Tough Beats

[Supa Stylin Stevie]

The story of my poker life and Im sick of them. lol

 

[sante]

Had too many of them lately


AA/KK/QQ lost with them all

 

[London-Tavern-Is-Filth]

hows this we r playin yesterday at mates
flop is J, K, 10
1 guy whos on low stack moves all in
other guy calls
the guy that moved in flips over AK
other guy flips over A2
turn is a 2
river is a 2
Thats the worst call ive ever seen

 

[Crosby87]

hows this we r playin yesterday at mates
flop is J, K, 10
1 guy whos on low stack moves all in
other guy calls
the guy that moved in flips over AK
other guy flips over A2
turn is a 2
river is a 2
Thats the worst call ive ever seen

I got worse. Last weekend I played with a few mates, including some guy who had never played before.

I had A-K and the flop came 10 4 2. He was a short-stack. He bet, and I moved all-in over the top. He flipped over J-9. Jack-friggin-nine.

Turn was a blank, river was the J.

Then up against a player who knew what he was doing but was basically a beginner I flopped two pair. He was bluffing and pushing people around all night, and I told him what I had, and what I thought he had - which was nothing. And I was right. I moved all-in, he called, and he flipped over K-J. The K hit the river. Worst part was I was dealing.

 

[Supa Stylin Stevie]

I was playing at crown over xmas and one night this drunk tool comes to the table with not much idea how to play. Anyway, he proceeded to take me down several times in a string of tough beats. Id had enough after I went all in pre-flop with AA and he called with 33. Suprise suprise the other two 3s appear by the time the turn has been dealt. Unbelievable.

 

[monarch4]

I can top all of these stories. Monday night at Burswood, playing structured, I got involved in what turned out to be a $450 pot. I had pocket 7's and a 7 came up on the flop. A player 2 positions down from me had pocket jacks. I found out later in the hand that a player 2 positions to the right of me had another jack.

So come the turn and the river, the player with the pocket jacks had a 2% chance of beating me. What came up on the river, a stupid jack

 

[Daytripper]

I can top all of these stories. Monday night at Burswood, playing structured, I got involved in what turned out to be a $450 pot. I had pocket 7's and a 7 came up on the flop. A player 2 positions down from me had pocket jacks. I found out later in the hand that a player 2 positions to the right of me had another jack.

So come the turn and the river, the player with the pocket jacks had a 2% chance of beating me. What came up on the river, a stupid jack

That is a bad beat !!!

Some of the others though are just the law of averages. For example AA against 33 pre-flop is only an 80% favourite. Which means 20% of the time the person with 33 will win. In racing parlance its a 4/1 chance and I'm sure everyone has backed a horse at 4/1 before.

And AK vs J9 is only a 70% favourite pre flop and about 80% post flop if no one paired.

 

[fridige's failures]

mine would have to be the worst. pre flop i had pocket queens and my friend had pocket 10's. the flop was queen 10 10. got absolutely killed

 

[red+black]

And AK vs J9 is only a 70% favourite pre flop and about 80% post flop if no one paired.

Where do you calculate your odds? I use Poker Stove as recommended by Phil Gordon. CardPlayer.com have an online calculator.

you talk about AA v 33 being only 80%. no hand v AA will give you more than about 89%, so there's always that chance you'll lose out.

can anyone guess what the best hand v AA is, apart from another AA?

 

[Borgsta]

9-10 suited or something around there.

 

[red+black]

I have tried more than one program to calculate this, but I come up with 5-6s. And especially 5-6s where both Aces are of a different suit to the 5-6.

 

[Crosby87]

And AK vs J9 is only a 70% favourite pre flop and about 80% post flop if no one paired.

You've missed the point completely. Against any other player I take that pot. I lost the pot simply because of his ignorance. Nobody calls all their money with a J high to a pre-flop raise looking to hit one of six cards in the deck with two to come. That's where the beat is.

And I wouldn't get too sucked into odds. As the saying goes, "Poker is about everything but the cards." Sure, it's great to know the odds, but you better have some moves at the table. I'll take AK vs J9 post flop every time - he's got six cards to beat me with, and if he wants to "get lucky", he'll have to give me all of his chips to do so. But the call was dumb, and that's where the beat is. He had no right being in that pot past the flop with Jack high.

 

[Daytripper]

Here are the odds.
By the way I was a bit out with the AK v J9 - its not 70%, its 60% pre flop.

Pre flop

High pair vs Low pair
82% vs 18%
Pair vs two high cards
55% vs 45%
Pair vs 2 low cards
80% vs 20%
Pair vs high and low
70% vs 30%
Two high vs two low
60% vs 40%

Post flop (turn card)

Basically count the number of outs you have and multiply by 4. So if you have 2 hearts and there are two hearts on the table there are 9 hearts remaining. Therefore your chance of getting the flush is 9 outs * 4 = 36%.

Of course its not that simple as someone might have a higher flush or a full house so you need to take that into consideration when calculating your outs. But the basic mathmatics is to multiply your outs by 4.

Post flop (river card)

Same as above except multiply by 2. A flush therefore with the same situation is 18%. You can check this by calculating 9 outs left with 45 cards remaining - 52 cards less your two cards less 4 cards on table. You are a 1 in 5 chance or 20% but 18% is close enough if you need to to some quick workings out.

And I wouldn't get too sucked into odds. As the saying goes, "Poker is about everything but the cards." Sure, it's great to know the odds, but you better have some moves at the table.

