Current Disappearance of 3yo William Tyrrell Pt 3 * Coroner's Hearings Concluded

[Kurve]

Continued from PART 2

Criminal charges:

• Apprehended Violence Orders on both (AVOs)
• Lying to the NSW Crime Commission on former foster mother *Not Guilty
• Lying to the NSW Crime Commission on former foster father *Not Guilty
• 2 x charges of assault against a child on former foster mother *Guilty
• 1 x charge of assault against a child on former foster father *Not Guilty
• Stalking &/or Intimidation on FF *Guilty Overturned on Appeal
• Stalking &/or Intimidation on FM *Guilty
• Dummy bidding real estate fraud *Guilty

TIMELINE

Where's William Tyrrell? - The Ch 10 podcast (under Coroner's subpoena)

Operation Arkstone

Please type names out in full for those who are not covered by suppression orders.

For those covered by suppression orders, please use the following to indicate:

WT - William Tyrrell
FM - Foster Mother
FF - Foster Father
FGM - Foster Grandmother
FD - Foster Daughter
FPs - Foster Parents

Up to you if you wish to refer to them as former fosters but please write it in full, strictly using the above. No deviations.

Other initials posters will use informally but should not are:

BCR - Batar Creek Road
FA - Frank Abbott
MW - Michelle White
SFR - Strike Force Rosann
AMS - Anne Maree Sharpley
CCR - Cobb and Co Road
GO - Geoff Owens
One even reduced bike riding to - BR
COG - Consciousness of guilt. Like WHO KNEW?

 

[Leon Higgins]

It might make sense if the photos are out but still limited evidence to what happened after to William and finding him.

Hypothetical. Person responsible charged and convicted. No chance of parole unless WT resting place is identified.

This is how I think he will be found.

 

[31550]

I agree, I think asking people to ask each other what they were doing on that Friday was a great idea too. Fehon sounds so sensible and methodical. It makes you wonder where the investigation went balls up. Personally I find it hard to read Fehon saying early on to media something about the parents (fosters) being good Christian people from a wealthy area of Sydney. Him saying goodbye to them in a carpark 7 days after William disappeared and the car not getting searched, or followed all the way to Sydney, flawed IMO considering all their odd behaviour and falling out with the FGM. If the fosters were battlers from West Sydney would they have been managed or looked at differently or properly even?

Pretty sure they concluded the blond woman in the black car was the local postie.

Confirmed? Why wasn't she out on her rounds?

 

[Leon Higgins]

Rup and Jubelin. Dumb and Dumber.

 

[passball]

Hypothetical. Person responsible charged and convicted. No chance of parole unless WT resting place is identified.

This is how I think he will be found.

Interesting.
I hope for William this is how it will go, not just discarded like he didn’t matter

 

[Underarrest_]

Hypothetical. Person responsible charged and convicted. No chance of parole unless WT resting place is identified.

This is how I think he will be found.

I hope you’re right.

 

[Curious Clues]

Confirmed? Why wasn't she out on her rounds?

Sorry I can’t find where I read about the details of the blond woman allegedly being the postie, I could be wrong.

 

[LRitz]

If the 3 cars FM mentioned were real the people in them might not have taken William, but maybe watchers.
Watching when they arrived, when they went out and what they were doing.
According to FM she saw the two cars hours before William disappeared.

Why would they be watching? No one knew fosters arrived on Thursday night, AFAIK. So they are sitting and spying from 7 am to see the unlikely event that a child is alone in the front yard. And I don't think there was anything special about William.

The one thing I FIRMLY believe is that the birth parents had nothing at all to do with Williams's disappearance.

I am doubtful about the drive by FM, at any time to any where. The semi has not been identified AFAIK. Did it come past the tennis CCTV? It could have come via Lorne Rd and not be on the CCTV. Why not use the A1 if it was going south. It was using back roads. Where did it come from and where was it heading? If the driver acknowledged FM, how did he do this? Sound a horn or flash lights? You would think that anyone in that area would have heard the news in the days after and come forward. Peter did, but he was not the semitrailer driver and he did see some cars but he did not report a semitrailer or large truck, AFAIK. Did she drive somewhere else, and turn left out of Benaroon? And the destination of the riding school was a red herring.

