

I think a North-Fitzroy merger would have had a bigger effect on the AFL as we know it now if that had of gone through.

To be fair, the Dogs should have convered at lest one of the 90s prelim to a grand final appearance of their own and possible flag.

I would not have supported an AFL side if the Dogs died or merged.

 

[Feraligatr]

To be fair, the Dogs should have convered at lest one of the 90s prelim to a grand final appearance of their own and possible flag.

Yeah, probably a bit unlucky then.
In my lifetime, I'm 32, I reckon the dogs have been up around the mark for most of it. Just unfortunate timing with the teams around them always peaking.

 

[footyfan1978]

But when would you have merged North & Fitzroy? Fitzroy merged with Brisbane about 1996? North Melbourne were huge in the nineties.

I did not want them to merge.

 

[Mr Ripper]

I thought at the time, and probably still do now, that if it wasn't such a one-sided deal Fitzroy's way, they might have gotten away with it.

 

[Bunk Moreland]

I don’t think the landscape today would be any different, really. Footscray would be the Lions and Brisbane would be the Bears. That aside, pretty much the same.

 

[Supercoach Bargain]

If it had happened the "Bad news Bears" staying terrible might have ensured no Gold Coast side.

If they had merged, maybe Melbourne/Hawthorn would not have fallen over. But probably would have anyway.

The biggestr thing would be if the league got their way, it may have continued with other clubs or relocations.

 

[tess]

If it had gone ahead I think it would have encouraged other VFL teams to have merged to possibly super clubs.
North Carlton
North Essendon
Melbourne Tigers
Richmond Saints
Probably the only club that was safe would have been Collingwood, although they did offer Fitzroy a Deal, Collingwood seconds would be called Fitzroy.

 

[CarterS]

Not many of us around but there were some die hard Brisbane Bears supporters who were disappointed at the merge- Bears just starting to forge their (hard fought) identity. I grew up supporting the Bears and was at the first home game.

 

[CarterS]

If it had happened the "Bad news Bears" staying terrible might have ensured no Gold Coast side.

If they had merged, maybe Melbourne/Hawthorn would not have fallen over. But probably would have anyway.

The biggestr thing would be if the league got their way, it may have continued with other clubs or relocations.

Bears finished 3rd in 1996

 

[Dogs Rule]

 

[The King!]

Theres a podcast on it

 

[Bunk Moreland]

If it had happened the "Bad news Bears" staying terrible might have ensured no Gold Coast side.

If they had merged, maybe Melbourne/Hawthorn would not have fallen over. But probably would have anyway.

The biggestr thing would be if the league got their way, it may have continued with other clubs or relocations.

The Bad News Bears were long dead by then. It’s sometimes forgotten they were already on a very good trajectory before the merger. They’d long since moved to the Gabba, played finals in 95, played a prelim in 96, and had a good young side with plenty of talent (incl some local talent).

Who knows if they win the flag or three, but they were going well. Securing Matthews really pushed them over the top.

 

[Freomaniac]

To be fair, the Dogs should have convered at lest one of the 90s prelim to a grand final appearance of their own and possible flag.

I would not have supported an AFL side if the Dogs died or merged.

Dogs made preliminary finals in 1992, 1997 and 1998.

I don't think the merged Fitzroy / Footscray team would of won 1992 or 1998. Definately 1997.

Probably would of won the 1997 flag.