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Explain to me why the OFC exists

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Please. The strongest nation of the 14 members is New Zealand. Tahiti got absolutely smashed at the Confederations Cup. Australia used to dominate the region but left for the AFC next door. Why did that move not bring about the end of the OFC? They clearly cannot compete with the other confederations, and surely no-one would think it wrong if they were to join the AFC. So why hasn't it happened?
 
Yep, the OFC desperately needs to merge with the AFC and become the Asia-Pacific confederation or something. While it would hardly mean that the worse Oceanic nations would instantly be better, more regular scheduling of competitive matches (such as cup qualifiers) with a wider level of skill would slowly but surely improve the region as a whole over time. As it is, all of the OFC nations are ranked in the 180s or worse, except for New Zealand (97th), New Caledonia (140th) and Tahiti (161st).

Now, most of these countries may never qualify for the World Cup or even an Asian (Asia-Pacific?) Cup, but changing nothing would be relegating their teams to a lifetime of complete and utter irrelevance (which, honestly, is not far off anyway). Any players of note might find ways of playing for better national teams by way of dual citizenships or the like, purely for the chance to playing for some level of success on the international stage.

And God help them if New Zealand were to follow Australia into the Asian confederation as it is now. The remaining OFC nations might as well not exist at all if that were to happen.
 
Please. The strongest nation of the 14 members is New Zealand. Tahiti got absolutely smashed at the Confederations Cup. Australia used to dominate the region but left for the AFC next door. Why did that move not bring about the end of the OFC? They clearly cannot compete with the other confederations, and surely no-one would think it wrong if they were to join the AFC. So why hasn't it happened?


Except, you know, the AFC themselves.

It was hard enough getting Australia accepted, there's no way they would want the dregs of the OFC clogging up their fixtures.

The OFC nations bring nothing to the table - no fans, players, money etc and would take more of the AFC's resources.
 
Some fair points, Shoei, but is it really okay for the OFC to die a slow death as long as it's 'someone else's problem' and not a part of any Asian confederation? Mightn't be a lot of potential in the finances or growing the game, but if it comes to it, I'm sure FIFA could be inclined to force Asia's hand. As with the Gold Coast and Western Sydney AFL teams, a lot of initial investment (financial and otherwise) could well lead to greater things down the path. Or maybe I'm too much of an optimist.
 

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Some fair points, Shoei, but is it really okay for the OFC to die a slow death as long as it's 'someone else's problem' and not a part of any Asian confederation? Mightn't be a lot of potential in the finances or growing the game, but if it comes to it, I'm sure FIFA could be inclined to force Asia's hand. As with the Gold Coast and Western Sydney AFL teams, a lot of initial investment (financial and otherwise) could well lead to greater things down the path. Or maybe I'm too much of an optimist.

Oh i'd love to see the OFC join the AFC, but lets be realists, why would any of the AFC members want the OFC nations?

‘We are against Australia joining the Asian continent, even in soccer,’ Sheikh Talal complained. ‘This is the biggest mistake made against Asian soccer."

Australia is barely accepted as an Quasi-Asia country by the Asian community at large. There is no way they want Fiji, Tonga, PNG, Samoa and New Zealand etc. Australia was accepted because of hardcore political lobbying, a strong economy and a developed football system meaning we were not going to dip into the AFC development funding.

There is also no chance in hell of any sort of investment being put into those countries if they were to join the AFC - not when you have the likes of China and India with 2.5 billion people, Philippines (100m) Indonesia (230m) Pakistan (190m) Iran (77m) etc etc all needing investment. It's just not practical to spend any money on developing Oceanic nations footballing abilities when compared to those of the Asian countries and their potential markets/player bases.
 
The OFC Cup or whatever it's called should be held very very early in the world cup qualifying campaign, before the AFC one kicks off, then maybe the two finalists or whatever can join the AFC Qualifying draw.

It shouldn't completely merge, but it should become a 'sub-confederation' or something.
 
I really think the OFC should be absorbed into the AFC - the AFC is probably the second weakest confederation (next to the OFC) anyway and gaining another solid nation such as New Zealand would be a boost to all the AFC's stronger nations (Australia included) IMO in the long run.

