Major problems

[Roger Dodger]

A brief list:

Kane Johnson still can't kick. He gave off some great handballs on saturday night but his kicking is woeful and a liability likely to lose us more games than it wins us. This hasn't changed in five years. And why does he wave his hands at players all time when he has the ball in his hand? Forwards are frightened at leading to him because they know he can't kick. So do the opposition. That's why he is allowed to get the ball.

Newman is protected because he is part of the leadership group but he is completely deficient in the vital areas constitute man on man football. Aside from a great game against Freo he is too often a passenger. He had a Barry Crocker on the weekend.

Pattison has gone backwards this year. Full stop.

Why does Jack Riewoldt always wait for the ball to bounce in front of him when he can just as easily mark it albeit maybe sliding on his knees? This is a bad habit that needs to be rectified. Who is drilling these guys in development? Pick up your game.

Deledio has lost so much speed off the mark. It is starting to affect his confidence in taking blokes on. Has he bulked up too much? Whatever it is he needs to get it back.

We need better delivery into the forward line. Guys like Connors and Cotchin need to be introduced ASAP. Tuck, Johnson, Hyde aren't efficient enough.

Shepherding. Too many guys are still watching the ball carrier. When will they learn?

 

[JSFish]

Well we are going ok even with these apparant major problems so I'd hate to be on the oppositon team if we rectify them (assuming they exist).

 

[nut]

A brief list:

Kane Johnson still can't kick. He gave off some great handballs on saturday night but his kicking is woeful and a liability likely to lose us more games than it wins us. This hasn't changed in five years. And why does he wave his hands at players all time when he has the ball in his hand? Forwards are frightened at leading to him because they know he can't kick. So do the opposition. That's why he is allowed to get the ball.

Newman is protected because he is part of the leadership group but he is completely deficient in the vital areas constitute man on man football. Aside from a great game against Freo he is too often a passenger. He had a Barry Crocker on the weekend.

Pattison has gone backwards this year. Full stop.

Why does Jack Riewoldt always wait for the ball to bounce in front of him when he can just as easily mark it albeit maybe sliding on his knees? This is a bad habit that needs to be rectified. Who is drilling these guys in development? Pick up your game.

Deledio has lost so much speed off the mark. It is starting to affect his confidence in taking blokes on. Has he bulked up too much? Whatever it is he needs to get it back.

We need better delivery into the forward line. Guys like Connors and Cotchin need to be introduced ASAP. Tuck, Johnson, Hyde aren't efficient enough.

Shepherding. Too many guys are still watching the ball carrier. When will they learn?

???????????????????????

 

[Greggy]

A brief list:

Kane Johnson still can't kick. He gave off some great handballs on saturday night but his kicking is woeful and a liability likely to lose us more games than it wins us. This hasn't changed in five years. And why does he wave his hands at players all time when he has the ball in his hand? Forwards are frightened at leading to him because they know he can't kick. So do the opposition. That's why he is allowed to get the ball.

I agree, he's afraid to kick and will only do so as a last resort, he killed the momentum for us in the third quarter when instead of charging towards goal after Brown found him with a classy handball he decided to cut backwards into traffic because he's got no left foot and no confidence in his speed.

 

[_RT_]

Just thought I would pick you up on a few of these 'problems'.

A brief list:

Pattison has gone backwards this year. Full stop.

Reckon Simmonds coming back as the number 1 ruckman might have something to do with this champ? As it stands Pattison averages 4 disposals a game less than Simmonds despite spending a lot less time on the ground. Go figure.

Why does Jack Riewoldt always wait for the ball to bounce in front of him when he can just as easily mark it albeit maybe sliding on his knees? This is a bad habit that needs to be rectified. Who is drilling these guys in development? Pick up your game.

First thing I was taught when learning the game was you always keep your feet in a contest. So let me ask if Jack was to slide into a mark and spilled it and his opponent wandered off with the ball while Jack got to his feet would you be critical of Jack for going to ground?

