Mick McGuane

[The Doctor]

About a year ago we discussed whether Mick McGuane would be a suitable candidate for an Asst coaching role at the Bulldogs. THere were some mixed views on this. I'd like to bring it up again!

I was one who was all for giving him a go or at least pro-actively seek him out to see if there was any interest. Others thought there werre some flaws in his make up and we should steer clear.

Listening to him on 927 the other day some interesting achievements were highlighted.His coaching record at Burnie Dockers in Tassie and at Gisborne is impeccable. He's had direct influence in both those clubs winning premierships despite being strugglers prior to his arrival. In the case of Burnie he also took on the CEO role at the cash strapped club and led them to a $50k profit (which is bloody miraculous).

I've always thought that he has an astute football brain. It was noticeable in his playing days and during his brief career in the media.

I suspect if he is keen on furthering his coaching career a VFL or senior asst coaching position would be next in his sights. Whatever his reputation in his younger days he seems to have matured into a football professional at coaching and admin. That kind of talent is not easy to find and we could use all the quality help we can get. If he was interested I reckon we should get him on board.

What do you folks think?

 

[stefoid]

If he was any good, why wouldnt the wobbles take him?

 

[Lockyer24]

I hope we offer him a job next year.

I have a mate playing under Mick in the BFL Representative side, he says Mick makes his players treat their Country Football just as professionally as they would if they were playing AFL. His 'rev up' speeches before games are also meant to be quite good. Good luck to him, wouldn't suprise me at all to see him in the AFL soon.

 

[Chops]

Sounds ok to me Doc

What about Buddha Hocking, seems to have worked wonders with the Jets?

 

[Dog Town]

Originally posted by The Doctor
About a year ago we discussed whether Mick McGuane would be a suitable candidate for an Asst coaching role at the Bulldogs. THere were some mixed views on this. I'd like to bring it up again!

I was one who was all for giving him a go or at least pro-actively seek him out to see if there was any interest. Others thought there werre some flaws in his make up and we should steer clear.

Listening to him on 927 the other day some interesting achievements were highlighted.His coaching record at Burnie Dockers in Tassie and at Gisborne is impeccable. He's had direct influence in both those clubs winning premierships despite being strugglers prior to his arrival. In the case of Burnie he also took on the CEO role at the cash strapped club and led them to a $50k profit (which is bloody miraculous).

I've always thought that he has an astute football brain. It was noticeable in his playing days and during his brief career in the media.

I suspect if he is keen on furthering his coaching career a VFL or senior asst coaching position would be next in his sights. Whatever his reputation in his younger days he seems to have matured into a football professional at coaching and admin. That kind of talent is not easy to find and we could use all the quality help we can get. If he was interested I reckon we should get him on board.

What do you folks think?

Couldn't agree more on that doc!I really thought we should have targeted Mcguane or Hocking last season and both have continued to impress since.Gisborne have been transformed under him and I dont think they have lost a game under him in one and a half seasons after finishing second last the season before he came.Also worth noting is the fact that the side he has transformed is a very young one which suits us.Done a fantastic job with the bendigo leagues intra club side aswell by all reports.

While where at it I think theres a number of ways we could improve our coaching structure.I would love for an ex coach to be involved somehow just to give a bit more direction and to help Rohde out in situations he isn't familiar with.Names like Northgey and Alves spring to mind.I reckon these guys would love to be involved at a league club again.We should also be looking at guys coming out of the playing arena this season.Any thoughts?

 

[OldSchool]

Not a fan at all.
Very good with the football cliche's and projecting his "positive attitude" but has yet to really shake off what is a bad professional reputation both in a football and media sense.
His name alone may lend itself to country leagues success but for mine is way to risky to be added to a no frills coaching structure.
At best perhaps as a consultant

 

[Dog Town]

Originally posted by OldSchool
what is a bad professional reputation both in a football and media sense.

I believe he is still suffering from a bad rep because hes presentation and articulation wasn't great when he was a special comments man on channel 7 a few years back.If you had seen the results he has had you would change your mind I think.I suppose the main thing for me is that he obviously has a burning desire to coach.What about Hocking?

 

[OldSchool]

Originally posted by Dog Town
I believe he is still suffering from a bad rep because hes presentation and articulation wasn't great when he was a special comments man on channel 7 a few years back.If you had seen the results he has had you would change your mind I think.I suppose the main thing for me is that he obviously has a burning desire to coach.What about Hocking?

