WAFL FANS UNITE! - Say NO to Reserves Teams

[Sico 17]

Re: AFL Clubs want own reserves team in WAFL

Talking about promoting the WAFL, the ABC radio is regularly pushing the WAFL along with Russell Wulff, Peter Kennedy (last years) and the sports crew.

The same on 6PR and you can't complain about the WAFL coverage in the two papers over the last couple of weeks.

There has always been enough coverage (not as much as the AFL but it is madness to expect that much), even some of the clubs have been doing some good work. There just has not been enough of a push from those in charge of the league.

This weekend is a prime example, only week of the year the WAFL gets to play with no AFL games on and they only fixture two games instead of the full four.

 

[greenred]

Re: AFL Clubs want own reserves team in WAFL

Personally, I think Sico17 is right about one thing. There's a lot more the WAFL clubs could do to promote the game to AFL followers. I have never understood why they haven't been able to work out a way to play WAFL-AFL double-headers, so at least that way the AFL fans are exposed to more WAFL action.

I agree there is a lot more the WAFL could do to promote itself, but as always, it comes down to money.

The main reason for not having double headers with the AFL is because AFL is a lock out every week in WA. All you do is alienate the dedicated WAFL members and supporters who turn up every week but then can't see their team play when they are scheduled as a curtain raiser. West Coast fans in particular are notorious for turning up as the ball is bounced to start the game so you have WAFL teams playing to an empty stadium. Nobody wins.

 

[Sico 17]

Re: AFL Clubs want own reserves team in WAFL

There is some promotion they could do that would cost nothing except hard work.

Don't know why the season launch piss up is a closed event every year. Why not do it at a place where everyone can go if they want.

Having a WAFL game as a curtain raiser is a problem, that is why I suggested having it after a day game. Promote it as a chance to beat the traffic, stay back and watch a bit of WAFL footy and wait for the traffic to die down. Also could open the gates and allow the family and fans of the two WAFL clubs free entry.

Do it with colts only so no club loses gate turnover and I can see a few fans staying back if the next Naitanui or Swallow is involved.

 

[greenred]

Re: AFL Clubs want own reserves team in WAFL

There is some promotion they could do that would cost nothing except hard work.

Don't know why the season launch piss up is a closed event every year. Why not do it at a place where everyone can go if they want.

Having a WAFL game as a curtain raiser is a problem, that is why I suggested having it after a day game. Promote it as a chance to beat the traffic, stay back and watch a bit of WAFL footy and wait for the traffic to die down. Also could open the gates and allow the family and fans of the two WAFL clubs free entry.

Do it with colts only so no club loses gate turnover and I can see a few fans staying back if the next Naitanui or Swallow is involved.

Most day games start at 2.10 or 2.40, so you'd be looking at a 5pm start at the earliest and the strong possibility of lights being required. I'm not sure if there are still restrictions on the number of night games at Subiaco or not, but there is the issue of who is going to pay for Subiaco to be 'open' for an additional 3-4 hours? It's security, food people, gate staff etc.

You also have the problem that most people simply don't want to sit and watch two games of footy. If it's a Saturday they head out for dinner, if it's Sunday they want to get home before the week starts.

With all due respect to the Colts, they are hardly the best promotional tool if you want to attract numbers to the WAFL. The WAFL (league level) is in itself a quality level of football. That is what needs to be promoted.

I think a better option could be to have one or two passes to WAFL games included in the membership for the two AFL clubs and some strong promotion from both the AFL clubs and the WAFL for people to use them. Part of the charm and enjoyment of going to the WAFL is going to the WAFL grounds. The atmosphere is completely different to the concrete jungle of Subiaco and that's what people need to experience. The only way you are going to get people going regularly is by getting them to a game in the first place.

 

[Krazy Kris]

Re: AFL Clubs want own reserves team in WAFL

If you ask me, why don't the AFL ressies, play in the WAFL ressies... It makes sense, they're both not in the first team for their registered clubs!!!

 

[pablo668]

Re: AFL Clubs want own reserves team in WAFL

If you ask me, why don't the AFL ressies, play in the WAFL ressies... It makes sense, they're both not in the first team for their registered clubs!!!

This is a guess on my part but I think the AFL clubs want their prospective ressie teams to be playing in an environment that is as close to the top league as is possible.
For the AFL teams the WAFL ressies would be a step too far down.