Deledio has lost so much speed off the mark. It is starting to affect his confidence in taking blokes on. Has he bulked up too much? Whatever it is he needs to get it back.

Thats funny I saw him take on and beat a few players on the weekend because he now has the ability to break through tackles that used to stop him.

We need better delivery into the forward line. Guys like Connors and Cotchin need to be introduced ASAP. Tuck, Johnson, Hyde aren't efficient enough.

71 goals in the last 4 games would suggest that our delivery into the forward line is working fine at the moment. Sure it can always inprove but when you have blokes picking the right options instead of the same option there is hardly a cause for concern.

 

[CoggaRules]

First thing I was taught when learning the game was you always keep your feet in a contest. So let me ask if Jack was to slide into a mark and spilled it and his opponent wandered off with the ball while Jack got to his feet would you be critical of Jack for going to ground?

first thing you were taught was not what is required in AFL footy playing at HF as a lead up target. He needs to start not giving up on the attempt to actually mark it. It is what sets the good ones apart from the also rans. The game has become such, that its now a matter of cms and if you can make the mark sliding into it, cms off the ground, then you go for it. If you dont you will forever be playing safe and not taking risks, because you will never learn how to do it.

Go and ask Richo what was one of his main assets when starting out in his career, apart from his moblity. He did not give up on taking the mark at any cost.

 

[C-Dog]

shane tuck would surely be one of the least efficient kicks in the afl?

we cant afford to have jackson, hyde, johnson, tuck (tivendale) in the same team.

of course johnson should stay in probably along with hyde on his current form.

 

[JSFish]

I can only remember one incident from the match of Jack letting the ball bounce before it got to him, but really it is him who can best tell whether he is able to take the mark, not us watching from afar. It's like in cricket, someone doesn't go for a catch and they cop shit for it, but I'm sure if they could've caught it they would've made an attempt.

 

[metallichris]

Johnson's kicking was below par, but his handballing and setting up other teammates has been really great.

 

[nut]

shane tuck would surely be one of the least efficient kicks in the afl?

we cant afford to have jackson, hyde, johnson, tuck (tivendale) in the same team.

of course johnson should stay in probably along with hyde on his current form.

We cant afford to have 5 teenagers playing instead of them.... The players you mentioned will be replaced overtime.... in the meantime they are the best we have, so try supporting them because they are busting their chops for us at the moment. I cant believe the negativity on here.

 

[_RT_]

first thing you were taught was not what is required in AFL footy playing at HF as a lead up target. He needs to start not giving up on the attempt to actually mark it. It is what sets the good ones apart from the also rans. The game has become such, that its now a matter of cms and if you can make the mark sliding into it, cms off the ground, then you go for it. If you dont you will forever be playing safe and not taking risks, because you will never learn how to do it.

Go and ask Richo what was one of his main assets when starting out in his career, apart from his moblity. He did not give up on taking the mark at any cost.

So Cogga, I'll ask you the same thing, if Jack does start sliding into marks and the ball spills out and hits the ground will you be critical of him or will you pat him on the back? There is a time to take risks and a time to play it safe. Would much rather Jack keeping his feet in a contest and having a 50% chance of keeping the ball in the area or better yet being able to dish a handball or kick to a teammate, than diving for a mark where he has about a 20% chance of marking and an 80% chance that his opponent will head off unopposed to deliever the ball into his teams forward line.

BTW, should have read one of the first things I was taught when learning the game was to always keep my feet in a contest. After all pretty hard to chase when you're on all fours.

