Domestic Violence Epidemic

[Kurve]

Thread here on COERCIVE CONTROL

 

[TheEscapeClub]

A register and a visible, colour coded ankle bracelet so we all know who they are. Shame them out of it because I don't think anything else will work in any meaningful way.

 

[Underarrest_]

Not necessarily. A younger woman can wield a lot of power over an older man. I would suggest the power imbalance in this case comes from her being a drug user, possibly dependent to some extent, and her PoS 'BF' supplying her with drugs.

Why wouldn’t a 32 year old man try and help a 19 year old instead of supplying them with drugs?

 

[Toump Ass]

Please, watch the above first and before weighing in again.

Of course there are circumstances where people change or gradually increase their controlling behaviours and it's great that money is being spent on educating people on behaviours that are red flags, but at the same time, DV is a multi-faceted thing and there's not one profile that fits all perpetrators.

 

[PenfoldsFan]

At the risk of being labelled as victim blaming, Id like to suggest that in many cases certain Women seem to be attracted to 'bad boys'.
Throw in the current housing crisis and the likelihood of vulnerable Women taking refuge with less than desirable men only increases.

My best mates Daughter fits that profile perfectly.
She left home at an early age, 16, and moved from SA to northern NSW with her then boyfriend. Soon enough she fell pregnant and had a child followed by another a couple of years later.
When she separated from the children's Father, she became basically homeless and lost her children to welfare. This triggered a period in her life and an ongoing mindset of whatever it takes to survive and would go from bloke to bloke just to keep a roof over her head, many of these guys were bad boys, bikies, druggies, you name it.
I lost count of how many times I'd be with her dad when she'd call and tell of another beating and breakup.
I used to say to him let's bring her back home where we can help her out and set her on the right track, which was always met with the same response, she won't change, it's been like this for too long, it's all she knows.

I was skeptical of that attitude, he suffered mental health issues himself and so I figured it was simply a case of being there for her to take her calls when she needed him but unable to deal with her problems too.
Having said all that, she was no angel either and in her late 20's reached a point where she became the hunter and hooked up with much younger Men to secure a roof over her head, she even had a 3rd child with a lad 10yrs her junior.

In 2021 my best mate suddenly took ill and was given only days to live. As he had no other family in SA I arranged to fly his Daughter down so she could see him before he passed. Initially she was only coming down for a few days but within 24hrs she'd decided she wanted to come home permanently to SA and be around us.
Despite the words of my now passed best mate ringing in my ears I decided to give her the benefit of the doubt and help her relocate and hopefully turn her life around.
Problem was she had left her young partner and new born in NSW and had no money to get them down here, so she set about cleaning up her Father's estate and selling off anything she could to raise funds.
He had a lot of what you'd call junk, was a bit of a hoarder but loved his camping and it was something we did together so I offered to buy all his camping gear to keep it close whilst helping her out.
She left here to go back and tie up the loose ends with a few thousand in her pocket and returned a couple of weeks later with the baby and broke.

She moved in with us until she could find a place but despite all the encouragement and assistance with offers from many of my Family members to drive her around, she made little effort.
Soon enough I began to realise what my mate meant, she didn't want help, she just wanted the next person to take responsibility for her whilst she lived her lifestyle.
It drove me nuts as Im a helper, I always look to solve problems, but you can't help someone who doesn't want help.
Soon enough she'd take off on weekends and spend it at a motel where one of her friends from school was being put up by a charity group for also being homeless.
This friend also led a lifestyle that led to 'bad boys' and soon enough they were partying with guys every weekend.
Then one day a letter arrived in the mail for her with dept of corrections on it from an inmate in Yatala.
I googled the name and was appalled at what he was incarcerated for. I took the letter to the local Police station where I was told in no uncertain terms that this guy was well known for serious crimes and not someone I'd want to know my address or get involved with.
When I got home, I messaged her to see wtf was going on, she said apparently he was her friend's boyfriend and because she was worried about welfare taking her kids due to his rap sheet she got him to send his letters to our address which my mates daughter gave him and pretended to be his girlfriend.
I called time on it at that moment and told her to come and get her stuff as I wasn't being any part of that.
Kicking her out hurt deeply as I felt I'd let my mate down but the reality is, she only knew one way to live and despite our efforts that was never going to change.
I've had the occasional contact with her through common associates and the cycle has continued to this day.

