The Flood

[Kildonan]

The flood is a gameplan based on possession.

It requires fitness, precise passing, and patience (discipline).
Offensive players are required to flood into defence to tie up opposition scoring opportunities. When possession is regained, offensive players must rapidly move forward to provide passing options.

It works on two levels.

1) Possession of the ball means that the opposition doesn't have the ball.
This means the opposition gets fewer opportunities to score.

2) Precise passing and patience are required to capitalise on the oppositions defensive errors.
The ball is kept in possession until an opportunity arises.

The most effective way of defeating the flood is gaining first possessions and getting quick clearances away.

We have been able to do both to some effect, so far this year, (the Geelong game was the exception) but we miss the in and under work that Powell and Thompson were responsible for during much of last year. The inclusion of a player like McGough may make a big difference to our ability to get the ball out quickly. At the moment our midfielders with the quality disposal skills are being wasted going in for the contested ball.

Historically, we have overcome teams that flood by having a division of duties that we are currently unable to provide. Powell was never a match winner, but the role he played was very useful to the Saints. I think McGough can fill that role. He is a hard nut, he gets down and dirty and gets the ball out to our players with evasive skills and disposal skills.

We also need to be more competitive in the ruck contests.
This is obvious, but there are more ways to do this than just bringing in the tallest player we have. The loss of Kosi (and Hamill) has, and will continue, to hurt us. Our ruck stocks are currently not cutting it and we need to investigate other options. At this stage that looks like giving Rix a run, as Brooks is still injured. Other options need to be devised. These would be tactical approaches as we just don't have the personnel.

It is still quite early in the season. The doom and gloom merchants on here seem to think our season is all but over. We play Carlton this week, and although they are becoming more competitive, they do not represent much of a threat to us. In fact, I believe they will help play us back into form. Winning against them will bring our win / loss record to 4 and 4. This is exactly where we were last season after eight rounds. We managed to put ourselves into a position to be a real premiership contender. We did so with similar injury problems to what we are experiencing right now. We are still a very big show for the final four, and if we make it there and regain our missing (injured) players, no team will stop us.

Some posters have questioned our passion.

You will see the true meaning of passion when we get to the business end of the season.

 

[chas]

There is no lack of passion, BUT there is a HUGE lack of a brain !!!!

too many receivers in midfield !!! need to have Montagna and Gram in there to fight for the footy !!

 

[Kildonan]

too many receivers in midfield !!! need to have Montagna and Gram in there to fight for the footy !!

Actually Chas these guys are better suited, I believe, to be receivers and ball carriers.
That seems to be what they do best.

 

[chas]

seems to me like they are the only ones getting their hands on the pill!!

 

[SpInNeR]

Actually Chas these guys are better suited, I believe, to be receivers and ball carriers.
That seems to be what they do best.

I question Grams intensity in his attack for the football. Ive been a big supporter of him since he was recruited yet seemed to notice this at the beginning of this year.

He's right for everything else, its just at the very last second towards the footy.

Thoughts????

Stkildoan, totally agree that Joey and Gram should be our running players. But i have notice that Joey in particular is mostly getting his own ball this year. Probably in the absence of bally in the middle.

 

[Kildonan]

Jason Gram remains on absolute last place in the St Kilda list for contested possessions.

Joey is currently third on that list.

We need our in and under guys to get the ball out to our ball carriers and highly skilled players, rather than these players being forced to get the ball themselves. (Then who do they get the ball out to ??)

Luke Ball is one reason, he is not able to contribute in the same manner as can when he's at his best. I'm convinced that we've missed Powell and Thompson doing the largely unrecognised bottom of the pack work, when they do, the Lenny Hayes, Dal Santos, Goddards and the running winger / flanker types can do a whole lot more with it.

 

[Kildonan]

We are at a critical time for us and the AFL.

Flooding is ruining our game.
Every club is using it as it is a successful tactic to win games. But this game style is unattractive and slow.

It is ruining our game.

Grant Thomas used the flood tactic back in 2002 to almost beat the much favoured Sydney Swans at a time when injuries forced us to field very much a team of inexperienced kids. A drawn match that gained much publicity at the time as being unattractive and slow (geez, where have I heard that before?).

We all hailed it a great achievement, Grant Thomas had tactically changed the result of a match. It seemed that despite having an inferior team, St Kilda had ground out a draw, an unlucky one at that when former player, Daniel Wulff, kicked at goal, a gimmee, and hit the post.

Didn't Richmond (Terry Wallace) do something remarkably similar (4 years later)?

What does anyone have to say of the Richmond-Adelaide match?
Was it glorious? Was it clever? Is this what you want to watch when you go to the footy?

The week after the Sydney draw, St Kilda played Collingwood.
We tried using the flood again. This time it worked against us.
Collingwood were a finalist that year, we were second last with a depleted list and only Carlton's first ever wooden spoon team behind us. They smashed us from the start. After half time we had to play our normal style to slow the massacre.

Thomas has not employed the flood (to anywhere near that degee) since.
Every other team is using it.

We are in a unique position that we can redeem our season and save the AFL from further damage by developing our team to play a style that negates the flood.

