Bluemour Melting Pot XIX - Give Me Ed Baby - Return of the Prodigal Son

[therubbernub]

You mustn't have been paying attention if you think that.

The Suns culture and administration is much better than it was even 2 years ago. They've had more young players sign up than ever before. The only real issues are King and Lukosius - and both of them were touted as flight risks before the draft. You could make the case that it was poor list management draft kids with that knock, but at the same time the Suns just lost there no.1 key forward and defender, they had to take the best best key back and forward. Ironically Luko ended up playing back and King was forward, the opposite of where both were drafted.

Dew has been great with what he has to play with. Afaic the off field side of things is alright now, it's just targeting the right kids who will hang around ala what Brisbane did. Draft mates and country kids who won't miss Melbourne after 3 weeks. Rowell and Anderson are a good start just make sure the rest fit the mould, which I think they will.

So who are these great leaders that they have- as you say i mustn't have been paying attention. I need educating...

 

[rog1995]

I think Stack and Pickett would have struggled in our team this year (and past couple of years) while we've been building a nucleus.

You think so? Stack on the half back line and Pickett in the centre? Deluca selection is strange considering we identified in this trade period would target small forwards.

 

[therubbernub]

It would he similar to if they didn't have the concessions.

It sounds like they will be bringing in some OK mature players starting with Ellis and greenwood. Certainly a step up from last years recruits.

Agree its a good start. Wallace just reporting that the suns " just have to get B Crouch"

 

[rog1995]

And the risks were/are clear.

Both players could still walk out/fall of the rails at any time, for a rebuilding club, that risk should not be considered. Other contending clubs also passed, when considering the risk

That strategy will change as the core develops

Agree to disagree. Our recruiting of late selections and rookies hasn't been good either way you want to analyse it.

 

[BluesTragic]

will all other clubs have to donate a player so that crows can field a team, under twelves style?

And someone to coach them !!!



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[El Topo]

No way Stocker or Dow are anywhere near being full time gun mids next year. Anyone suggesting it is living in navy blue na na land.

We don't need them to be guns, we need them to compete physically and play a role for the team - which both should be ready to do after another pre season

 

[resolute_blue]

No way. Look at what Essendon gave up for Smith an All Australian Mid/HF.

The Giants will receive Pick 11 and a 2018 third round selection from the Bombers, while Essendon receive Smith, Pick 24 and GWS' 2018 second round pick.

Was Smith still contracted though?
Also, Papley has stated he will stay if a deal can’t be done, understanding he has an existing contract to honour.
We need to fill the holes in our list and require mature players to compliment our talented kids.
He helps tick both these boxes and is a perfect fit. We likely pay slight overs here for a contracted player we clearly need IMO.
SOS is pretty tight but won’t let this slip and hopefully Pick 9 is sufficient to get it done.

 

[Kruezing]

You think so? Stack on the half back line and Pickett in the centre? Deluca selection is strange considering we identified in this trade period would target small forwards.

I think the pre DT era created a distorted image of what was required ...

 

[rog1995]

let's rate every decision by sos that didn't produce immediate gold against the premiers......

Do the exercise and you'll see.

 

[gbatman]

SOS and Co need to get better in getting quality players with later picks. Deluca selection is looking a little puzzling right now. Pickett and Stack were both taken with rookie selections by the premiers.

Pick 53 - Silvagni, best 22.
Pick 47 - Macreadie, Played a lot of footy in his first year, been injured, he can play.
Pick 59 - Polson, not yet a bust but hasn't done much.
Pick 61 - Williamson, Best 22 if not for two years of back injuries.
Pick 65 - Not a bad player but our drafting of tall forwards has been too good.
Pick 30 - DeKoning, Looking very much like a very good future ruckman for years to come.
Pick 70 - Schumacher, Looked ok but delisted at the moment.
Pick 78 - Garlett, Didn't have it.
Pick 66 - O'Dwyer, Far too raw to tell.
Pick 70 - Silvagni, Raw but looking good.

