Analysis 2019 List Management Discussion

[Bamboo Harvester]

I saw that, and my blood started boiling; I cant remember if it was sellers or king saying he has given nothing to the team.
Carrots was a shite kick when he first started, and his little handballs gives and receives in the one passage of play used to drive me crazy. Then he was played on ball and he become integral to our midfield. I know each had/has different attributes, but he just reminds me a-lot of Carrots.

It was King....said he's either not a natural forward, or being selfish presenting himself as a lead up forward. It was a load of bullshit when you saw the leading patterns of our talls, and the delivery of the mids into the forward line.
It was appalling...

 

[Eiffel 65]

For those interested, AFL360 on our forward line:

https://www.foxsports.com.au/afl/tv-shows/afl360?nk=1bd3dd5754c60951725e3e8351a01675-1555509121

 

[true blue19]

Sorry, I don't want to hog this thread, but that is 100% correct Ope.

We even saw in the preseason that his fitness levels were well above average....up in QLD he won every hill sprint on that last day, which indicates he can go over and over and over to each contest. He is a contested driven beast...all 175cm of him!!

On AFL360 tonight, they highlighted his running patterns as a forward, which showed he doesn't have the attributes as a small forward at the moment. It also doesn't help when the delivery from the mids, and forward movement patterns from the talls, are horrible...but reinforces that forward play is a craft best left to natural forwards. How many makeshift small forwards do the Tiggs, or Woods, or WCE have at the moment?

As a fan, I just want to be given the opportunity to see him play some games in the midfield in the position he has excelled. We may be all pleasantly surprised, and to be frank, we don't have that much to lose by doing so.

Anyway, that's all I'm saying on this matter...a bit like Forrest

I agree with you 100% and I'm frustrated that our two best endurance runner in Gibbons and Ed are playing as small forwards and we need seasoned body in the midfield.

 

[Bamboo Harvester]

I agree but it's really hard to fit him into our midfield.

You probably take one ruck and seven pure mids into a game. Who would you leave out of the following list for Gibbons:

1. Cripps
2. Setterfield
3. Dow
4. Walsh
5. SPS
6. Murphy
7. Fisher/Ed/O'brien/Kennedy (final rotation)

Cuningham will push through the middle too and Stocker will soon make his case for a spot.

I just don't see how he fits into our midfield mix at the moment.

I'll say it again...apart from Crippa, Walsh and maybe SPS, which of the others that you have indicated has been any more than just a pass mark this year? We can keep on throwing up the same names, but the fact is we are 0-4 right now with those mids.

Why are we so reluctant to do something a little different to see if it may actually makes a difference'?

 

[BlueView]

It was King....said he's either not a natural forward, or being selfish presenting himself as a lead up forward. It was a load of bullshit when you saw the leading patterns of our talls, and the delivery of the mids into the forward line.
It was appalling...

I would have thought the purpose of a small forward was to get themselves into a position to crumb the tall forwards. Haven’t seen anything even resembling that from Gibbons.

As for playing Gibbons in the midfield Bolton would want to be a brave brave man or a lunatic to even entertain the idea on a guy that hasn’t shown anything.

 

[Eiffel 65]

I'll say it again...apart from Crippa, Walsh and maybe SPS, which of the others that you have indicated has been any more than just a pass mark this year? We can keep on throwing up the same names, but the fact is we are 0-4 right now with those mids.

Why are we so reluctant to do something a little different to see if it may actually makes a difference'?

I've been a big fan of Dow's stoppage work this year. He's had big moments exploding from the centre. He's a big tick in my book. Yes, he has to tidy up his disposal, but that will come. The important thing is that he's putting himself in positions where he can influence the outcome of the game. That's the hardest part to master.

Fisher has been down the start of the season but I'd attribute that to Bolts making him play inside the contest. He needs to be the receiving player. His game will probably get back to the standard we know when maybe someone like Kennedy provides a bit more grunt through the middle.

The other big tick is Cuningham. What he showed in the JLT series when running through the middle was brilliant. When he returns, he's ahead of Gibbons in my book.

Murphy and Ed have played pretty well on the rare occasion they've rotated on the wing this season. They just need to be around the ball more often.