Now I'm not saying this is typical of all domestic violence incidents but in many cases, we hear of age imbalances, drugs and dodgy looking Men that you wouldn't look at twice if you had choices and so I believe a lot of what we're seeing is due to people having no other choice than to stay in dangerous situations or enter them for survival which sadly ends up being anything but.

 

[Underarrest_]

Two men aged 32 and 34yo have been charged this far, with drugs and theft offences over the Bondi death of the 19yo girl.

The age disparity tells of a gross power imbalance. This girl might have died of an overdose, if only one gram of meth and some marijuana was actually found in the unit and imo their responsibility needs to be examined.

Autopsy not complete yet.

https://www.skynews.com.au/australia-news/crime/police-charge-two-men-aged-32-and-34-over-outstanding-warrant-and-drugs-offences-after-teens-body-found-in-north-bondi-unit/news-story/60af62762db7e555cbbca50272de52b4

At the risk of being labelled as victim blaming, Id like to suggest that in many cases certain Women seem to be attracted to 'bad boys'.
Throw in the current housing crisis and the likelihood of vulnerable Women taking refuge with less than desirable men only increases.

My best mates Daughter fits that profile perfectly.
She left home at an early age, 16, and moved from SA to northern NSW with her then boyfriend. Soon enough she fell pregnant and had a child followed by another a couple of years later.
When she separated from the children's Father, she became basically homeless and lost her children to welfare. This triggered a period in her life and an ongoing mindset of whatever it takes to survive and would go from bloke to bloke just to keep a roof over her head, many of these guys were bad boys, bikies, druggies, you name it.
I lost count of how many times I'd be with her dad when she'd call and tell of another beating and breakup.
I used to say to him let's bring her back home where we can help her out and set her on the right track, which was always met with the same response, she won't change, it's been like this for too long, it's all she knows.

I was skeptical of that attitude, he suffered mental health issues himself and so I figured it was simply a case of being there for her to take her calls when she needed him but unable to deal with her problems too.
Having said all that, she was no angel either and in her late 20's reached a point where she became the hunter and hooked up with much younger Men to secure a roof over her head, she even had a 3rd child with a lad 10yrs her junior.

In 2021 my best mate suddenly took ill and was given only days to live. As he had no other family in SA I arranged to fly his Daughter down so she could see him before he passed. Initially she was only coming down for a few days but within 24hrs she'd decided she wanted to come home permanently to SA and be around us.
Despite the words of my now passed best mate ringing in my ears I decided to give her the benefit of the doubt and help her relocate and hopefully turn her life around.
Problem was she had left her young partner and new born in NSW and had no money to get them down here, so she set about cleaning up her Father's estate and selling off anything she could to raise funds.
He had a lot of what you'd call junk, was a bit of a hoarder but loved his camping and it was something we did together so I offered to buy all his camping gear to keep it close whilst helping her out.
She left here to go back and tie up the loose ends with a few thousand in her pocket and returned a couple of weeks later with the baby and broke.

She moved in with us until she could find a place but despite all the encouragement and assistance with offers from many of my Family members to drive her around, she made little effort.
Soon enough I began to realise what my mate meant, she didn't want help, she just wanted the next person to take responsibility for her whilst she lived her lifestyle.
It drove me nuts as Im a helper, I always look to solve problems, but you can't help someone who doesn't want help.
Soon enough she'd take off on weekends and spend it at a motel where one of her friends from school was being put up by a charity group for also being homeless.
This friend also led a lifestyle that led to 'bad boys' and soon enough they were partying with guys every weekend.
Then one day a letter arrived in the mail for her with dept of corrections on it from an inmate in Yatala.
I googled the name and was appalled at what he was incarcerated for. I took the letter to the local Police station where I was told in no uncertain terms that this guy was well known for serious crimes and not someone I'd want to know my address or get involved with.
When I got home, I messaged her to see wtf was going on, she said apparently he was her friend's boyfriend and because she was worried about welfare taking her kids due to his rap sheet she got him to send his letters to our address which my mates daughter gave him and pretended to be his girlfriend.
I called time on it at that moment and told her to come and get her stuff as I wasn't being any part of that.
Kicking her out hurt deeply as I felt I'd let my mate down but the reality is, she only knew one way to live and despite our efforts that was never going to change.
I've had the occasional contact with her through common associates and the cycle has continued to this day.

