AFL Player #47: Jye Menzie

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Not a goalsneak and not a pressure forward. What exactly is the benefit of having him in the team? Is it to develop him? What are we working with then? He’s a player who gets on the end of a few by finding dangerous positions but he doesn’t make things happen. There’s a stark difference to what Papley provides. That stark difference was the margin between the 2 sides.
 

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un_eggs said:
Not a goalsneak and not a pressure forward. What exactly is the benefit of having him in the team? Is it to develop him? What are we working with then? He’s a player who gets on the end of a few by finding dangerous positions but he doesn’t make things happen. There’s a stark difference to what Papley provides. That stark difference was the margin between the 2 sides.
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The Davys aren’t ready for a full AFL game and Tex is injured
 
Said this a while ago and although he did kick a few goals last year the question still stands: What exactly is he good at? He's not super quick, he's not super skilful, doesn't provide amazing defensive pressure, not super smart and crafty, not super clean with the footy, not a great mark, and not exactly mercurial around goals. To be fair he's not terrible at anything, but I really struggle to see any standout traits to work with. Harsh, but a bit of Ned Cahill about him for me.
 
P Money said:
Said this a while ago and although he did kick a few goals last year the question still stands: What exactly is he good at? He's not super quick, he's not super skilful, doesn't provide amazing defensive pressure, not super smart and crafty, not super clean with the footy, not a great mark, and not exactly mercurial around goals. To be fair he's not terrible at anything, but I really struggle to see any standout traits to work with. Harsh, but a bit of Ned Cahill about him for me.
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He's an AFL standard player, I think.

While he doesn't have a stand out attribute he's pretty solid at all parts of the game.

The thing he has a struggled with is the defensive work off the ball as a forward. It was the first thing that stood out in that first half season he played VFL. He gets caught between being able to impact the contest and defending where the ball is going.

Combine that with only average speed and it's not a great fit for our forward line.

Not immediately relevant to last night or even this discussion but he's probably really just a small medium forward more than he is a 'small forward'.
 
P Money said:
Said this a while ago and although he did kick a few goals last year the question still stands: What exactly is he good at? He's not super quick, he's not super skilful, doesn't provide amazing defensive pressure, not super smart and crafty, not super clean with the footy, not a great mark, and not exactly mercurial around goals. To be fair he's not terrible at anything, but I really struggle to see any standout traits to work with. Harsh, but a bit of Ned Cahill about him for me.
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Few goals lol. He was our 2nd highest goal kicker. Ease up with the propaganda.

And is he not entitled to a drop off in form like most players are before we write him off completely? Yes we want to win games of footy but that eagerness shouldn't be placed on the unrealistic expectations of a young player.
 
un_eggs said:
Not a goalsneak and not a pressure forward. What exactly is the benefit of having him in the team? Is it to develop him? What are we working with then? He’s a player who gets on the end of a few by finding dangerous positions but he doesn’t make things happen. There’s a stark difference to what Papley provides. That stark difference was the margin between the 2 sides.
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Comparing the game of a player who just turned 21 and kicked the 2nd most goals as a 20 year old to a player who's soon to be 28...

This board never fails to deliver.
 
I've said this before; he's the small forward we have until we can upgrade to another Walla-type small forward: evasive in traffic, snaps from tight angles under pressure, reliable set shots, dangerous positioning, hits stoppages and crumbs at pace, decent leap and a reliable set of dukes, pressure defensive runner and can tackle.

When that player comes along, Menzie's gone...
Or he develops.
 
Call Me Cake said:
Comparing the game of a player who just turned 21 and kicked the 2nd most goals as a 20 year old to a player who's soon to be 28...

This board never fails to deliver.
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What? It’s taboo to highlight the obvious deficiencies he has. I’m not saying he should be playing with the experienced know-how of Papley, I’m saying he hasn’t got the attributes to ever be that type of player. And the difference was evident in the score line because we don’t have a player of that type at the club.

As for his measly total of goals to be second highest last year - I hope that we don’t have that again for a long time. A goal per game is nothing to write home about and if we had Wright, Stringer and Gresham available he’d have been nowhere near it.
 
un_eggs said:
And the difference was evident in the score line because we don’t have a player of that type at the club.
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How are you claiming you're not comparing them but then using the score line of the most recent game as the be all end all regarding Menzie as a player. You're literally contradicting yourself. May I remind you that Papley only scored one goal a game in the last two that Sydney played.

Not only that but you're sh*tting on his efforts last year which clearly illustrates a lack of context comprehension. He was never meant to be our 2nd highest goal kicker, that's not what he should be doing anyway because he's developing, but it is a clear sign that he gave it his all and did what he was supposed to do.

un_eggs said:
As for his measly total of goals to be second highest last year
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Papley kicked the same amount of goals in his 3rd season at Sydney as a 23 year old.

un_eggs said:
What? It’s taboo to highlight the obvious deficiencies he has.
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You're not just pointing out deficiencies, you're literally writing him off completely before he's even had a proper go at it despite past efforts showing that he deserves the benefit of doubt. What? It's taboo to explain how you're being ridiculous?
 
