Revolt.

[anchor man]

With the AFL holding the whip hand over fixturing and all other things football, where does it leave clubs like those not run run by the AFL
How do the two Aussie rules states get their voices hear amid all the clamour of assisting the non viable VFL clubs! How do they boost their stock with the franchise clubs belled the draft wirh extra selections, and this applies also to some VFL clubs.
The two WA clubs ar every hard done by by the AFL. ALways ahve been always will be.The test of travel has never ever been taken into account by the AFL since the Eagles became part of the VFL.
How can the two Aussie rules states get their concerns heard on a decent level when it appears everythingis run by Victorains for VFL clubs.
How can the these two clubs, along side the SA clubs get to tell the AFL that there are too many VFL still sucking on the teat of the AFL.
How can they tell the AFL that these clubs, and there are many still on the teat, that they are bleeding money from the out of Victortia clubs to the unfinancial VFL clubs.
From memory, clubs like the Lions and Swans have fed off the AFL for a long time. Maybe secure now, but still fed from them. Th Eagles only assistance came from the State Government whey they ran into financial trouble; They have never asked for assistance from the AFL.
Fremantle have been in the red, but managaed to fight their own way out of the trouble. Never a whisper of help from the AFL.
The Giants and Suns will be feeding off the AFL money wise and talent wise for many years.And we know that the Tassie team will deplete an already depleted pool of football talent.
How, with all this happening, allow the AFL to compensate the four clubs not tied to the apron strings of the AFL.
Remember the AFL promised that they would compensate the Dockers for the tough Gather Round they dealt to us. We have heard nothing as to what crumb they may throw our way.
How do we as supporters and members of these clubs demand a voice to the AFL for an equal chance at success in the competition.
I am not being an oh woe is me about this, I just want a fairer and more equal competition for all.

 

[mightymouse75]

With the AFL holding the whip hand over fixturing and all other things football, where does it leave clubs like those not run run by the AFL
How do the two Aussie rules states get their voices hear amid all the clamour of assisting the non viable VFL clubs! How do they boost their stock with the franchise clubs belled the draft wirh extra selections, and this applies also to some VFL clubs.
The two WA clubs ar every hard done by by the AFL. ALways ahve been always will be.The test of travel has never ever been taken into account by the AFL since the Eagles became part of the VFL.
How can the two Aussie rules states get their concerns heard on a decent level when it appears everythingis run by Victorains for VFL clubs.
How can the these two clubs, along side the SA clubs get to tell the AFL that there are too many VFL still sucking on the teat of the AFL.
How can they tell the AFL that these clubs, and there are many still on the teat, that they are bleeding money from the out of Victortia clubs to the unfinancial VFL clubs.
From memory, clubs like the Lions and Swans have fed off the AFL for a long time. Maybe secure now, but still fed from them. Th Eagles only assistance came from the State Government whey they ran into financial trouble; They have never asked for assistance from the AFL.
Fremantle have been in the red, but managaed to fight their own way out of the trouble. Never a whisper of help from the AFL.
The Giants and Suns will be feeding off the AFL money wise and talent wise for many years.And we know that the Tassie team will deplete an already depleted pool of football talent.
How, with all this happening, allow the AFL to compensate the four clubs not tied to the apron strings of the AFL.
Remember the AFL promised that they would compensate the Dockers for the tough Gather Round they dealt to us. We have heard nothing as to what crumb they may throw our way.
How do we as supporters and members of these clubs demand a voice to the AFL for an equal chance at success in the competition.
I am not being an oh woe is me about this, I just want a fairer and more equal competition for all.

Will never happen.
If all the clubs presidents voted tomorrow, 10 Victoria to 8 rest of the world.
It's a loss every day of the week.
Short of spotting the dummy and not playing a game which we would be demonized and punished for.
We are farked.

The eagles really embraced the us vs them and thrived on that siege mentality..
Now with the modern professionalism of all afl clubs, those little things like recovery and travel can make all the difference in a season.
Richmond, Collingwood , Melbourne, Hawthorne have dominated in recent years.

Probably a good reason for that.

 

[anchor man]

Will never happen.
If all the clubs presidents voted tomorrow, 10 Victoria to 8 rest of the world.
It's a loss every day of the week.
Short of spotting the dummy and not playing a game which we would be demonized and punished for.
We are farked.