 

[jinxd]

Re: AFL Clubs want own reserves team in WAFL

I can honestly say that I don't regularly go to WAFL games. Not because I don't follow the WAFL but mainly due to the fact that they're played on Saturday at 2pm. Like most people, I have more important things to do at that time. IMHO, they should be played on Sundays, when everything else is closed for business, so I can relax and enjoy the game.

As a Freo member, I quite often watch the WAFL games on ABC. Mainly to see the new draftees or even next year's potential draftees. Which is why I find it hard to support only one WAFL team over the years. I originally supported the Bulldogs but find myself supporting clubs like Perth each year cos they have more Freo players in their team on game day.

(BTW, I have no problem with the ABC broadcasting the WAFL - there's less ads and no conflicts with other games/programs. Plus the commentary is good for a laugh!)

 

[melbournemartin]

Re: AFL Clubs want own reserves team in WAFL

The reserves structure fails in so many aspects around the country. Sydney and Brisbane have it too easy, Victorian clubs often can't develop players because of experienced VFL players, WA and SA teams have to spread reserves over the entire competition. The list goes on.

What we need is a nation-wide second tier competition. If that requires extended rookie lists so teams can be filled or the ability to pick top-up players locally then so be it. The WA teams would probably dislike this idea though because of the excess travel involved.

 

[Underdog]

Re: AFL Clubs want own reserves team in WAFL

I can honestly say that I don't regularly go to WAFL games. Not because I don't follow the WAFL but mainly due to the fact that they're played on Saturday at 2pm. Like most people, I have more important things to do at that time. IMHO, they should be played on Sundays, when everything else is closed for business, so I can relax and enjoy the game.

But then you're going to be losing a lot of families who have kids football on Sundays.

Personally, it's easy to find 4 hours on a Saturday arvo. Do shopping in the morning, grab some lunch then head down to the footy and I still have my whole night free.

 

[greenred]

Re: AFL Clubs want own reserves team in WAFL

The reserves structure fails in so many aspects around the country. Sydney and Brisbane have it too easy, Victorian clubs often can't develop players because of experienced VFL players, WA and SA teams have to spread reserves over the entire competition. The list goes on.

What we need is a nation-wide second tier competition. If that requires extended rookie lists so teams can be filled or the ability to pick top-up players locally then so be it. The WA teams would probably dislike this idea though because of the excess travel involved.

The WA teams have it pretty good. There have been many players move to WA to play for West Coast and Fremantle who just haven't been good enough to play at WAFL league level, so there's no issues with it being 'too easy'. They can transfer their players to a different club (even mid-season) if they aren't happy with the way the WAFL club is dealing with them, so no issues with being unable to develop players.

I think the Victorian clubs would have a greater issue with a national second-tier comp. Quite a few are struggling to make ends meet as it is without needing to find additional revenue to pay more players, fund more coaches/medical/fitness staff and pay for additional travel. The other problem, particularly in Victoria, would be where do you play the reserves games? The MCG and Etihad aren't going to be able to take a double-header for every game.

 

[The_Wookie]

Re: AFL Clubs want own reserves team in WAFL

I wonder if perhaps they could include a WAFL membership with a WCE/Freo membership, in the same way that the AFL does club support memberships with its own members.

So in this instance, you would buy your Freo membership and be able to get a WAFL club support membership at the same time. Or the same with a West Coast membership. That might encourage more people to get out, boost club memberships, which leads to more sponsors and more club finances. Id have thought that would be a good thing.

 

[howard77]

Re: AFL Clubs want own reserves team in WAFL

I am a bit surprised that everyone is so dead against ressies teams in the WAFL. Here in QLD we have had both systems- the Lions used to farm their players out to QAFL clubs before the decision was made about 12 years ago to do a Lions reserves. The Suns farmed players out to Gold Coast QAFL clubs last year but will have a reserves in the new NEAFL comp this year.

Personally, I think it is enjoyable when your local club plays the AFL reserves, get a game on the Gabba and a big crowd when they play at your home ground. Local players enjoy testing themselves against the pros. Its better for the AFL club also.

The Lions reserves here are generally a mid range team and this year will probably finish towards the bottom, therefore I suspect WAFL clubs would be stronger that FREO ressies for example. Would not interrupt your finals too much.

