Eddie McGuire: Destroy AAMI Park, nobody's using it.

[stmookeyj]

1. Why did we need to build a rectangular stadium at all? Many if not most European and South American soccer playing countries have soccer pitches with athletics tracks around them (Uruguay even has a moat). Why in a city where the only minority sports use rectangular pitches do we need a dedicated Rolls Royce facility for those sports?

Pretty much every new stadium I know around the world is rectangular....


And anyway, Eddie's just holding a grudge because he wanted to use the land for a training paddock anyway.

 

[Zidane98]

I personally don't have a problem with the concept of a new rectangular stadium.

But Melburnians would be right to question why, after spending $270 million (about two thirds of what Etihad cost to build):

1. why it can't be used for the WC;
2. why no sport made even a nominal contribution (not one cent);
3. why the Qld Govt can manage to get a 28,000 stadium for less than half the cost (at Carrara, in fact, they only have put in $60 mill).

These are perfectly legitimate questions, and that's why it's ok for Zachary to post what he did.

I suspect that if the Vict Government wants to get a bit of money back on the investment, they'll price the tickets accordingly - I wonder how that will go down?

1. It can be used for the World Cup but at the present point in time it isn't economically viable to do so. Australia has until 2017 to finalise stadia if the bid goes ahead, let's see what happens. And don't forget the deal the government did with Etihad regarding competing stadiums up until the end of this year.
2. Melbourne Victory has signed up to the stadium for a long term lease. Thanks to Melbourne Victory's patronage of the venue it now has an income source to keep it going. AFL have paid barely a cent to any stadium infrastructure across the whole country if you are including direct contributions to stadium infrastructure. Let's not forget the agreements from the Storm/Hearts/Rebels (albeit not as big as the Victory's). Infact, construction of the stadium depended on MVFC signing on the dotted line for a long term lease (for a while it looked as if there wasn't going to be any stadium as MVFC were not happy with the 21,000 seat configuration.
3. Carrara is largely funded by the feds. By the same token, the QLD state government will get less returns out of the venue then the VIC state government does here so it works both ways. Obviously the futuristic design of the stadium itself had a lot to do with increased costs. That's a Vic government decision and nothing to do with the FFA/ARU/NRL etc etc.

 

[Aucklander]

I reckon that the Hearts will average around 15-17K and the Victory will pull around 25K crowd averages next season (lots of fans have been turned away by the shambles that Etihad stadium is).

I think people under estimate just how many more people will go to a game at a stadium that actually enhances a game rather than one that diminishs it.

Of course another solution would be for Victorians to get out and support the teams.

As for Eddie, well he's entitled to his opinion, just like Richard Hines.

 

[zachary]

Golly, thats a bit politically incorrect Zac.

Union: I said those crowds gave the Rebels something to work with & you go on about AFL crowds in the last week. Whats the AFL break even @ the G, was 25k before the State Govt solved the problems over ground costs. (The State Govt SOLVED the problem Zac).

The MCG Trust kick in a couple of $mil every year to pay down debt Zac, thats the taxpayer Zac, reducing the net rent the MCC pay to less than $0.5k p.a. As for how much the taxpayer has kicked in, you were wrong over your originbal claim WHY would I believe you over your ONLY time claim, its just more unsubstantiated nonsense from your crock !!!
Maybe the MCG Trust is not the Vic taxpayer Zac?

You are confusing the MCG Trust with the Melbourne Cricket Club, which pays off the loan partly by AFL match rental and partly by a levy on its members - I know because I get levied. The MCG Trust pays NOTHING.
You are the one claiming the Vic govt put money into the MCG - you tell us when and how much.

 

[zachary]

You know, you'd think that now that it's FINISHED, you'd give up and let live. But NO, you have to tear the thing down, because god forbid that rugby and soccer might get up in this city.

I certainly don't want to pull the thing down - I just want it to be converted into something useful which won't be a drain on the taxpayers for a generation.

 

[zachary]

I reckon that the Hearts will average around 15-17K and the Victory will pull around 25K crowd averages next season (lots of fans have been turned away by the shambles that Etihad stadium is).

