Toast Round 4 = Collingwood 77-72 Hawthorn

[No SPIN]

It's amazing how many times Maynard goes to ground at crucial times.

When the opposition have momentum he just panics and does a full dive at everything then ends up out of the contest and his opponents run away

It’s in your imagination - but happy for you to give me 3 examples from last night.

 

[Anzacday]

I thought Jack Riewoldt was very good. Has an astute footy brain

He was calling out the lack of imagination in our forward entries.

 

[Cousin of Daicos]

It’s in your imagination - but happy for you to give me 3 examples from last night.

I think he generally keeps his feet, but I think (and this seems to be a an issue with all our defenders this season outside Frampton) they're making odd decisions around positioning and choosing when to leave their man

That second goal Moore kicked, Maynard really didn't have to leave him and I can't work out why he did.

The Hawthorn player (can't remember who it was) had both Moore and Quaynor right on him, basically on either side of him.

There was no reason for Maynard to leave Moore free to score that goal

 

[Fruit]

I’ve always wondered when we have posession after a mark or a free roughly 60 out from goal why we kick it long into a pocket or pull the kick slightly and drop it in front of the square. We seem to be seduced by Cox’s height but it’s rare he looks like marking it in these instances.
What would be the reason we don’t kick 15m and find an easy option 45m from goal. We are really good from that distance and to me it looks like a much easier option.

 

[caloschwaby]

A lot like the QF last year, an inspired 5-goal drive by the oppo in the last quarter while we hang on goalless in the last. To quote Fly from the docco, we just kick one early in that run about 5-10 minutes into Q4 and that game is just over, completely destroy their will/momentum.

Repeated it ad nauseum on here, most recently in the Brisbane gameday thread, but every single game this year we have given up a 4+ goal run. That's simply unacceptable and beyond forgiveness at this point with what it does to a game. In this case it turned a promising % booster into a slow choke. Understandably these waves of momentum are hard to stop and somewhat contributed by intangibles, 1%'s, etc, but going forward we need to have figured out some way to "call time out", completely stop the game for 5 or so minutes even if it means us not scoring either.

It appears we did this during the middle of Q4 last night, with Ginnis goal @ 6 min mark, then their next with Dyl Moore @ 20 min mark. We had two pings and misses at it in between that time from Reef and Bobby, the latter of the two should have easily been a mark/set shot but was an uncharacteristic miss of a snap kick for him - intangibles. They then go coast to coast from the kickout and goal. Any of those result in a goal, particularly that last, and the game is more than over and we go home 20+ point victors.

We definitely did enough in the first half to justify a winning position at the end of the game, footy is like that sometimes and really an inaccurate 2nd half allowed the opposition to have belief and they took that with both hands. 9.4 to 2.7 - Sainters struggled with that just in reverse vs Tiges 1.8 early in Q3 the same afternoon. Taking our chances has really been the name of the game early this season and still seems to be the one other common sore point between all our games. Patches of inaccurate kicking at best, and inability to turn i50s into high % chance shots on goal at worst.

Also would've helped not turning a medium-backman into primetime Plugger.

 

[sr36]

I think we were in the second half. I was getting anxiety watching Newcombe and Co just brush our mids aside. Maybe not so much at the centre bounce but around the ground it was getting ugly

Newcombe is a good player isn't he, but Jordy was doing the same even more often. In terms of the second half - Pendles's defensive work around stoppage is under valued. He's very good at covering off the break out of the front of stoppage.

 

[caloschwaby]

I’ve always wondered when we have posession after a mark or a free roughly 60 out from goal why we kick it long into a pocket or pull the kick slightly and drop it in front of the square. We seem to be seduced by Cox’s height but it’s rare he looks like marking it in these instances.
What would be the reason we don’t kick 15m and find an easy option 45m from goal. We are really good from that distance and to me it looks like a much easier option.

Most teams are wise enough to shut down the 45-degree angle kicks inside like that, or at least make it appear likes its open but really there's a player ready to run like a cut snake, intercept, then burn you and the free paddocks ahead of them to the other side.

But a simple set up to block opponents' run and jump at it like that combined with an intelligent lead would be easy to create if we just had another big bodied KPF to take the heat vs Mihocek.

 

[sr36]

I’ve always wondered when we have posession after a mark or a free roughly 60 out from goal why we kick it long into a pocket or pull the kick slightly and drop it in front of the square. We seem to be seduced by Cox’s height but it’s rare he looks like marking it in these instances.
What would be the reason we don’t kick 15m and find an easy option 45m from goal. We are really good from that distance and to me it looks like a much easier option.

They block it off and if you turn those over, you're in trouble on the rebound, as every one has pushed up and they're sprinting forward, whereas we have to do a u-turn.

 

[sr36]

Repeated it ad nauseum on here, most recently in the Brisbane gameday thread, but every single game this year we have given up a 4+ goal run. That's simply unacceptable and beyond forgiveness at this point with what it does to a game. In this case it turned a promising % booster into a slow choke. Understandably these waves of momentum are hard to stop and somewhat contributed by intangibles, 1%'s, etc, but going forward we need to have figured out some way to "call time out", completely stop the game for 5 or so minutes even if it means us not scoring either.