 

[CoggaRules]

So Cogga, I'll ask you the same thing, if Jack does start sliding into marks and the ball spills out and hits the ground will you be critical of him or will you pat him on the back? There is a time to take risks and a time to play it safe. Would much rather Jack keeping his feet in a contest and having a 50% chance of keeping the ball in the area or better yet being able to dish a handball or kick to a teammate, than diving for a mark where he has about a 20% chance of marking and an 80% chance that his opponent will head off unopposed to deliever the ball into his teams forward line.

sBTW, should have read one of the first things I was taught when learning the game was to always keep my feet in a contest. After all pretty hard to chase when you're on all fours.

dude, understand what you are saying. I would rather jack take the mark 3 cms off the ground 80% of the time, when the opportunity presents.
If he did try it more often than not, i for one would applaud him for the effort, instead of spewing that he was a top chance to make it and not even trying.
BTW, when the Jacks etc of this world, and players of his "inexperience" attempt such things as we are discussing and they make errors, to me it aint a problem, moreso a pleasing thing in that they have that x factor that says i want to stand out and make this. Its when stupid ridiculous, school boy errors are made by more exeprienced playes, attempting a basic skill that riles me.

 

[_RT_]

dude, understand what you are saying. I would rather jack take the mark 3 cms off the ground 80% of the time, when the opportunity presents.
If he did try it more often than not, i for one would applaud him for the effort, instead of spewing that he was a top chance to make it and not even trying.
BTW, when the Jacks etc of this world, and players of his "inexperience" attempt such things as we are discussing and they make errors, to me it aint a problem, moreso a pleasing thing in that they have that x factor that says i want to stand out and make this. Its when stupid ridiculous, school boy errors are made by more exeprienced playes, attempting a basic skill that riles me.

I agree I would love to see Jack taking those marks but I also understand when he is taking the safe option and doing the team thing by trying to maintain possession or at the very least force a ball up inside our forward 50.

 

[Tiger67]

Just thought I would pick you up on a few of these 'problems'. Reckon Simmonds coming back as the number 1 ruckman might have something to do with this champ? As it stands Pattison averages 4 disposals a game less than Simmonds despite spending a lot less time on the ground. Go figure.

First thing I was taught when learning the game was you always keep your feet in a contest. So let me ask if Jack was to slide into a mark and spilled it and his opponent wandered off with the ball while Jack got to his feet would you be critical of Jack for going to ground?


Thats funny I saw him take on and beat a few players on the weekend because he now has the ability to break through tackles that used to stop him.

71 goals in the last 4 games would suggest that our delivery into the forward line is working fine at the moment. Sure it can always inprove but when you have blokes picking the right options instead of the same option there is hardly a cause for concern.

Well summed up RT
Why would Rodger Dodger want a bit of reality to get in the way of his idealistic little world.
Everyone is entitled to an opinion but some should just keep it to themselves

 

[Rayzorwire]

A brief list:

Kane Johnson still can't kick. He gave off some great handballs on saturday night but his kicking is woeful and a liability likely to lose us more games than it wins us. This hasn't changed in five years. And why does he wave his hands at players all time when he has the ball in his hand? Forwards are frightened at leading to him because they know he can't kick. So do the opposition. That's why he is allowed to get the ball.

Yep. This year his clearance work and running has - (so far!) - made up for it, but it's a big flaw in his game.

Newman is protected because he is part of the leadership group but he is completely deficient in the vital areas constitute man on man football. Aside from a great game against Freo he is too often a passenger. He had a Barry Crocker on the weekend.

Yep. The emergence of King, recruiting of McMahon, absence of Raines as a scapegoat (defensively), and our three talls/mid talls (Moore, Thursty, McGuane) has exposed him more than ever as a defender who can't defend when he has to.

Pattison has gone backwards this year. Full stop.

Just Simmonds being back brings him into the game less as RT said. He's the type of player who goes better the more workload you give him.

Why does Jack Riewoldt always wait for the ball to bounce in front of him when he can just as easily mark it albeit maybe sliding on his knees? This is a bad habit that needs to be rectified. Who is drilling these guys in development? Pick up your game.

Covered below...

Deledio has lost so much speed off the mark. It is starting to affect his confidence in taking blokes on. Has he bulked up too much? Whatever it is he needs to get it back.

