Eade, Wallet and Craig

[Cap]

So they were the 3 coaches the Crows were most interested in (well let me know if I'm wrong)

One was an unmitigated disaster and virtually destroyed an era for the Richmond fans.

Eade has just taken his team to his 3rd preliminary loss in a row under the Dogs with a list that people have questions about moving forward (there fans don't so I guess that is important)

Craig - Got to 2 preliminary which he lost and a number of other finals...which we also lost. We now have list which has a number of questions around it

The question has to be asked,

Were we between a rock and hard place

 

[Smoooothy]

I think the dogs and us would be happy we dodged the Terry tan...

 

[Cap]

I think so too.

I'd gather going on results we got the same deals....

 

[Magma]

Thank the Lord that we didn't pick up Terry.

 

[Sekaj]

I think the dogs and us would be happy we dodged the Terry tan...

I don't think the Dogs were going to re-hire Wallace after the way he left.

 

[Cap]

The thing is we can compare eades and craigs final records.... you can't with terrys

 

[Crow-mo]

So they were the 3 coaches the Crows were most interested in (well let me know if I'm wrong)

One was an unmitigated disaster and virtually destroyed an era for the Richmond fans.

oh nonsense. they were richmond long before he arrived, and will be long after.

even Greg Miller has said they gave him so little support, he had little chance. that said, the way he conducted himself won few friends.

Eade has just taken his team to his 3rd preliminary loss in a row under the Dogs with a list that people have questions about moving forward (there fans don't so I guess that is important)


Craig - Got to 2 preliminary which he lost and a number of other finals...which we also lost. We now have list which has a number of questions around it

The question has to be asked,

Were we between a rock and hard place

poor question. that was back in 2004, even if your premise was accurate it wouldn't excuse sticking with it into a 7th year. IF.

we've not contended properly since 2006, so with our infrastructure and advantages I fail to see we would have done significantly worse.

maybe we would, maybe we wouldn't have.

Eade has been very good for a team that was rock bottom when he took over, Wallace would've gotten the support he lacked at richmond, and Craig's been ok.

the AFC are a superior outfit to the doggies in every way, and without those advantages Eade has outperformed Craig. you never know how things would go if done differently, but I don't see any argument to presume he'd have done worse in any meaningful way. whereas you can use same to project legimately (but speculatively) that he could've done better.

2004 was a long time ago, and the decisions are all about now not then.

 

[Cap]

purely subjective I know!

I'm not sure I follow re:Craig has advantages over Craig - better draft picks, maybe better trading

Whilst I agree that Richmond were a basket case, but after 5 years I reckon he left them in a lot worse position than he found them

 

[Crow-mo]

purely subjective I know!

I'm not sure I follow re:Craig has advantages over Craig - better draft picks, maybe better trading

Whilst I agree that Richmond were a basket case, but after 5 years I reckon he left them in a lot worse position than he found them

Richmond 2004
16th 4 wins, 18 losses 69.2%
richmond 2009
15th 5 wins, 1 draw, 16 losses 74.3%

not much to speak of, but not worse.

mind you, I think he should have been given another 5 years after all apparently coaches can't be judged until they've had 10 years at the helm

 

[ManInTheArena]

Great.. let's start talking about alternate universes.

FWIW I'm glad we picked up NC, and if Mark Riccuito had not contracted "slap cheek" in the alternate universe then we wouldn't be having this conversation.

Bring on 2012!

 

[The Sloane Ranger]

Great.. let's start talking about alternate universes.

FWIW I'm glad we picked up NC, and if Mark Riccuito had not contracted "slap cheek" in the alternate universe then we wouldn't be having this conversation.

Bring on 2012!

this

 

[conVINCEd]

Crow-mo, I've never understood your fascination with defending Terry Wallace's record at Richmond.

He was given a five year deal from the beginning, all the talk from the Tigers was was about taking the time to properly rebuild. He knew what he was dealing with and the opportunity he had.

Instead he tried to stroke his own ego and produce 'decent' results from the start. He brought in rubbish mature recruits like Kent Kingsley and threw away quality picks for soft hacks like McMahon.

His player development was atrocious and after five years the club was in exactly the same position it was when he started - needed to start a complete rebuild from scratch.

Do you think he was harshly treated because he wasn't given the chance to oversee Richmond's 'decade of opportunity' from 2012?