 

[Underarrest_]

Why would they be watching? No one knew fosters arrived on Thursday night, AFAIK. So they are sitting and spying from 7 am to see the unlikely event that a child is alone in the front yard. And I don't think there was anything special about William.

The one thing I FIRMLY believe is that the birth parents had nothing at all to do with Williams's disappearance.

I am doubtful about the drive by FM, at any time to any where. The semi has not been identified AFAIK. Did it come past the tennis CCTV? It could have come via Lorne Rd and not be on the CCTV. Why not use the A1 if it was going south. It was using back roads. Where did it come from and where was it heading? If the driver acknowledged FM, how did he do this? Sound a horn or flash lights? You would think that anyone in that area would have heard the news in the days after and come forward. Peter did, but he was not the semitrailer driver and he did see some cars but he did not report a semitrailer or large truck, AFAIK. Did she drive somewhere else, and turn left out of Benaroon? And the destination of the riding school was a red herring.

People would have known they were expected that day. I don’t believe the FGM never mentioned it to anyone. IMO.
I’m not sure that we know what the truck driver saw, only what’s been allowed public. There seems to have been other cars in the area.
Perhaps someone saw a car or something that fits the jigsaw whether that be one of the fosters, both or/and someone else.

 

[LRitz]

People would have known they were expected that day. I don’t believe the FGM never mentioned it to anyone. IMO.
I’m not sure that we know what the truck driver saw, only what’s been allowed public. There seems to have been other cars in the area.
Perhaps someone saw a car or something that fits the jigsaw whether that be one of the fosters, both or/and someone else.

important part of the narrative is a change in plans at the last moment. So this is the reason the alibi work conference call is still scheduled for 9:30.

Even if "people" did know, what made them want to plan an abduction of William. As I said he was not special.

IMO, I think the drive is a distraction.
IMO, I think the bike riding is a distraction.
IMO, I think William crashing into the garden on purpose is a distraction.
IMO, I think the orange juice is a distraction.

 

[Leon Higgins]

I agree, I think asking people to ask each other what they were doing on that Friday was a great idea too. Fehon sounds so sensible and methodical. It makes you wonder where the investigation went balls up. Personally I find it hard to read Fehon saying early on to media something about the parents (fosters) being good Christian people from a wealthy area of Sydney. Him saying goodbye to them in a carpark 7 days after William disappeared and the car not getting searched, or followed all the way to Sydney, flawed IMO considering all their odd behaviour and falling out with the FGM. If the fosters were battlers from West Sydney would they have been managed or looked at differently or properly even?

Pretty sure they concluded the blond woman in the black car was the local postie.

Hypothetically Let’s say they had seized the computer and searched the house in Sydney. They may have found the sandals/shoes that went missing and some interesting images. It’s mind boggling incompetence.

It shows you how people ‘like us’ are treated differently to the marginalised. I am very privileged in comparison to the biological parents.

 

[Curious Clues]

Hypothetically Let’s say they had seized the computer and searched the house in Sydney. They may have found the sandals/shoes that went missing and some interesting images. It’s mind boggling incompetence.

It shows you how people ‘like us’ are treated differently to the marginalised. I am very privileged in comparison to the biological parents.

For all we know he could have had many pairs of shoes so I think that would be too hard to prove. But I do believe they should have had a police escort all the way home. Anything could have been discarded in the hundreds of kms of bush. Why were they so keen to pack up and leave exactly a week to the day William disappeared? Something made them rush out of there and I can guarantee it wouldn’t have been on advice from the cops as FF claims, how ridiculous. Volunteers were still searching for William after 3 weeks.
It’s also now proven that being wealthy and Christian doesn’t make you an automatic good parent.

 

[31550]

People would have known they were expected that day. I don’t believe the FGM never mentioned it to anyone. IMO.
I’m not sure that we know what the truck driver saw, only what’s been allowed public. There seems to have been other cars in the area.
Perhaps someone saw a car or something that fits the jigsaw whether that be one of the fosters, both or/and someone else.

