Preview Round 11 - Hawthorn v Brisbane 1.10pm Sunday -Marvel

[ZoBlitz]

Gameday thread is up.

 

[dlanod]

Fort almost certainly comes in doesn’t he? We won’t risk O or Joe going down and either having no talk forward or Joe rucking the entire game

The problem with Fort coming in is that when he's resting up forward he's a simple option for Sicily to "defend" and drop off, because it's highly unlikely Fort is either going to make him pay or keep up with him enough to keep him honest.

 

[Elixuh]

 

[Elixuh]

The problem with Fort coming in is that when he's resting up forward he's a simple option for Sicily to "defend" and drop off, because it's highly unlikely Fort is either going to make him pay or keep up with him enough to keep him honest.

Do you just limit the time he spends up forward (eg he could be backup ruck, bench and back half cover and O could play primary ruck and forward) or make him sub?

 

[Darren Downunder]

Fort almost certainly comes in doesn’t he? We won’t risk O or Joe going down and either having no talk forward or Joe rucking the entire game

I expect Fagan to do this, but I wish he wouldn’t. I really don’t rate Fort. I think he’ll be a liability replacing Hipwood. The only thing he has in common with Hipwood is his height. He lacks mobility, Argo, tackling pressure, forward craft.

The argument that we don’t want to risk Joe in the ruck all game if Oscar goes down is fallacious. We’ve been in that position all year. If Oscar goes down, we never put Hippy in the ruck. Hipwood is a forward. If he’s out, he should be replaced by a forward. Not a reserve Ruckman.

 

[McIvor]

Hopefully he'd learn the importance of being able to defend and stick tackles as a crucial foundation of a successful team. Until he learns that and is able to apply that learning, he is a liability at senior level, sets a poor example to the younger players (of which there are now several more than there were only a month ago), and as such he can ply his trade at the lower level for the time being.

The trait that has crept into Zacs game that I only started noticing late last season and continued before his injury were these , I thought, pathetic soccer off the ground because he didn’t want to physically get in and pick the ball up even if it meant wearing a solid bump or two. There were quite a few of these instances that aesthetically looked weak and were ultimately detrimental to the team. I hope the coaches sat down with him over this break and reinforced our standards and what is expected because Zac has fallen well below it in recent times. I’m with you on this Grasshopper

 

[Paul Mac]

Does anyone know if there is a bay on level 1 you can sit in as GA members at Marvel?

Sorry but all general admission is on top level. If you are a member you can always pick the right person standing in the aisles to check tickets and just show them your membership and say you are in the cheer squad. You can always tell by the colour of the coats who the newbies are who dont know much about the process. We had done that for many years but cant be bothered now so we just take a stroll up to the top level.

 

[BuntonRules]

Cal AhChee. Sicily is your job. Just beat him.

Fort or Ryan makes us too top heavy, IMO. A smaller, mobile forward line that plays the whole length of the ground is a far better bet. Time for Logan to play a bit taller.

That said, I would have Fort as sub. Insurance, and a chopout for Oscar who will have a lot of work in the first 3/4 with a bit of resting up forward.

Bruce or Baily for the last spot. Reckon Fages will go with Bailey.

 

[Sherrinator]

Looking at Hawthorn’s backline, they aren’t very tall. You’ve got 2024 debutant Philips as a genuine tall but then Frost is 194 and the next guy is 190. Feel like we should be playing Rayner as a CHF and make sure Bailey understands that his job is to be at the front of every pack.

 

[Jivlain]

Fort almost certainly comes in doesn’t he? We won’t risk O or Joe going down and either having no talk forward or Joe rucking the entire game

Not a bad time to use him as a sub, honestly

 

[vic_LION]

Not a bad time to use him as a sub, honestly

Unless a small, fast player like Sharp was to get injured though. I guess one of the benefits of more younger guys in the squad is we’re already a bit more balanced there

 

[Viceregal]

How do we fit Bailey into our 23 right now? Hard to drop any of the 3 debutants in my opinion.

If it were up to me, I'd be giving McKenna a run in the VFL (his 2nd half v Richmond was better but fair dinkum it wanted to be), moving Rayner back into his position, and playing Bailey in Rayner's role up forward.

But if Bailey isn't right to go anyway I'm simply going Ryan in for Hipwood. Ryan probably needs to play closer to goal while Joe and Logan get up the ground a bit.

Would be nice to give Brain a full game... Hasn't been able to play any VFL the last 2 weeks so he's legit only played 2 quarters in 2 weeks. But again I'm not sure who you make sub. McKenna I guess, but I doubt Fages would do that. Noah "whipping boy" Answerth probably

Normally new/young players legitimately need a rest after their first few AFL level games ... maybe one of them will need the break when Zac is ready.

I would prefer to see him prove he is ready in the two's but I am ok with him having the opportunity to show he is ready in the ones as long as they are ready to put him down if he is providing less to the team than others ... depends on whether him being on field is a net gain in squad synergy and effectiveness of a net loss.

Time will tell I suppose.

Zac in for Rayner would make for some interesting selection night commentary

 

[Grasshopper17]

That’s a good one; Zac Bailey is a liability

As if every other club wouldn’t be keen on picking him

Top 5 in our team for tackles and pressure acts in the grand final as well

I've had a bit of a think about this.

Zac Bailey's last game was against Melbourne at the MCG.

