Welcome Darcy Fogarty, AFC Pick 12 in the 2017 draft!

How many AFL matches do you think Darcy Fogarty will play in 2018?

  • 16+ games

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  • It depends on form, injuries blah blah why even bother posting about the season or footy in general

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    78
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Southerntakeover

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To me FOG needs to address the 15-20 minute spans of time where he's completely unsighted. And yes Tank/stamina play a large part in this, but also understanding the role and how to get involved with correct positioning on the field (which will come with age and experience).

Its hard when its an extended bench in JLT to get a true vibe on how he's going in this regard which is frustrating, but having said that I still think there was only probably 4 or 5 times I really remember him being in the contest on the weekend. That needs to lift dramatically before he earns the start.
It couldnt have anything to do with being a key forward, could it?
 

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It couldnt have anything to do with being a key forward, could it?
That’s the whole point. Key forwards take time to develop, and often need loads of work on figuring out how to stay in the contest. And watching FOG in the trial and JLT1, I didn’t see a guy that looked like he was progressing to that next stage as quickly as I’d originally hoped. He has many traits I love, but this is one that seems to be coming on a bit slower for him.

I have no doubt he’ll get there, but I’d like to see a big lift before he’s in serious consideration for one of the key position posts in the 1’s
 

GreyCrow

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Man I hope you're being sarcastic on that one...
No I'm not

Read the original description

It's no fluke he gets uncontested possessions. Opposition players and coaches know how important his link-up play is to our forward structure, yet he is still able to gather the majority of his possessions as uncontested. He breaks his defenders with his gut running and repeat efforts.

Who is that?
 

70lethal

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No I'm not

Read the original description

It's no fluke he gets uncontested possessions. Opposition players and coaches know how important his link-up play is to our forward structure, yet he is still able to gather the majority of his possessions as uncontested. He breaks his defenders with his gut running and repeat efforts.

Who is that?
You aren't serious, the whole point is Mackay doesnt get enough possessions.
Your comparing one guy who plays one of the hardest positions on a field as a lead up forward and is the best in the league to a guy that is an outside runner whose job it is to get uncontested marks and still averages 20% less possessions a game.
If Mackay is gut running so hard he should be getting 30 possies a game.

Milera has already gone past him in this area and he's only into his 3rd season.
 

GROTTO

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Funnily enough fog got a couple of goals on a 40+ degree day against our most hated rivals. If he comes in this season and snares a couple of goals a game each time i'd take that
To kick straight a 45+ kick is a weapon. We need to exploit him a lot more. Its very hard to defend against a player that can kick that straight from that far out from goal. Fog needs to be encouraged to do this as often as possible.
 

Golumless

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To me FOG needs to address the 15-20 minute spans of time where he's completely unsighted. And yes Tank/stamina play a large part in this, but also understanding the role and how to get involved with correct positioning on the field (which will come with age and experience).

Its hard when its an extended bench in JLT to get a true vibe on how he's going in this regard which is frustrating, but having said that I still think there was only probably 4 or 5 times I really remember him being in the contest on the weekend. That needs to lift dramatically before he earns the start.
What key forward doesn't suffer spans of 15-20 minutes of being unsighted? Nature of the beast seeing you're completely reliant on others to even be involved in the game. Especially in dangerous positions where ideally all of them will be, and not desperately trying to get the ball at half back.

All about game to game consistency, as it is very much a burst position in the majority of times.

That’s the whole point. Key forwards take time to develop, and often need loads of work on figuring out how to stay in the contest. And watching FOG in the trial and JLT1, I didn’t see a guy that looked like he was progressing to that next stage as quickly as I’d originally hoped. He has many traits I love, but this is one that seems to be coming on a bit slower for him.

I have no doubt he’ll get there, but I’d like to see a big lift before he’s in serious consideration for one of the key position posts in the 1’s
Not really. You can always sacrifice a spot to let a player develop. You don't need a lot of production out of a third tall after all.