By having another nation such as NZ in the confederation, it ultimately improves the quality of Asian 'pool' of nations. If you look at the world cup, no Asian teams won any games and collectively we amassed:
  • 3 points.
  • 9 goals for.
  • 25 goals against.
Based on that, you could say the Asian confederation (looking at it in a pure black and white perspective) did quite poorly when tested against the best teams from around the world. I think the only way Asia can get stronger is to strengthen the quality of the teams in the confederation and forcing them to play more highly competitive games against other quality teams. Bringing in NZ would instantly make the upper tier of the AFC a bit stronger and make the final round of qualifying a bit tougher for teams (though the likes of Fiji and American Samoa would have next to no impact even in the unlikely case they got that far into qualifying).

Surely it would also be in NZ's best interests to look to jump ship (because if they are forced into playoff games every 4 years, they might be forced to play stronger teams like Uruguay or Mexico). The remaining Oceania nations should be incorporated into the AFC and have their own 'regional' qualifiers with the best teams getting inserted into the first round of qualifying (pretty sure the AFC has preliminary qualifiers as well for the smaller countries like Guam, Macau and Timor).

Just had a look and the AFC actually is divided into 5 different regions (Central, East, South, South East - which Australia is part of, and West Asia). I don't see why the the remaining OFC nations couldn't be absorbed into one of those sub confederations. Ultimately, wouldn't the island nations also improve by playing against teams on a similar level to them but from other parts of Asia (than playing against the same Island nations where they aren't exposed to different schools of tactics, gameplay etc?).
 
Also, read this piece by Fozzy last week about his calls for Asia to create a 'super league'. I personally don't agree with it but think it's an interesting concept/suggestion nonetheless.

http://theworldgame.sbs.com.au/blog/2014/07/11/why-asia-needs-super-league

I've always wondered if it would be possible for the FFA to say, buy a club in Europe and then use that as like a feeder team (ship promising Aussie players there to help them find their feet in Europe/get used to playing with each other). Would also hopefully allow them to have more contact with European coaches, tactics, knowledge etc. Has something like that ever been done before? I remember reading about Qatar bringing over South Americans to 'nationalise' them for their national side.
 
I'm not sure we should be using this World Cup as true benchmark of where the Asian nations are at, granted the AFC performed poorly but it was always going to be a tough ask in unfamiliar conditions halfway across the world. I'd say that they all underachieved and have a lot more to offer; South Korea were disappointing and showed very little, Japan never really got going, Iran were solid defensively but didn't offer much else and Australia were simply outclassed.

I'm just comparing these performances against those in South Africa, where Australia grabbed four points in a relatively tough group while Japan and South Korea reached the knockouts. I personally think its one-off given the talent that South Korea and Japan have coming through, although I might be overly optimistic.
 
You could be right RA but I guess the conditions would have been pretty much the same for other countries too who would also be in the same boat. I think on the rung above the AFC you'd have both CONCACAF (North & Central American plus Carribean nations etc) and the CAF (African confederation) and both of those had teams making the knockout stages (Mexico, Costa Rica and the US as well as Algeria and Nigeria).

It could very well be a one off aberration by the AFC nations but given the WC is only every 4 years, teams should be ready and stocked to play in any conditions given it's the biggest footballing showcase in the world. I'll be very interested to see how the Asian Cup goes. Across the board, I'd imagine all of the Asian nations probably would be disappointed with their tournaments so it could be a decent way to get redemption.

Going back to the OFC, I hope FIFA don't give up on those nations and continues to help them progress/develop even if the OFC becomes extinct.
 
Had this discussion pre-World Cup on here. The AFC is by far the worst 'proper' confederation and the World Cup has backed that up. Japan is always talked up leading into tournaments but their weaknesses in defence and up front are never fixed. I had CONCACAF a close 2nd to be worst but after seeing some great performances from Costa Rica, USA and Mexico it's safe to say they are streets ahead now.

The OFC qualifying should be included into the 1st round of the AFC qualifying which sees two-leg ties between nations of the ilk of Pakistan, Malaysia, Laos, Macau etc. New Zealand should romp through that stage so maybe they come into the 2nd round automatically when sides like Kuwait and Iraq come in.
 

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Had this discussion pre-World Cup on here. The AFC is by far the worst 'proper' confederation and the World Cup has backed that up. Japan is always talked up leading into tournaments but their weaknesses in defence and up front are never fixed. I had CONCACAF a close 2nd to be worst but after seeing some great performances from Costa Rica, USA and Mexico it's safe to say they are streets ahead now.