That night the whole team's attitude and defensive intent was outstanding, and Zac was not a notable exception in that regard so his must have been at least adequate in that game.

So on his most recent form I'm willing to admit I've perhaps been a little harsh on him.

That said, I'm struggling to find anyone who deserves to come out of the side for him.

I mean I'd almost say Bailey for Hipwood as a straight swap but I think this puts a great deal of undue pressure on Logan Morris playing game number 4, particulary when Daniher goes into the ruck.

If it were up to me I'd drop McKenna, shift Rayner to half back, and Bailey takes Rayner's forward line spot. Not that this will happen of course

 

[Grasshopper17]

Unfortunately, defensive application is not our biggest problem right now - it is getting our spluttering forward line going again.

The two go hand in hand. Indeed, I've highlighted defensive application as what I believe is one of the 4 key pillars of scoring in the modern game.

Even the flashy Kai Lohmann has made a point of emphasising this in every single interview he's given of late. SENQ Brekky last week, his press conference this morning, AFL 360 tonight. It's being absolutely drummed into him and it's making him a much more well rounded player, and that in turn is having a positive impact on the scoreboard.

 

[Grasshopper17]

The problem with Fort coming in is that when he's resting up forward he's a simple option for Sicily to "defend" and drop off, because it's highly unlikely Fort is either going to make him pay or keep up with him enough to keep him honest.

I think it's going to be a problem either way. He's a versatile player, able to play on blokes of most sizes.

That's why I'd deliberately send someone to him in a defensive capacity. Ah Chee or even Lohmann, both of whom have displayed the right attitude, skills and temperament for the role.

 

[Jivlain]

Unless a small, fast player like Sharp was to get injured though. I guess one of the benefits of more younger guys in the squad is we’re already a bit more balanced there

Theory being that you add in an extra small from the start of the game, then can sub him in if one of the limited number of talls gets injured or if we're having an issue with height generally. And no worse off if a small is injured because we started with an extra.

 

[SizeMatters]

Wouldn't be opposed to having Big O play FF and Fort as the main ruck. Big O would at least force opposition to contain him due to his size and aggression alone whereas Fort is just a bit weak. Would help Joe and Logan a lot having a big dog presence up forward.

 

[rye]

Wouldn't be opposed to having Big O play FF and Fort as the main ruck. Big O would at least force opposition to contain him due to his size and aggression alone whereas Fort is just a bit weak. Would help Joe and Logan a lot having a big dog presence up forward.

thats just asking to get smacked in the midfield, meek is a physical ruckman who is playing really well and fort got bullied by an out of form kieren briggs in his last match

 

[briztoon]

I've had a bit of a think about this.

Zac Bailey's last game was against Melbourne at the MCG.

That night the whole team's attitude and defensive intent was outstanding, and Zac was not a notable exception in that regard so his must have been at least adequate in that game.

So on his most recent form I'm willing to admit I've perhaps been a little harsh on him.

That said, I'm struggling to find anyone who deserves to come out of the side for him.

I mean I'd almost say Bailey for Hipwood as a straight swap but I think this puts a great deal of undue pressure on Logan Morris playing game number 4, particulary when Daniher goes into the ruck.

If it were up to me I'd drop McKenna, shift Rayner to half back, and Bailey takes Rayner's forward line spot. Not that this will happen of course

So who is taking Hipwoods spot?

 

[Grasshopper17]

So who is taking Hipwoods spot?

Your knee's just come good hasn't it?

 

[janty]

We better show up with the right attitude. The way the Hawks can play they can blow us out of the water early.

 

[LongLion]

Looking at Hawthorn’s backline, they aren’t very tall. You’ve got 2024 debutant Philips as a genuine tall but then Frost is 194 and the next guy is 190. Feel like we should be playing Rayner as a CHF and make sure Bailey understands that his job is to be at the front of every pack.

He'll get in the way of Lohman as that is a standout in his game.

 

[MSB ROYS]

Should win this game but logic goes out the window playing Hawthorn.

 

[MSB ROYS]

He'll get in the way of Lohman as that is a standout in his game.

One of Lohman's goals: ran straight to the front of the pack, ball spills straight to him and goal. He can take instructions.

Also, no use waiting for the ball out the back as that's Charlie's space.

 

[Nunez]

He'll get in the way of Lohman as that is a standout in his game.

Bailey Daniher Ah Chee
Cameron Rayner Lohmann

If pressure is on the ball carrier and we can't lower eyes, they'll be challenged. Get the ball into the F50 direct or on the ground and this fleet will absolutely carve up the Hawks backline. Have watched them closely - including that time Elixuh outed me as a Hawks supporter at the Suns game - and if there is one area their backs struggle is when the ball hits the deck.

 

[dlanod]

I think it's going to be a problem either way. He's a versatile player, able to play on blokes of most sizes.

That's why I'd deliberately send someone to him in a defensive capacity. Ah Chee or even Lohmann, both of whom have displayed the right attitude, skills and temperament for the role.

If he's on a Daniher or a Hipwood, even a Charlie or McCarthy, it's a lot harder for Sicily to intercept because he has to respect their leads.

If he's on a defensive small, like you say, they can impact his defensive work.

But someone like Fort - well they're not leading really, so he doesn't have to follow them away from the contest. They also don't do much to prevent his intercepting. Worst of both worlds.