Lehmann reprimanded

[dr nick]

well ive read about 4 sources, and the tv news, and they all say he said the "c" word.

i dont think it is really that big an issue, some teams play the race card very well, and the ICC bows to it. there are far worse sledges than that going around, why is it that they take particular offence to be called black as opposed to anything else?? is it something to be ashamed of?

 

[Dogwatcher]

This is going to cause a minor riot, but here goes.
Is yelling 'black bastard' in a change room, not directly at anyone really a racial abuse.
1) he wasn't abusing anyone in particular
2) he wasn't being derogatory
3) It was a word, albeit a very poor choice of word.

He's ****ed off at the Sri Lankans for getting him out and his picked their most visible body feature to vent his anger.
As someone pointed out had they been fat he would have yelled out fat bastard, if they'd had dicks on their head he would have called them ********s.
I'm not justifying what he said, because its not something that anyone should say, particularly an educated person.
But...is it really rascist? He wasn't being demeaning, he wasn't suggesting that they were inferior due to their skin tone and he wasn't trying to put them down.
Where now does rascism end?
As far as the Sri Lankans and the rest of the world goes, Lehmann is now going to be branded a rascist, particularly in the sub -continent. Sad for him, his own fault.
Yet from some of the posts that have appeared here, the Sri Lankans were using tactics regarding a player's skin in South Africa, just not as blatently. Yet they will not be considered rascist.
I'm not saying any of this is right, but I'm suggesting the boundaries are blurred.

 

[Becker]

Originally posted by Wicked Lester

The ICC via Malcolm Speed seem to be determined to make an issue of it to prove the ICC's policy works.

Will be interesting to see how this pans out.

Aren't the ICC priceless? (or should that be worthless?). These toothless tigers do nothing about cheating, betting on games, chuckers, sledging, and just about every other issue you can think of, and yet they jump into the Darren Lehmann case.
Why? Because it is an easy one. White guy calls black guy a back anything, and it is a racial slur. The ICC are just too politically correct to be of worth to anyone.
Malcolm Speed, your mob has a history of being non-commital, how about maintaining your perfect record?

 

[P76]

You know, I thought the Australian team, with all their minders and hangers on, would have got it right by now. The correct thing to say is "Stupid bastard" - then if anyone has a go, you can always claim you were referring to yourself, for getting out.....

 

[Becker]

Darren Lehmann appears to be in a bit of trouble here. He has to front the ICC (Clive Lloyd) tomorrow morning at 9am, and if found guilty, Clive Lloyd has to fix a penalty of between 4-8 one day matches.
Seeing as Darren has already admitted the charge, it would appear he must receive a penalty of at least 4 matches.
Well done ICC, now see if you can do something about match fixing, gambling, cheating on the field, sledging, and chucking.
I find those issues far more offensive than something I never saw or heard a player do.

 

[SpecialBruce]

Originally posted by acuguy
If you think Brett Lee is a chucker than you know nothing about cricket, nothing worse than an idiot with no idea.

Gee you can talk. Stop criticising other bowlers if you refuse to look closer at your very own 'crap yet can't bowl' Brett Lee. Murli was cleared. Donald Bradman even said he doesn't chuck. Thats like saying Donald Bradman knows nothing about cricket because he said that Murli doesn't chuck and you are saying he does chuck. Bradman would have more of an idea than what you will ever have on cricket.
I take it you were one of the ones that cheered when he went off the ground with a quad strain? I wouldn't put it past you.

 

[jim boy]

Geez, it really is tough on Boof

the actual rules are

Level 3 Penalty provision
Penalties for Level 3 offences will range from a ban for the player or match official concerned of between 2 and 4 Test matches or between 4 and 8 ODI matches

Level 3 Offences
3.4 Using language or gestures that offends, insults, humiliates, intimidates, threatens, disparages or vilifies another person on the basis of that person's race, religion, colour, descent or national or ethnic origin.

Considering the remark in question, although insulting, is only questionably racist, then Boof's only argument is that it was a fair description, although he would still have to justify why he alluded to the skin colour of the Sri Lankans.

Anyway, I don't think you get rid of racism by giving people a reason to develop a chip on their shoulder. IMO the AFL approach is far superior approach to this sort of issue.

Boof was certainly guilty of a level 2 breach

Level 2 Penalty provision
Level 2 penalties will range from a fine of the equivalent of between 50% of the player or official's match fee, up to their full match fee and/or a 1 Test Match or 2 ODI Match ban.