Now I'm not saying this is typical of all domestic violence incidents but in many cases, we hear of age imbalances, drugs and dodgy looking Men that you wouldn't look at twice if you had choices and so I believe a lot of what we're seeing is due to people having no other choice than to stay in dangerous situations or enter them for survival which sadly ends up being anything but.

In this case I’d be curious to know if the young person mentioned had witnessed healthy relationships in her life? Was she educated on healthy relationships? Was there something in her life that happened to lower her self esteem, believe that she didn’t deserve better in life?

 

[CredibleSauce]

I wish I believed this, but honestly, I don’t.

Some people are just a horrible judge of character. Like anyone who is friends with me, for instance.

You don’t have to believe it (despite it being fairly easy to verify) but even if they are “just a horrible judge of character”, is being bashed to death by the character in question really an appropriate punishment for daring to look for the good in someone?

 

[PenfoldsFan]

In this case I’d be curious to know if the young person mentioned had witnessed healthy relationships in her life? Was she educated on healthy relationships? Was there something in her life that happened to lower her self esteem, believe that she didn’t deserve better in life?

My mate and her Mother werent a couple for very long, she herself was a runaway and lied to him about her age, not sure on her exact age but he was 19.
Her Mother left with her own 'bad boy' and had a cycle of that lifestyle for many years, my mate raised his Daughter until she was probably 4. During that time her Mother would appear out of nowhere and threaten to take her and have my mate 'dealt with'.
I was present as an 18yo one night when this happened and it scared s**t out of me, she mixed with crazies.

My mate decided to flee in the end but to avoid having his Daughter homeless he left her in the care of his Sister and Husband who had kids of similar age where she stayed until age 16.
She was raised as their own and attended private school where her Aunt worked, he was in the army.
I think she rebelled against discipline to be honest.
There was no domestic violence during those years that Id ever heard of and when she would visit us in her early teens she came across as naive if anything and had obviously been sheltered.

I wouldnt call her a bad person, she just did what she thought she had to do to survive which was my point.
I think this plays out more than we realise or want to admit or confront.

I was born and raised in Elizabeth so I know full well what DV looks like and how it becomes not only a part of life but in many cases a way of life.
I lived it myself until I fled at age 15.

 

[Kurve]

My mate and her Mother werent a couple for very long, she herself was a runaway and lied to him about her age, not sure on her exact age but he was 19.
Her Mother left with her own 'bad boy' and had a cycle of that lifestyle for many years, my mate raised his Daughter until she was probably 4. During that time her Mother would appear out of nowhere and threaten to take her and have my mate 'dealt with'.
I was present as an 18yo one night when this happened and it scared s**t out of me, she mixed with crazies.

My mate decided to flee in the end but to avoid having his Daughter homeless he left her in the care of his Sister and Husband who had kids of similar age where she stayed until age 16.
She was raised as their own and attended private school where her Aunt worked, he was in the army.
I think she rebelled against discipline to be honest.
There was no domestic violence during those years that Id ever heard of and when she would visit us in her early teens she came across as naive if anything and had obviously been sheltered.

I wouldnt call her a bad person, she just did what she thought she had to do to survive which was my point.
I think this plays out more than we realise or want to admit or confront.

We see constantly across this board, that male DV offenders and killers cut across all classes of society so I don't understand what your point is here or even if it's a valid one.

 

[PenfoldsFan]

We see constantly across this board, that male DV offenders and killers cut across all classes of society so I don't understand what your point is here or even if it's a valid one.

It wasnt directed at you so you can scroll on bye for all I care.
I was just giving some background to my original post that underarrest_ quoted.

 

[fs88]

At the risk of being labelled as victim blaming, Id like to suggest that in many cases certain Women seem to be attracted to 'bad boys'.
Throw in the current housing crisis and the likelihood of vulnerable Women taking refuge with less than desirable men only increases.