Rookies
Glass-McCasker - Not up to it.
Gallucci - Good VFL player but not AFL level.
Korcheck - Project ruck who didn't work out.
LeBois - Not good enough.
Silvagni - Good solid mature pick brought down by injuries.
Shaw - Recruited as a one year list filler and to have a mature player.
O'Shea - Same as above.
Goddard - Has been a pretty good pick IMO.
Bugg - He backflipped on us.
Owies - Showed plenty.

Mid seasons
Gibbons - Best 22, been pretty good.
Cottrell - Been injured a bit but has shown a fair bit.
DeLuca - Finished off playing games but didn't do anything massive, will be interested to see how he goes next year.

I wouldn't say it's been bad, it's been heavily affected by injuries, if not for injuries it looks quite good.

I think what we all need to consider is that players don't miss the draft and keep missing drafts or get left until the last rounds or the rookie draft if there isn't something wrong with them.

We're not in a position to take players who are not squeaky clean off field and will not contribute positively to our leadership yet. We might be nearly there at the moment but at this stage we just can't take who we like because they have talent. Richmond can, they are a mature list which won't be effected by individuals potential off field issues.

Definitely an are to improve on but I think there is more to it that us being not good at picking talent late in the draft. We would have lines drawn through talented players who have been taken by other clubs and done well simply because they aren't a good fit for us at this stage.

I still think we are well on track with our rebuild in terms of where the list is at and the expected time frame. Need to land these small forwards though. Then there won't be too much more to do. Especially if we do land Papley, Martin, Betts and maybe one more and our young midfielders like Dow, O'Brien, Setterfield, Stocker, Fisher and Cuningham really come on like they should. Our list rebuild will look in a really solid position.

End of next year I am hoping we tarket a midfielder, not because we have a hole there but because we see an opportunity to increase the quality there. I'm hoping that the hole is filled by a player we have drafted. IMO it should be and that is where we can judge the recruiting harshley.

 

[Jimmae]

Papley will get done contracted or not. Pick 8 is our starting point
Future pick for Martin is on the table
Betts will happen for alot cheaper then you'd think (both salary and draftpick)

Future first? I take it we're chasing a 2nd or very early 3rd coming back the other way for both (with at least one in this draft)?

If Jeremy Sharp is really sliding into the second round, he'd be a great get.

 

[Accidental genius]

While we have murph and Ed we still have time to allow our younger mids to develop and also have the option of trading one next year so I’m not too concerned if we don’t land one this year.

 

[NavySteel]

You think so? Stack on the half back line and Pickett in the centre? Deluca selection is strange considering we identified in this trade period would target small forwards.

Likely.

Spine has to get the ball to the forwards. Our spine is growing and showed great progress at the back half of the season (albeit with less Cripps influence, which was exciting to see).

Given Stack and Pickett slotted into a side that have players that have gone all the way, I think it would be an easier integration; these players augment the side, but I don't think they would slot into a developing nucleus like us easily.

On Deluca, I think the thinking was for Cripps coverage, but since Gibbons' move for more midfield minutes (which produced results) meant Deluca spent time in the forward line.

We clearly have an agenda this trade period.

 

[bluebrew]

Agree to disagree. Our recruiting of late selections and rookies hasn't been good either way you want to analyse it.

You forget 16 other clubs also did not look at Stack and Pickett Why Why Why?
We can look backwards every single day and nothing will change.

 

[NewDarkNavyBlues]

We don't need them to be guns, we need them to compete physically and play a role for the team - which both should be ready to do after another pre season

Even that will be a stretch. Dow still built like a twig and Stocker has played what .. 3 games?

 

[mario bortallotto]

What was the 'risk' with Kelly again? Lists have 40+ players and every year as you pointed out previously a minimum of three have to go - what was the 'risk' with Stack/Pickett/Kelly ....