Scratchy articulation and poor presentation hasn't stopped guys like Rex or Danny Southern from getting different types of media gigs plus there are a number of media improvement courses that could iron out any personal grooming or pronunciation issues if that was all that was holding Mick back.
I believe that the problems are far deeper than just his presentation etc and whilst his record over the last few years is a credit to him I doubt that he could offer much ongoing value to a professional club. I take on board his renowned football brain but nowdays you needs a lot more.
Carmen had a good football brain and achieved some creditable success outside of the AFL but no one wanted him near their club because of the off field baggage he would bring and I am afraid that is how I rate Mick.

The little I know about Hocking is all good and I would expect him to be great value for any club.

 

[Dog Town]

Originally posted by OldSchool

I believe that the problems are far deeper than just his presentation etc and whilst his record over the last few years is a credit to him I doubt that he could offer much ongoing value to a professional club. I take on board his renowned football brain but nowdays you needs a lot more.
Carmen had a good football brain and achieved some creditable success outside of the AFL but no one wanted him near their club because of the off field baggage he would bring and I am afraid that is how I rate Mick.

Care to elaborate?Off field baggage shouldn't really be a problem unless it is something very serious.

 

[OldSchool]

Originally posted by Dog Town
Care to elaborate?Off field baggage shouldn't really be a problem unless it is something very serious.

Not really but if you look closely at Mick McGuane's career you would probably have to agree that he never fully reached his potential because of a number of reasons and one of then was that he never really had the right work ethic off the field.
There are of course other reasons.
For mine, Mick was a very good footballer but he could have been so much more. I'm not sure how a player that never reached his own true potential gets others to over achieve which is really what is needed in these professional times.
Look at some of the current successful coaches, Sheedy, Malthouse, Worsfold and Laidley for example and they all got the most out of their potential as players and now appear to be able to do the same with the players they coach. Players need to respect their coaches and I'm not sure that Mick could command the required respect that he would need.
I think he might do OK at a very strong club like Collingwood or Brisbane but in a no frills coaching structure like the Bulldogs there just wouldn't be a spot

 

[The Doctor]

Originally posted by OldSchool
Not really but if you look closely at Mick McGuane's career you would probably have to agree that he never fully reached his potential because of a number of reasons and one of then was that he never really had the right work ethic off the field.

I can't go along with that. McGuane was a top player during a very strong era for the Pies. I would say that between 1988-1994 he would have been consistently in their top 5 group of players and that is a fair length of time to play so well in a good team. He was an integral part of their premiership side and won 2 best and fairests. I think that is a fair measure of whether a player has got the best out of himself or not.

I still don't know what these doubts are about his character? I doubt there is anything sufficient to exempt him from being a decent coaching candidate. Nearly every coach has had their up and down moments during their careers. If there is nothing to substantiate or elaborate on then why raise the question of off field baggage? Hardly anyone is squeaky clean and those types are usually not good coaches (ie Watson and Buckenara).

If he's a looney then sure we don't need him but there is no evidence of that. If he is no good. Sack him! thusfar in his coaching career he has done brilliantly with 2 different teams. Has earned a lot of respect within the footy communities he has been involved with. Shown remarkable administrative ability. Was appointed regional rep coach. Thats is a fair resume and a lot more qualification than many others have had when getting their AFL/VFL gigs.

I think an AFL asst coach or VFL job would be a natural progression for him and I believe his astute football knowledge and ability to win over players would be a superb addition to our coaching panel.

While we are on the topic I would add that there are a few others we ought to consider;

Gary Lyon - has expressed interest in senior coaching and Mike Sheahan stated he would be willing to take an asst role for a year or two. He would have to be a top candidate as well and could help solve our forward line coaching you would think.

John Longmire - Getting big raps in Sydney for his support role to Roos and another with premiership experience and forward line knowldege.

Alistair Lynch - if he retires?

 

[Darky]

Originally posted by The Doctor
I can't go along with that. McGuane was a top player during a very strong era for the Pies. I would say that between 1988-1994 he would have been consistently in their top 5 group of players and that is a fair length of time to play so well in a good team. He was an integral part of their premiership side and won 2 best and fairests. I think that is a fair measure of whether a player has got the best out of himself or not.

I still don't know what these doubts are about his character? I doubt there is anything sufficient to exempt him from being a decent coaching candidate. Nearly every coach has had their up and down moments during their careers. If there is nothing to substantiate or elaborate on then why raise the question of off field baggage? Hardly anyone is squeaky clean and those types are usually not good coaches (ie Watson and Buckenara).

Hope you don't mind me butting in here... I think McGuane's character might be questioned because of a few instances of poor control of alcohol.