Yes they were expected THAT DAY (Friday 12th - the day he vanished). It was not until after 4.30pm Thursday 11th that FGM got the call telling her they were coming up early (according to her own walkthrough). So she did not have time to tell anyone they were arriving Thursday night.
They were originally supposed to be driving up from Sydney AFTER FF's work call (scheduled for 9.30am). So they were never going to be there in the morning. Or, possibly FF was going to do the work call in the car on the way up. It's a 3 to 4 hour drive. They still wouldn't have arrived until mid-morning, and then they needed to unpack etc. - not really any window of opportunity for an abductor. Why would anyone stake the house out so early? Did they think they could nab him straight out of the FFs car as he arrived?
Do you think FGM got on the phone immediately to her pedo connections to tell them, "He'll be here tonight, so come over first thing tomorrow!" ?
The ONLY people who knew William would be there for certain that morning, and possibly 'out and about' were the fosters themselves, and then FGM after the phone call.
The 'planned abduction - snatch and grab' scenario is totally implausible.

 

[Underarrest_]

Yes they were expected THAT DAY (Friday 12th - the day he vanished). It was not until after 4.30pm Thursday 11th that FGM got the call telling her they were coming up early (according to her own walkthrough). So she did not have time to tell anyone they were arriving Thursday night.
They were originally supposed to be driving up from Sydney AFTER FF's work call (scheduled for 9.30am). So they were never going to be there in the morning. Or, possibly FF was going to do the work call in the car on the way up. They still wouldn't have arrived until mid-morning, and then they needed to unpack etc. - not really any window of opportunity for an abductor. Why would anyone stake the house out so early? Did they think they could nab him straight out of the FFs car as he arrived?
Do you think FGM got on the phone immediately to her pedo connections to tell them, "He'll be here tonight, so come over first thing tomorrow!" ?
The ONLY people who knew William would be there for certain that morning, and possibly 'out and about' were the fosters themselves, and then FGM after the phone call.
The 'planned abduction - snatch and grab' scenario is totally implausible.

I don’t believe it’s implausible.
If FGM knew her family were arriving for a few days it would only make sense that you’d tell people, friends, tradies or other.
Of course no one would know what time they’re arriving which is why they might be there early.
Of course if there were cars there, they might not have any involvement. Did FM lie though? We don’t know for sure.
Do you completely believe that one or both fosters dumped William’s body from the little evidence there is?
Is there other possibilities?

 

[LRitz]

I don’t believe it’s implausible.
If FGM knew her family were arriving for a few days it would only make sense that you’d tell people, friends, tradies or other.
Of course no one would know what time they’re arriving which is why they might be there early.
Of course if there were cars there, they might not have any involvement. Did FM lie though? We don’t know for sure.
Do you completely believe that one or both fosters dumped William’s body from the little evidence there is?
Is there other possibilities?

I bet FGM told the repair man.

 

[31550]

I don’t believe it’s implausible.
If FGM knew her family were arriving for a few days it would only make sense that you’d tell people, friends, tradies or other.
Of course no one would know what time they’re arriving which is why they might be there early.
Do you completely believe that one or both fosters dumped William’s body from the little evidence there is?
Is there other possibilities?

There are several possibilities. I do not 'completely believe' anything unless there is some proof.
Sure, they would have told some people they were arriving on Friday, and staying overnight or possibly 2 nights.
In a planned abduction, they want to get in and out quickly, not hang around and attract suspicion. So they are not going to turn up at 10am, when there is no chance of the family having even arrived.

 

[31550]

I bet FGM told the repair man.

Maybe she did. ("My daughter and grandkids will be coming from Sydney on Friday"). But so what? William was nabbed at around 10am. The 'repair man' wouldn't have expected him to even be there at that time. And if he was, how was the 'repair man' going to wrangle him away from the family at that time?

Unless FGM rang someone on the Thursday night to tip them off. (I don't believe she did).

