Moore and Freeman - time is not for conservative selection

[The Magnificent Seven]

 

[Cousin of Daicos]

The insinuation that playing Freeman and Moore would be gifting the games is funny. Their form has been excellent for last few weeks.
If anyone is being gifted games, it would be incumbents like Goldsack and Varcoe.

Yeah Goldy has been a funny one. I"m actually legit shook by how bad he's been. I'm wondering if there's one of:

1) Injury he's carrying
2) Personal issue affecting performance

Remember I think it was 09 when Trav had a shocking year and we later found out his house was shot up before the season started. Affected his whole season. Could be something happened with Goldy in his personal life that's affecting him?

His sister is a police officer, maybe something happened there?

 

[jackcass]

Freeman has played a grand total of 5 practice games in 18 months. You can make your case but thts the facts. Have you seen him in the VFL practice games and the Nab cup? He hasn't shown anything to show he's ready..

Gee thanks for the permission to make my case but my post also included facts (which you conveniently dismissed) and at no time discounted THE 1 fact you brought to the discussion.

In response to your question, yes, I watched him in the intraclub game, the NAB game, and watched him last week where I thought he was BOG across the 4 quarters, marginally pipping Moore who faded in the last and Dwyer who was a no show after half time. Have you watched him?

 

[Kilmo]

It's Round 2 for Christ's sake.

Imagine if a few weeks ago I told you guys you would be crying foul if Darcy Moore wasn't in the team by Round 2? Get a grip.


Anyway, I am stoked that Dwyer is back in. He is going to have an absolute blinder, he is in sterling form.

 

[Jedi01]

So did Jackson Payne and Peter Yagmoor and that didn't work out so good. There are plenty of games to get 10+ games in to all of them. A few games in the VFL want kill any of them.

So you are comparing Jackson Paine and Peter Yagmoor to Cloke, Pendlebury, Beams and Thomas?

I tell you what, if it works for our low picks, I can handle a few Jackson Paines not making it.

 

[Pendles!]

Gee thanks for the permission to make my case but my post also included facts (which you conveniently dismissed) and at no time discounted THE 1 fact you brought to the discussion.

In response to your question, yes, I watched him in the intraclub game, the NAB game, and watched him last week where I thought he was BOG across the 4 quarters, marginally pipping Moore who faded in the last and Dwyer who was a no show after half time. Have you watched him?

Yes I have watched him and very closely. He's not ready, simple. If he was he'd be in the side!

 

[jackcass]

It's Round 2 for Christ's sake.

Imagine if a few weeks ago I told you guys you would be crying foul if Darcy Moore wasn't in the team by Round 2? Get a grip.


Anyway, I am stoked that Dwyer is back in. He is going to have an absolute blinder, he is in sterling form.

Maybe there should have been discete threads for both Moore and Freeman.

At this stage it's a moot point anyway as neither have made the 22 but i certainly don't think Moore is ready despite his stella performance for 3 quarters Saturday, I do think Freeman is. I've also said elsewhere that I'd be happy for Dwyer to get picked, he's the safer option and his form warrants it. I'd just prefer Freeman and a game against the Saints is a fantastic opportunity given team similarities. Hopefully he has a terrific game Sunday and becomes impossible to ignore.

 

[jackcass]

Yes I have watched him and very closely. He's not ready, simple. If he was he'd be in the side!

We'll agree to disagree however the fact he's not in the side does not confirm your stance as that can equally be explained as the club just being conservative.

 

[PieBeast]

But the exclamation mark does.

 

[Boris the Contradiction]

Yeah let's run all of our youth into the ground before they're ready, phenomenal idea.

No need to be dramatic. Regardless of the side of the fence you are on, there is a big difference between giving someone a chance to prove himself and running him into the ground are very different things. Noone is suggesting we pick a player and continue to pick him if he continually fails. If a player is given a chance and shows he is not ready, he should be dropped.

How often has a player been held back until they are "ripe" and they fail anyway? How often has a player been thrown in before that (eg Langdon who only got a shot because of injuries to other players) and they have flourished? Some players just step up and you don't always know which players will until they are given a chance. Some players surprise you.

 

[Wooljay]

No need to be dramatic. Regardless of the side of the fence you are on, there is a big difference between giving someone a chance to prove himself and running him into the ground are very different things. Noone is suggesting we pick a player and continue to pick him if he continually fails. If a player is given a chance and shows he is not ready, he should be dropped..

Are we now in the business of gifting senior games to young kids who haven't shown enough at a VFL level?

Why should we play Freeman/Maynard/De Goey/Kennedy/whoever else even if they're playing pretty run of the mill footy in the 2s?

Do we drop players who are performing, or play these kids ahead of others such as Dwyer who are performing?

I just do not see the value of bringing players in early, having them smacked, lose their confidence, and stunt their development and possibly lose us games.

 

[Boris the Contradiction]

Are we now in the business of gifting senior games to young kids who haven't shown enough at a VFL level?

Why should we play Freeman/Maynard/De Goey/Kennedy/whoever else even if they're playing pretty run of the mill footy in the 2s?

Do we drop players who are performing, or play these kids ahead of others such as Dwyer who are performing?

I just do not see the value of bringing players in early, having them smacked, lose their confidence, and stunt their development and possibly lose us games.

