Has Anyone Noticed....

[The Dice Man]

How cocky and self-assured Hawthorn supporters have become recently?



While us guys are being realistic and not over-rated our chances iin 07, the Poo and Wees seem to think theyre on the Angry Anderson Road to Glory.

Personally I see them on the road to middleroadville.

Midroadville is above where they belong, and I have a feeling Cla rkson or what ever other F***ckin clown they have down there is actually takin em backwards.

 

[cherryripe]

Of all other supporters they suffer this syndrome the most blatantly. Whilst they have some talent garnered from high draft picks any level-headed human being knows it's not an automatic premiership. I can't believe how some of them think a flag will undoubtedly be theirs in a few years time. We might eat our own but at least we're realistic. I mean there's 15 other teams in the competition drafting, training and trying to win as well.

If they don't deliver on their bold predictions the s**t will hit the fan.

 

[Weaver]

The Hawks are getting it wrong.

The days when key position players were the most valuable on the field have past. St Kilda are showing that a 'traditional' football team with 4-5 star forwards and a 4-man midfield only takes you to 6th.

The Crows and Eagles are showing you can make the grade with some ho-hum big blokes plucked from rookie lists and the junk pile - if your midfield is up to sratch.

Our approach may take longer but we are loading up where it counts most - the midfield.

While the Hawks are celebrating Roughead keeping his man to 2 goals - we will have JON conceeding 3, but getting 25 touches and scoring a goal of his own at the other end.

Their under-21 midfiled - Lewis, Ellis, Young, Tuck, McGlynn and Muston.

Ours - Deledio, Raines, Tambling, Polo, Meyer, White, Oakley-Nicholls, Casserley, Hartigan and Foley.

We are going to run them to death. Fingers crossed we go for a midfielder in the draft and they go tall again.

 

[nugget_12]

u forgot Jackson, he will feature prominantly in the tigers line up this year....has grunt and speed and enough bulk to throw around (sure skills r scratchy but i can look past the indescrepencies).
I can feel it

 

[Weaver]

u forgot Jackson, he will feature prominantly in the tigers line up this year....has grunt and speed and enough bulk to throw around (sure skills r scratchy but i can look past the indescrepencies).
I can feel it

I didn't forget Jackson

 

[Richo83]

The Hawks are getting it wrong.

The days when key position players were the most valuable on the field have past. St Kilda are showing that a 'traditional' football team with 4-5 star forwards and a 4-man midfield only takes you to 6th.

The Crows and Eagles are showing you can make the grade with some ho-hum big blokes plucked from rookie lists and the junk pile - if your midfield is up to sratch.

Our approach may take longer but we are loading up where it counts most - the midfield.

While the Hawks are celebrating Roughead keeping his man to 2 goals - we will have JON conceeding 3, but getting 25 touches and scoring a goal of his own at the other end.

Their under-21 midfiled - Lewis, Ellis, Young, Tuck, McGlynn and Muston.

Ours - Deledio, Raines, Tambling, Polo, Meyer, White, Oakley-Nicholls, Casserley, Hartigan and Foley.

We are going to run them to death. Fingers crossed we go for a midfielder in the draft and they go tall again.

They do have players like Hodge, Mitchell, Birchall and Sewell coming through though. It's not all bad.

I see what you mean with our midfield though, WC won it this year because of their midfield, which ran teams off their legs. WB are kinda similar in that they got far because of their speed. Good times lay ahead IMO (well I hope anyway)

 

[Supertiger]

I personally believe we should take a mid at both 13 and 26. Look at the psd and get a kpp. No one rates Kingsley but Kingsley has kicked 8 goals in a game of AFL so the boy knows how to play...then put in him in a forward line behind Richo, Brown, Petts, maybe Schulz and Hughes and he ends up taking the 3 or 4th best defender...he then becomes a valuable player who kicks you 40 goals a year as a 4th forward.

 

[monday-expert]

How cocky and self-assured Hawthorn supporters have become recently?