The eagles really embraced the us vs them and thrived on that siege mentality..
Now with the modern professionalism of all afl clubs, those little things like recovery and travel can make all the difference in a season.
Richmond, Collingwood , Melbourne, Hawthorne have dominated in recent years.

Probably a good reason for that.

The latter part of your reply is exactly the things that have to be sorted.It is unfair, and the funny thing is, the clubs them selves say it is. But they add, it is what it is.With a smirk on their face.Like they all everyone of the acknowledge there are too many VFL clubs. Yes they should remove some, as long as it is not my club.
There is only one way to find out how far clubs can go and that is for the out of Victorian clubs to take a stance.How, I do not know.But as we all know the two WA clubs are the ones who suffer the most.I think I read where Fremantle in the last set of games from round 16, travel 30,000 kms.
I have no idea what the answer is, but until the non Victorian clubs band together and have a crack, we will never get change.

 

[errant bounce]

Fremantle (and the Eagles) basically subsidise junior and grassroots footy across the state.

Like no other, really.

Should just be proud of that.

It's hard to wrangle the fixture, i saw a post on the main forum about the SA teams forgoing their extra (Gather Round) home match for a relatively mild flight to host the Suns each in the NT. Suns get 11 home matches and so too do the Crows and Port.

Issue is Freo have tried stuff like back to back games in SA but not sure how keen players are on spending a week in Adelaide. probably isn't even an advantage. I don't think we've ever gotten back to back wins from it. if anything they'd probably rather a week in Melbourne with back to back Victorian games and then allow the WA sides to bank up three home matches each around the Derby.

Also feel like the AFL drop the ball a bit on fixturing around the byes, you'd think Gold Coast/Brisbane would always play here and we'd always play over there either side of a bye. when Tasmania come in you'd seriously hope Freo always play them in rounds 11/12 or 13/14.

 

[dockshark]

So anchor man you’re saying that there’s something you feel passionately about, and you would like to mobilise some likeminded people to communicate with the leadership of the organisation responsible for that. I fully support what you are trying to achieve and fully support your right to express this view.

 

[errant bounce]

So anchor man you’re saying that there’s something you feel passionately about, and you would like to mobilise some likeminded people to communicate with the leadership of the organisation responsible for that. I fully support what you are trying to achieve and fully support your right to express this view.

Reminds me of people who whinge about protestors because they got to work 40 minutes late and then moan about mortgage rate increases or something.

'It's only okay if I believe in it!'

 

[dockshark]

Reminds me of people who whinge about protestors because they got to work 40 minutes late and then moan about mortgage rate increases or something.

'It's only okay if I believe in it!'

Hey some people are full of P&W…All bluff and bluster. Not anchor man though, he’s legit.

And in case you wonder, P&W stands for piss and wind.

 

[anchor man]

Reminds me of people who whinge about protestors because they got to work 40 minutes late and then moan about mortgage rate increases or something.

'It's only okay if I believe in it!'

Believe me, I have written to the club many times over various issues confronting the club. If it hurts me I try to ease the pain.
Marched with the masses early when they wanted to move us From Freo.
Spoken many times at members only meetings. Talked over issues with people running the club.
Nah, not a piss and wind person.

 

[King Huskii]

I thought we were going to make another play at Jack Rewoldt

 

[MadMundy]

I agree that we should say something about continuing to get screwed over in the fixtures but the most likely scenario is the media and AFL laughing at us and calling as "Whingers" and to just suck it up, no matter how much revolting we do it won't make a difference.

 

[mightymouse75]

Round ****ing 0.
Why wouldn't you get the west Australian to start the stupid wank round 0. Then space us out until the bye so we have minimum 7 day breaks.
**** I hate the afl

 

[errant bounce]

Round ******* 0.
Why wouldn't you get the west Australian to start the stupid wank round 0. Then space us out until the bye so we have minimum 7 day breaks.
heck I hate the afl

Because it's an established market and they know Freo games'll get 35,000 guaranteed regardless of how shit the team is. the club's in no financial strife either so why would they put effort into it?

And the reality is, if this happened, it'd be six weeks of Sunday games and people would complain about that, too.

There's genuinely no way to help the club out that much, it's hamstrung by the timezone and its geography. as well as its comfortable off-field position.