My best mates Daughter fits that profile perfectly.
She left home at an early age, 16, and moved from SA to northern NSW with her then boyfriend. Soon enough she fell pregnant and had a child followed by another a couple of years later.
When she separated from the children's Father, she became basically homeless and lost her children to welfare. This triggered a period in her life and an ongoing mindset of whatever it takes to survive and would go from bloke to bloke just to keep a roof over her head, many of these guys were bad boys, bikies, druggies, you name it.
I lost count of how many times I'd be with her dad when she'd call and tell of another beating and breakup.
I used to say to him let's bring her back home where we can help her out and set her on the right track, which was always met with the same response, she won't change, it's been like this for too long, it's all she knows.

I was skeptical of that attitude, he suffered mental health issues himself and so I figured it was simply a case of being there for her to take her calls when she needed him but unable to deal with her problems too.
Having said all that, she was no angel either and in her late 20's reached a point where she became the hunter and hooked up with much younger Men to secure a roof over her head, she even had a 3rd child with a lad 10yrs her junior.

In 2021 my best mate suddenly took ill and was given only days to live. As he had no other family in SA I arranged to fly his Daughter down so she could see him before he passed. Initially she was only coming down for a few days but within 24hrs she'd decided she wanted to come home permanently to SA and be around us.
Despite the words of my now passed best mate ringing in my ears I decided to give her the benefit of the doubt and help her relocate and hopefully turn her life around.
Problem was she had left her young partner and new born in NSW and had no money to get them down here, so she set about cleaning up her Father's estate and selling off anything she could to raise funds.
He had a lot of what you'd call junk, was a bit of a hoarder but loved his camping and it was something we did together so I offered to buy all his camping gear to keep it close whilst helping her out.
She left here to go back and tie up the loose ends with a few thousand in her pocket and returned a couple of weeks later with the baby and broke.

She moved in with us until she could find a place but despite all the encouragement and assistance with offers from many of my Family members to drive her around, she made little effort.
Soon enough I began to realise what my mate meant, she didn't want help, she just wanted the next person to take responsibility for her whilst she lived her lifestyle.
It drove me nuts as Im a helper, I always look to solve problems, but you can't help someone who doesn't want help.
Soon enough she'd take off on weekends and spend it at a motel where one of her friends from school was being put up by a charity group for also being homeless.
This friend also led a lifestyle that led to 'bad boys' and soon enough they were partying with guys every weekend.
Then one day a letter arrived in the mail for her with dept of corrections on it from an inmate in Yatala.
I googled the name and was appalled at what he was incarcerated for. I took the letter to the local Police station where I was told in no uncertain terms that this guy was well known for serious crimes and not someone I'd want to know my address or get involved with.
When I got home, I messaged her to see wtf was going on, she said apparently he was her friend's boyfriend and because she was worried about welfare taking her kids due to his rap sheet she got him to send his letters to our address which my mates daughter gave him and pretended to be his girlfriend.
I called time on it at that moment and told her to come and get her stuff as I wasn't being any part of that.
Kicking her out hurt deeply as I felt I'd let my mate down but the reality is, she only knew one way to live and despite our efforts that was never going to change.
I've had the occasional contact with her through common associates and the cycle has continued to this day.

Now I'm not saying this is typical of all domestic violence incidents but in many cases, we hear of age imbalances, drugs and dodgy looking Men that you wouldn't look at twice if you had choices and so I believe a lot of what we're seeing is due to people having no other choice than to stay in dangerous situations or enter them for survival which sadly ends up being anything but.

I'm facebook friends with a former work colleague who is now a CPA and Director of an accounting firm, and his wife.

Last month his wife changed her surname back to her maiden name and posted a DV statement so it can happen to anyone on the chain.

I kind of see where you are coming from with the whole 'attractive girls gravitating towards bad guys' thing, but the Bondi murders were all random and the other deaths didn't exclusively happen to models per se.

 

[PenfoldsFan]

I'm facebook friends with a former work colleague who is now a CPA and Director of an accounting firm, and his wife.

Last month his wife changed her surname back to her maiden name and posted a DV statement so it can happen to anyone on the chain.

I kind of see where you are coming from with the whole 'attractive girls gravitating towards bad guys' thing, but the Bondi murders were all random and the other deaths didn't exclusively happen to models per se.

I dont recall mentioning physical appearance of the girl in my example so not sure what the 'attractive' or 'model' reference is about.