While us guys are being realistic and not over-rated our chances iin 07, the Poo and Wees seem to think theyre on the Angry Anderson Road to Glory.

Personally I see them on the road to middleroadville.

Midroadville is above where they belong, and I have a feeling Cla rkson or what ever other F***ckin clown they have down there is actually takin em backwards.

Well I guess if anyone would know "midroadville" it would be a Richmond supporter!

 

[monday-expert]

I personally believe we should take a mid at both 13 and 26. Look at the psd and get a kpp. No one rates Kingsley but Kingsley has kicked 8 goals in a game of AFL so the boy knows how to play...then put in him in a forward line behind Richo, Brown, Petts, maybe Schulz and Hughes and he ends up taking the 3 or 4th best defender...he then becomes a valuable player who kicks you 40 goals a year as a 4th forward.

Ok so you're recruiting a "4th forward" to kick 40 goals!

Thats a bit bit rich when even your superstar Richo as the "1st forward" can only mange 45.

 

[Weaver]

They do have players like Hodge, Mitchell, Birchall and Sewell coming through though. It's not all bad.

None are 21 or under though (other than Birchall who is a Pat Bowden utility type). I mean if they want to claim the 24 year old Mitchell, we will claim the 24 year old Mark Coughlan.

The 21-and-unders are more indicitive of the Clarkson v Wallace rebuilding programs and the future direction of the teams.

 

[Punt_Road_Roar]

How cocky and self-assured Hawthorn supporters have become recently?



While us guys are being realistic and not over-rated our chances iin 07, the Poo and Wees seem to think theyre on the Angry Anderson Road to Glory.

Personally I see them on the road to middleroadville.

Midroadville is above where they belong, and I have a feeling Cla rkson or what ever other F***ckin clown they have down there is actually takin em backwards.

I remember early this season after Round 4 when they got off to a flyer those same supporters were beating their drums, the comparisons came out between where Richmond were at compared to the Hawks. Quite laughable, as a matter of fact it makes me want to look for a few of those chest thumping threads and posts at the time.

Let them talk it up, everyone knows its going to be another average year, I believe that apart from the Pies the top 8 of 2006 will be hard to crack into for season 2007. They are all very good teams.

 

[Richo83]

None are 21 or under though (other than Birchall who is a Pat Bowden utility type). I mean if they want to claim the 24 year old Mitchell, we will claim the 24 year old Mark Coughlan.

Yeah but Mitchell seems more damaging. I get your point though, point taken.

The 21-and-unders are more indicitive of the Clarkson v Wallace rebuilding programs and the future direction of the teams.

So where do you see Hawthorn in a few years time?

 

[monday-expert]

I think you can't ignore the fact that we have 3 top draft picks from last year in Ellis, Muston and Dowler who have barely had the chance yet of playing any footy.

If they had all been fit and ready to go at the start of the year than we could brag about how great our under 21's are.

And once Richo and Brown retire from your forward line the Hawks will be enjoying the peak of the careers of Franklin, Roughead and Williams kicking our goals - while Mitchel and Hodge will be at the peak of theirs also.

I guess that's where the optimism comes from - and to suggest that we're talking rubbish is pretty ridiculous.

 

[monday-expert]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Weaver
None are 21 or under though (other than Birchall who is a Pat Bowden utility type). I mean if they want to claim the 24 year old Mitchell, we will claim the 24 year old Mark Coughlan.


Mark Coughlan!!!! Would take Mitchell every day of the week

 

[monday-expert]

How cocky and self-assured Hawthorn supporters have become recently?



While us guys are being realistic and not over-rated our chances iin 07, the Poo and Wees seem to think theyre on the Angry Anderson Road to Glory.quote]

Actually most on the Hawks forum are predicting we challenge or just scrape into the finals next year. It's a gradual progression.

 

[cherryripe]

Well I guess if anyone would know "midroadville" it would be a Richmond supporter!

As least we know it and don't claim flags are in the bag.