I hate the AFL but I don't think they're intentionally bullying or ignoring the FFC. just what can you do?

It's also a bit overrated and just a nice comfy excuse. Essendon and Carlton play, what, 15 games a season in Melbourne? at least. at least half of those at the MCG. they never have to go to Tasmania, Canberra, the Territory and rarely even down to Kardinia Park. without even going into their influence at AFL House, strong assets and finances, and powerful(/disruptive) backers then it just shows how overrated fixturing problems are. those clubs have done nothing between them for just about 25 years.

 

[GingerDocker]

I don't follow the fixtures debate too closely, all I know is the AFL prioritises revenue above all else.

But, if you read other team boards, almost to a tee, there are complaints about the draw. It's the same with umpiring, everyone thinks it's a conspiracy against them, and no one else.

 

[dockshark]

I don't follow the fixtures debate too closely, all I know is the AFL prioritises revenue above all else

Yes this is where it's at. The footy purist fans want fairness and parity in the season, draw, venues etc and that is an entirely reasonable thing to want. The reality is that the AFL is a billion dollar plus business and their primary objective is maximisng TV audiences and crowds to keep the commercial machine turning.

 

[Tonga Bob]

Apparently Andrew Dillon was at some luncheon event at Crown the day before the Derby earlier this season. Does anyone know what was talked about there, and whether he gave any indication of things the AFL are considering for the WA teams? I'm assuming he just blew smoke up our proverbial, but keen to know if there was anything more.

 

[DragoDelph]

Apparently Andrew Dillon was at some luncheon event at Crown the day before the Derby earlier this season. Does anyone know what was talked about there, and whether he gave any indication of things the AFL are considering for the WA teams? I'm assuming he just blew smoke up our proverbial, but keen to know if there was anything more.

Daniels was the host, surprised there hasn't been some print from it.

 

[Tonga Bob]

Daniels was the host, surprised there hasn't been some print from it.

Might hit him up. Cheers mate

 

[anchor man]

Because it's an established market and they know Freo games'll get 35,000 guaranteed regardless of how s**t the team is. the club's in no financial strife either so why would they put effort into it?

And the reality is, if this happened, it'd be six weeks of Sunday games and people would complain about that, too.

There's genuinely no way to help the club out that much, it's hamstrung by the timezone and its geography. as well as its comfortable off-field position.

I hate the AFL but I don't think they're intentionally bullying or ignoring the FFC. just what can you do?

It's also a bit overrated and just a nice comfy excuse. Essendon and Carlton play, what, 15 games a season in Melbourne? at least. at least half of those at the MCG. they never have to go to Tasmania, Canberra, the Territory and rarely even down to Kardinia Park. without even going into their influence at AFL House, strong assets and finances, and powerful(/disruptive) backers then it just shows how overrated fixturing problems are. those clubs have done nothing between them for just about 25 years.

It is not just Fremantle, but the Eagles as well, and other clubs outside Melbourne.
The strangle hold by the AFLis strictly leaning toward the VFL clybs. They care not about clubs they don't control. So many clubz from the VFL are still feeding off the AFL. Money that the other clubs miss out on.
And not only WA AGL vlubs but second tier competitions like the WAFL.

 

[errant bounce]

It is not just Fremantle, but the Eagles as well, and other clubs outside Melbourne.
The strangle hold by the AFLis strictly leaning toward the VFL clybs. They care not about clubs they don't control. So many clubz from the VFL are still feeding off the AFL. Money that the other clubs miss out on.
And not only WA AGL vlubs but second tier competitions like the WAFL.

The AFL control every club except the WA ones.

Part of the Crows initial mandate was to be operated and representative of the SANFL but they're now AFL run. Port too. it's why they're so easily leaving the SANFL competition and going to the AFL reserves.

The Melbourne clubs have better contacts and more to leverage, but they're far more independently operated just in terms of the boards and their members.

GWS, Brisbane, and Gold Coast are all just about run top-to-bottom by the AFL, the Swans to an extent as well. those other clubs outside of Melbourne get extreme help from the AFL because they're just outlets for the AFL to exist in those areas.

This idea that North and St Kilda are hoarding money from non-Victorian clubs is patently untrue and just paranoid.

