Matthew Lloyd v Nick Riewoldt

[HyperAgressiveDonk]

In the spirit of recent Matthew Lloyd threads, I decided to start one comparing him with another all time great.

I know they played different positions, but both were gun forwards and arguably the best forward in the competition in their prime. Which player was the better player, Riewoldt or Lloyd?

Here are some career achievements

Riewoldt

4xAA
5xB&F
1xMVP

Lloyd

5xAA
3xColeman medalist

Hard to split in my opinion. Thoughts?

 

[Ed D]

Using statistics only:

Lloyd's best season: 2000, 25 games, 391 disposals, 186 marks, 109 goals, 60 behinds.

Riewoldt's best season: 2004, 25 games, 432 disposals, 256 marks, 67 goals, 32 behinds.


Lloyd for me, and that was before I looked up the stats as well.

 

[HyperAgressiveDonk]

Using statistics only:

Lloyd's best season: 2000, 25 games, 391 disposals, 186 marks, 109 goals, 60 behinds.

Riewoldt's best season: 2004, 25 games, 432 disposals, 256 marks, 67 goals, 32 behinds.


Lloyd for me, and that was before I looked up the stats as well.

So Riewoldt gets more possessions and marks, yet Lloyd easily Riewoldts best year earnt him an MVP and was widely regarded as the best player in the comp by everyone that year

They play different positions, Riewoldt doesn't play as deep as Lloyd.

 

[Kong]

Riewold't a gun, but Lloyd's an all time great.

Riewoldt's comparisons are best with Brown, Tredrea, Pavlich, Richardson etc.

 

[The Finger]

Riewoldt plays the hardest and most important position on the ground.

 

[Jade]

Yeah Lloyd.

He truly is an all time great.

As the OP pointed out though, they are different players which makes it a little harder to compare.

 

[JonoNash]

but Lloyd's an all time great.

He is?

When I think of all-time greats I think of (in that position).

Tony Lockett, Bob Pratt, Gordon Coventry, Doug Wade, Peter Hudson, Dick Lee, Gary Ablett Snr, Jason Dunstall & John Coleman.

Lloyd is an all-time great of Essendon, he isn't the class & group of the all-time full forwards.

Lloyd wouldn't even be on the level of a Peter McKenna. McKenna averaged 4.6 goals / game, Lloyd 3.4 goals / game.

McKenna kicked 100 goals in a season 3 times, Lloyd twice. McKenna's best was 143 in a season & this was in 20 & 1/2 games. He also kicked 134 goals the year after for good measure kicked another 130 the year after. Lloyd's best was 109 in a 25 game season.

McKenna is an all-time great of Collingwood, just like Lloyd & Essendon. However both aren't all-time greats in that position league wide.

 

[DapperDon]

So Riewoldt gets more possessions and marks, yet Lloyd easily Riewoldts best year earnt him an MVP and was widely regarded as the best player in the comp by everyone that year

They play different positions, Riewoldt doesn't play as deep as Lloyd.

So you discredit Lloyd's goals because he played deeper, but argue that Riewoldt is better because he got more possessions and took more marks?

You continue to baffle me with your stupidity HAD.

 

[HyperAgressiveDonk]

Riewold't a gun, but Lloyd's an all time great.

Riewoldt's comparisons are best with Brown, Tredrea, Pavlich, Richardson etc.

Do you really believe Lloyd is better than Tredrea, Riewoldt & Pavlich? Tredrea = best CHF since Carey, Riewoldt = best player in the comp in his prime, and Pavlich is a 6 x All Australian. Lloyd never even won a best and fairest. Sure he's an all-time great, but he's not a top 20 player of all time or anything like Ablett, Dunstall, Carey, Matthews and co. I think it's a fair comparision to Riewoldt.

 

[HyperAgressiveDonk]

So you discredit Lloyd's goals because he played deeper, but argue that Riewoldt is better because he got more possessions and took more marks?

You continue to baffle me with your stupidity HAD.

Matthew Lloyd never even won a B&F in his prime. Nick Riewoldt won an MVP in his prime and was regarded as the best player in the comp. So on that basis, Riewoldts best is better than Lloyds best.

 

[Gone Critical]

Pretty good comparison. Would lean slightly to Reiwoldt.