In my experience - the greater risk over time - is not taking any risks.

i was under the impression we were right into kelly at the time .. geelong went earlier than expected , thus us or the eagles missed the boat ..

 

[Arr0w]

Agree to disagree. Our recruiting of late selections and rookies hasn't been good either way you want to analyse it.

That I agree with, but not because of the likes of Stack and Pickett

I think that will change over the next 2-3 draft/trade periods

 

[LegendaryBlues]

The question to ask is whether or not deluca wouldve been selected had Teague already taken over. Pickett at the time was injured and we may have wanted a mature body to play straight away.

 

[Dravid's in]

i was under the impression we were right into kelly at the time .. geelong went earlier than expected , thus us or the eagles missed the boat ..

Yep.

Blues eye Sandover runner-up

CARLTON have emerged as the preferred destination for Sandover Medal runner-up Tim Kelly, but at least three other clubs may use an earlier opportunity to draft the WAFL gun.

www.perthnow.com.au

 

[ITCHY EYEBALLS]

Even that will be a stretch. Dow still built like a twig and Stocker has played what .. 3 games?

Stocker will make it....he has "it"
Paddy, jury's still out imo

 

[JustaBattler]

i was under the impression we were right into kelly at the time .. geelong went earlier than expected , thus us or the eagles missed the boat ..

If so we weren't onto him fast enough - bloke is a jet - even arm chair experts on here were raving about him....

* ok we just didn't have the pick...same one we didn't need for Stack...

 

[rog1995]

That I agree with, but not because of the likes of Stack and Pickett

I think that will change over the next 2-3 draft/trade periods

Hopefully. I was only using those two as recent examples.

 

[Jimmae]

Rookies
Glass-McCasker - Not up to it.
Gallucci - Good VFL player but not AFL level.
Korcheck - Project ruck who didn't work out.
LeBois - Not good enough.
Silvagni - Good solid mature pick brought down by injuries.
Shaw - Recruited as a one year list filler and to have a mature player.
O'Shea - Same as above.
Goddard - Has been a pretty good pick IMO.
Bugg - He backflipped on us.
Owies - Showed plenty.

You could not sugar coat that any more if you tried. We probably got Agresta just to fix the litany of mistakes we were making trying to get a mature age player into the club, though so far his work can only be described as 'competent'.

 

[mario bortallotto]

And the risks were/are clear.

Both players could still walk out/fall of the rails at any time, for a rebuilding club, that risk should not be considered. Other contending clubs also passed, when considering the risk

That strategy will change as the core develops

thats about it

 

[Coops93]

So who are these great leaders that they have- as you say i mustn't have been paying attention. I need educating...

I don't know if they have any "great" leaders but they have a few good ones

As I said i think Dew is doing a good job, the culture has shifted immensely since he took over.

David Swallow is a very good captain also, early in the year when they were in games he stood up every time even when injured, he's a hard worker off field and is a very good example for the team to follow. Jarrod Witts is also a good leader who flies under the radar. Touk Miller is a good lieutenant - only a B grade player but works as hard as anyone and has openly talked about his passion for being a leader with the Suns

Mark Evans is a good executive and is largely responsible for the off field shift, along with Tony Cochrane. Say what you will about Tony, he does like to puff his chest out in public for some reason - which is silly, but he's done a great job.

The positive shift is evident as I said before given the amount of youth that has re-signed. Even Brodie, who's hardly been given a game and the media has said is looking for trades every year since he was drafted, has signed up. The only ones of note who haven't are Luko and King, again though like I said they were high risk before the draft as flight risks.

The next step for the Suns is getting the players in, most of the off field work has been done now. The draft picks should help with that, either in trade or drafting youth.

Believe it or not I could go on, there's definite growth in the Suns, most of the comp doesn't know it though and they're still under the impression that they have the same cultural issues as 4 years ago and that's just not the case.