The Crows are in the top five richest and most financially reliable clubs in the competition; Port get hand outs and hand outs and got ten times their current amount back in 2012ish when they were borderline folding; Gold Coast and GWS make zero money; the Brisbane Lions and Sydney Swans have been in the comp for 25 and 40 years and have won far more than the Freo ever have and yet still get millions every year.

I've said it before and it's not just something I make up. if you want to look at the publicly listed breakdown of club allowances, you'll see every single entity gets about 10 million a year in raw cash from the AFL. that bloats out to an insane 25 million for the two newest teams. that is without the Suns and Giants' crowds essentially consisting of free tickets – ostensibly paid for by the AFL.

If you want to have an independent competition where clubs who can afford it on their own, then you'd have the Eagles, the Crows, Collingwood, Richmond, Carlton,

then about six teams could independently operate in a breakaway league: the Eagles, the Crows, Collingwood, Carlton, Richmond, and Geelong. Hawks and Dons would come close, Freo and Melbourne could probably do it for a few years but not many more than that.

I just don't get your argument. I don't know what you're advocating for.

 

[errant bounce]

Yes this is where it's at. The footy purist fans want fairness and parity in the season, draw, venues etc and that is an entirely reasonable thing to want. The reality is that the AFL is a billion dollar plus business and their primary objective is maximisng TV audiences and crowds to keep the commercial machine turning.

It's a balancing act and I don't say this to defend the AFL, because they're all ****in grubs, but if you're giving all teams equal airtime then you're going to end up with massive blockbusters being behind a paywall and exposure going to a Port - Suns shitfest in front of 28,000 on a Friday night.

We don't have the geography of soccer nor the population and economics of the United States and so have issues related to fairness and income.

The AFL is absolutely massive. some of the biggest crowds in the world. the appetite is growing, too. huge entity. but it could very quickly become a shitty half-amateur little thing very very quickly. it's a quirk and kink of the comp and the game here. I don't know the solution. some things just don't have one.

The AFL were unintentionally the smartest people in the room when they decided to pay a few hundred million for Marvel riiiiight before covid kicked off. they were able to leverage that asset to get all the loans they needed to keep the comp going throughout covid. considering the lack of housing in those five years since, they could make billions off the land at Marvel.

The comp could have been really, really ****ed if they didn't do that.

 

[anchor man]

It's a balancing act and I don't say this to defend the AFL, because they're all heckin grubs, but if you're giving all teams equal airtime then you're going to end up with massive blockbusters being behind a paywall and exposure going to a Port - Suns shitfest in front of 28,000 on a Friday night.

We don't have the geography of soccer nor the population and economics of the United States and so have issues related to fairness and income.

The AFL is absolutely massive. some of the biggest crowds in the world. the appetite is growing, too. huge entity. but it could very quickly become a shitty half-amateur little thing very very quickly. it's a quirk and kink of the comp and the game here. I don't know the solution. some things just don't have one.

The AFL were unintentionally the smartest people in the room when they decided to pay a few hundred million for Marvel riiiiight before covid kicked off. they were able to leverage that asset to get all the loans they needed to keep the comp going throughout covid. considering the lack of housing in those five years since, they could make billions off the land at Marvel.

The comp could have been really, really ****ed if they didn't do that.

The competition was as you say F****d before the EAgles went into the VFL.
Your previous comment reagring everyone getting a fair share is in your opinion correct
How come Melbourne FC was aided by the AFL with appointing an administrater and coach all paid for by the AFL. This because the competition could not run without a competitive MFC>
The Westen Bulldogs was assisted by the AFL whn they won their premiership.
The Kangaroos are a basket case, monetary wise and player wise. They survive on hand outs from the AFL. The Siants are assisted by extra moneys from the AFL.
It is not only the fixture is lopsided but the monetary hand out.
The less financial VFL clubs are assisted by the AFL.

 

[Purple Suit]

It's a balancing act and I don't say this to defend the AFL, because they're all heckin grubs, but if you're giving all teams equal airtime then you're going to end up with massive blockbusters being behind a paywall and exposure going to a Port - Suns shitfest in front of 28,000 on a Friday night.

We don't have the geography of soccer nor the population and economics of the United States and so have issues related to fairness and income.

