News Jack Grimes

[Crusty Demon]

Seems to be a fair bit of hate for Dawes lately, and it's probably not justified. He's kicked 16 goals in just 13 games this year, and if he hadn't been injured for a number of games he could've gone close beating his PB of 30 goals and 1 Brownlow vote in 2010. Cut the guy some slack, he's only 26.

Wasn't having a dig at what Dawes has achieved this season. I feel he's been OK(nothing to rave about though). Was having a go at his decision making and his kick late in the game when we had a slender lead. Terrible terrible decision by a senior player and leader of our club. Was merely pointing out to others in this thread, that Jack Grimes did make a skill error very late in the game. But I thought the kick from Dawes a minute or two earlier was more costly!! Was a poor decision by Dawes, who by all reports is a smart bloke. Wasn't a smart decision...

 

[Cannon82]

Wasn't having a dig at what Dawes has achieved this season. I feel he's been OK(nothing to rave about though). Was having a go at his decision making and his kick late in the game when we had a slender lead. Terrible terrible decision by a senior player and leader of our club. Was merely pointing out to others in this thread, that Jack Grimes did make a skill error very late in the game. But I thought the kick from Dawes a minute or two earlier was more costly!! Was a poor decision by Dawes, who by all reports is a smart bloke. Wasn't a smart decision...

I have no love for Dawes and was being sarcastic.

 

[Gysberts2Bate]

Seems to be a fair bit of hate for Dawes lately, and it's probably not justified. He's kicked 16 goals in just 13 games this year, and if he hadn't been injured for a number of games he could've gone close beating his PB of 30 goals and 1 Brownlow vote in 2010. Cut the guy some slack, he's only 26.

Sarcasm, in case anyone didn't get it.

EDIT:

I have no love for Dawes and was being sarcastic.

Oops.

 

[melbournemartin]

Honestly, I forget from time to time that he is the captain. I only think of Jones.

 

[thetank]

Well no s**t, Maxwell had Swan, Pendlebury, Beams, Sidebottom, Cloke etc at his disposal, how in the blue hell can you use this as something against Grimes' captaincy?

My God man.

Someone else brought up Maxwell as also being a poor player (not me).

I responded by saying that the Pies won a premiership under Maxwell, so it didn't really matter whether Maxwell was a good or bad player. The goal of a team is to win a premiership, and if they win one with a bad player as captain - so be it.

Now, is Melbourne winning premierships?

Melbourne lost / is losing the majority of its matches under Grimes, and Grimes is not cutting it as a footballer (and that is his job first and foremost). What exactly is the downside of removing Grimes' captaincy - would Melbourne have won only 1 game in 2013 instead of 2? I actually do not see any positives by having Grimes as a captain, but there is an ironclad negative - he is a liability as a footballer.

A captain MUST be an excellent footballer first and foremost - 99% not negotiable. The only time this rule should be broken is if the team wins premierships.

 

[Cannon82]

A captain MUST be an excellent footballer first and foremost - 99% not negotiable. The only time this rule should be broken is if the team wins premierships.

Seems a bit cart before the horse.

 

[Jordie_tackles]

People saying it didn't matter if maxwell was a good player ect because they won a premiership, yes that's true but I would have thought if he wasnt bringing more to the table much like grimes who I would have as a footballer over maxwell then thy lose out, winning one premiership could be looked as a failure? Could they have done better without maxwell and a players player rather than a leader/player?

 

[thetank]

Seems a bit cart before the horse.

How so?

Doesn't seem to be good football coaching to go onto the field 17 vs 18...however if you can win with only 17 players then go for it.

 

[thetank]

People saying it didn't matter if maxwell was a good player ect because they won a premiership, yes that's true but I would have thought if he wasnt bringing more to the table much like grimes who I would have as a footballer over maxwell then thy lose out, winning one premiership could be looked as a failure? Could they have done better without maxwell and a players player rather than a leader/player?

Don't see how 1 premiership is a failure when:
- an all-time great side in Geelong was around;
- a powerhouse in Hawks was around;
- St Kilda had a high-powered midfield and Riewoldt in his prime.

Let's not forget that the messiah Paul Roos only has 1 premiership to his name.

St Kilda is considered more of a failure, with zero premierships, than Geelong/Collingwood not having won more.

 

[Cannon82]

How so?

Doesn't seem to be good football coaching to go onto the field 17 vs 18...however if you can win with only 17 players then go for it.

You appoint a captain at the start of the season and potentially win a Premiership at the end of it. The logic seems a little strange to me. If a team thinks they have a side worthy of contending, they can afford to appoint a lesser player captain. If not, one of the best players gets the gig.

Who our captain is or should be is at the bottom of the list of factors in why we're a rubbish side.

 

[Tulip]

You appoint a captain at the start of the season and potentially win a Premiership at the end of it. The logic seems a little strange to me. If a team thinks they have a side worthy of contending, they can afford to appoint a lesser player captain. If not, one of the best players gets the gig.

Who our captain is or should be is at the bottom of the list of factors in why we're a rubbish side.

And is also a very easy matter to address. Jones is our leader, spiritually and with his actions on field. His media profile has improved significantly since he took the captaincy on. Why dilute something that doesn't need it?