Call Me Cake said:
How are you claiming you're not comparing them but then using the score line of the most recent game as the be all end all regarding Menzie as a player. You're literally contradicting yourself. May I remind you that Papley only scored one goal a game in the last two that Sydney played.

Not only that but you're sh*tting on his efforts last year which clearly illustrates a lack of context comprehension. He was never meant to be our 2nd highest goal kicker, that's not what he should be doing anyway because he's developing, but it is a clear sign that he gave it his all and did what he was supposed to do.



Papley kicked the same amount of goals in his 3rd season at Sydney as a 23 year old.



You're not just pointing out deficiencies, you're literally writing him off completely before he's even had a proper go at it despite past efforts showing that he deserves the benefit of doubt. What? It's taboo to explain how you're being ridiculous?
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No, he's not. You're looking at any criticism and saying that they're writing him off.
 

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dank420_ said:
Comparing him with Papley is clearly disingenuous unless you’re saying that Menzie should be aiming for that output.

However, he’s had a very slow start to the year.

Mayo is bad for you.
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Fatten him up for Tassie.
 
Call Me Cake said:
How are you claiming you're not comparing them but then using the score line of the most recent game as the be all end all regarding Menzie as a player. You're literally contradicting yourself. May I remind you that Papley only scored one goal a game in the last two that Sydney played.

Not only that but you're sh*tting on his efforts last year which clearly illustrates a lack of context comprehension. He was never meant to be our 2nd highest goal kicker, that's not what he should be doing anyway because he's developing, but it is a clear sign that he gave it his all and did what he was supposed to do.



Papley kicked the same amount of goals in his 3rd season at Sydney as a 23 year old.



You're not just pointing out deficiencies, you're literally writing him off completely before he's even had a proper go at it despite past efforts showing that he deserves the benefit of doubt. What? It's taboo to explain how you're being ridiculous?
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I’m not writing him off at all. I hope he proves me wrong about the deficiencies in his game.

The comparison is more related to the type of player we don’t have - the nippy small forward that makes things happen. Menzie is a fair example of this as he doesn’t fit the mould especially when we have Gresh, Stringer, Guelfi all in the forward line as well. It’s a fair thing to ask ‘what difference is he offering as a player with his attributes?’ I’m questioning his selection as it doesn’t fit with the balance of our team and it’s glaringly obvious when the type of player we need is tearing us apart down the other end. I’m being realistic.
 
un_eggs said:
I’m not writing him off at all. I hope he proves me wrong about the deficiencies in his game.

The comparison is more related to the type of player we don’t have - the nippy small forward that makes things happen. Menzie is a fair example of this as he doesn’t fit the mould especially when we have Gresh, Stringer, Guelfi all in the forward line as well. It’s a fair thing to ask ‘what difference is he offering as a player with his attributes?’ I’m questioning his selection as it doesn’t fit with the balance of our team and it’s glaringly obvious when the type of player we need is tearing us apart down the other end. I’m being realistic.
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It's time for a new position name as small forward doesn't really descriptive enough.

There is the Papley / Elliott / Bruest / Gray small forward

And the Tippa / Cyril / Bobby Hill / K Pickett type

I'd call the former "small forwards" and the latter "pressure forwards"
 
fairbump_playon said:
It's time for a new position name as small forward doesn't really descriptive enough.

There is the Papley / Elliott / Bruest / Gray small forward

And the Tippa / Cyril / Bobby Hill / K Pickett type

I'd call the former "small forwards" and the latter "pressure forwards"
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Problem is I’m not sure that Menzie is either. He has more of the former attributes but the issue is, and this is the crucial bit, he doesn’t make things happen like those you mentioned. Hopefully it will come.
 
un_eggs said:
Problem is I’m not sure that Menzie is either. He has more of the former attributes but the issue is, and this is the crucial bit, he doesn’t make things happen like those you mentioned. Hopefully it will come.
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I think you're forgetting a bit from last year while yes, admittedly he's not had a good two games this year. He manages to kick goals which is something that he makes happen. He was a class above everyone else in our VFL side which is why he gets picked.

He's not Papley and I haven't seen anyone mention that he was ever going to be.
 
ghostdog said:
I've said this before; he's the small forward we have until we can upgrade to another Walla-type small forward: evasive in traffic, snaps from tight angles under pressure, reliable set shots, dangerous positioning, hits stoppages and crumbs at pace, decent leap and a reliable set of dukes, pressure defensive runner and can tackle.

When that player comes along, Menzie's gone...
Or he develops.
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:whitecheck:
 
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