MCG Southern Stand upgrade

[The_Wookie]

If it were to happen. Could those stadiums deliver 70k tickets to the AFL?

If they could remember the MCG has 20k plus mcc seats they can't sell. Although they'd probably have to compensate the mcc

WA and SA stadiums may have membership deals too though

remember that those 20k plus MCC members pay for entry to the Grand Final or the MCC pays on their behalf - IIRC its like 260 per person.

 

[Rob]

too hard basket?

It's the AFL - where the feelings of Victorians come ahead of any pragmatic considerations.

 

[HTT]

It's the AFL - where the feelings of Victorians come ahead of any pragmatic considerations.

You want pragmatic? Remember in 2013 when they couldn't get all of the Fremantle supporters over in a week?
That issue is a 1 in 9 (2 teams out of 18) chance of happening at any given grand final. You could possibly expand it to 2 in 9 if you count Brisbane/Gold Coast in that.

Now imagine a grand final in Perth. There is a 7 in 9 chance of that issue happening (10 vic + 2 nsw + 2 qld) and you could even add Adelaide/port into that to make it 8 in 9. In any case, the game would become more coporate dominated than it already is. If the GF ever had to move from the G, it would go to Etihad or Adelaide before Perth.

 

[Pj.Rj.Hj]

delete

 

[Pj.Rj.Hj]

sure?
in a rectangular position it will have the capacity of 70k but in oval configuration its 60k
hot sure how the stadium will be up gradable in the future, like the new Adeliade oval is

It was in the construction brief that the Perth Stadium be designed to easily expand to 70 000 from 60 000. The Previous Government always stated it before and during construction and it says as much on the Stadiums website. With the initial capacity it will be 60 000 for Footy, 65 000 for Rugby/Soccer.

It has not been made clear if the 70 000 figure is for Footy or Rugby/Soccer, so either it could be only another 5000 seats or if 10 000 seats then Rugby/Soccer capacity could be as high as 75 000.

With the cross sections I have of the Perth Stadium, I can see room for an additional 8000 seats within the building envelope. Maybe another 2000 can be found moving the current seats (which are on slideable rails) closer together?

 

[FootyJunkie]

delete

 

[Rob]

You want pragmatic? Remember in 2013 when they couldn't get all of the Fremantle supporters over in a week?
That issue is a 1 in 9 (2 teams out of 18) chance of happening at any given grand final. You could possibly expand it to 2 in 9 if you count Brisbane/Gold Coast in that.

Now imagine a grand final in Perth. There is a 7 in 9 chance of that issue happening (10 vic + 2 nsw + 2 qld) and you could even add Adelaide/port into that to make it 8 in 9. In any case, the game would become more coporate dominated than it already is. If the GF ever had to move from the G, it would go to Etihad or Adelaide before Perth.

That's not the reason why though. The AFL wouldn't dare move the game for fear of offending Victorians. The league had a huge opportunity in 2003 and 2004 to move the game to Sydney where a larger crowd would have been hosted, more tickets would have been available to competing club members, there wouldn't have been a gaping hole in the stadium for the premier game of the season and the promotional value would have been almost priceless. They refused.

Irrespective, a GF in Perth with interstate combatants would be planned at least a couple of years in advance. It's not like where a WA team makes it with a week's notice, and airlines, bus companies etc have to scramble to arrange transport in a couple of days. Rent wouldn't be a problem either - the WA government have paid millions for a state of origin game and a rugby game, i'm sure they'd be more than happy to pay a lot more for an AFL GF.

 

[HTT]

That's not the reason why though. The AFL wouldn't dare move the game for fear of offending Victorians. The league had a huge opportunity in 2003 and 2004 to move the game to Sydney where a larger crowd would have been hosted, more tickets would have been available to competing club members, there wouldn't have been a gaping hole in the stadium for the premier game of the season and the promotional value would have been almost priceless. They refused.

Irrespective, a GF in Perth with interstate combatants would be planned at least a couple of years in advance. It's not like where a WA team makes it with a week's notice, and airlines, bus companies etc have to scramble to arrange transport in a couple of days. Rent wouldn't be a problem either - the WA government have paid millions for a state of origin game and a rugby game, i'm sure they'd be more than happy to pay a lot more for an AFL GF.

Of course you'd refuse to play the grand final on a rugby ground

 

[Rob]

Of course you'd refuse to play the grand final on a rugby ground

A cricket ground is OK though. Even when there's a stand missing.

There will always be an excuse.

 

[HTT]

A cricket ground is OK though. Even when there's a stand missing.

There will always be an excuse.

When that cricket ground is used primarily for football and is prepared as such, it is ok. In September, the only thing 'cricket' about the ground is its name.

 

[The_Wookie]

That's not the reason why though. The AFL wouldn't dare move the game for fear of offending Victorians.

the biggest factor in this discussion is actually the AFL members and AFL corporates - most of whom are going to be based in Victoria.

The league had a huge opportunity in 2003 and 2004 to move the game to Sydney where a larger crowd would have been hosted, more tickets would have been available to competing club members, there wouldn't have been a gaping hole in the stadium for the premier game of the season and the promotional value would have been almost priceless. They refused.

Im not even sure it was even an option under its contract.

 

[Rob]

the biggest factor in this discussion is actually the AFL members and AFL corporates - most of whom are going to be based in Victoria.

Im not even sure it was even an option under its contract.

Neither was bulldozing half the ground - that's why they had to renegotiate it.