Coming from a piss-head like me, I'm not pre-judging him by any means, nor do I think it's a bad thing to be fond of a drink BUT if my memory serves me correctly McGuane was actually banned by a judge from consuming ANY alcohol for several years, due to repeat offences of public drunkenness, drink driving and possibly assault.

Doesn't mean he's a bad bloke by nature, nor does it mean he can't coach, but there's an underlying habit of poor discipline both mentally and physically, even if it is from the past.

He might be worth a punt in some roles, but isn't it possible there is a bit of risk involved?

 

[The Doctor]

Originally posted by Darky
Hope you don't mind me butting in here... I think McGuane's character might be questioned because of a few instances of poor control of alcohol.

Coming from a piss-head like me, I'm not pre-judging him by any means, nor do I think it's a bad thing to be fond of a drink BUT if my memory serves me correctly McGuane was actually banned by a judge from consuming ANY alcohol for several years, due to repeat offences of public drunkenness, drink driving and possibly assault.

Doesn't mean he's a bad bloke by nature, nor does it mean he can't coach, but there's an underlying habit of poor discipline both mentally and physically, even if it is from the past.

He might be worth a punt in some roles, but isn't it possible there is a bit of risk involved?

I knew he liked a drink but wasn't aware of his track record being at this level. That would certainly sway my opinion against such an appointment.

It would then depend upon how well he has rehabilitated since. Some people can come back as much better people as a result of these experiences, some don't. People who have experienced the highs and lows can often have a lot more to teach!

 

[jim440]

And that small matter at Carlton when he turned up for an early morning recovery session straight from the casino and promptly gave Matthew Hogg a touchup.

 

[Cyclops]

Excuse me for butting in on your board...

I believe Mick enjoyed a beer and still enjoys a punt, however he went through a real bad patch around the time the Pies let him go: he ran his groin to shreds for us and we dumped him at 27. His last game was for the blues wearing the infamous M&M light blue guernsey.

He was an impeccably skilled and intelligent footballer, superb kick, creative hands and a big game player. He won back to back Copelands (in 1992-1993 from memory) and it is little surprise that such a clever bloke has translated well into coaching. He looks more like a Lethal than a Watson, if you know what I mean.

I'd love him at Pieland, to see if he has what it takes in the big time.

 

[chels_09]

Not sure about this one guys! Not to sure on his achievements or anything, I was pretty young when he was in his playing days, n haven't heard much of him since, so ill leave this one to you guys!!!

 

[Dog Town]

Originally posted by Darky
Hope you don't mind me butting in here... I think McGuane's character might be questioned because of a few instances of poor control of alcohol.

Coming from a piss-head like me, I'm not pre-judging him by any means, nor do I think it's a bad thing to be fond of a drink BUT if my memory serves me correctly McGuane was actually banned by a judge from consuming ANY alcohol for several years, due to repeat offences of public drunkenness, drink driving and possibly assault.

Doesn't mean he's a bad bloke by nature, nor does it mean he can't coach, but there's an underlying habit of poor discipline both mentally and physically, even if it is from the past.

He might be worth a punt in some roles, but isn't it possible there is a bit of risk involved?

I was aware of that but hey who hasn't stuffed up on the grog from time to time?Its not as if hes there to be our public face he would be there because of his football brainThis discussion has come about because some of us dont like our current coaching set up.I just think we would be stupid to overlook anyone who could add to the club.Perhaps we should just wait for the the big clubs to get them and we can fight over the scraps.

 

[OldSchool]

Originally posted by Dog Town
This discussion has come about because some of us dont like our current coaching set up.I just think we would be stupid to overlook anyone who could add to the club.Perhaps we should just wait for the the big clubs to get them and we can fight over the scraps.

I'd be surprised if Doc started the thread because he is too unhappy with the current coaches but more because he sees value in Mick's renowned football brain as he also pointed out last year.
I'm just trying to say to people that it is a case of buyer beware
because there are some area's of concern. The things Darky stated I thought were almost common knowledge although they were hushed up at the time. There is one or two other issues as well like Jim pointed out.

Just to add to the thread, I am also not a fan of Garry Lyon, who has an almost squeaky clean image, and although he might command the respect of the players and possibly get some results I doubt that he would commit long term to the Bulldogs nor do I think he has what it takes over the long term.

 

[The Doctor]

Originally posted by OldSchool
I'd be surprised if Doc started the thread because he is too unhappy with the current coaches but more because he sees value in Mick's renowned football brain as he also pointed out last year.

What I want to see is that we get the best people we possibly can down to the club. There are many good candidates out there and we should always be looking to improve our coaching structure. Especially when you are coming last!