 

[Kildonan]

The media seem to think that St Kilda's poor early season form is due to us not adopting the flood, like everybody else. The pressure is on for Thomas to conform to what other coaches are doing. This would be disaster (in my opinion) not only for the Saints, but for footy in general.

Saints give Thomas big tick
The Australian
Chip Le Grand
May 20, 2006

IF Grant Thomas sounds paranoid, it is only because everyone is out to get him.
When St Kilda wins, it is because the Saints are the most talented team. When it loses, it is because Thomas is a tactical troglodyte. It isn't fair but it has ever been thus. Little wonder then, that Thomas this week politely declined interview requests.

The St Kilda board is standing by its coach, who is contracted until the end of next season. "I am in no doubt that Grant is the right man to take us forward, as he has done in the past," president Rod Butterss said.

But after nearly five seasons spent swimming upstream, Thomas and his Saints have reached difficult waters.

As always, injuries tell part of the story. Neither Aaron Hamill nor Justin Koschitzke will play for the next two months and the Clarke brothers, Xavier and Raphael, have shown a disposition towards soft-tissue injuries.

"Anyone who said to me that Grant had an over-abundance of talent, I would suggest they look in the grandstand and they will see that over-abundance of talent sitting there," Butterss said.

Beyond this familiar tale of torn muscles and fractured bones, however, St Kilda can no longer ignore broader questions about Thomas's coaching.

He is the only coach who refuses to flood and one of the few who does not share Mick Malthouse's belief in a premiership clock. He believes football has not changed dramatically since Brisbane was the best team in the land and that the best way to win is still to move the ball fast and long to high-marking forwards.

In a new era of possession and tempo control, St Kilda is perhaps the last true believer of power football.

The evolution and direction of the game is an evocative debate and traditionalists will hope Thomas is right. When the St Kilda midfield is on its game and Fraser Gehrig, Koschitzke and Nick Riewoldt are ruling the skies, there are few greater spectacles in football.

But what if the Brisbane model is out of date and Thomas, like so many generals, has prepared for the last war? Is the St Kilda game plan already redundant in a fast changing game?

Nathan Burke, a 300-game player for St Kilda and an assistant coach to Thomas for two seasons, explained the fundamentals of the Thomas approach.

"He doesn't believe flooding can be effective in finals," Burke said. "You will very rarely, if ever, see the Saints flood. There is no direction for the onballers to play behind the ball. It is get the ball, move it accurately and quickly to key forwards capable of taking a mark on a lead or a pack mark or bringing the ball to ground.

"It is not the total Brisbane plan; Brisbane probably kicked the ball longer than the Saints do ... I don't think the Saints have had that consistency of key forwards yet. But with a full list of forwards, they will back themselves to win the ball on the ground.

"I am pretty sure Grant's way of thinking would be it is too early to say the Sydney way of going about things is the new face of football and everyone has to adopt that."

In the precision versus power debate, Burke sides with his old coach. "I personally believe that the way the Saints play, given the right circumstances and a full list, they will beat Sydney easily," he said.

"Once that side clicks into gear and gets things going, it is going to take a real good side to stop them. I can't see them coming up against anyone in September they can't beat."

This is also the view of Butterss and the board. "I am very cautious about issues like tactics and game plans," Butterss said.

"Probably the three most successful fellows in terms of the development of tactics and game plan over the last 20 years have been (Kevin) Sheedy, (Leigh) Matthews and (Denis) Pagan.

"It is just 10 days ago that Grant coached against the Western Bulldogs. They were the form side and the crack team and we were able to dismantle that. Everyone raves about Neil Craig's tactical approach but when it mattered under the pressure of finals football last year, we were successful against Adelaide."

Thomas has shown himself to be an effective motivator, a good list manager and, by any reasonable measure, his win-loss record over the pat two years is exceptional. At 3-4 this season, a win against Carlton tomorrow will equal St Kilda's start to 2005. On these numbers, the club is hardly in crisis. But there is one glaring flaw in Butterss' argument.

Sheedy, Pagan and Matthews are all premiership coaches but this year they are coaching three of the worst performed teams in the league. All three can reasonably claim to be victims of the football cycle. But it can never be known whether Brisbane's 2002 team would win a premiership in today's AFL playing the same game as they did four years ago.

The Lions once were kings of power football but even Matthews has conceded games are no longer won that way.

St Kilda kicked more goals than any other team last year. It took the most marks inside 50m and was the most efficient at turning forward moves into goals. It is now an average side by these measures.

The Saints are winning less of the ball than their opponents and have a scoring efficiency below Essendon and Carlton. They are beaten every week in the ruck and have slipped from being one of the competition's best clearance teams to 13th overall. Is it because they are not playing well, or playing the wrong game?

According to Butterss, any talk of a window of opportunity closing around the Saints is bunk. Where other clubs watch the clock, Butterss talks about a funnel; an application of a sales and marketing theory in which raw recruits are "processed" into elite players over three or four years.

"That is an [ad] infinitum approach," Butterss said. "If you get your clock wrong and you miss it, you are dead. We take a long-term approach and have faith in taking later picks and grow them into elite performers."