SANFL can't teach a player shit about being a key forward in our set up either, it's just not conditions conducive to developing them. Our only weak spot with that set up as we are completely reliant on a lack of injuries to be competitive, and you can't develop key talls without being competitive in the midfield as the supply just isn't there.
 
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Golumless

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Funnily enough fog got a couple of goals on a 40+ degree day against our most hated rivals. If he comes in this season and snares a couple of goals a game each time i'd take that
Absolutely I would. 2 goals is a good game from a developing KPF on 64% game time.
 

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No I'm not

Read the original description

It's no fluke he gets uncontested possessions. Opposition players and coaches know how important his link-up play is to our forward structure, yet he is still able to gather the majority of his possessions as uncontested. He breaks his defenders with his gut running and repeat efforts.

Who is that?
I’m not even gonna justify that with a response
 

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What key forward doesn't suffer spans of 15-20 minutes of being unsighted? Nature of the beast seeing you're completely reliant on others to even be involved in the game. Especially in dangerous positions where ideally all of them will be, and not desperately trying to get the ball at half back.

All about game to game consistency, as it is very much a burst position in the majority of times.



Not really. You can always sacrifice a spot to let a player develop. You don't need a lot of production out of a third tall after all.

SANFL can't teach a player shit about being a key forward in our set up either, it's just not conditions conducive to developing them. Our only weak spot with that set up as we are completely reliant on a lack of injuries to be competitive, and you can't develop key talls without being competitive in the midfield as the supply just isn't there.
I’d love to play him for development sake, I’ve said that many times. But im also not gonna bury my head in the sand to an obvious and prevalent flaw in his game. Some may find it tolerable in their forward 50 to carry a bloke who phases out of games for quarters or half’s at a time, but I don’t see Pyke being one of them.

Make no mistake, if we bomb out this season, Pyke’s head is ....well, on a Pike! So if everyone is fit I see FOGs best shot is a bench player until he can keep himself in the game more.
 

spexau

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What key forward doesn't suffer spans of 15-20 minutes of being unsighted? Nature of the beast seeing you're completely reliant on others to even be involved in the game. Especially in dangerous positions where ideally all of them will be, and not desperately trying to get the ball at half back.

All about game to game consistency, as it is very much a burst position in the majority of times.



Not really. You can always sacrifice a spot to let a player develop. You don't need a lot of production out of a third tall after all.

SANFL can't teach a player shit about being a key forward in our set up either, it's just not conditions conducive to developing them. Our only weak spot with that set up as we are completely reliant on a lack of injuries to be competitive, and you can't develop key talls without being competitive in the midfield as the supply just isn't there.
Especially in our forward line. It's not like he's the main focal point
 

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No I'm not

Read the original description

It's no fluke he gets uncontested possessions. Opposition players and coaches know how important his link-up play is to our forward structure, yet he is still able to gather the majority of his possessions as uncontested. He breaks his defenders with his gut running and repeat efforts.

Who is that?
Tom Lynch. Its certainly not David Mackay who barely ever gets 20 touches a match. Lynch gets that every week.
 

Southerntakeover

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To kick straight a 45+ kick is a weapon. We need to exploit him a lot more. Its very hard to defend against a player that can kick that straight from that far out from goal. Fog needs to be encouraged to do this as often as possible.
It's really the area where he's an upgrade over McGovern (there are others where he's not). Gov would take amazing marks, get into amazing positions, and yet on occasion was prone to spray straight forward set shots.

They were important goals too- our first goal when we'd started badly as a settler, and the sealer.

I think people are underrating how good the play to set up Jones was as well- there was a pick up, a balk, a fend, and a dish. That's the sort of play elite key forwards make. He's going to be very very good this kid. The idea the board's losing faith in him would be absurd, if it weren't obvious that it's a reaction to his having been championed.
 

spexau

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It's really the area where he's an upgrade over McGovern (there are others where he's not). Gov would take amazing marks, get into amazing positions, and yet on occasion was prone to spray straight forward set shots.