Setterfield and O'brien need a bit more development but I'm still struggling to see how to get Gibbons in the middle.

Arrow touched on this before but the most logical solution is to put Thomas across half forward. Most likely when Williamson returns.

So based on the above, I'm not putting him in the middle ahead of Dow, Fisher (wing), Murphy (wing), Ed and Cuningham.

 

[Opine]

Diesel was one of the most skilful players in the history of the game. It would be truly amazing if Gibbons can replicate that.

I haven’t watched him play VFL, so I’m not sure if he has great skills and is just going through a rough patch at the start of his AFL career, or if what made him a dominant player in the VFL was his smarts, rather than skill?

His Smarts, and his work ethic. Somewhat like Carrots

 

[Stamos]

His Smarts, and his work ethic. Somewhat like Carrots

Thing is, Carrots had 5 inches and 10 kg on him. That makes a big difference.

 

[Opine]

Thing is, Carrots had 5 inches and 10 kg on him. That makes a big difference.

Yes it might. We'll never know until he is give a go at playing to his strength

 

[Eiffel 65]

I'll say it again...apart from Crippa, Walsh and maybe SPS, which of the others that you have indicated has been any more than just a pass mark this year? We can keep on throwing up the same names, but the fact is we are 0-4 right now with those mids.

Why are we so reluctant to do something a little different to see if it may actually makes a difference'?

Just to put Dow's progress in perspective, when you look at his draft class, how many of the top rated midfielders in Brayshaw, Cerra, LDU, Clarke, Bonar and O'brien have shown the capacity to win the stoppage and burst away with an I50 entry?

The answer is none of them have.

Rayner and Stephenson have had moments up forward, but that's a different craft altogether.

On this forum, there's far too much fixation on his kicking that it's blinding people from his elite clearance work. There are shades of Patrick Dangerfield about his game. A lot to be excited by.

 

[HavUEvaSeenTheRain]

How do we know if he's limited as a mid if we don't play him there?
How many of the 10 state league players taken before him were mids? He was the best midfielder at state league level over the past three years, so why aren't we playing him there?
We've been trying to manufacture a forward line for the last decade out of bits and pieces. You think we would have learned by now.

Good points and Worpel is a player currently making recruiters look stupid because they thought he was limited. For me I just don’t see him long term being good enough or having the tricks at his size for a mid so I don’t mind him off a HFF pushing high up the ground. We are playing him too deep imo.
ATM for me it’s like having a dominant VFL ruckman who stands a

 

[Accidental genius]

You may be right. I was looking more from the point of view that anyone would be happy to get picked. And sometimes its not going to be in ' best position'. Its a team game and if there are better players than him in the middle he isnt going to get that gig.

I think sps and fish would provide more benefits by playing up front. Midfield should be made up of Cripps Walsh Dow Obrien Kennedy setters Ed Curnow gibbons jsos (may have missed some here)

 

[HavUEvaSeenTheRain]

Just to put Dow's progress in perspective, when you look at his draft class, how many of the top rated midfielders in Brayshaw, Cerra, LDU, Clarke, Bonar and O'brien have shown the capacity to win the stoppage and burst away with an I50 entry?

The answer is none of them have.

Rayner and Stephenson have had moments up forward, but that's a different craft altogether.

On this forum, there's far too much fixation on his kicking that it's blinding people from his elite clearance work. There are shades of Patrick Dangerfield about his game. A lot to be excited by.

For me he is looking like our Taylor Adams minus the mongrel. Very good player but can’t kick

 

[Blue and Blue]

Just to put Dow's progress in perspective, when you look at his draft class, how many of the top rated midfielders in Brayshaw, Cerra, LDU, Clarke, Bonar and O'brien have shown the capacity to win the stoppage and burst away with an I50 entry?

The answer is none of them have.

Rayner and Stephenson have had moments up forward, but that's a different craft altogether.

On this forum, there's far too much fixation on his kicking that it's blinding people from his elite clearance work. There are shades of Patrick Dangerfield about his game. A lot to be excited by.

I like that Paddy is not a knob. Thats the part thats better than Dangerfield already, and a few others I can think of.
Two years from now the knockers will....say nothing...just like with Weiters.