 

[fs88]

A register and a visible, colour coded ankle bracelet so we all know who they are. Shame them out of it because I don't think anything else will work in any meaningful way.

I also thought about a register but it would seem like an administrative nightmare? Realistically you'd only be able to be put on the register once it goes through court and the murders happen well and truly before then unfortunately.

 

[PenfoldsFan]

Wasnt there some online platform where you could post up about dodgy ex's to warn off future victims?

 

[Underarrest_]

My mate and her Mother werent a couple for very long, she herself was a runaway and lied to him about her age, not sure on her exact age but he was 19.
Her Mother left with her own 'bad boy' and had a cycle of that lifestyle for many years, my mate raised his Daughter until she was probably 4. During that time her Mother would appear out of nowhere and threaten to take her and have my mate 'dealt with'.
I was present as an 18yo one night when this happened and it scared s**t out of me, she mixed with crazies.

My mate decided to flee in the end but to avoid having his Daughter homeless he left her in the care of his Sister and Husband who had kids of similar age where she stayed until age 16.
She was raised as their own and attended private school where her Aunt worked, he was in the army.
I think she rebelled against discipline to be honest.
There was no domestic violence during those years that Id ever heard of and when she would visit us in her early teens she came across as naive if anything and had obviously been sheltered.

I wouldnt call her a bad person, she just did what she thought she had to do to survive which was my point.
I think this plays out more than we realise or want to admit or confront.

I was born and raised in Elizabeth so I know full well what DV looks like and how it becomes not only a part of life but in many cases a way of life.
I lived it myself until I fled at age 15.

I’m glad you were able to get away from that situation as no one should experience DV.
I hope the person you’ve mentioned is able to find her way and break that cycle also.

 

[Toump Ass]

You don’t have to believe it (despite it being fairly easy to verify)

Yes of course, very easy to verify I'm sure.
And you only have to do it once I guess, every case being exactly the same and all.

but even if they are “just a horrible judge of character”, is being bashed to death by the character in question really an appropriate punishment for daring to look for the good in someone?

Look I'm all for destroying the patriarchy and equality and spending money on videos that explain to people how your partner asking for access to your phone could lead to you being socially isolated, also educating people on what good relationships look like (sorry ladies, you might need to be involved in that bit), cultural change, respect, and we can also tell men to tell their mates to pull their heads in when they say a misogynist joke as we've been doing for what feels like decades now... and all the other things too. Clearly addressing poverty, improving educational outcomes, removing social and economic barriers, massively increasing the social welfare expenditure and funding social services would have a positive effect too. Let's do all of these things.

I also think that suggesting to young women that instead of "looking for the good in someone", they should just look for someone who is actually good, or at least not a total piece of s**t, might also be a nice way to minimise the amount of bodies? Or at least trying to understand what it is- trauma, naivety, lack of self esteem, etc. that causes people to end up with horrible violent people in the first place.

I'm genuinely sorry if that comes across as offensive.

 

[Underarrest_]

Yes of course, very easy to verify I'm sure.
And you only have to do it once I guess, every case being exactly the same and all.




Look I'm all for destroying the patriarchy and equality and spending money on videos that explain to people how your partner asking for access to your phone could lead to you being socially isolated, also educating people on what good relationships look like (sorry ladies, you might need to be involved in that bit), cultural change, respect, and we can also tell men to tell their mates to pull their heads in when they say a misogynist joke as we've been doing for what feels like decades now... and all the other things too. Clearly addressing poverty, improving educational outcomes, removing social and economic barriers, massively increasing the social welfare expenditure and funding social services would have a positive effect too. Let's do all of these things.

I also think that suggesting to young women that instead of "looking for the good in someone", they should just find someone who is actually good, or at least not a total piece of s**t, might also be a nice way to minimise the amount of bodies? Or at least trying to understand what it is- trauma, naivety, lack of self esteem, etc. that causes people to end up with horrible violent people might be somewhat helpful.

I'm genuinely sorry if that comes across as offensive.