Also it is a bit fairer, I personally would be pissed off if my WAFL club had 1 AFL player available in a game and the opposition had 4, and my team lost because of this.

 

[greenred]

Re: AFL Clubs want own reserves team in WAFL

I am a bit surprised that everyone is so dead against ressies teams in the WAFL. Here in QLD we have had both systems- the Lions used to farm their players out to QAFL clubs before the decision was made about 12 years ago to do a Lions reserves. The Suns farmed players out to Gold Coast QAFL clubs last year but will have a reserves in the new NEAFL comp this year.

Personally, I think it is enjoyable when your local club plays the AFL reserves, get a game on the Gabba and a big crowd when they play at your home ground. Local players enjoy testing themselves against the pros. Its better for the AFL club also.

The Lions reserves here are generally a mid range team and this year will probably finish towards the bottom, therefore I suspect WAFL clubs would be stronger that FREO ressies for example. Would not interrupt your finals too much.

Also it is a bit fairer, I personally would be pissed off if my WAFL club had 1 AFL player available in a game and the opposition had 4, and my team lost because of this.

I'm not sure there is any ground for comparison of the WAFL to the QAFL.

The WAFL has managed for well over 100 years without AFL teams. There are already too many teams and adding another 2 is not a positive, regardless of whether they are AFL teams or not.

The two AFL clubs won't draw big crowds. They might generate a little bit of interest for the first week or two, but they won't make any difference to the average person who isn't interested in their players who aren't good enough for AFL and a few kids who aren't ready.

On the numbers of AFL players per team, I think you would find in a lot of cases most clubs and their supporters would be happy to not have any. It's not often they make enough of an impact to be the difference between a win or a loss and all they do is keep out a player who would otherwise be playing league.

 

[jinxd]

Re: AFL Clubs want own reserves team in WAFL

But then you're going to be losing a lot of families who have kids football on Sundays.

Personally, it's easy to find 4 hours on a Saturday arvo. Do shopping in the morning, grab some lunch then head down to the footy and I still have my whole night free.

Oh, ok. Well, each to their own, I guess. Maybe they could include a couple of Sunday matches every now and then.

On a side note, it was good to see East Perth beat N.Ballarat (Foxtel Cup). Not much of a crowd, though. I think they need to market it a bit better. It didn't cost us anything (have Freo memberships) and we got to see two games in one day.

 

[royaldave]

Re: AFL Clubs want own reserves team in WAFL

I am a bit surprised that everyone is so dead against ressies teams in the WAFL. Here in QLD we have had both systems- the Lions used to farm their players out to QAFL clubs before the decision was made about 12 years ago to do a Lions reserves. The Suns farmed players out to Gold Coast QAFL clubs last year but will have a reserves in the new NEAFL comp this year.

Personally, I think it is enjoyable when your local club plays the AFL reserves, get a game on the Gabba and a big crowd when they play at your home ground. Local players enjoy testing themselves against the pros. Its better for the AFL club also.

The Lions reserves here are generally a mid range team and this year will probably finish towards the bottom, therefore I suspect WAFL clubs would be stronger that FREO ressies for example. Would not interrupt your finals too much.

Also it is a bit fairer, I personally would be pissed off if my WAFL club had 1 AFL player available in a game and the opposition had 4, and my team lost because of this.

Out of curiousity , where do the AFL reserves teams get their extra players from? Obviously Brisbane etc squad lists aren't big enough to support an AFL and a reserves team so they would need some extra players. This is one of the issues I see as a big no for the eagles and dockers coming in because I can just see them poaching the best young talent out of the WAFL to top up their lists.

 

[Smurftown#11]

Re: AFL Clubs want own reserves team in WAFL

Out of curiousity , where do the AFL reserves teams get their extra players from? Obviously Brisbane etc squad lists aren't big enough to support an AFL and a reserves team so they would need some extra players. This is one of the issues I see as a big no for the eagles and dockers coming in because I can just see them poaching the best young talent out of the WAFL to top up their lists.

I imagine the QAFL do it similarly to how the ACTAFL do it here in Canberra for the Swans Reserves. It is up to the other clubs NOT playing against the Swans to nominate players for the Swans to use in Canberra. These aren't usually first team players, but up-and-coming youngsters on the fringes of first team selection. There may be some experienced gun keeping them out of the first grade club side, but they get the opportunity to play with the Swans Reserves against first grade opposition.