 

[Underarrest_]

There are several possibilities. I do not 'completely believe' anything unless there is some proof.
Sure, they would have told some people they were arriving on Friday, and staying overnight or possibly 2 nights.
In a planned abduction, they want to get in and out quickly, not hang around and attract suspicion. So they are not going to turn up at 10am, when there is no chance of the family having even arrived.

The cars were either there or not and involved or not.
Perhaps with a planned abduction of a pedo criminal ring, they had other information.

 

[Underarrest_]

I bet FGM told the repair man.

and the person fixing her patio.

 

[31550]

The cars were either there or not and involved or not.
Perhaps with a planned abduction of a pedo criminal ring, they had other information.

You seem to believe the cars were there, and were involved, and were watching the house in anticipation of a planned abduction of William. If this is all true, then the only people who could provide information are the foster parents, as it was them who made the decision to travel to Kendall on the Thursday instead of the Friday. If there was a pre-planned abduction in the wings, it would have been planned for much later than the actual time William disappeared unless the fosters themselves were involved.

 

[Curious Clues]

Deleted.
Article already posted.

But still can't believe Jubelin has completely ruled FM out.
Has she got something over him or what?

Jubelin is so predictable. Always trying to get a few public jabs in about the current investigation before any upcoming inquest hearings or foster parent drama.
Bring it on, his investigation will surely trump all incompetent missing person investigations.

 

[Underarrest_]

You seem to believe the cars were there, and were involved, and were watching the house in anticipation of a planned abduction of William. If this is all true, then the only people who could provide information are the foster parents, as it was them who made the decision to travel to Kendall on the Thursday instead of the Friday. If there was a pre-planned abduction in the wings, it would have been planned for much later than the actual time William disappeared unless the fosters themselves were involved.

I’m saying it’s possible there were cars there.
All I know is the fosters took off a day early and William disappeared by the 000 call around 11am on the day they were meant to there.

 

[Jim Cricket]

The limited time frame was on the day of Williams disappearance after FF and FM had arranged to meet after secret text messages/phone calll and explains her drive. The following day I agree he had unlimited time frame basically. FF could have left potentially somewhere between 2am and sunrise the following morning and until he was seen on his return I believe.
Like I said I’m just thinking of possible scenarios. FF and FM could have met somewhere entirely different. I’m just leaning towards where I said as FF knew that area better and knew he could access it the following morning on foot without drawing anyone’s attention (until he was seen returning and questioned).
Deleted texts and FM’s drive has to be linked. And the fake text ‘home in 5’ when really they had just been in each other’s company.
Also really strange they never answered the door to police at FGM house on night of Williams disappearance. Wouldn’t you be anxious and hopeful or them bringing you good news. If your child was genuinely missing in the wild. Unless you already knew otherwise. Just my opinion only.

But they could have rung the cops at any time they liked once everything was done and dusted on the day William disappeared, it didn't need to be at 11am or even that day. There was no rush. Is there evidence that there were multiple deleted texts? I've seen it in here from the usual people but the only text I know of that was deleted was the home in 5 minutes text. AFAIK the FM told the cops and they've known of this deleted text since early on so there's not much suspicious about it and there was still a copy on FF's phone - we haven't been told his copy was deleted as well, or any of his messages, and I'm sure the cops would love to have made that public if it happened. If FF had taken the car out the next day I'm sure the cops know about it but I don't think he would have because William would have been found if he was wandering the streets still, and FF would probably be a suspect instead of being cleared if he drove somewhere. He was cleared because we know the FM was the only suspect according to the cops, although that may have changed yet again.

Never answered the door for the cops on the night? Another first for me.

 

[Curious Clues]

But they could have rung the cops at any time they liked once everything was done and dusted on the day William disappeared, it didn't need to be at 11am or even that day. There was no rush. Is there evidence that there were multiple deleted texts? I've seen it in here from the usual people but the only text I know of that was deleted was the home in 5 minutes text. AFAIK the FM told the cops and they've known of this deleted text since early on so there's not much suspicious about it and there was still a copy on FF's phone - we haven't been told his copy was deleted as well, or any of his messages, and I'm sure the cops would love to have made that public if it happened. If FF had taken the car out the next day I'm sure the cops know about it but I don't think he would have because William would have been found if he was wandering the streets still, and FF would probably be a suspect instead of being cleared if he drove somewhere. He was cleared because we know the FM was the only suspect according to the cops, although that may have changed yet again.