They were important goals too- our first goal when we'd started badly as a settler, and the sealer.

I think people are underrating how good the play to set up Jones was as well- there was a pick up, a balk, a fend, and a dish. That's the sort of play elite key forwards make. He's going to be very very good this kid. The idea the board's losing faith in him would be absurd, if it weren't obvious that it's a reaction to his having been championed.
He's 19!
 

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I think people are missing the point. I never mentioned possession count

The description given could refer to Mackay
The problem is DMAC is a failed outside mid that was transitioned to the HBF to cover injury (and because there's no spot for him in the midfield), he's essentially never been manned up against in his career and still does almost no damage (And thats coming from someone who has defended DMAC on multiple occasions as getting a bum wrap around here).

Lynch is an Elite high half forward who is gameplanned for by the opposition each week and is fundementally vital to our systems.

So while certain descriptors may be similar, the context around these 2 is Chalk and cheese...
 

Southerntakeover

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Thanks for the update.

The criticisms that the board are now placing aren't the sort that are going to get better, were they accurate. He's apparently slow, fat, can't run.

Thankfully that's all a load of crap, but it's been another fun experience in just how quickly people will throw the young players under the bus if they want to defend status quo. I should have learned from Taylor Walker and tackle gate all those years ago I suppose.
 

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It's really the area where he's an upgrade over McGovern (there are others where he's not). Gov would take amazing marks, get into amazing positions, and yet on occasion was prone to spray straight forward set shots.

They were important goals too- our first goal when we'd started badly as a settler, and the sealer.

I think people are underrating how good the play to set up Jones was as well- there was a pick up, a balk, a fend, and a dish. That's the sort of play elite key forwards make. He's going to be very very good this kid. The idea the board's losing faith in him would be absurd, if it weren't obvious that it's a reaction to his having been championed.
Who's losing faith? People are allowed to talk about the flaws in a 19 year old kid, who is playing a difficult role in a stacked team without 'losing faith'!

Every single poster in here expects this kid to be a beast, but he has yet to earn anything. And in any elite sport you receive the praise when you earn it! Right now FOG has shown exciting flashes and boat loads of potential, but also a lack of mobility and aerobic capacity that leaves him prone to falling completely out of games!

These are just facts and things he needs to work on to reach his potential in the AFL, doesn't mean i've lost faith to say them out loud!
 

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Didn't you describe him as 'slow and bulky'?

Is your expectation that he'll get faster in advanced age?
I described his running action as 'noticeably non fluid'. Never said slow and bulky.

And yes, I think with increased aerobic capacity he will be able to run harder for longer which will enhance his perceived speed by leaps and bounds. Its when he's gassed that you really notice that really upright, short gate style of running that he does.
 
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beartoo

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I’d love to play him for development sake, I’ve said that many times. But im also not gonna bury my head in the sand to an obvious and prevalent flaw in his game. Some may find it tolerable in their forward 50 to carry a bloke who phases out of games for quarters or half’s at a time, but I don’t see Pyke being one of them.

Make no mistake, if we bomb out this season, Pyke’s head is ....well, on a Pike! So if everyone is fit I see FOGs best shot is a bench player until he can keep himself in the game more.
McGovern?
 

spexau

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I described his running action as 'noticeably non fluid'. Never said slow and bulky.

And yes, I think with increased aerobic capacity he will be able to run harder for longer which will enhance his perceived speed by leaps and bounds. Its when he's gassed that you really notice that really upright, short gate style of running that he does.
His short gait is what makes him quite agile for a big man.
 

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His short gait is what makes him quite agile for a big man.
You could be right, but I wouldn't say its mutually exclusive from what i've seen. Buddy has an extremely long gait and is plenty agile, same with Jeremy Cameron. With FOG it might be the case but I couldn't say with 100% certainty
 
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