No you're right. The better option is to continue to pick guys like Goldsack who offer nothing week in week out just to prove to the up and comers that no matter what they do in the twos, the incumbents will be picked every week regardless of form. If your mantra is that players get picked on form you have to be consistent with that.

I never said Dwyer shouldn't have been picked. He deserved to be in and performed ok.

 

[Wooljay]

No you're right. The better option is to continue to pick guys like Goldsack who offer nothing week in week out just to prove to the up and comers that no matter what they do in the twos, the incumbents will be picked every week regardless of form. If your mantra is that players get picked on form you have to be consistent with that.

I never said Dwyer shouldn't have been picked. He deserved to be in and performed ok.

Can't believe you're potting Goldsack. Plays both ends of the ground solidly and is aggressive and beats his man more often than not.

Moore doesn't replace Goldsack, not right now anyways.

 

[ghostfacekillah]

Freeman and Moore are almost ready but not quite. Bucks again proves us all wrong. Dwyer was fantastic addition and has been ripping it up in VFL. Patty K might need to make way for Adams next week

 

[didaksrightfoot]

No you're right. The better option is to continue to pick guys like Goldsack who offer nothing week in week out just to prove to the up and comers that no matter what they do in the twos, the incumbents will be picked every week regardless of form. If your mantra is that players get picked on form you have to be consistent with that.

I never said Dwyer shouldn't have been picked. He deserved to be in and performed ok.

That is ridiculous.
Goldsack is one of the last guys that could be accused of offering nothing.
He doesn't do the things that show up on a stats sheet - but he would be one of the first picked each week.

 

[Boris the Contradiction]

That is ridiculous.
Goldsack is one of the last guys that could be accused of offering nothing.
He doesn't do the things that show up on a stats sheet - but he would be one of the first picked each week.

He does very little in reality. I like him as a player and always have, but he hasn't performed in a long time. He doesn't get it nearly enough for a player that is not a dedicated forward or back and he doesn't put on nearly as much pressure as people claim, like he did three or so years ago. His tackling isn't what it once was, he is key position height but can't mark, is not a goal threat and is in reality an average 1 on 1 defender at best who provides no rebound. Being hard and hard alone doesn't cut it.

Wooljay I agree. I never said anything about Moore. I'm not sure where you're getting that from.

 

[didaksrightfoot]

He does very little in reality. I like him as a player and always have, but he hasn't performed in a long time. He doesn't get it nearly enough for a player that is not a dedicated forward or back and he doesn't put on nearly as much pressure as people claim, like he did three or so years ago. His tackling isn't what it once was, he is key position height but can't mark, is not a goal threat and is in reality an average 1 on 1 defender at best who provides no rebound. Being hard and hard alone doesn't cut it.

He was a steady head in defence when the Saints were getting ahead at the start. He took most of our kick-ins tonight, and did very well finding targets on long kicks... again - particularly at the start when the Saints were looking dangerous and we were struggling to get the ball forward.
A number of times he came in with important intercepts/punches to prevent a Saints push forward.

 

[Boris the Contradiction]

He was a steady head in defence when the Saints were getting ahead at the start. He took most of our kick-ins tonight, and did very well finding targets on long kicks... again - particularly at the start when the Saints were looking dangerous and we were struggling to get the ball forward.
A number of times he came in with important intercepts/punches to prevent a Saints push forward.

His kicking in is great I agree. It's good to have the same player taking them each time.

 

[Wooljay]

Wooljay I agree. I never said anything about Moore. I'm not sure where you're getting that from.

So who takes his spot? Freeman? De Goey? Kennedy?

None of them would make sense, Goldy provides versatility and flexibility for the side. Honestly think he is integral to the team setup, and he had a good game tonight playing his role. Not everyone is going to be a stat accumulator, and Goldy isn't one of those players.

 

[Boris the Contradiction]

He is in the side for his defensive acts and he had one tackle. Says it all really. As to who, all of the above. There are numerous small and medium backs in the side right now. There is a dearth of genuine mids.

 

[davywap]

So the selectors prove us wrong again, weird. And all this Goldsack bashing seems eerily familiar, like some other player who many had similiar opinions of and proved them all wrong

 

[Anzacday]

Goldy was great.
As has been said before he chases, tackles and harasses.
I was impressed with his attack on the ball and the number of times he won it on the ground or locked it in.
He's a keeper for mine.

 

[Baltimore Jack]

Goldy was great.
As has been said before he chases, tackles and harasses.
I was impressed with his attack on the ball and the number of times he won it on the ground or locked it in.
He's a keeper for mine.

I think he is better a defender, seems much more composed in the back half and is reasonable at doing the kick ins

 

[Pendles!]

Freeman and Moore play and we win by probably 10 goals more. /s

On Goldsack's kicking in, I was a bit sceptical. He did very well last night, but wouldn't like to see him kick it straight up the guts against a better team. Lose that contest and you're toast.

 

[didaksrightfoot]

Freeman and Moore play and we win by probably 10 goals more. /s

On Goldsack's kicking in, I was a bit sceptical. He did very well last night, but wouldn't like to see him kick it straight up the guts against a better team. Lose that contest and you're toast.

I agree - but it was working last night, and in those conditions and against that team, it was exactly what we needed - particularly after they got on top of us in the first quarter.