Never answered the door for the cops on the night? Another first for me.

Maybe they did have to rush. They had no idea if Spedding was going to just rock up at any time with the parts for the washing machine.
FM deleted ALL her text messages before handing her phone to police. It’s spoken about in her 2016 police interview with Jubelin. She just fobbed it off as something she always did and Jubelin accepted it. According to FM it’s completely normal to read a text from your husband while frantically searching for your missing child and stop to take the time to delete it. She’s got an answer for everything.

 

[KEEP MOVING]

But they could have rung the cops at any time they liked once everything was done and dusted on the day William disappeared, it didn't need to be at 11am or even that day. There was no rush. Is there evidence that there were multiple deleted texts? I've seen it in here from the usual people but the only text I know of that was deleted was the home in 5 minutes text. AFAIK the FM told the cops and they've known of this deleted text since early on so there's not much suspicious about it and there was still a copy on FF's phone - we haven't been told his copy was deleted as well, or any of his messages, and I'm sure the cops would love to have made that public if it happened. If FF had taken the car out the next day I'm sure the cops know about it but I don't think he would have because William would have been found if he was wandering the streets still, and FF would probably be a suspect instead of being cleared if he drove somewhere. He was cleared because we know the FM was the only suspect according to the cops, although that may have changed yet again.

Never answered the door for the cops on the night? Another first for me.

I believe the night of Williams disappearance a police officer attended the FGM house and both FP refused to leave their bedroom and were not up to talking to police officer (might have been Wendy but I’m not sure). And I think FGM answered door. This is after ambulance was called earlier in afternoon/night to attend to FF. Do you remember that bit!
You seem offended by my opinion which was not intentional. I believe the deleted texts and possible phone contact between FM and FF are related to the FM driving FGM car somewhere that morning or mid morning. That’s what I THINK. I am not stating facts. As there are very little facts in this case. And I never said FF drove anywhere the next day. I believe he left early that following morning on foot to relocate poor William to a further destination. It is purely a theory and definitely not fact. You seem very defensive which makes me wonder if you know foster parents or their associates.

 

[Jim Cricket]

Maybe they did have to rush. They had no idea if Spedding was going to just rock up at any time with the parts for the washing machine.
FM deleted ALL her text messages before handing her phone to police. It’s spoken about in her 2016 police interview with Jubelin. She just fobbed it off as something she always did and Jubelin accepted it. According to FM it’s completely normal to read a text from your husband while frantically searching for your missing child and stop to take the time to delete it. She’s got an answer for everything.

What, they couldn't put the body in the lower parking area under the house where he allegedly fell or somewhere else until Spedding left? If I'm an evil genius I'm going to do things methodically, not rush it.

I believe the night of Williams disappearance a police officer attended the FGM house and both FP refused to leave their bedroom and were not up to talking to police officer (might have been Wendy but I’m not sure). And I think FGM answered door. This is after ambulance was called earlier in afternoon/night to attend to FF. Do you remember that bit!
You seem offended by my opinion which was not intentional. I believe the deleted texts and possible phone contact between FM and FF are related to the FM driving FGM car somewhere that morning or mid morning. That’s what I THINK. I am not stating facts. As there are very little facts in this case. And I never said FF drove anywhere the next day. I believe he left early that following morning on foot to relocate poor William to a further destination. It is purely a theory and definitely not fact. You seem very defensive which makes me wonder if you know foster parents or their associates.

Not offended by your opinion at all, I just don't see that it makes sense. You're entitled to it though. The one thing I agree with is that there are very few publicly known facts, so how come people here and elsewhere have made up their minds? The Vibe? The cops desperately trying to charge SOMEONE with a crime so that they can get a pat on the back? If defensive means I have no opinion on who did what then charge me, I'm guilty. If you can find anywhere I've said she didn't do it charge me for that as well. I've seen this crap about "you must know the foster parents" before and it's lame as hell.