It’s not offensive and I agree everyone should only be with someone who’s good to them. No one deserves less than that but, and I think it might have already been mentioned here, part of the problem is that someone who commits DV is often charming at first or the early warning signs appear subtle. An example of this is DV often starting after a marriage or having a child. For a person in this situation there are 100 reasons that a person doesn’t leave this situation, such as fear, financial, homelessness, breaking up the family unit, have been told time and time again how useless they are and being broken down, etc and yes sometimes because that person committing DV is not always an arsole which is often confusing for the other person. (This is seen in the cycle of DV and the honeymoon phase.)
Also, education on what DV is, is vital because you can’t recognise DV if you don’t know what it is, especially in the case of coercive control which often goes unnoticed. Yes I agree that having an understanding of people’s experiences is also helpful although as we know anyone can find themselves in this situation.

 

[revo333]

At the risk of being labelled as victim blaming, Id like to suggest that in many cases certain Women seem to be attracted to 'bad boys'.

I've seen this kind of comment more than a few times over the last week.

Someone I know has a step daughter, who has been with a guy for 10 years who hits her.

Every time they bring up why She is still with him she gets aggressive about it.

What more can you do for someone like that?

We all live and die by our own choices.

 

[PenfoldsFan]

Yes of course, very easy to verify I'm sure.
And you only have to do it once I guess, every case being exactly the same and all.




Look I'm all for destroying the patriarchy and equality and spending money on videos that explain to people how your partner asking for access to your phone could lead to you being socially isolated, also educating people on what good relationships look like (sorry ladies, you might need to be involved in that bit), cultural change, respect, and we can also tell men to tell their mates to pull their heads in when they say a misogynist joke as we've been doing for what feels like decades now... and all the other things too. Clearly addressing poverty, improving educational outcomes, removing social and economic barriers, massively increasing the social welfare expenditure and funding social services would have a positive effect too. Let's do all of these things.

I also think that suggesting to young women that instead of "looking for the good in someone", they should just find someone who is actually good, or at least not a total piece of s**t, might also be a nice way to minimise the amount of bodies? Or at least trying to understand what it is- trauma, naivety, lack of self esteem, etc. that causes people to end up with horrible violent people might be somewhat helpful.

I'm genuinely sorry if that comes across as offensive.

Throwing money at it is an easy response but it wont fix the problems.

You have to understand the problems and they are wide and ranging.

Offering 5k to find somewhere else to live is a slap in the face to many who are nowhere near the top of the list for suitable alternatives.

 

[revo333]

Wasnt there some online platform where you could post up about dodgy ex's to warn off future victims?

There is a facebook page which is a group for that kind of stuff.

But it turns out some people were just bitter about getting dumped and were naming guys who hadn't even done anything.

 

[jason_recliner]

What more can you do for someone like that?

What happens if they call the police?

 

[revo333]

What happens if they call the police?

Police can't do anything if She doesn't want to leave him.

 

[jason_recliner]

Police can't do anything if She doesn't want to leave him.

Is that right? He can bash her and unless she wants to charge him, the police can't arrest him? That's ####ed up.

 

[Madas]

Going to put this out there for thought

In my opinion The defence lawyer who argued for bail for her client whom the professionals had warned was a high risk threat and later went on to kill his ex partner , should be held accountable for manslaughter.
There was no good reason the guy should been released and the argument that the lawyer was just doing their job doesn’t cut it with me .

On the contrary , if they were doing their job they would have considered the professional advice and not appealed for bail .

And I guess it’s not just relevant to DV but to all defence lawyers

System needs to be overhauled.

 

[Toump Ass]

Going to put this out there for thought

In my opinion The defence lawyer who argued for bail for her client whom the professionals had warned was a high risk threat and later went on to kill his ex partner , should be held accountable for manslaughter.
There was no good reason the guy should been released and the argument that the lawyer was just doing their job doesn’t cut it with me .

On the contrary , if they were doing their job they would have considered the professional advice and not appealed for bail .

And I guess it’s not just relevant to DV but to all defence lawyers

System needs to be overhauled.

The registrar could have denied bail, I reckon they should cop some heat.

But I agree the system is ****ed.

 

[Underarrest_]

I've seen this kind of comment more than a few times over the last week.

Someone I know has a step daughter, who has been with a guy for 10 years who hits her.

Every time they bring up why She is still with him she gets aggressive about it.

What more can you do for someone like that?

We all live and die by our own choices.

Perhaps the family can just be there for her and offer support, especially if they decide to leave.
The onus is on the perpetrator of DV, not the victim.