So you are predicting a 100 - 110% increase in soccer crowds in Melbourne. Where are these extra fans now? Sitting at home waiting for a team called "Heart"?.
I predict Heart will be very lucky to draw 10,000, 5,000 of which will come from Victory, reducing their crowds to 15,000. That will make 25,000 to soccer a fortnight, which is 5,000 more than they get now, so it is possibly a bit ambitious.

 

[Jakko]

Eddie is a strange one, needs to have an outburst every week it seems.

Looks like a nice stadium, crowds should grow a bit, how much is anyones guess.

 

[Aucklander]

I certainly don't want to pull the thing down - I just want it to be converted into something useful which won't be a drain on the taxpayers for a generation.

Don't worry mate, Football fans, Union fans and Rugby league fans are tax payers too and we don't mind the drain.

 

[zachary]

Don't worry mate, Football fans, Union fans and Rugby league fans are tax payers too and we don't mind the drain.

The trouble is you drain 10 times more than your fair share.

 

[telsor]

You know, you'd think that now that it's FINISHED, you'd give up and let live. But NO, you have to tear the thing down, because god forbid that rugby and soccer might get up in this city.

Happy for it to be there. Just wish the tenants actually paid for the ground ( like the AFL does, the costs they're charged cover the interest for the grounds ).

 

[Zidane98]

Don't worry mate, Football fans, Union fans and Rugby league fans are tax payers too and we don't mind the drain.

There isn't any point in trying to reason with these zealots, if they had it their way there would be no Cricket matches, no money wasted on facilities for the Australian Open (wouldn't be too difficult to plonk a tennis court in the middle of Etihad/MCG i'd imagine). They forget that the only reason that the AFL has ever had the opportunity to reap good returns is because they used a Cricket ground that was already in place.

Let's just demolish every single athletics / tennis / any other sporting venue and all turn them into ovals for the sole purpose of footy. Only then will all of these zealots be happy!

 

[Zidane98]

So you are predicting a 100 - 110% increase in soccer crowds in Melbourne. Where are these extra fans now? Sitting at home waiting for a team called "Heart"?.
I predict Heart will be very lucky to draw 10,000, 5,000 of which will come from Victory, reducing their crowds to 15,000. That will make 25,000 to soccer a fortnight, which is 5,000 more than they get now, so it is possibly a bit ambitious.

It isn't hard to work out. AFL crowds improved dramatically in the switch to modern facilities. Football crowds will experience a similar effect with the move to AAMI Park. It is just a better, more enjoyable place to watch football then that eyesore of a stadium, Etihad Stadium. I'd much prefer if that shithole was knocked down, Waverley & Princes Park were reinstated.

I can tell you right now that there won't be a single MVFC fan who will switch to the Melbourne Hearts. They are after the football fans in Melbourne who hate the Victory (quite a few of the old NSL fans have a massive grudge against the Victory).

 

[finders]

They just built it, it has four tenants (and the storm will still get big crowds) plus hosts international fixtures, cost a s**t load and will help with the World Cup bid.

Cost the VICTORIAN taxpayers a s**t load of our money!!!

 

[zachary]

It isn't hard to work out. AFL crowds improved dramatically in the switch to modern facilities. Football crowds will experience a similar effect with the move to AAMI Park. It is just a better, more enjoyable place to watch football then that eyesore of a stadium, Etihad Stadium. I'd much prefer if that shithole was knocked down, Waverley & Princes Park were reinstated.

I can tell you right now that there won't be a single MVFC fan who will switch to the Melbourne Farts. They are after the football fans in Melbourne who hate the Victory (quite a few of the old NSL fans have a massive grudge against the Victory).

So let me get this straight - AFL crowds improved when they moved from Waverley TO the modern facilities at Etihad stadium, but soccer crowds will not improve until they move FROM those same facilities. And you think AFL crowds would be better if we moved back to Waverley. Righto then.

 

[Dimenhydrinate]

Cost the VICTORIAN taxpayers a s**t load of our money!!!

Thus, tear it down. Because if the stadium that we spent money on is gone, it means we didn't spend any money! </AFL logic>

 

[Aucklander]

The trouble is you drain 10 times more than your fair share.

Well, that's exactly how the tax system works. It sucks, but that's life.