Carrying a niggle apparently. What he's lacked in pace he's made up for by being stronger through the hips and able to shake off a lot more tackles.

We need better delivery into the forward line. Guys like Connors and Cotchin need to be introduced ASAP. Tuck, Johnson, Hyde aren't efficient enough.

They've all been ok and make up for it in other areas. Another couple of designated kickers wouldn't hurt us at all, but ATM our more skilfull juniors are a way off earning senior selection, with the possible exception of Cotchin (we'll see).

Shepherding. Too many guys are still watching the ball carrier. When will they learn?

We could certainly improve further in this area, but we're light years ahead of where we were in previous years.

Ultimately, you could find another dozen 'problems' with our current side, but you could also find a dozen for Geelong...and a hundred for Melbourne, Freo and the Weagles.

The game has become such, that its now a matter of cms and if you can make the mark sliding into it, cms off the ground, then you go for it. If you dont you will forever be playing safe and not taking risks, because you will never learn how to do it.

Nah Cogga, RT is right, these days it's all about playing the percentages and holding the ball in the area. If he gathers on the half-volley and gets tackled straight away, we hold the ball in our forwardline. If he gathers and can get away a handball or turn his opponent, that's better than slowing the game down with a set kick from a tough place when his options have dried up by the time he's ready to take his kick. If he drops the mark then we lose the lot. Ultimately it's up to the player to decide on his odds of taking it, but on or outside 50, play the percentages - if you're 40m or less out, have a crack at anything.

You'll be pleased to know, one area I'm critical of Tuck in ATM is that he's not judging when to release the ball when tackled and when not to very well. Numerous times over the last few weeks he's been tackled as soon as he's got it and taken the 'get rid of it at all costs after you're tackled' mentality too far, when he should have just held the ball and gone to a ball-up with no prior opportunity.

It may be a hangover from last year when we tried to avoid stop plays all year through lack of a genuinely competitive ruckman.

shane tuck would surely be one of the least efficient kicks in the afl?

Nope, he's been pretty good this season. He's also been handballing a lot.

For all his ordinary ones, that pass onto Brown's chest from the centre clearance hitting him 35 out on the weekend was vintage 2005 Tuck. No coincidence it was on his right foot.

we cant afford to have jackson, hyde, johnson, tuck (tivendale) in the same team.

Jackson's a very good kick on the run, but he does need more work on his set play kicking when nobody is giving him options.

 

[nut]

FFS... he is 19... let the boy develop.

 

[CoggaRules]

Nah Cogga, RT is right, these days it's all about playing the percentages and holding the ball in the area. If he gathers on the half-volley and gets tackled straight away, we hold the ball in our forwardline. If he gathers and can get away a handball or turn his opponent, that's better than slowing the game down with a set kick from a tough place when his options have dried up by the time he's ready to take his kick. If he drops the mark then we lose the lot. Ultimately it's up to the player to decide on his odds of taking it, but on or outside 50, play the percentages - if you're 40m or less out, have a crack at anything.

You'll be pleased to know, one area I'm critical of Tuck in ATM is that he's not judging when to release the ball when tackled and when not to very well. Numerous times over the last few weeks he's been tackled as soon as he's got it and taken the 'get rid of it at all costs after you're tackled' mentality too far, when he should have just held the ball and gone to a ball-up with no prior opportunity.

It may be a hangover from last year when we tried to avoid stop plays all year through lack of a genuinely competitive ruckman.



Nope, he's been pretty good this season. He's also been handballing a lot.

For all his ordinary ones, that pass onto Brown's chest from the centre clearance hitting him 35 out on the weekend was vintage 2005 Tuck. No coincidence it was on his right foot.

1. Jack should look to his cousin and see what a lead up target does 9 times out of 10. Thats what he should aspire to, the only way to actually develop those skills is to give them a go under match day pressure. Over time, the last mistake would have taught him what he needs to do to not make it the next time. He takes a couple gets the rhythm and the read right and then its second nature.

