Suburban Grounds

[Jim Prideaux]

Having read through the surprisingly polite main board debate that is "How can we improve atmospheres in the AFL", I noticed a few posters bring up using the old suburban grounds. It's not the first time I've seen this be mentioned as a way of "fixing" issues in the league, particularly those involving crowd numbers.

Until recently, I was very much in favour of this. However, having recently been to watch a AFLW double header at Ikon park, and a Hawthorn JLT game at Arden St, I'm not so sure it would work.

To put it lightly, the facilities at both grounds are light years away from being appropriate for regular season AFL games. I was particularly surprised at how badly Ikon park had deteriorated - everything from the lights being to dim, to the seats (where they hadn't been ripped out) being in awful condition. That under-stadia concourse looked like a back alley in Whitechapel that the ripper might be found in. I still enjoyed two sunny summer afternoons there. But, in the middle of winter in Melbourne, at $40 or thereabouts a ticket, with a full house in - it would be a disaster.

The other issue that reared its head during the AFLW's opening match was the lack of parking. The population in Melbourne has skyrocketed since league games were last played at these grounds, the density of housing has increased around these grounds too, meaning that even if the same amount of spaces were still available, they are now inadequate.

A bit of a long winded way of asking, does anyone think that old suburban grounds are an option? I did until recently, and now I have serious doubts. Without 100's of millions of dollars being spent on one of these grounds, I just can't see it.

 

[Kram]

Well no shit, playing proper games back at these grounds is a pipedream. People need to move on and let it go.

 

[Jim Prideaux]

Well no shit, playing proper games back at these grounds is a pipedream. People need to move on and let it go.

I'm with you. I think that many people need to get down to these grounds during one of the pre-season games to see just how far away they are from being ready.

 

[JayJ20]

Pretty easy answer is that it won't happen. Maybe Carlton with Ikon Park might happen for a couple of games in the near future, but other than that, too much deals with the MCG, Etihad, TV rights etc. Since becoming a nationalised competition, the suburban aspect of the Melbourne teams don't really matter.

It would be pretty cool if we had like a heritage round in the preseason or even the actual season where teams play at their original home wearing their heritage guernsey.

 

[Jim Prideaux]

Pretty easy answer is that it won't happen. Maybe Carlton with Ikon Park might happen for a couple of games in the near future, but other than that, too much deals with the MCG, Etihad, TV rights etc. Since becoming a nationalised competition, the suburban aspect of the Melbourne teams don't really matter.

It would be pretty cool if we had like a heritage round in the preseason or even the actual season where teams play at their original home wearing their heritage guernsey.

I'm all for the nostalgia, but in it's present state I cannot see a regular season game being played at Ikon - it is just no where near up to scratch.

 

[master bate]

No, you couldn't just start having games there for the same reason they stopped having games at suburban stadiums in the first place.

But with the right amount of redevelopment Princes Park could become a boutique 25,000-30,000 stadium. Then you get back to the issue that only Carlton would willingly play games there. No other club wants to move to Carlton's home ground, even if it would be a financially rewarding exercise.

North and Hawthorn have Tassie. Melbourne fans are happy with games at the G regardless of crowd, not so happy with NT. Dogs are trying Ballarat. Saints trying NZ. Selling off home games is a better result for smaller Vic teams than spending huge money on a boutique stadium.

Invest in keeping the suburban grounds safe and active for AFLW and work on a boutique stadium/stadia in the future.

 

[Kram]

I'm with you. I think that many people need to get down to these grounds during one of the pre-season games to see just how far away they are from being ready.

Yep paying full price to watch games at these venues the nostalgia value would wear off extremely quickly, even if they had money put into them to be 'done up' they would still be very substandard compared to Docklands and the MCG.

 

[FootyJunkie]

9 sides playing out of 2 stadia, lol

 

[Paratus78]

I'm genuinely a fan of traditions but playing games at the old grounds probably sounds better than it would actually be.

 

[HolyRioli]

Frankly there's not enough money in football for it to be a worthwhile option

 

[Jim Prideaux]

No, you couldn't just start having games there for the same reason they stopped having games at suburban stadiums in the first place.

But with the right amount of redevelopment Princes Park could become a boutique 25,000-30,000 stadium. Then you get back to the issue that only Carlton would willingly play games there. No other club wants to move to Carlton's home ground, even if it would be a financially rewarding exercise.

North and Hawthorn have Tassie. Melbourne fans are happy with games at the G regardless of crowd, not so happy with NT. Dogs are trying Ballarat. Saints trying NZ. Selling off home games is a better result for smaller Vic teams than spending huge money on a boutique stadium.

Invest in keeping the suburban grounds safe and active for AFLW and work on a boutique stadium/stadia in the future.

Agree with most of this, not sure about the PP option though. It would need to be a page one re-write, Public transport and parking would need significant upgrades. They're currently talking about reducing traffic on Sydney rd as it is. It would be easier to build a stand alone boutique stadium you'd think.

 

[telsor]

The only games they'd be viable for would be smaller clubs against some of the non vic sides.