 

[Azzurro]

I like that Paddy is not a knob. Thats the part thats better than Dangerfield already, and a few others I can think of.
Two years from now the knockers will....say nothing...just like with Weiters.

And in 2 years he will still only be 21.

Perspective hugely lacking when it comes to this kid. Will work out his disposal issues. 19 year old finding his way in his second year.

 

[blue healer]

He is clearly limited though and most likely too much so to ever make it as a mid. There is a reason about 10 state league players were taken before him. He should be playing a lot higher off a HFF imo

I'm not sure how we can know he is limited given the lack of opportunity to show what he can do in his best position. Can't understand why we don't try him there.

Amazes me that we keep picking players out of, what appears to be their best position when we're crying out for, in Gibbons case, mature bodies around the ball.

Garlett, to me, is another. Looks to the unitiated like an ideal small forward but we try to teach him to play back.

There were also a lot who could not understand why Gibbons was continually overlooked.

 

[Arr0w]

https://www.afl.com.au/news/2019-04...10-outoffavour-players-your-club-could-target

Interesting list off players

Sier is a type we need right now, but Kennedy is a similar player

Cox who I rated highly in his draft year, yet our talls are developing well

Waterman would be nice, tall but a great runner and would be a great link player from midfield to forward

Greenwood, Brodie, Cutler would add to different areas

Not sure why Laverde is on that list, reasonably talented junior, with all the physical attributes, but has been extremely disappointing and doubt he will make it at the level. I doubt any club would be interested

 

[blue healer]

https://www.afl.com.au/news/2019-04...10-outoffavour-players-your-club-could-target

Interesting list off players

Sier is a type we need right now, but Kennedy is a similar player

Cox who I rated highly in his draft year, yet our talls are developing well

Waterman would be nice, tall but a great runner and would be a great link player from midfield to forward

Greenwood, Brodie, Cutler would add to different areas

Not sure why Laverde is on that list, reasonably talented junior, with all the physical attributes, but has been extremely disappointing and doubt he will make it at the level. I doubt any club would be interested

I think it's a bit early in the year to be labelling players as out of favour. Reminds me of how everyone thought that Harry was out of favour last year whilst we have seen this to be part of our strategy for him. Whose to say the same doesn't apply for some or all of these players.

And if they are still out of favour at the end of the year I think we should steer clear. We've been to that well too much in the past.

 

[Juddernaut08]

I have a question on Setterfield

I love our players, and don't want to get anyone here off side.

My view of our future midfield though is starting to have some questions.

Bigs
Cripps (tick)
Kennedy (?)
Setterfield (?)

Mediums
Walsh (tick)
SPS (tick)
Dow (tick)
Stocker (?)

Quicks
Fisher (tick)
LOB (?)
Cuningham (?)
Lang (?)
Pickett (?)

We have 5 locks, and 7 question marks in my view. 5 of those 7 (Kennedy, Setterfield, Stocker, LOB and Cuningham) I think will make it.

However, it really is key that one or both of Kennedy and Setterfield do become a gun player so that our structures don't turn to shit when Cripps rests forward or on bench.

In my view, the main risk with Kennedy is his health. If he gets his body right, I am confident he'll make it.

Question: Similar with Setterfield regarding health, however the last few games other than round 1 have not been encouraging to me. Seems to have poor disposal, decision making and plays a bit too much outside. Thoughts?

I know he's only a few games in to his career and all that. I'm just calling it as I see it.

 

[blue healer]

From what I've seen not too many of our players aren't guilty of poor disposal.

Bolton, reportedly, has put much of that down to composure and it's very hard to argue against that and probably even harder to fix.

A couple of wins wouldn't hurt for overall confidence.

 

[thylacine60]

best double negative ever, bh.........

 

[blue healer]

best double negative ever, bh.........

Thank you, I'm always in there trying.

 

[thylacine60]

not wrong

 

[Gavstar]

Any thoughts on selecting Adam Tipungwuti as our mid season selection

Addresses the small forward need??

http://neafl.com.au/electrifying-adam-tipungwuti-lands-at-nt-thunder/

 

[blue healer]

not wrong

I'm taking that as a veiled compliment but not confident that it's not a play on the word "trying"