The issue is we try that too often. It just results in the defence being under siege and unless they're really on, it's a matter of time before the goals against tick over. We tried to lock down that game yesterday from way too far out.

 

[caloschwaby]

The issue is we try that too often. It just results in the defence being under siege and unless they're really on, it's a matter of time before the goals against tick over. We tried to lock down that game yesterday from way too far out.

I agree absolutely it was too early in that it felt like we came out at Q3 with that in mind. But I think that ~10 min patch in Q4 we got it going was the perfect time for it, only to squander two reasonable chances near the end to call game and go board the plane.

 

[sr36]

I agree absolutely it was too early in that it felt like we came out at Q3 with that in mind. But I think that ~10 min patch in Q4 we got it going was the perfect time for it, only to squander two reasonable chances near the end to call game and go board the plane.

3rd wasn't as bad as some suggest. Just one of those quarters where we couldn't score. Had it locked forward for a fair bit but just kept blowing our entries and then eventually we'd pushed up too far and they get a couple of quick breaks that were too tough to defend as we'd gotten out of position with defenders getting involved in the repeat entries.

Last was like the qualifying final - we were just too defensive and decided to get numbers back and grimly hold on.

I know many are seeing yesterday as a disaster. I didn't think it was that bad - just a bit off with our disposal and a mindset issue in the last.

 

[BuildEmUp]

Horrible win and even more horrible umpiring. The blatant biased was nauseating. Every time our players were either held or scagged, and those yellow morons completely ignored it.



Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com

Yeah nah , umpiring was fine dont know what game you were watching ...

 

[sr36]

Yeah nah , umpiring was fine dont know what game you were watching ...

It always feels dodgy when you're copping frees against in the ruck - but Cox had lost the plot and just doing dumb things. Plus the Ginni one was just infuriating to put us into a negative mindset re the umps.

 

[JuniorB]

Most teams are wise enough to shut down the 45-degree angle kicks inside like that, or at least make it appear likes its open but really there's a player ready to run like a cut snake, intercept, then burn you and the free paddocks ahead of them to the other side.

But a simple set up to block opponents' run and jump at it like that combined with an intelligent lead would be easy to create if we just had another big bodied KPF to take the heat vs Mihocek.

Of course, that's why we recruited McStay.
If we could just get him onto the park...............

 

[Ctracks]

Yeah nah , umpiring was fine dont know what game you were watching ...

Hawks (mostly midfielders) were holding a fair bit on De Goey and Josh Daicos.

 

[Cousin of Daicos]

Yeah nah , umpiring was fine dont know what game you were watching ...

I wouldn't say it was "fine", but it was far from the worst we've copped this season

I'm still not sure why Hawthorn defenders were allowed to consistently just push our forwards in text book fashion in the back

 

[gouki88]

I thought Jack Riewoldt was very good. Has an astute footy brain and could well become a coach someday.

He was good when he wasn't joining in on Dwayne Russell's pants-wetting

 

[gouki88]

He was calling out the lack of imagination in our forward entries.

Can you imagine the tantrum Jack Riewoldt the player would have been having with those I50 entries?

 

[Kirby]

Hawks (mostly midfielders) were holding a fair bit on De Goey and Josh Daicos.

JDG is constantly held at every stoppage. They start tackling him before he takes possession half the time and he almost never gets a free. It's infuriating.

 

[Tarkyn_24]

I am a huge supporter of Mason but he hasn’t hit the scoreboard in five games. The cupboard is seemingly entirely bare for alternatives. I’d like to see what comes of playing Moore in his old forward/ruck role.

As average as our defence has been, I think we have the pieces there to cover Moore’s utilisation elsewhere, particularly given Darcy has been average at best down there anyway. Dean or Markov possibilities to come in, and Howe as the main loose interceptor. It’s the only solution I’m seeing to our lack of tall options in attack.

 

[gouki88]

JDG is constantly held at every stoppage. They start tackling him before he takes possession half the time and he almost never gets a free. It's infuriating.

This is what bothers me most about AFL umpiring. They let so much go in certain contexts (forwards roughing up backmen, ruckmen wrestling, mids tackling each other off-ball) that whenever they do pay a free for these things it's a complete lottery

 

[Kirby]

This is what bothers me most about AFL umpiring. They let so much go in certain contexts (forwards roughing up backmen, ruckmen wrestling, mids tackling each other off-ball) that whenever they do pay a free for these things it's a complete lottery.

The stupid frees when ruckman are wrestling are the worst. You can't see them and neither player knows whose free it is.

This is two 100kg monsters pushing each other. Just let it go!

 

[gouki88]

The stupid frees when ruckman are wrestling are the worst. You can't see them and neither player knows who's free it is.

This is two 100kg monsters pushing each other. Just let it go!

Still traumatised from years of Grundy being punished for being too strong

 

[Carringbush2010]

I didn't think we were that good in the first - Hawks were bad.

Agreed, far from it.

But what made us change (from my eye anyway) from outnumbering at the ball and running the ball with hand through the middle to kicking down the line to the flanks / pocket in the 2nd? Even at times when we had spare numbers unguarded in the corridor?

Something's a miss.

 

[BillyElliott]

Alistair was commentating.

He wasn't commentating on Kayo. Which broadcast?