That's the theory. In practice, the clock is very much ticking on Thomas. That much in football has not changed.

 

[Kildonan]

Whilst not quite flooding, the Kangaroos were desperate for a win, to this end they tried to play possession football against us:

Second game I've been to this year to watch the Saints...

My first game this year was against the Cats a few weeks ago..and I swore never to go to the AFL for some time until there were some rule changes or Grant Thomas and his coaching colleagues pulled out of their flooding tactics... but anyway, I went along today to watch the game to see if much had changed..

I left at three quarter time in disgust.

AFL is no longer a spectacle.... Don't believe me? Then just wait and see TV Ratings and crowd attendances drop significantly due to aneurism that has engulfed our game.. Local football in the Eastern Suburbs any day!

R Man

 

[silkykanga]

we played keepings off because you had 3 players running back on Thompson at every contest - you flooded in the last quarter and i can't see you guys winning many finals playing that crap football

We weren't any better but i think you guys contributed to the slow play after half time - but thats why i keep saying we need big Sav in there to crash packs and take the pressure off thommo - but only blame yourselves for possession footy - although it wasn't a bad game-plan because we don't have the skills to play poissession footy

good win today and hope hayes goes alsways a dog and geez if i was gehrig i would be ed off to, getting killed by johnno hay isn't the best day out

cheers guys

 

[Kildonan]

Coach adopts pragmatism at St Kilda
The Australian
Chip Le Grand
May 29, 2006

"I'll love the day sides see fit to do it against us because we are so damn good."
Grant Thomas, after employing a super flood against Sydney, round 5, 2002.
GRANT THOMAS has spent the best part of four years eating these words. With every passing season, as St Kilda developed from easy beat into the most potent team in the game, their forward arc slowly disappeared beneath the rising tide.

At times, a frustrated Thomas would be reduced to despair. "Crikey. I feel sorry for all you people at home watching that," he lamented after an early season game last year.

Mostly, so long as the Saints were winning, he was prepared to grin and bear it. Deep in his heart, Thomas remained convinced that a flooding team would never beat an attacking, one-on-one team in finals. In the ideological schism over good versus ugly football, Thomas and St Kilda were a one-team crusade.

Not any more.

Against the Kangaroos yesterday, St Kilda flooded no more or less than every team does in the modern game. When confronted by the Kangaroos' stacked defence, they kept possession until they found a way forward. If the Kangaroos moved the ball forward slowly, they rushed numbers back.

Having taken four years to decide flooding and football can no longer be separated, St Kilda has rejoined the herd. They won and they won ugly, and Thomas left Telstra Dome a contented man.

"It is a game we definitely had to win," Thomas said. "That was the important part. It wasn't really pretty, obviously, but some days you have got to win like that."

Like everyone in football, Thomas has a strong view about where the game is heading. Like most coaches, he is wary of further rule changes at a time when the game is in a high state of flux. But unlike the Grant Thomas of just a few weeks ago, when the Saints were dramatically out-played and out-coached by Geelong, he is now willing to compromise those beliefs to help his team win.

"We just coach to win," he said. "During the week and other points in time you think about the spectacle and how the game is going. But you can only do with what you are served up with on the weekend. We would love to have man-on-man, contested footy all around the place and it doesn't always happen like that. We are getting more used to sides getting significant numbers behind the ball."

Dean Laidley is another coach who is struggling to keep pace -- quite literally -- with the changing game.

Laidley is meticulous in his preparation for opposition teams. But, according to Kangaroos president Graham Duff and by Laidley's own admission, the players he now has to work with are short of leg speed and a step behind the evolution of the game.

"I have got no qualms with that," Laidley said. "Graham fully supports me, along with (chief executive) Geoff Walsh. We have got a clear understanding where we are at and what we are trying to change and where we are going."

Laidley said he was happy with the "effort and grunt" his players showed in restricting St Kilda to 10 goals and the final margin to 17 points. The Kangaroos kicked poorly for goal and struggled to find a way forward beyond Nathan Thompson, who was well beaten by Max Hudghton.

Equally, they rarely gave St Kilda the opportunity to play their favoured game. Nick Riewoldt was double-teamed by Leigh Brown and Glenn Archer, who played loose in defence. Fraser Gehrig kicked two goals but had little influence and finished the day on report for striking Hamish McIntosh.

The style of this game was reflected in the final stats. Of St Kilda's top five ball winners, Leigh Fisher, Brendon Goddard and Sam Fisher all played in defence. For the Kangaroos, Archer made use of his roaming commission to gather 26 touches, almost all in the Kangaroos' own half.

Midway through the last quarter, Shannon Grant found himself 60 metres out from goal staring at a wall of St Kilda players. He turned around and kicked the ball 50 metres backwards to Archer. Grant's decision was met with howls of derision by supporters from both teams.

"When everybody pushed up the ground -- so the opposition's forward line ends up in front of the ball carrier -- what is the point of kicking down the line and being out-numbered?" Laidley asked. "That is the way it is going. Basketball, soccer, you can call it whatever you like but, at the end of the day, that is what it is turning into."

On this, Laidley will get no argument from Thomas. Not any more.