 

[monday-expert]

As least we know it and don't claim flags are in the bag.

Where are these people claiming that Hawthorn will win a flag next year????

 

[cherryripe]

Where are these people claiming that Hawthorn will win a flag next year????

Read the OP and think about the relevancy of what we're posting. How long have you been here?

 

[Weaver]

I think you can't ignore the fact that we have 3 top draft picks from last year in Ellis, Muston and Dowler who have barely had the chance yet of playing any footy.

I didn't ignore Muston and Ellis. I put both on the list of your under-21 midfielders. And for Ellis, Muston and Dowler we have Oakley-Nicholls, Hughes and Casserley who are similarly still making their way.

If they had all been fit and ready to go at the start of the year than we could brag about how great our under 21's are.

Wouldn't have changed the fact that you are emphasising KP juniors in an era of midfielders.

And once Richo and Brown retire from your forward line the Hawks will be enjoying the peak of the careers of Franklin, Roughead and Williams kicking our goals - while Mitchel and Hodge will be at the peak of theirs also.

When Richo and Brown retire we will be like Adelaide. Getting the bulk of our goals from midfielders and having some key forwards pop-up with an occasional 2 or 3. Don't need great key position players. Hentschel, Perrie, Welsh, McGregor will do - if the midfield is good enough. And when they don't kick goals you can use Burton or Ricciuto.

In contrast Hawks star forward line will be stadning around with their hands on their hips while the ball is up the other end. Don't win in midfield and your forwards will be about as useful as a used scratchie.

I guess that's where the optimism comes from - and to suggest that we're talking rubbish is pretty ridiculous.

The optimism comes from a 70s-80s understanding of football. Same thing as the bulk of Richmond supporters have when they say they want us to recruit a FB with pick 13, or that we should draft a batch of rovers.

It is all about 2010+. We will be fast, versatile and skillful. Deledio will play FF, FB and centre all in the same game. JON will start on the wing, drop into CHB and then move into a tagging job - all in the same game. Casserely will play the first half at FB on Williams, and then the second half kick 3 goals from the wing.

 

[Matt9]

Weaver-
You need not have bothered here mate. The one line that sums it all up is that Franklin, Williams and Roughhead will be the star Hawks in the future. That's laughable-
Williams- the pin up boy for one trick ponies. Speed of the mark 10/10. One percenters 0/10, second efforts (what's an effort?), strength of character to get back into the game when required to work hard 0/10.

Franklin- Ability to talk himself up all over Melbourne 10/10, ability to believe his own press 10/10, proven ability to contribute consistently 0/10, ability to play one good game and then go missing for a month 10/10.

Roughead- umm......Roughhead.....let me see.....is he the one....no, that's Hodge....um, wait a minute I'll remember him...........is he....no,........hang on.......is....no.....na, sorry. Don't remember him. He must be a plonker without the ability to hold down a position of his own.

Hard but very, very fair

 

[monday-expert]

Weaver-
You need not have bothered here mate. The one line that sums it all up is that Franklin, Williams and Roughhead will be the star Hawks in the future. That's laughable-
Williams- the pin up boy for one trick ponies. Speed of the mark 10/10. One percenters 0/10, second efforts (what's an effort?), strength of character to get back into the game when required to work hard 0/10.

Franklin- Ability to talk himself up all over Melbourne 10/10, ability to believe his own press 10/10, proven ability to contribute consistently 0/10, ability to play one good game and then go missing for a month 10/10.

Roughead- umm......Roughhead.....let me see.....is he the one....no, that's Hodge....um, wait a minute I'll remember him...........is he....no,........hang on.......is....no.....na, sorry. Don't remember him. He must be a plonker without the ability to hold down a position of his own.

Hard but very, very fair

Very innacurate more like it:

Richmond Forward Line 2006:
Richo 45
Pettifer (next best) 31
Simmonds 25

Williams (the one trick pony) 60
Dixon 41
Franklin 31 (in 14 games)

'nuf said!

