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QANTASS.

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Ghost Patrol said:
The libs gave Qantas $900 million jobkeeper, and $1.6 billion in other financial assistance......
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That's an irrelevant two wrong make a right argument. Jobkeeper was panic policy.

Qantas actively screw over households but you reckon the government should be protecting their profits. Why?
 
sdfc said:
That's an irrelevant two wrong make a right argument. Jobkeeper was panic policy.

Qantas actively screw over households but you reckon the government should be protecting their profits. Why?
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No, you aren't forced to use Qantas. I'd prefer if they were nationalised.
 
QANTASoles own Labor so the profit gouging will continue for a long time.
QANTASoles 'giving' Three House Albo's son VIP lounge membership was a great and cheap way to let the gravy train roll on.
Catherine King is a compliant & useless Transport minister so suck it up you silly 32% who voted for the knobs running the country.
 
www.thesaturdaypaper.com.au

Exclusive: Joyce sought to sell government a stake in Qantas

Following the resignation of Qantas chief executive Alan Joyce, fresh details have emerged regarding his relationship with government.
www.thesaturdaypaper.com.au www.thesaturdaypaper.com.au

But for perhaps the first time in his career, Joyce seriously underestimated the strength of community anger over the airline’s behaviour. After years of cutbacks, the airline was hit more severely by Covid-19 and became the most complained about business in Australia. Thousands upon thousands of flights were cancelled in a three-month period last year. Customers were parted with baggage for days at a time. Others couldn’t even access refunds for the flights they had paid for but had never been able to board. Against this backdrop Qantas received more than $2 billion in government assistance through the pandemic, almost half of which came in the form of JobKeeper. Despite this, the airline sacked 1700 baggage handlers.

“You know, Albo has been too close to him in the past,” a senior Labor figure says of Joyce.

“But having said that, it was the previous Coalition government that gave them ****ing JobKeeper. The taxpayers have underwritten their profits.

“With them keeping that money when they didn’t need it, the taxpayer under the previous government has redistributed income upwards to the richest people in Australia. It’s a shocking joke.”
 
From the same article;

King, for her part, fought back, accusing the Coalition of promulgating “chaos” in the aviation sector.

“They gave billions of taxpayer dollars to Qantas for nothing in return, with no strings attached. They stood by as Virgin collapsed into administration, only for it to be snatched up by foreign private equity, with a third of its workforce laid off, and it’s now seeking to sell its share. They oversaw the mass outsourcing of jobs and labour hire mess that drove down wages and conditions across the sector, which was one of the prime drivers of the same job, same pay legislation,” she said.

“They commissioned the Harris review into the Sydney Airport, only to spend almost two years sitting on it, leaving it for us to have to sort out now. They introduced an early retirement scheme for air traffic controllers – and guess what, there is now a shortage of air traffic controllers, causing airport delays up and down the country.”
 
I wonder how much of this and other government failures (especially failures to explain) by both sides is due to the decline in the quantity of POLADS from experienced people who had networks of knowledge not afraid to challenge ideas to the modern day where POLADS have a uni degree and maybe a couple of years doing admin support in a pollies office where saying no isn't career enhancing.

As an example, a friend ran into a POLAD (24 year old Director equivalent) who excitedly told them about an idea to improve conditions in remote communities. They quickly called in the indigenous LO and found to their horror:
1) This conversation was the extent of the engagement with the relevant organisation
2) There was no indigenous engagement even with LOs within 50 metres.
3) It sounded good but there was no depth to the proposal just a sound bite.
4) The idea actually was either illegal or would require declaration of a national emergency.
5) If it hadn't been for this accidental meeting, the minister was going to announce it at a international meeting two days later cause the POLAD said it was a great idea and had written talking points.

Voice might have helped (especially if LOs are transferred to work for the voice rather than the department which will also save money and avoid duplication) but not sure as it didn't require legislative change and the current LOs are ignored so the POLAD might have just pushed it through anyway because of the timeline for the conference.

On SM-A125F using BigFooty.com mobile app
 

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Rob R said:
I wonder how much of this and other government failures (especially failures to explain) by both sides is due to the decline in the quantity of POLADS from experienced people who had networks of knowledge not afraid to challenge ideas to the modern day where POLADS have a uni degree and maybe a couple of years doing admin support in a pollies office where saying no isn't career enhancing.