 

[rayven]

A few points!
Footscray had a few things going for them (draft picks, ability to trade aker/hall) and a better draw(less interstate games)
Craig missed the finals for the first time(not as aresult of ability,his or the list) yet we have introduced and found considerable talent this season!
Got umpired out of a GF, ran into angel dust eagles!
Footscray are on the way down from peaking now(unless the rest of the league is on a downward spiral)

 

[James23]

Overall im very pleased with Craig as coach.

He turned potential delistees Rutten and Bock, into AA players.

He turned a favoured wooden spoon squad, into a premiership favoured squad.

We now have multiple gun key forward options developing.

We've developed great, young list with barely any high draft picks.

We have earnt the title of one of the most respected, professional teams in the league.

I think we can push for top 4 next year and give it a real shake. With a good preseason and the natural development of Walker, Tippett, Davis, Dangerfield, Mackay, Otten, etc I think that can overpower the retirements.

 

[feenix67]

Overall im very pleased with Craig as coach.

He turned potential delistees Rutten and Bock, into AA players.

He turned a favoured wooden spoon squad, into a premiership favoured squad.

We now have multiple gun key forward options developing.

We've developed great, young list with barely any high draft picks.

We have earnt the title of one of the most respected, professional teams in the league.

I think we can push for top 4 next year and give it a real shake. With a good preseason and the natural development of Walker, Tippett, Davis, Dangerfield, Mackay, Otten, etc I think that can overpower the retirements.

Nail. Hammer. Head.

 

[Crow-mo]

Crow-mo, I've never understood your fascination with defending Terry Wallace's record at Richmond.

I'm hardly defending it. I do think he got a bit of raw deal, I also think he brought plenty onto himself.

He was given a five year deal from the beginning, all the talk from the Tigers was was about taking the time to properly rebuild. He knew what he was dealing with and the opportunity he had.

sure no problem. do you feel that same way about our coach who is entering his 8th season, and according to some hasn't enough time?

Instead he tried to stroke his own ego and produce 'decent' results from the start. He brought in rubbish mature recruits like Kent Kingsley and threw away quality picks for soft hacks like McMahon.

His player development was atrocious and after five years the club was in exactly the same position it was when he started - needed to start a complete rebuild from scratch.

I'm not sure what serious commentary you think this really is? but there is no question that time wasn't a success for Richmond, and I don't think there is much doubt that he was only part of that.

Do you think he was harshly treated because he wasn't given the chance to oversee Richmond's 'decade of opportunity' from 2012?

whoosh straight over the top.

 

[Crow-mo]

Overall im very pleased with Craig as coach.

He turned potential delistees Rutten and Bock, into AA players.

its very easy to be pleased when you make things up to suit.

 

[James23]

its very easy to be pleased when you make things up to suit.

What part is made up?

 

[Crow-mo]

What part is made up?

dunno, was the quoted bit too cryptic?

FFS

 

[James23]

As i remember it, Bock was hopeless under Gary Ayres. Given a new contract I have no doubt that Ayres would have seriously considered cutting him.

Rutten also showed very little, was being groomed as a forward that wasnt really working out.

 

[Tas]

Wallace is a decent coach when he has the cattle, not sure he is suited to rebuild a side.

Richmond has been an elephant graveyard for coaches for 30 years so not sure Wallace can be blamed, they have been very unstable at board level and have a lot of outside influence from past players cause havoc whenever someone shows any vulnerability.

 

[Cap]

has the current coach helped that?

 

[Kickin_Goals]

The bulldogs have several advantages that adelaide does not, like collingwood and other victorian sides players do not gravitate towards adelaide like they do to them and moving along from reasonably successful sides that have that factor just isn't done.

Eade seems very reliant on the marquees he has on the park from big trades and earlier picks of our SA lads, where as craig tends to make things work as much as he can with his structure without being pushed along by what you would consider the elites of the game and so are generally competitive, where as missing very few players the bulldogs are dispatched easily by form sides.
Neither club has been successful in the purest sense, which would you say has had the better players on their list under the circumstances and at what point is it about the coach and at what point the circumstance.

 

[Crow-mo]

As i remember it, Bock was hopeless under Gary Ayres. Given a new contract I have no doubt that Ayres would have seriously considered cutting him.

Rutten also showed very little, was being groomed as a forward that wasnt really working out.

shovel?

 

[Crow-mo]

The bulldogs have several advantages that adelaide does not,

which are?