The OFC qualifying should be included into the 1st round of the AFC qualifying which sees two-leg ties between nations of the ilk of Pakistan, Malaysia, Laos, Macau etc. New Zealand should romp through that stage so maybe they come into the 2nd round automatically when sides like Kuwait and Iraq come in.

This. Remember discussion well and agree with all of the above points. There was another poster who was claiming AFC was far stronger than CAF but can't remember who that was.

Also not sure how redalert can say AFC can't be judged based on the World Cup - FFS what else are they going to be judged against?

AFC showed its true face as a complete minnow when it comes to World Football at this World Cup.
 
They may as well be merged with AFC at this point, have the localised playoffs then throw the winner (New Zealand) into the AFC system.
Looks like this may happen in the future, as of right now though, I have read there are certain things not enabling this to happen. As a kiwi myself, I would like this alternative better than getting thrown up into a playoff again next time the World Cup comes around. I reckon we'd do quite well, by the time the next World Cup comes around, not only do I think we could qualify, but compete very well.
 
The OFC qualifying should be included into the 1st round of the AFC qualifying which sees two-leg ties between nations of the ilk of Pakistan, Malaysia, Laos, Macau etc. New Zealand should romp through that stage so maybe they come into the 2nd round automatically when sides like Kuwait and Iraq come in.

I wouldn't put it past Tahiti, Fiji and New Caledonia to beat those teams on their day.
 
I wouldn't put it past Tahiti, Fiji and New Caledonia to beat those teams on their day.
I agree. If FIFA actually cared about the game getting better all over the world they'd force this. Those 3 nations play about 2 meaningful games every 4 years before being trounced by the Kiwis. And the poor Kiwis have none going into a 2-legged play off to make it into the WC. They'll wont improve as much as they could playing meaningless games. Same could be said for the UEFA minnows going straight into the main draw over there, they should have a pre-qualyfing tournament or stage where sides like Malta, Andorra, Georgia etc. are a chance at getting a few wins and can build some sort of platforms for the future rather than copping 8 defeats normally 6 of those by more than 4 goals!
 
I agree. If FIFA actually cared about the game getting better all over the world they'd force this. Those 3 nations play about 2 meaningful games every 4 years before being trounced by the Kiwis. And the poor Kiwis have none going into a 2-legged play off to make it into the WC. They'll wont improve as much as they could playing meaningless games. Same could be said for the UEFA minnows going straight into the main draw over there, they should have a pre-qualyfing tournament or stage where sides like Malta, Andorra, Georgia etc. are a chance at getting a few wins and can build some sort of platforms for the future rather than copping 8 defeats normally 6 of those by more than 4 goals!
NZF does very little to improve anyway, there's a lot of young talent coming through right now yet the national team doesn't have a coach.
 
NZF does very little to improve anyway, there's a lot of young talent coming through right now yet the national team doesn't have a coach.
That's probably because they know how low the ceiling is with the current situation. There is no way Lowy would have pumped the money into the game in Australia if we were stuck in the rut of playing just you guys and then a play off against the next best from somewhere else.
 

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That's probably because they know how low the ceiling is with the current situation. There is no way Lowy would have pumped the money into the game in Australia if we were stuck in the rut of playing just you guys and then a play off against the next best from somewhere else.
They aren't doing much to change who we play though, right now it seems all hopes are pinned on the World Cup expanding to 40 teams and effectively being guaranteed a spot. I feel in 2018 the team will be as talented as it has been in a long while, yet don't think the team will have a chance of making the World Cup, and NZF seem content with a %50 chance of making the World Cup every 4 years. Right now I'm pinning my hopes on getting Bahrain again or a country of that ilk in the playoffs, about our only chance of qualifying.
 
New Zealand have gone backwards if anything. They struggled early on in the qualifying process for 2014. They're not improving anytime soon if they stay in OFC.
As a team yes. Individually as players no. For the first time ever it appears a national team full of professional players is finally on the horizon.
 
I think if NZ were in the AFC, they'd be good enough to be a decent chance of doing well in the final round of qualifying. Think they could beat the likes of Qatar, Uzbekistan, China, Iraq, North Korea etc and if well coached, could push some of the stronger teams too. At the very least, they wouldn't be blown out of the water and surely playing teams like Australia, South Korea, Japan, Iran etc can only help make them better than disposing of the island nations with relative ease.
 

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Explain to me why the OFC exists


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