2. Tuck should watch what other more notables do. Yes get rid of it at all costs, but yes too, you wont get pinged a split second after you get tackled, and yes too, just letting the ball drop to the ground, inside the pack is sometimes better when you are "hoping" for a target when flicking it out to anywhere. Dont think he can change his ways though.

 

[ize_]

We cant afford to have 5 teenagers playing instead of them.... The players you mentioned will be replaced overtime.... in the meantime they are the best we have, so try supporting them because they are busting their chops for us at the moment. I cant believe the negativity on here.

Spot on

Johnson in particular is playing magnificently. There is nothing wrong with our side at the moment.

 

[tigers_of_old_08]

A brief list:

Kane Johnson still can't kick. He gave off some great handballs on saturday night but his kicking is woeful and a liability likely to lose us more games than it wins us. This hasn't changed in five years. And why does he wave his hands at players all time when he has the ball in his hand? Forwards are frightened at leading to him because they know he can't kick. So do the opposition. That's why he is allowed to get the ball.

Newman is protected because he is part of the leadership group but he is completely deficient in the vital areas constitute man on man football. Aside from a great game against Freo he is too often a passenger. He had a Barry Crocker on the weekend.

Pattison has gone backwards this year. Full stop.

Why does Jack Riewoldt always wait for the ball to bounce in front of him when he can just as easily mark it albeit maybe sliding on his knees? This is a bad habit that needs to be rectified. Who is drilling these guys in development? Pick up your game.

Deledio has lost so much speed off the mark. It is starting to affect his confidence in taking blokes on. Has he bulked up too much? Whatever it is he needs to get it back.

We need better delivery into the forward line. Guys like Connors and Cotchin need to be introduced ASAP. Tuck, Johnson, Hyde aren't efficient enough.

Shepherding. Too many guys are still watching the ball carrier. When will they learn?

What the?? We came to within 3 points of St Kilda on Sunday and generally outplayed them. I have nothing but praise for this very young and inexperienced side. I say give them time to develop, they are a vastly different playing group to last season..

Go Tigers

 

[Crumden]

Johnson, Tuck and even Hyde are probably close to career best form at the moment, although Johnson and Tuck in particular are poor kicks. Those two are winning plenty of contested pill, we just need to continue to surround them with good ball users like Brown, Deledio and Tambling and hopefully Cotchin and co.

 

[tiggywigs]

Newman looks and plays like a midfielder. He has decent (not amazing) defensive skills, but more noticeably has a huge appetite for possession and attack (with good quick hands and very decent kick). Seems to me that he should be a part of the regular midfield rotation.

 

[oxx]

So Cogga, I'll ask you the same thing, if Jack does start sliding into marks and the ball spills out and hits the ground will you be critical of him or will you pat him on the back? There is a time to take risks and a time to play it safe. Would much rather Jack keeping his feet in a contest and having a 50% chance of keeping the ball in the area or better yet being able to dish a handball or kick to a teammate, than diving for a mark where he has about a 20% chance of marking and an 80% chance that his opponent will head off unopposed to deliever the ball into his teams forward line.

BTW, should have read one of the first things I was taught when learning the game was to always keep my feet in a contest. After all pretty hard to chase when you're on all fours.

U lead - u Mark.

?????

U let the ball bounce if,after busting ur gut to get to the spot,u still can't mark it.

Two options after the ball bounces.
1- grab it on the bounce
2- flick it off to a runner


?????

 

[mhill]

Everyone is a FUGGAN coach!!!!!!

 

[CoggaRules]

Everyone is a FUGGAN coach!!!!!!

fuggan oath man. That is what footy is all about dude. Been in a pub in the last 100 years? Everyone is a fuggan coach, that is what ropes us into this fuggan game.

 

[Bazzar]

Everyone is a FUGGAN coach!!!!!!

Mondays experts.... An lovin it