Injury Medical Sub - the first integrity check

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Feb 17, 2010
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Next week there is a huge decision for the AFL which will demonstrate if it maintains the integrity of the competition and the rules or if they shift the goal posts being finals and to suit certain teams.

Weightman was subbed off and out of the match after a head knock.

The dogs are already claiming it was precautionary and not concussion, in the hope he would be able to play next week.

Now we all know under the new medical sub and concussion rule that any concussion, no matter how severe, is a 12 day break. Meaning he cannot play the prelim next week.

So either, he was subbed out with a concussion (even if slight) and he misses.

Or they determine he wasn’t concussed which then means a perfectly healthy player was subbed out of the game for a fresh player. If he was not concussed and he was removed as a precaution, a precaution is not a reason for a medical substitution as they are saying at the time he is not injured. Meaning he cannot then be subbed out.

The AFL was very clear with the rules that they will come down hard on teams trying to circumvent the rules.

He’s either concussed and out next week, or the Dogs broke the medical sub rule.

Particularly when Johanisson was the medical sub who came on and kicked a goal for the dogs in a final decided by 1 pt, if it was a precautionary sub for a player who by their own admission was not injured, that’s a massive integrity issue.

This decision alone will either support the rule or remove any credibility the rule has.
 

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Feb 17, 2010
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One thing you cant question is the medical team at the dogs. Drs Zimmerman et al in no way will cross the line when it comes to the players health. As i would expect from all clubs.

And if that’s the case (which I hope it is as you said for all Drs) then he’s been removed for concussion concerns and has no option but too miss next week.
 

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I'll run with what the doctor says on this one. Weightman has proven to be a more than handy player so I don't see any reason to sub him off when he'd already kicked a goal and was lively.

Doctor has maybe assessed the incident and had concerns about delayed concussion. Regardless, I'm sure if he is actually concussed the Bulldogs medical staff will not clear him to play next week.
 

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Do you have to submit the reason for subbing a player?

As per the rule below, yes the following working day.

And as per the rule, the player had too be determined medically unfit to be subbed out. In this case, the only reason to be declared medically unfit was due to a head knock and concussion concerns. If there was no concussion concerns, he is therefor medically fit and the rule has been broken to sub him out.

A Medical Substitute can be activated immediately after it is determined a Player is medically unfit to continue to participate in the match and, due to the nature of the injury sustained, it is reasonably determined the player will be medically unfit to participate in any match for at least the next 12 days.
a. Only the Club Medical Officer can determine a Player is medically unfit.
b. A Medical Substitute can be activated at any stage during the match.
c. A Medical Substitute can occur even after the Interchange Cap of 75 has been met as per current AFL Regulations when an injured player has exited the Playing Surface.
d. On or before the first working day after the match, the Club Medical Officer must provide a Medical Certificate to the AFL certifying that the Player replaced by the Medical Substitute Player sustained the injury.
 
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The medical sub has been “compromised” a number of times this season. At the start of the season, a lot of pundits reckoned that it wouldn’t be long before teams used the sub tactically.

As it has been left to roll along “loosely” all season, nothing will occur from tonight’s game.
 
As per the rule below, yes the following working day.

And as per the rule, the player had too be determined medically unfit to be subbed out. In this case, the only reason to be declared medically unfit was due to a head knock and concussion concerns. If there was no concussion concerns, he is therefor medically fit and the rule has been broken to sub him out.

A Medical Substitute can be activated immediately after it is determined a Player is medically unfit to continue to participate in the match and, due to the nature of the injury sustained, it is reasonably determined the player will be medically unfit to participate in any match for at least the next 12 days.
a. Only the Club Medical Officer can determine a Player is medically unfit.
b. A Medical Substitute can be activated at any stage during the match.
c. A Medical Substitute can occur even after the Interchange Cap of 75 has been met as per current AFL Regulations when an injured player has exited the Playing Surface.
d. On or before the first working day after the match, the Club Medical Officer must provide a Medical Certificate to the AFL certifying that the Player replaced by the Medical Substitute Player sustained the injury.
Sounds like a catch 22 for the dogs unless they can blame it on something else. But I suspect they just lodged it as a head knock as you've suggested which means they've cooked them selves for next week.
 
Feb 17, 2010
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Why would we want JJ, who has been useless this year, over Weightman, who is our most dangerous forward?

But that’s not the discussion here, it is was Weightman concussed and an automatic 12 days out or is a “precautionary head knock substitution” and attempt to circumvent this rule and avoid being forced too miss a match?

He was either concussed or they broke the rule and judging by their language following the match they are avoiding labelling it a concussion.
 
Next week there is a huge decision for the AFL which will demonstrate if it maintains the integrity of the competition and the rules or if they shift the goal posts being finals and to suit certain teams.

Weightman was subbed off and out of the match after a head knock.

The dogs are already claiming it was precautionary and not concussion, in the hope he would be able to play next week.

Now we all know under the new medical sub and concussion rule that any concussion, no matter how severe, is a 12 day break. Meaning he cannot play the prelim next week.

So either, he was subbed out with a concussion (even if slight) and he misses.

Or they determine he wasn’t concussed which then means a perfectly healthy player was subbed out of the game for a fresh player. If he was not concussed and he was removed as a precaution, a precaution is not a reason for a medical substitution as they are saying at the time he is not injured. Meaning he cannot then be subbed out.

The AFL was very clear with the rules that they will come down hard on teams trying to circumvent the rules.

He’s either concussed and out next week, or the Dogs broke the medical sub rule.

Particularly when Johanisson was the medical sub who came on and kicked a goal for the dogs in a final decided by 1 pt, if it was a precautionary sub for a player who by their own admission was not injured, that’s a massive integrity issue.

This decision alone will either support the rule or remove any credibility the rule has.

He got hit in the head and was subbed out as a precaution. He didn't fail a concussion test.

Are you suggesting that players aren't subbed out as a precaution to further injury?

That Johannisson came on and kicked a goal is irrelevant. Unless you are also suggesting that medical subs can't kick goals?
 

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But that’s not the discussion here, it is was Weightman concussed and an automatic 12 days out or is a “precautionary head knock substitution” and attempt to circumvent this rule and avoid being forced too miss a match?

He was either concussed or they broke the rule and judging by their language following the match they are avoiding labelling it a concussion.
he obviously didn't fail the concussion test, or else it would have been labelled a concussion. Seems like a wait and see. If you don't fail the concussion test, why label it concussion?
 
Feb 17, 2010
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He got hit in the head and was subbed out as a precaution. He didn't fail a concussion test.

Are you suggesting that players aren't subbed out as a precaution to further injury?

That Johannisson came on and kicked a goal is irrelevant. Unless you are also suggesting that medical subs can't kick goals?

But that is the whole point of the discussion on the integrity of the rule.

If they were concerned about a concussion then he should have been made to go through the 20 minute protocol period and be assessed. If he passes the test, he’s not concussed and not suitable too be a medical sub as he is not injured. If they are still concerned, he simply stays on the bench.

Or he’s either concussed and subbed out.

The medical sub is not there for precautionary discretion under the rules for head knocks. He’s either concussed or not and that determines if under the rules he’s able to be a sub.
 
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