Another guy who I think would be ideal for us is Robert Shaw at Essendon. He has been 2IC to Sheedy for a long time and is a master tactician and very experienced. We do lack experience on our coaching panel and dare I say it we lack tactical enterprise.

Darren Wheadon at Melb is possibly another?

 

[OldSchool]

Originally posted by The Doctor
What I want to see is that we get the best people we possibly can down to the club. There are many good candidates out there and we should always be looking to improve our coaching structure. Especially when you are coming last!

Another guy who I think would be ideal for us is Robert Shaw at Essendon. He has been 2IC to Sheedy for a long time and is a master tactician and very experienced. We do lack experience on our coaching panel and dare I say it we lack tactical enterprise.

Darren Wheadon at Melb is possibly another?

There is an article about this in todays paper listing contenders.

Out of Rohde, Bond, Richardson and Prendergast ( all new to their positions ) which ones are you looking to upgrade ? or are you just saying we should be looking at improving our coaching panel as a matter of principle ?

Shaw strikes me as a great back-up but not a real contender to a senior coaches job.
O'Donnell is the standout for mine but I doubt we could get him

Xavier Tanner is by far the best coach going around the TAC and I think would add value to our list but is also doubtful to make the change.

I agree that there is a number of quality people out there and perhaps Campbell Rose needs to look at the coaching structure once he has fixed the salary cap and trading dilemmas

 

[The Doctor]

Originally posted by OldSchool
are you just saying we should be looking at improving our coaching panel as a matter of principle ?

Indeed.

Just like we look for new players to help our cause the coaching situation is no different.

In fact I would be tempted if I were Campbell Rose to see who might be available sooner rather than later. Attracting new players and re-signing existing players will be greatly enhanced if there is a coaching set up that they believe is professional, capable of maximising their playing potential, and has the tactical acumen required to play finals football successfully.

Our current panel is too inexperienced for my liking. The reason I mentioned Robert Shaw is because he has been around a long time and is what you would call a professional assistant coach! He probably wouldn't get a senior gig now but is no doubt an outstanding deputy. Same with Wheadon. These guys have been through the premiership grind and know what to do and have seen the best coaches do it.

O'Donnell would be great (I was hoping he'd get the senior gig) but would probably command more $$ than Rhode. Tanner may very well be an option after all Pagan had 10 years as a successful junior coach.

A lot of people say coaching is over rated. I'm not one who supports that theory. Getting the right people is crucial imo.

 

[OldSchool]

Originally posted by OldSchool
Not a fan at all.
Very good with the football cliche's and projecting his "positive attitude" but has yet to really shake off what is a bad professional reputation both in a football and media sense.
His name alone may lend itself to country leagues success but for mine is way to risky to be added to a no frills coaching structure.
At best perhaps as a consultant

We had a few good discussions about Mick McGuane last season and for those who haven't read the Hun today, there is quite a big article on McGuane and some of the problems he has faced plus a reference that his name is linked to a possible consultant position with the Doggies.

 

[STARSHIPTROOPER]

Mick has been stereotyped is a volitile, inarticulate **** head best suited to a legue where he escapes the medias attention. No doubt he knows the game and was a top footballer in his prime. But the damage to his cred is all his own doing.

Avoid at all costs.

 

[The Doctor]

It's a pity the off field shenanigans have ruined his life and much of his credibility. My question is has he overcome the problems and learnt from his mistakes? Everyone makes them. it's how we deal with them and ultimately overcome them that is a true test of someone's carachter. These experiences can often make you a better person as a consequence.

McGuane has an incredible football brain and would have a lot to offer a footy club.

If that is with us I don't have a problem with it so long as he can prove that what happened in the past is where it belongs. In the past.

 

[OldSchool]

Originally posted by The Doctor
It's a pity the off field shenanigans have ruined his life and much of his credibility. My question is has he overcome the problems and learnt from his mistakes?

It would appear that he still has some work to do and paying is debts will go along way to getting his house in order.

Originally posted by The Doctor
McGuane has an incredible football brain and would have a lot to offer a footy club.

Agreed, as long as he can concentrate on the job at hand.

Originally posted by The Doctor
If that is with us I don't have a problem with it so long as he can prove that what happened in the past is where it belongs. In the past.

I think there will be an answer on that in the next few weeks.

If we are looking for a consultant either coaching or as a specialist with players then he is a worthy candidate.

Given that we passed on OhAilpin because of finances, adding a consultant might seem to be a bit of a luxury however, it also might be money very well spent.