As an example, a friend ran into a POLAD (24 year old Director equivalent) who excitedly told them about an idea to improve conditions in remote communities. They quickly called in the indigenous LO and found to their horror:
1) This conversation was the extent of the engagement with the relevant organisation
2) There was no indigenous engagement even with LOs within 50 metres.
3) It sounded good but there was no depth to the proposal just a sound bite.
4) The idea actually was either illegal or would require declaration of a national emergency.
5) If it hadn't been for this accidental meeting, the minister was going to announce it at a international meeting two days later cause the POLAD said it was a great idea and had written talking points.

Voice might have helped (especially if LOs are transferred to work for the voice rather than the department which will also save money and avoid duplication) but not sure as it didn't require legislative change and the current LOs are ignored so the POLAD might have just pushed it through anyway because of the timeline for the conference.

On SM-A125F using BigFooty.com mobile app
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There is no meaningful policy debate or otherwise about anything in Australia. We are at a point where it is ok to punch down on the disadvantaged endlessly (Robodebt, housing crisis, the gap) but everyone turns a blind eye when eye watering amounts of money are simply handed over to big business.

This is not the role of government and why the $2.7 billion Qantas handouts are a complete disgrace.

We have huge ongoing social problems in this country and it is politically impossible to resolve them due to the media and political landscape.

Meanwhile corporate Australia can make off like bandits with eye watering subsidies and handouts and no one bats an eyelid.

All political discourse in Australia has been dumbed down to a binary choice of which side of the culture wars you stand on.

And the whole time PAYE tax payers do all the heavy lifting with government revenue raising and the government in turn gives all their money away to corporates with the little to no benefit to tax payers at all. Both sides of politics are guilty and we are all ok with it.

It is maddening.
 
QuietB said:
There is no meaningful policy debate or otherwise about anything in Australia. We are at a point where it is ok to punch down on the disadvantaged endlessly (Robodebt, housing crisis, the gap) but everyone turns a blind eye when eye watering amounts of money are simply handed over to big business.

This is not the role of government and why the $2.7 billion Qantas handouts are a complete disgrace.

We have huge ongoing social problems in this country and it is politically impossible to resolve them due to the media and political landscape.

Meanwhile corporate Australia can make off like bandits with eye watering subsidies and handouts and no one bats an eyelid.

All political discourse in Australia has been dumbed down to a binary choice of which side of the culture wars you stand on.

And the whole time PAYE tax payers do all the heavy lifting with government revenue raising and the government in turn gives all their money away to corporates with the little to no benefit to tax payers at all. Both sides of politics are guilty and we are all ok with it.

It is maddening.
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Absolutely true. Every word.
 
I'm glad we all worked hard so we could donate $2.7 BILLION to Qantas

Just enough to keep the Chairman's Lounge running for judges & politicians. Also to help give Joyce a decent payout

No wonder the ATO wants to crack down on the average Australian with their WFH tax returns.
 
Ghost Patrol said:
No, you aren't forced to use Qantas. I'd prefer if they were nationalised.
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You think a government run airline would provide a better or cheaper service?

The problem is that they privatised the airports. That's the main barrier to domestic competition - both Qantas and Virgin have tied up the major airports and the barriers to entry for a new airline are too high.
 
Rob said:
You think a government run airline would provide a better or cheaper service?

The problem is that they privatised the airports. That's the main barrier to domestic competition - both Qantas and Virgin have tied up the major airports and the barriers to entry for a new airline are too high.
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Isn't Qatar a government owned/run airline?

Apparently they can lower prices.

Why should we prop up Qantas when things are bad, but have no stake in it for when things are good?
 

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Ghost Patrol said:
Isn't Qatar a government owned/run airline?

Apparently they can lower prices.

Why should we prop up Qantas when things are bad, but have no stake for when things are good?
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You think Qantas has the same costs as Qatar? What do you think a baggage handler or cleaner at Doha airport gets paid?

I'm not arguing for propping Qantas up BTW.
 
Ghost Patrol said:
They use our baggage handlers at this end. Don't we use theirs at their end?
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Qantas doesn't fly to Qatar. Or many other international destinations.

I'm guessing you don't remember what it used to cost to fly. What happened to Ansett was a genuine circuit breaker for the whole industry, but it's gone backwards since covid.
 
Rob said:
Qantas doesn't fly to Qatar. Or many other international destinations.

I'm guessing you don't remember what it used to cost to fly. What happened to Ansett was a genuine circuit breaker for the whole industry, but it's gone backwards since covid.
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I'm happy for there to be less air travel. As such, it would and should cost more.

I think flying somewhere for a glorified picnic on the beach (for example) is a waste of resources, and bad for the environment.
 

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