Peter Gordon explores Swiss appeal and injunction on suspension

[FFC_RoyBoys]

and the answer may be the player didnt want Reid to know because the player felt he wouldnt approve of the program

So it is your seriously considered view that a player with Cardiac Arrhythmia did not tell his specialist of the drugs he was taking because he felt his GP would not approve?

Really? Is that not approve in a fatherly sort of way, or not approve in an I am the medical officer of the club and I am duty bound to report PED use to the AFL and others sort of way?

They took the drugs - it does not make them bad people. In my view it doesn't make the cheats (at least not in the black / white way it is often described in HTB). Given the often sort recovery periods and the physical nature of the game itself a heck of a lot of players need some chemical assistance.

Notwithstanding that, they took the drugs and there is no other possible logical view, at least for the player with Cardiac Arrhythmia, that they knew what they were doing.

 

[Oscarman]

Not torn. Trolling. May be very young though.

Remember all the gloating flogs after the AFL tribunal wasn't comfortably satisfied? Where have they been the since the 12th?

 

[jenny61_99]

Not torn. Trolling. May be very young though.

No, not young.

 

[Percel]

I got no rhythm at all, let alone a cardiac one.

My kids can dance though.

 

[mxett]

Why wouldn't he approve the program when the players believed what they were taking were approved BY him?

im trying to take the HTB stance, that the players wanted to dope and excluded Reid from everything

 

[mxett]

Good luck arguing with Mxett. He's got the blinkers on and is Hird like in his belief that nothing happened. In his eyes this is a compliment.

who's got blinkers on? Ive said the players were given TB4 for months

 

[crowsup]

im trying to take the HTB stance, that the players wanted to dope and excluded Reid from everything

Are you actually saying that you have seen the light and agree that the players were complicit with the doping?

 

[Jimthegreat]

im trying to take the HTB stance, that the players wanted to dope and excluded Reid from everything

They may have wanted to dope but at least with thymosin and AOD there was informed consent, even if it a little was after the initial event. Without informed consent on other substances, compliant or not, Essendon are in trouble as players didn't know of the potential danger. Law gives you no leg to stand on.

 

[mxett]

They were given many substances not on consent forms

such as?

 

[Proper Gander]

who's got blinkers on? Ive said the players were given TB4 for months

Like that "Hawks" guy. Totally.

 

[mxett]

They may have wanted to dope but at least with thymosin and AOD there was informed consent, even if it a little was after the initial event. Without informed consent on other substances, compliant or not, Essendon are in trouble as players didn't know of the potential danger. Law gives you no leg to stand on.

So your claim is basically damages for health issues then? What health issues?

 

[Proper Gander]

such as?

I'll say GRHP 2 & 6

 

[Jimthegreat]

So your claim is basically damages for health issues then? What health issues?

You know full well often substances untested have potential nasty side effects. Those substances were given without informed consent of the dangers. Now players have that in the back of their mind for years to be concerned about. That's a problem right there for you.

Don't be an idiot and pretend otherwise.Are you stupid enough not to know that, or just stupid enough to be in denial. #drugcheats.

Dirty stinking football club. With you defending the indefensible we can only assume you approve of it all.

 

[NikkiNoo]

Snake oil salesman would probably work.

I do believe that Professor Kevin Norton referred to him as a "snake oil merchant" when he came knocking at the AFC and tried to get them to employ him. Professor Norton was one of his supervisors of his aborted attempt at a PhD.

 

[Jimthegreat]

such as?

Not capable of downloading the Ziggy and Interim Reports. That'll tell you all you need to know. Remember those.

Like i said, you'll see All Lube Plus. Your club will need it because it's going in deep.

#drugcheats

 

[the conch]

That's a massive cop-out. They should take way more responsibility than this. They actively kept the program a secret from any medical opinion or involvement. They believed information provided by a person with no medical qualifications.

Wow. Tables have turned ... blame the players?

 

[mxett]

You know full well often substances untested have potential nasty side effects. Those substances were given without informed consent of the dangers. Now players have that in the back of their mind for years to be concerned about. That's a problem right there for you.

Don't be an idiot and pretend otherwise.Are you stupid enough not to know that, or just stupid enough to be in denial. #drugcheats.

Dirty stinking football club. With you defending the indefensible we can only assume you approve of it all.

if the players do develop any health issues they no doubt are entitled to compensation. Without any I cannot see them winning much in the way of damages for lack of informed consent

 

[mxett]

Wow. Tables have turned ... blame the players?

isnt everyone blaming the players, including CAS?

 

[Chameleon75]

I'll say GRHP 2 & 6

he does have history of using vitamin cjc

 

[the conch]

You "don't agree with his decision"

The question was: In your opinion, other than knowing that he was using PED's, what other logical reason could an athlete have for not telling his specialist about the drugs administered to him by the club?

Maybe he was worried that the specialist was going to leak it to a rival club?

 

[Lore]

if the players do develop any health issues they no doubt are entitled to compensation. Without any I cannot see them winning much in the way of damages for lack of informed consent

The standard of proof in a court of law is 'beyond reasonable doubt', which is where such a hearing for damages would be heard - a standard of proof which requires evidence of both a health issue and a chain of evidence which shows that said health issue is a direct result of the infamous supplements program.

EFC should settle with players for any damages anyway - it is the right thing to do.

 

[mxett]

The standard of proof in a court of law is 'beyond reasonable doubt', which is where such a hearing for damages would be heard - a standard of proof which requires evidence of both a health issue and a chain of evidence which shows that said health issue is a direct result of the infamous supplements program.

EFC should settle with players for any damages anyway - it is the right thing to do.

assuming they could afford it

 

[the conch]

isnt everyone blaming the players, including CAS?

Not Hirdy, Tanner and Marshy and others that need to keep them on side.

 

[Chameleon75]

The standard of proof in a court of law is 'beyond reasonable doubt', which is where such a hearing for damages would be heard - a standard of proof which requires evidence of both a health issue and a chain of evidence which shows that said health issue is a direct result of the infamous supplements program.

EFC should settle with players for any damages anyway - it is the right thing to do.

not quite, beyond reasonable doubt is a criminal standard, this is a civil matter so balance of probabilities would apply.

but I do agree that it will be settled

 

[imperial_oz]

The standard of proof in a court of law is 'beyond reasonable doubt', which is where such a hearing for damages would be heard - a standard of proof which requires evidence of both a health issue and a chain of evidence which shows that said health issue is a direct result of the infamous supplements program.

EFC should settle with players for any damages anyway - it is the right thing to do.

After all this time and discussion, this sort of comment really shouldn't be coming up any more.

The stand of proof for 'criminal' trials is beyond reasonable doubt. In a civil matter like this, the standard required is balance of probabilities. You have way overstated the what is needed for a successful claim against the club