 

[The_Wookie]

Neither was bulldozing half the ground - that's why they had to renegotiate it.

The 2002 Renegotiation

During the course of negotiation it emerged that the AFL had offered to pay the MCC for the loss of any finals, but for the MCC it was about more than just the money. The Government felt that the economic benefits to having the preliminary final and Grand Final in Victoria outweighed the compensation on offer.

Demetriou said the AFL had offered the MCC financial compensation in return for giving up the automatic preliminary final, but, for the MCC, it was not simply a matter of financial compensation. Demetriou said the preliminary finals were a key to the selling of the MCC’s corporate packages and boxes, not to mention its membership, while the Victorian Government – which has a substantial hand in the development of the MCG – believes the preliminary and grand finals have “a massive economic impact” on the Victorian economy and wishes to retain them in the state.[6]

The AFL 2002 Annual Report

The 2002 AFL annual Report stated that Final Agreement was reached the the MCG Trust and the Melbourne Cricket Club to pay an additional $5 million per year, indexed for 32 years, for the redevelopment of the MCG, a process that will be completed by the 2006 Commonwealth Games.

Between 70 and 80 percent of the total revenue generated by operation of the MCG is directly related to AFL matches held at the Stadium.

The additional $5 million per year is a further investment by football and its supporters. In part the redevelopment is paid for by a user-pays levy of $1 on all adults attending AFL premierships season matches, $5 for finals and $8 for the Grand Final. The balance will come from AFL consolidated revenue.

Finals and the MCG

During negotiations with the MCC we were not able to substantially change the condition of our 1989 agreement between our respective organisations which requires us to play 1 game per week at the MCG during the finals.

The new agreement does, however, allow us to “bank” finals so that during any three year period, we will average four finals at the MCG each year including a Preliminary Final and a grand Final.

This agreement was challenged by the then Premier of South Australia, Mike Rann who complained to the ACCC who advised that since the AFL, MCC and MCG Trust were not competitors they could not be in voliation of competition law.[7]

 

[telsor]

Irrespective, a GF in Perth with interstate combatants would be planned at least a couple of years in advance. It's not like where a WA team makes it with a week's notice, and airlines, bus companies etc have to scramble to arrange transport in a couple of days. Rent wouldn't be a problem either - the WA government have paid millions for a state of origin game and a rugby game, i'm sure they'd be more than happy to pay a lot more for an AFL GF.

A couple of years in advance...So there would be a fair chance there would be no WA teams playing. So you'd have to allow for 50-60K people arriving...

2 questions.
1) Could Perth airport take that many extra flights without causing major disruption to routine operations? An average day at Perth airport is ~35-40K people, and you're need to almost double that a day either side of the GF, with major increases a few more days either way. (of course, that's if they can even get the planes).
2) Are there enough spare hotel rooms for that many people? Remembering that many (half?) of those who come will be corporate types, so hostels/airBnB are unlikely to cut it, and remember, you still need enough for 'normal' operations.

Oh, and millions for a SOO game...Chicken feed...Think somewhere over $10million (40K seats * $260 -- the amount the MCC pays + losses from corporates & sponsors, etc that I'm sure the AFL would require compensation for).


Sydney, Brisbane, perhaps even Adelaide could all handle this (not sure Adelaide has the hotel space), but Perth is so isolated, it would be a MASSIVE logistical problem.

 

[Rob]

A couple of years in advance...So there would be a fair chance there would be no WA teams playing. So you'd have to allow for 50-60K people arriving...

2 questions.
1) Could Perth airport take that many extra flights without causing major disruption to routine operations? An average day at Perth airport is ~35-40K people, and you're need to almost double that a day either side of the GF, with major increases a few more days either way. (of course, that's if they can even get the planes).
2) Are there enough spare hotel rooms for that many people? Remembering that many (half?) of those who come will be corporate types, so hostels/airBnB are unlikely to cut it, and remember, you still need enough for 'normal' operations.

No idea, but the AFL would never have considered these issues because they wouldn't get past the first hurdle - the feelings of Victorians. That's my point - the AFL wouldn't even consider it.

If the AFL undertook a detailed feasibility study on such matters then i'd give them some credit.

PS. We're talking about a situation where the MCG is missing a lot of seats due to redevelopment.

 

[The_Wookie]

Moved fixture discussion to a seperate thread.
https://www.bigfooty.com/forum/threads/the-victorian-fixture-favoritism-thread.1164115/page-2

 

[Konrad2709]

remember that those 20k plus MCC members pay for entry to the Grand Final or the MCC pays on their behalf - IIRC its like 260 per person.

It's essentially the difference in price between a full member and restricted member. I've seen it said that the difference in price is the price of the GF ticket.

In other words, every full MCC member is paying for a GF ticket whether they go or not.

After ~13-14 years of full membership, I've been to 2 GFs. Now I've just made myself sad.

 

[Bort]

It's essentially the difference in price between a full member and restricted member. I've seen it said that the difference in price is the price of the GF ticket.

In other words, every full MCC member is paying for a GF ticket whether they go or not.

I think The_Wookie and yourself are talking about two different things.

It is true that the difference in the price of a Restricted and Full annual subscriptions is the cost of the Grand Final.

However the MCC contributes money to the gate for every member that attends a game. For the H&A games the amount is the cost of general admission, and the home team gets the gate. For the finals the gate goes to the AFL and the amount paid is equal to one of the ticket-categories. I forget which category but The_Wookie's $260 per person for the Grand Final is about right.