I respect your opinion as you know what you're talking about but as far as I'm concerned you must know the odds (and by extention the pot odds) if you are going to finish ahead in the long haul.
The object is to always enter pots where you are getting value for your dollar or to make your opponent enter pots where he isn't - ie he is making a mistake.
Of course moves are vital and sometimes you have to throw the rule book out the window but you need to stick to basics most of the time.

I guarantee you that all the top guys like Ivey, Negraneu, Matusow, Helmuth know their outs and mathmatical chances off by heart.

 

[Daytripper]

9-10 suited or something around there.

close - its 67 or 78 suited with the suits being different from the aces.

 

[Crosby87]

I respect your opinion as you know what you're talking about but as far as I'm concerned you must know the odds (and by extention the pot odds) if you are going to finish ahead in the long haul.
The object is to always enter pots where you are getting value for your dollar or to make your opponent enter pots where he isn't - ie he is making a mistake.
Of course moves are vital and sometimes you have to throw the rule book out the window but you need to stick to basics most of the time.

I guarantee you that all the top guys like Ivey, Negraneu, Matusow, Helmuth know their outs and mathmatical chances off by heart.

I know all the odds I need to know - but I'm NOT going to let that dictate my play. I'm going to play in situations where the odds are against me - you need to do that in poker.

 

[Falchoon]

Playing online just now, 2 tournaments at once.

$5 holdem, approx 21st out of 53 remaining, paying top 20, pick up 88 blinds 400.

Raise to 1000

5 callers!

flop 8, 5, K rainbow

AKo calls A10heart calls all in short stacked, 13000 pot, enough to push me in to top 5, runner K runner A.

On the other one $20 omaha hi lo, I get rivered to finish 6th paying 3. The river gives him both pots, anything above an 8 gives me the lot

back to the holdem with 2200 chips, AQ suited, double the blind to 800, 3 callers, A76 flop, all in, he turns over A7.

All in the space of 4mins afer a total of 3+hrs between them

 

[Daytripper]

Playing online just now, 2 tournaments at once.

$5 holdem, approx 21st out of 53 remaining, paying top 20, pick up 88 blinds 400.

Raise to 1000

5 callers!

flop 8, 5, K rainbow

AKo calls A10heart calls all in short stacked, 13000 pot, enough to push me in to top 5, runner K runner A.

On the other one $20 omaha hi lo, I get rivered to finish 6th paying 3. The river gives him both pots, anything above an 8 gives me the lot

back to the holdem with 2200 chips, AQ suited, double the blind to 800, 3 callers, A76 flop, all in, he turns over A7.

All in the space of 4mins afer a total of 3+hrs between them

Not much you can really do there.
No matter what you bet in early position the AK would have been sure to call.

Maybe lay down the 88 pre flop but to do that is taking conservatism too far.

Thats poker, I guess.

 

[TheBigV]

Playing a tournament last night. Have AQ. The flop QQA. Feeling pretty good about myself thinking I've got this one in the bag. A guy bets, another raises, I raise that, before you know it all in (monster pot). The other guy has AA.

 

[grimlock]

Playing a tournament last night. Have AQ. The flop QQA. Feeling pretty good about myself thinking I've got this one in the bag. A guy bets, another raises, I raise that, before you know it all in (monster pot). The other guy has AA.

Did you stop to consider he had the aces or you just went right in?

 

[TheBigV]

Did you stop to consider he had the aces or you just went right in?

Because there was another person in the pot I thought they may have split the aces between them. Sadly not the case.

 

[monarch4]

I inflicted a bad beat on 2 people last night at burswood and enabled me to cash in on a $550 pot.

I had king 10
Another player queen 10
Another player pocket 4's

Community cards queen, 10, 10......turn 4.........river king

Say no more

 

[red+black]

I had king 10

My favourite online hand.

 

[Borgsta]

Wow I just had 3 in 4 hands to knock me out of a tourny in 17th place/70. Top 10 paying.

First hand K-10. Flop K-8-6, small stack goes all in for 800, I call. He shows K-5 and of course the turn was a 5.

2nd hand A-K. I bet twice blinds, everyone folds bar smallest stack he is all in for 400. Turns over 2-Q. Flop 2-4-2. Hand over.

3rd hand 7-7. Im big blind, guy who beat me last hand goes all in for 1000ish and turns over A-2. Flop A-4-9. Turn 7 and Im finally happy.

4th hand A-6. Small blind just call. Flop A-8S-6S. Check, 1 guy bets 300, 1 call and I raise. 1 call, 1 fold. Turn 5S. I bet 600 and the other guy goes all in for 5000. I thought he was bluffing the flush and called. He had no spades and shows A-7. River = 9, game over.

 

[Lajon]

Ahhh!

Just had to come on and vent my frustration

Played tonight in a cash game ... saving the details

looked down at AA after a raise an re-reaise pre flop ... got all my money in against a bloke on KK ... K hits ... (suck it up and get on with it, as I always say).

Rebuy and build my stack up again. Look down at AA again after a raise and a re-raise pre flop. raise the inital raiser all in, he calls as does the second raiser. A-10 clubs (initial raiser), QQ (re-raiser). poo-club-poo-club-club ... and goodnight.

Some nights it's jut not your night ey ... Smiled and stood up... "well played boys, have a good night" is all you can say

 

[monarch4]

I was at Burswood on the weekend just gone and was a witness to 2 bad beats inflicted on the same person. You would think that he would have walked out after the first bad beat, but he didn't.

Hand 1.........he turns a full house and loses to a royal flush on the river.

Hand 2.........he flopped a full house and loses to a straight flush on the river.

All up in those 2 hands he lost about $1500