 

[monday-expert]

I didn't ignore Muston and Ellis. I put both on the list of your under-21 midfielders. And for Ellis, Muston and Dowler we have Oakley-Nicholls, Hughes and Casserley who are similarly still making their way.



Wouldn't have changed the fact that you are emphasising KP juniors in an era of midfielders.



When Richo and Brown retire we will be like Adelaide. Getting the bulk of our goals from midfielders and having some key forwards pop-up with an occasional 2 or 3. Don't need great key position players. Hentschel, Perrie, Welsh, McGregor will do - if the midfield is good enough. And when they don't kick goals you can use Burton or Ricciuto.

In contrast Hawks star forward line will be stadning around with their hands on their hips while the ball is up the other end. Don't win in midfield and your forwards will be about as useful as a used scratchie.



The optimism comes from a 70s-80s understanding of football. Same thing as the bulk of Richmond supporters have when they say they want us to recruit a FB with pick 13, or that we should draft a batch of rovers.

It is all about 2010+. We will be fast, versatile and skillful. Deledio will play FF, FB and centre all in the same game. JON will start on the wing, drop into CHB and then move into a tagging job - all in the same game. Casserely will play the first half at FB on Williams, and then the second half kick 3 goals from the wing.

I'm actualy not doubting that Richmond are building for the future - just don't agree that Hawthorn are going the wrong way about it - which was the original theme of this post.

I think if you look at out best players and prospects now - and then look say 4-5 years down the track, they will all be at their peak. Plus Ellis and Dowler were very high draft picks for us (3 and 6), thats why I pointed them out in the under 21 category. They would have to be fancied as becoming better players than Oakley-Nichols, Hughes, Casserly, who were taken further down.

As for Franklin and Williams with their hands on their hips in 5 years time - what about Hodge and Mitchell working through the midfield - they will also be in their prime you would think.

 

[wart101]

Well I guess if anyone would know "midroadville" it would be a Richmond supporter!

LOL, i was waiting for it

 

[_RT_]

Very innacurate more like it:

Richmond Forward Line 2006:
Richo 45
Pettifer (next best) 31
Simmonds 25

Williams (the one trick pony) 60
Dixon 41
Franklin 31 (in 14 games)

'nuf said!

Lets have a look then and compare the goals from the midfielders/backmen:

Richmond
Krakouer 19
Tambling 14
P.Bowden 14
Hyde 13
Tivendale 12
Tuck 11
Polo 6
Deledio 5 (12 behinds)
Johnson 5
Howat 4 (5 games)

Hawthorn
Crawford 15
Clarke 12
Vandenberg 10
Hodge 6
Bateman 5
Lewis 5
Guerra 3
Mitchell 3
Birchall 3
Sewell 2

'Nuff Said

Most of the Tigers goals were scored by their younger players where as the Hawks leader was near retirement Crawford. Third place was Vandenberg who does not instill a heap of fear as a gmaebreaker.

BTW one final piece to add to this while the Tigers may not have had high scoring forwards like Williams we kicked more goals than the Hawks talent group overall.

 

[I Rock]

Lets look at the reality here:

Fact: Both clubs started a new coach/ rebuild at the same time.
Fact: Richmond have finished higher since said rebuilds.
Fact: Hawthorn of recent times have been a more succesful club.
Fact: Richmond since 82 don't have many runs on the board.

Put these together and you have two teams that all things going right will be playing off against each other in the finals in the not too distant future for many a season to come.

However the difference is Richmond wil once again be showing and will prove why they are a member of the big 4. Hawthorn will only be wishing they were, but a good late 80's early 90's run is enough guys.

We all know why so many threads are started by Hawks supporters bagging Richmond and it's not about Franklin or Tambling or drafting of youngsters and it's not even about finishing ninth.

The truth is that you are and allways will be jealous that your club is not seen or reconised as one of the Victorian Big 4 Power Houses.



























P.S. Tamblings going to be a star.