 

[zachary]

There isn't any point in trying to reason with these zealots, if they had it their way there would be no Cricket matches, no money wasted on facilities for the Australian Open (wouldn't be too difficult to plonk a tennis court in the middle of Etihad/MCG i'd imagine). They forget that the only reason that the AFL has ever had the opportunity to reap good returns is because they used a Cricket ground that was already in place.

Let's just demolish every single athletics / tennis / any other sporting venue and all turn them into ovals for the sole purpose of footy. Only then will all of these zealots be happy!

Pardon me, but the only reason that we have a cricket ground is because AFL crowds paid for it.

 

[Dimenhydrinate]

So let me get this straight - AFL crowds improved when they moved from Waverley TO the modern facilities at Etihad stadium, but soccer crowds will not improve until they move FROM those same facilities.

Exactly. AAMI Park shits all over Etihad.

 

[finders]

I agree with Eddie 100%. Several points need to be made:
1. Why did we need to build a rectangular stadium at all? Many if not most European and South American soccer playing countries have soccer pitches with athletics tracks around them (Uruguay even has a moat). Why in a city where the only minority sports use rectangular pitches do we need a dedicated Rolls Royce facility for those sports?
2. Why has it been built totally with taxpayer's money? On prime public parkland? The vast majority of Victorian taxpayers support our own code of football yet the State Government has only put a total of $70m into the MCG in 150 years - all up for all venues no more than $100m for football and cricket compared with $280m for these johnny-come-latelies.
3. The 4 teams to play at AAMI are all privately owned franchises whereas AFL clubs are all community membership based. Why the hell are we paying for the business infrastructure of wealthy knobs like Rupert Murdoch, Geoff Lord and Harold Mitchell? They are not contibuting one cent to the construction cost, which will be a burden on Victorian taxpayers for decades to come.
4. Melbourne Storm before their cheating fiasco were drawing an average of about 10,000 - 12,000 over 10 very successful years on the field. Melbourne Victory are now averaging under 20,000, which will be diluted by the second team, which itself will obviously draw even less. And anyone who imagines rugby union is a crowd puller is pulling something else. There is no way these codes can generate the gate returns to cover the cost to the taxpayer. If it had been an oval stadium we wouldn't have a problem - AFL matches would have underwritten the viability of the stadium.
We should definitely do a feasability study on converting this white elephant to an oval pitch - that would be money well spent.

I agree with both Eddie and you Zachary.As I have said many times if Soccer and Rugby wanted their own stadium let them buy the land and build it themselves like the AFL did a Waverley.

Of course thats not possible because the new stadium will run at a massive lossesno doubt picked up by the taxpayers.

 

[zachary]

Well, that's exactly how the tax system works. It sucks, but that's life.

That's life for a parasite until the host decides to scratch it.

 

[zachary]

Thus, tear it down. Because if the stadium that we spent money on is gone, it means we didn't spend any money! </AFL logic>

No, lets find out how much it would cost to convert it from a rectangular lemon to an oval goldmine.

 

[Aucklander]

That's life for a parasite until the host decides to scratch it.

That's a bit rich given the AFL have signed K Hunt and are after Israel Falou too.

 

[HolyWars]

2) The AFL needs a 30,000 seater ground in Melbourne? Newsflash: You had TWO. They were called Waverly and Princes Park. You ****ed them off in favour of Etihad.

Waverly held around 75k.

 

[Aucklander]

Exactly. AAMI Park shits all over Etihad.

World Cup teams will love it as a training venue. The ground looks sensational.

 

[Zidane98]

Well, that's exactly how the tax system works. It sucks, but that's life.

Zealots don't understand tax systems in a democracy. They can't seem to understand the it is the government who decides how tax dollars are spent - I didn't particularly like taxpayer money being spent on Myki (over a billion dollars now yet none of these deluded zealots are complaining about it) or the Australian Open redevelopment (300 million). I respect the government's decision to do so and I am sure they have done quite a lot of research into the benefits of both projects economically.

In any case, AAMI Park is going to develop some $775 million in economic activity: http://www.mopt.com.au/desktopdefault.aspx/tabid-22//243_read-247/ more then paying for itself. There is absolutely zero argument for anyone who thinks the place is a waste of money (anybody that does is a blatant anti football/rugby footy only type person).