 

[Cannon82]

And is also a very easy matter to address. Jones is our leader, spiritually and with his actions on field. His media profile has improved significantly since he took the captaincy on. Why dilute something that doesn't need it?

No doubt. I agree Jones is the on-field leader and should be the sole captain but I think it makes the square root of FA difference to team performance.

 

[schmuttt]

It is a bit odd that Jones isn't the sole captain, I mean Grimes didn't crumble like Trengove did but always thought it made more sense for chunk to be the main man. He has been our best player by a mile since 2012 and he thrives on the responsibility.

Not that I think captaincy is a huge issue, but just thought it was a little odd Jones wasn't the sole captain when Roos came aboard, I guess he didn't want to rock the boat too much.

 

[thetank]

You appoint a captain at the start of the season and potentially win a Premiership at the end of it. The logic seems a little strange to me. If a team thinks they have a side worthy of contending, they can afford to appoint a lesser player captain. If not, one of the best players gets the gig.

Who our captain is or should be is at the bottom of the list of factors in why we're a rubbish side.

Our captain is a footballer that can't play football well.

Our captain is leading a team that isn't winning.

What use is he as captain?? At least if he wasn't captain, he could be dropped. As it stands, it appears that he is contributing nothing significantly tangible to MFC results. There is also a viable alternative in N Jones.

Look at the Australian cricket team. When they were winning, it didn't matter who was captain. When they were losing and the captain wasn't batting well, the captain's position was under review.

 

[Cannon82]

Our captain is a footballer that can't play football well.

Our captain is leading a team that isn't winning.

What use is he as captain?? At least if he wasn't captain, he could be dropped. As it stands, it appears that he is contributing nothing significantly tangible to MFC results. There is also a viable alternative in N Jones.

Look at the Australian cricket team. When they were winning, it didn't matter who was captain. When they were losing and the captain wasn't batting well, the captain's position was under review.

If making N.Jones sole captain is going to transform us into a finals side, then by all means let's make the change. Captaincy is primarily a media and ceremonial role these days. Not much of a comparison to a cricket captain who actually makes decisions on the field (or at least has an ear piece or smoke signals from the friendly balcony if he's stupid, a la Watto). Mark Taylor held his spot for quite a while as a non-batting skipper. Michael Clarke is a tremendous campaigner and no one likes him, hence the knives usually aren't far away from out for him.

Where are people getting the captain is undroppable spiel from? If he's not playing well, he'll get dropped and Jones will skipper or Roos will find someone else to do it.

Finally and most importantly, who gives one who the captain happens to be.

 

[Dez!]

Our captain is a footballer that can't play football well.

Our captain is leading a team that isn't winning.

What use is he as captain?? At least if he wasn't captain, he could be dropped. As it stands, it appears that he is contributing nothing significantly tangible to MFC results. There is also a viable alternative in N Jones.

Look at the Australian cricket team. When they were winning, it didn't matter who was captain. When they were losing and the captain wasn't batting well, the captain's position was under review.

He's beating his man pretty much every week, he just lets himself down with some disposal errors which can be corrected.

 

[maxmustard]

He's beating his man pretty much every week, he just lets himself down with some disposal errors which can be corrected.

That sums it up for me. I cringed as hard as anyone with that last kick but dropping him is reactionary and it will not happen. Big summer of kicking practice for jack cos he needs to get these errors out of his game.

 

[Theseventhhamster]

There are at least a dozen guys with bigger disposal issues than Grimes in the team. This includes the 'good' kicks who are frequently lazy or stupid with the ball.

 

[PureFooty]

It might just be that Grimes puts too much pressure on himself to be the best. Played so well in his first 25 games, his not a dud, he's making some horrendous errors with the ball, but as a defender he's been good. Needs to fix up his ball use, get a bit more confidence and I'm sure he'll go alright again.

 

[Demon 16]

Its a shame that these days, your best kicks of the footy actually need to be your defenders - particularly your half backs.

If we had some really good kickers in our defense, Grimes wouldnt be such a big problem - but unfortunately, we also carry guys like McDonald, McKenzie, Terlich etc..

 

[schmuttt]

Its a shame that these days, your best kicks of the footy actually need to be your defenders - particularly your half backs.

If we had some really good kickers in our defense, Grimes wouldnt be such a big problem - but unfortunately, we also carry guys like McDonald, McKenzie, Terlich etc..

Pretty much this. Excluding Dunn and Jetta none of our defenders are good users of the ball, and even then those two aren't exactly on the Malceski/Suckling level, they are more reliable than damaging.

 

[Demon 16]

Pretty much this. Excluding Dunn and Jetta none of our defenders are good users of the ball, and even then those two aren't exactly on the Malceski/Suckling level, they are more reliable than damaging.

Well put - Dunn, Jetta and Garland are 'good' kicks of the footy, but guys like Malceski, Hodge, H Bennell and Hill are very damaging and attacking.

 

[Cannon82]

Well put - Dunn, Jetta and Garland are 'good' kicks of the footy, but guys like Malceski, Hodge, H Bennell and Hill are very damaging and attacking.

Technically Terlich is also a very damaging kick.

 

[CTHORANGE]

Technically Terlich is also a very damaging kick.

 

[Demon 16]

Technically Terlich is also a very damaging kick.

When you put it that way, one could argue that we have the most damaging back line in the comp..