I know clubs here often try and pick the same kids regulalry (16-18yr olds usually) as a way to expose them to first team football. These kids get a taste of it, get to be involved with a very professional game day set-up and often progress in the next year or two to regular first team footy for their own club.

 

[The_Wookie]

Re: AFL Clubs want own reserves team in WAFL

Out of curiousity , where do the AFL reserves teams get their extra players from? Obviously Brisbane etc squad lists aren't big enough to support an AFL and a reserves team so they would need some extra players. This is one of the issues I see as a big no for the eagles and dockers coming in because I can just see them poaching the best young talent out of the WAFL to top up their lists.

Players outside AFL lists fall under the state league salary cap in the VFL (IIRC this is $185,000). Where a player is on an AFL list that player is paid by the AFL club and doesnt fall under the state league clubs TPP.

I believe the same applies to the Brisbane and Gold Coast sides.

 

[jonesy86]

Re: AFL Clubs want own reserves team in WAFL

Sumich was on radio today and was asked about an announcement which is being made tomorrow by WCE.

Said he wasn't sure what it is, but could be about getting their own reserves team.

 

[royaldave]

Re: AFL Clubs want own reserves team in WAFL

That would be a bit premature. The "plan" the eagles have is supposed to be presented to each WAFL club over the next month or so.

Unless some club has done the dirty and agreed to align with them NOW, this must be about something else.

 

[Docker Clint]

Re: AFL Clubs want own reserves team in WAFL

That would be a bit premature. The "plan" the eagles have is supposed to be presented to each WAFL club over the next month or so.

Unless some club has done the dirty and agreed to align with them NOW, this must be about something else.

Langdon is adamant that it is Perth.

 

[pablo668]

Re: AFL Clubs want own reserves team in WAFL

Well, Perth is a bit of a basket case so I guess it wouldn't surprise me.
It would even be understandable considering their fortunes over the last few years.....though they had a good year in 08 I think.....

 

[swannies]

Re: AFL Clubs want own reserves team in WAFL

Langdon is adamant that it is Perth.

But the other 8 clubs still have to agree, correct?

No announcement today, though, was there?

 

[greenred]

Re: AFL Clubs want own reserves team in WAFL

But the other 8 clubs still have to agree, correct?

No announcement today, though, was there?

You would certainly hope the other clubs still have to agree swannies. If they had to vote to allow the host club arrangements then a change as significant as one or two clubs being taken over would surely also need agreement from the rest of the competition too. I just hope Perth and any other clubs are having a good long hard think about where this will leave them if the AFL decided to run it's own reserves competition in a few years time. I think they are signing their own death warrant.

 

[swannies]

Re: AFL Clubs want own reserves team in WAFL

Well, there you go, fancy that, Langdon was wrong. These media people continue to stun and amaze me. I could be adamant that Elle McPherson was sleeping with me, doesn't make it true though.

The 9 WAFL clubs have rejected the proposal but it looks as if some are going to keep trying to push it.

http://au.news.yahoo.com/thewest/sport/a/-/afl/9151140/clubs-reject-eagles-dockers-reserves/

The nine WAFL clubs have closed ranks to officially oppose West Coast and Fremantle introducing reserves teams into the State league.
The club presidents voted unanimously on Tuesday night to oppose any in-principle expansion of the competition.
But they will revisit the issue later this month when the Eagles and Dockers submit their proposal to have stand-alone reserves teams in the 2012 season.

 

[greenred]

Re: AFL Clubs want own reserves team in WAFL

Well, there you go, fancy that, Langdon was wrong. These media people continue to stun and amaze me. I could be adamant that Elle McPherson was sleeping with me, doesn't make it true though.

The 9 WAFL clubs have rejected the proposal but it looks as if some are going to keep trying to push it.

http://au.news.yahoo.com/thewest/sport/a/-/afl/9151140/clubs-reject-eagles-dockers-reserves/

Karl Langdon is wrong more often than a stopped watched.

I think the key from that quote swannies is that there was unanimous opposition to expansion of the competition. If the rumours are correct that West Coast are looking at a takeover of Perth, then there's no expansion required. No idea what Freo's plans would be in that case but I'd imagine they will eye off Peel?