Neither are all time greats but sit in the grouping that would include J Brown, Wade, McKenna, Templeton, Brererton, Kernahan, Modra etc

 

[Kong]

Do you really believe Lloyd is better than Tredrea, Riewoldt & Pavlich? Tredrea = best CHF since Carey, Riewoldt = best player in the comp in his prime, and Pavlich is a 6 x All Australian.

Of course I do.

Continuing that theme, Lloyd = best FF since Locket.

 

[scaryness]

Riewoldt

4xAA
5xB&F
1xMVP

Lloyd

5xAA
3xColeman medalist

Wow i would have thought that Lloyd would have won a B&F somehwere in his career. Who was winning them?

 

[Kong]

During his peak of '97-04, Hird, usually.

Fletch won one, Lucas two, the Johnsons three between them IIRC.

 

[HyperAgressiveDonk]

Wow i would have thought that Lloyd would have won a B&F somehwere in his career. Who was winning them?

Lloyd never really dominated the competition like other forwards have, but was ultra consistent. I don't know who won them

 

[JonoNash]

During his peak of '97-04, Hird, usually.

Hird played 7 games in 97', 13 games in 98' & 2 games in 99'. How can this be his peak?

 

[juss]

At his best Riewoldt was considered the best player in the competition.
I'm not sure Lloyd has reached those heights.

On the other hand, Lloyd probably had him for consistancy over their careers. Lloyd kicked more goals, but Riewoldt impacted around the ground more.

Goalkicking goes to Lloyd, but courage goes to Riewoldt. Riewoldt's taken some breathtaking contested marks, and covered insane amounts of turf.

They both have their pros and cons, but personally I voted Riewoldt, based on the fact his best was the best in the comp at one time.

 

[Kong]

Hird played 7 games in 97', 13 games in 98' & 2 games in 99'. How can this be his peak?

During Lloyd's peak, mate.

 

[HurleyTheFuture]

So Riewoldt gets more possessions and marks, yet Lloyd easily Riewoldts best year earnt him an MVP and was widely regarded as the best player in the comp by everyone that year

They play different positions, Riewoldt doesn't play as deep as Lloyd.

Riewoldt doesnt play as deep as Lloyd and yet he only averaged 2 more disposals in their best years?
Also in Riewoldts MVP year he didnt have as much competition as Lloyd did for the title and was very over hyped by the media, however I do believe he was the best forward in the comp in 2009

 

[Kong]

Lloyd never really dominated the competition

Yeah those 100 goal seasons, they were nothing, eh.

lol. Coming from the same guy that continually (rightfully so) pumps up Buddy's 2008-2011..

 

[HyperAgressiveDonk]

Yeah those 100 goal seasons, they were nothing, eh.

lol. Coming from the same guy that continually (rightfully so) pumps up Buddy's 2008-2011..

Buddy isn't a FF mate, and games these days are lower scoring. Apples & Oranges.

Lloyd was never good enough to win 1 single B&F. He was never considered the best player in the competition in those years. And yes, games were higher scoring and teams were more reliant on one full forward back then.

Look, I think he is a great payer, but for you to dismiss Riewoldt, Tredea & Pavlich as just "inferior" to Lloyd is just wrong.

 

[Kong]

Well I guess Lockett, Ablett and Modra's 100 goal seasons are null and void then.

Sorry lads.

 

[HyperAgressiveDonk]

Well I guess Lockett, Ablett and Modra's 100 goal seasons are null and void then.

Sorry lads.

They kicked theirs in the H&A season, and Lockett & Ablett did so multiple times.

All I did, was start a poll between two great players, who I have labelled both all-time greats. And I all get, is Essnedon fans lining up to dismiss every other forward in the last 15 years. Lol.

 

[Kong]

Hyperbole.

I don't think Riewoldt's comparable to Lloyd, that's it.

The only modern forwards I would (bother) compare him to are Fev and maybe Buddy. All others are either completely different or (IMO) not on the same level.

 

[Jade]

And I all get, is Essnedon fans lining up to dismiss every other forward in the last 15 years. Lol.

Two pages in and I haven't seen a single Essendon fan dismiss the previously mentioned names.

I think stating Lloyd has been the games best forward since Lockett is a fairly reasonable statement.

I don't dismiss the talents of say Tredrea; whom was a great player. I still think Lloyd was better (and Richardson for that matter).