The AFL is absolutely massive. some of the biggest crowds in the world. the appetite is growing, too. huge entity. but it could very quickly become a shitty half-amateur little thing very very quickly. it's a quirk and kink of the comp and the game here. I don't know the solution. some things just don't have one.

The AFL were unintentionally the smartest people in the room when they decided to pay a few hundred million for Marvel riiiiight before covid kicked off. they were able to leverage that asset to get all the loans they needed to keep the comp going throughout covid. considering the lack of housing in those five years since, they could make billions off the land at Marvel.

The comp could have been really, really ****ed if they didn't do that.

It doesn't really matter. If the AFL died due to covid, they just wipe the floor and start a new competition with a fraction of the debt the AFL would have had. The void would be backed in by Federal & State governments and the teams could survive while the entity that is the AFL is put down. It might have even started up with a more balanced and fair competition rather than Frankenstein's Unequitable Monster that we have ended up with.

The game is bigger than the administrators, although they seem to have forgotten that along the way.

 

[DragoDelph]

What we should be advocating for is a government backed custodianship of the game (which the AFL is meant to be)

Separate the corporation that is the AFL from those that are there to look after the game. Make sure more of their profits are going to grassroots, Equal voice for each state, streamlined rules and history. (And not politicians)

Then the AFL actually have to answer to someone when they try to cover things up. National policies on D&A, bullying etc.

 

[errant bounce]

The competition was as you say F****d before the EAgles went into the VFL.
Your previous comment reagring everyone getting a fair share is in your opinion correct
How come Melbourne FC was aided by the AFL with appointing an administrater and coach all paid for by the AFL. This because the competition could not run without a competitive MFC>
The Westen Bulldogs was assisted by the AFL whn they won their premiership.
The Kangaroos are a basket case, monetary wise and player wise. They survive on hand outs from the AFL. The Siants are assisted by extra moneys from the AFL.
It is not only the fixture is lopsided but the monetary hand out.
The less financial VFL clubs are assisted by the AFL.

All coaches are essentially paid by the AFL though. like the players to the umpires are.

Gold Coast are basically an AFL operation. they've had what, three dud coaches. it's no insurance of anything.

The AFL could exist with an uncompetitive Melbourne just as it is with an uncompetitive North Melbourne. the issue is it was getting to such a serious state that they needed to step in and get them competitive. isn't that a good thing? they've won a premiership but they have barely been dominant.

Those clubs do receive lot more handouts than big Victorian clubs and the Eagles and Crows but so too do the northern clubs, which you seem to support and want in the comp. if North Melbourne, Melbourne, St Kilda, the Western Bulldogs are deemed 'unfinancial' than so too go the Suns, Lions, Giants, and probably Sydney Swans and Port and potentially Fremantle after a while.

You're looking at a 10-12 club competition. Tasmania absolutely won't come in, either.

The handouts exist purely on how clubs are faring financially. if Freo lost 20,000 members and crowds dipped to just as many, the AFL would help us out. there's not some giant conspiracy about the club. AFL need two WA clubs and there's no way they're dropping Freo, either for an Eagles monopoly or a new franchise.

It doesn't really matter. If the AFL died due to covid, they just wipe the floor and start a new competition with a fraction of the debt the AFL would have had. The void would be backed in by Federal & State governments and the teams could survive while the entity that is the AFL is put down. It might have even started up with a more balanced and fair competition rather than Frankenstein's Unequitable Monster that we have ended up with.

The game is bigger than the administrators, although they seem to have forgotten that along the way.

Fair call, and interesting point, but I doubt the Federal Government would be able to get away with floating the mammoth amounts of money involved in junior football, country and suburban, state, and the senior game. it would cost billions to start up.

 

[Freomaniac]

Will never happen.
If all the clubs presidents voted tomorrow, 10 Victoria to 8 rest of the world.
It's a loss every day of the week.
Short of spotting the dummy and not playing a game which we would be demonized and punished for.
We are farked.

The eagles really embraced the us vs them and thrived on that siege mentality..
Now with the modern professionalism of all afl clubs, those little things like recovery and travel can make all the difference in a season.
Richmond, Collingwood , Melbourne, Hawthorne have dominated in recent years.

Probably a good reason for that.

That's why no other Victorian sides were merged or relocated after 1996.

Tassie comes in, that makes it 9 then another non Vic side makes it 10 non Vic sides in a 20 team comp