Level 2 Offences
2.9 Using language that is obscene, offensive or of a seriously insulting nature to another player, umpire, referee, Team Official or spectator. (It is acknowledged that there will be verbal exchanges between players in the course of play. Rather than seeking to eliminate these exchanges entirely, umpires will look to lay charges when this falls below an acceptance standard. In this instance, language will be interpreted to include gestures)

 

[GOALden Hawk]

I have no problems with Lehmann getting reported and suspended if he was guilty of racial vilification.

My question is, where was the reports from the South Africa v Sri Lanka series.

I like a few others here watched those games and simply couldn't believe some of the sledging - it was literally every ball. Great TV, but I hardly think the ICC would have been too happy about it.

Yet nothing was done about it.

 

[dr nick]

its just like if you have a dispute with a neighbour who happens to be asian you are a racist. you just arent allowed to mention a persons skin colour or ethnic background these days

i think darren lehmann is a fat, bald c***, i think steven harmison is a tall, gangly c***, i think scott muller cant bowl and cant throw and i think arjuna ranatunga is a fat, black c***, yet for some reason the latter will get me in trouble whereas the other three wont.

if they are going to come down hard on lehmann, fair enough, but they have to come down hard on a lot of other things as well if they do.

 

[Briedis]

Originally posted by nicko18
well ive read about 4 sources, and the tv news, and they all say he said the "c" word.

i dont think it is really that big an issue, some teams play the race card very well, and the ICC bows to it. there are far worse sledges than that going around, why is it that they take particular offence to be called black as opposed to anything else?? is it something to be ashamed of?

I agree that a lot of countries play the race card a bit too often, but I don't think this is the case here.

The "black" reference is incredibly offensive because of the history of white treatment of blacks. I don't remember their ever being segregation in a country of people into fat and thin, but black and white. This is where the resentment comes from.

I also think that Lehmann should be made an example of. The fact that he made the comment indirectly is more of an example of his character than if he had of said it directly to a Sri Lankan player. Gutless act.

 

[Diego]

What would happen if a black cricketer calls a white cricketer whitey?

Racist?

Still he should have known better.

We need a Mike Moore type of character to front the ICC and make a doco about it.

Maybe call it "Bowling for Murali"?

 

[Dogwatcher]

mcDermott was a white coward according to crowds in the caribbean.

 

[Bombers 2003]

Lehmann reprimanded.

I agree with Wicked Lester.
Acuman.
I'd rather watch Murali bowl then Brett Lee.As for the "Chucking" accusations,are u a mate of Emerson and Hair Brain?.

 

[goal_umpire]

Here is the latest.
Lehmann suspended
AAP - 18 January 2003


ADELAIDE, Jan 18 AAP - Australian batsman Darren Lehmann was today suspended for five one day international matches for breaching the International Cricket Council's racial vilification code.

Lehmann was found guilty of a breach during a three hour hearing in Adelaide today.

Lehmann is the first international cricketer to be suspended for breaching the game's racial code of conduct.

Lehmann was to have been vice captain in the tomorrow's one day match against England at Adelaide Oval, but national selectors are believed to have summoned New South Wales batsman Michael Clarke as his replacement.

The South Australian and Yorkshire captain had already apologised for a racial slur after being dismissed against Sri Lanka in one day match in Brisbane on Wednesday.

He offered a verbal and written apologies to the Sri Lankans which were immediately accepted.

The Australian Cricket Board instructed Lehmann to also undergo counselling but did not impose a further penalty, prompting the ICC to charge the left-handed batsman under its racial vilification code.

that's what happens when the ICC stick their noses in where it shouldn't

 

[GoEagles]

Originally posted by suzi_olsen


that's what happens when the ICC stick their noses in where it shouldn't

Suzi, the ICC needs to set an example that racism in cricket and sport in general won't be tollerated. Yes 5 matches seems very harsh (I would have said 2-3 games) but this is the 21st century.

The AFL has vilification rules and so should cricket.

 

[Dogwatcher]

Well, azt least we can say tjhat the ICC has continued its recognised tough approach to infractions of the rules and laws of the game. No one can deny that.

 

[dreamkillers]

Originally posted by GoEagles
The AFL has vilification rules and so should cricket.

I don't have a problem with that and Lehmann's penalty as long as the ICC is consistent.

For this to occur they would have to have interpeters at each match listening in on the non-english comments made on and now off the field as I'm sure the umpires and match referee would have no idea what is being said most of the time.

Somehow I don't believe this is the case which IMO makes the ICC a bunch of hypocrites in their case against Lehmann.