Those same non vic sides that are clamoring for more games at the MCG.

 

[didaksrightfoot]

Im sure on SEN i heard them talking about Cricket Victoria building a smaller stadium (junction oval? - im not a victorian so dont know much about whats going... but apparently thats why they now cant play Shield cricket at the G from the start of march, which was part of the deal for the AFL to help fund a new stadium).

Surely if you wanted a boutique stadium you would just use that one and hire it from Cricket Victoria or the state gov. (Whoever becomes owner), or try to include it in any deal the AFL is making to support the stadium.

Unless the AFL suddenly decide to sell Etihad, its not like theres a big need for a 3rd stadium, just would be nice to have for the occasional game - one being built by someone else would be the smart option.

 

[Jim Prideaux]

Im sure on SEN i heard them talking about Cricket Victoria building a smaller stadium (junction oval? - im not a victorian so dont know much about whats going... but apparently thats why they now cant play Shield cricket at the G from the start of march, which was part of the deal for the AFL to help fund a new stadium).

Surely if you wanted a boutique stadium you would just use that one and hire it from Cricket Victoria or the state gov. (Whoever becomes owner), or try to include it in any deal the AFL is making to support the stadium.

Unless the AFL suddenly decide to sell Etihad, its not like theres a big need for a 3rd stadium, just would be nice to have for the occasional game - one being built by someone else would be the smart option.

Yup, currently redoing the Junction oval as their home ground/ headquarters . However, CV will use it year around, and it's capacity would be 10,000 at a guess. Not suitable for AFL really.

 

[didaksrightfoot]

Yup, currently redoing the Junction oval as their home ground/ headquarters . However, CV will use it year around, and it's capacity would be 10,000 at a guess. Not suitable for AFL really.

Thanks for the info

 

[FootyJunkie]

the thing is, no one's a home team anymore in melbourne

 

[Hawthorn United]

My main issue with the Victorian clubs, with the exception of Geelong, are basically all Melbourne variations. However, even they play home matches at the MCG/Etihad.

Eg. Melbourne Magpies, Melbourne Hawks, Melbourne Tigers, Dockland Dogs, Dockland Bombers, Dockland Saints, Dockland Kangaroos.

Geelong can be renamed to Greater Western Melbourne.

Similar to how US sporting teams relocate their franchise and change their city name. A lot of the clubs I've listed above have also moved their operations into another suburb so nothing about them actually identifies with their name.

This is how you get issues with some of the AFL population trying to argue why Geelong should get home finals at Kardinia Park.

It's also created a very neutral environment at Victorian venues.

 

[FootyJunkie]

My main issue with the Victorian clubs, with the exception of Geelong, are basically all Melbourne variations. However, even they play home matches at the MCG/Etihad.

Eg. Melbourne Magpies, Melbourne Hawks, Melbourne Tigers, Dockland Dogs, Dockland Bombers, Dockland Saints, Dockland Kangaroos.

Geelong can be renamed to Greater Western Melbourne.

Similar to how US sporting teams relocate their franchise and change their city name. A lot of the clubs I've listed above have also moved their operations into another suburb so nothing about them actually identifies with their name.

This is how you get issues with some of the AFL population trying to argue why Geelong should get home finals at Kardinia Park.

It's also created a very neutral environment at Victorian venues.

Agree... seeing Melbourne sides playing out at the MCG and Etihad... they are just corporate brands now

I really wish Waverley was still around (perhaps downgraded a bit in capacity, but upgraded in terms of facilities) - Hawthorn and St.Kilda would make that place a fortress, and fans in the south eastern suburbs, peninsula and beyond would be happy

 

[Hawthorn United]

Agree... seeing Melbourne sides playing out at the MCG and Etihad... they are just corporate brands now

I really wish Waverley was still around (perhaps downgraded a bit in capacity, but upgraded in terms of facilities) - Hawthorn and St.Kilda would make that place a fortress, and fans in the south eastern suburbs, peninsula and beyond would be happy

NSW and QLD are the only states with sides that play in their named areas.

Fremantle don't play in Fremantle, and neither do Port Adelaide.

 

[Colonial]

NSW and QLD are the only states with sides that play in their named areas.

Fremantle don't play in Fremantle, and neither do Port Adelaide.

PLASTIC!

Sent from my SM-G920I using Tapatalk

 

[Jim Prideaux]

PLASTIC!

Sent from my SM-G920I using Tapatalk

Very droll. It's an interesting problem. Most Melbourne clubs would average over 25,000 at a guess (someone will correct me), which makes the concept of surburban/ boutique stadiums obsolete before they're even built.

 

[Jim Prideaux]

the thing is, no one's a home team anymore in melbourne

Who's the home team in the Fremantle West Coast game?

 

[luke livingston seagull]

was hoping this was gonna be a thread about a hip new coffee spot

 

[Garlic muncher]

Vic Park is a perfect venue for AFLW - perfect.

 

[luke livingston seagull]

I thought Suburban Grounds was a cafe at Etihad Stadium