we need talls now

[true blue19]

It takes at least 3 years to develop talls. So at the end of the 2012 season cloke and fisher will be gone O'hAilpin will more than likely be gone or he will 30yo. Thornton and Waite will also be 30. So that leaves us with Jamison (26), Bower (24), Austin (23) and Henderson (23)

Judd, Murphy, Gibbs and McLean will all be at there peak and I don't want us to turn out like the bulldogs they have one of the best list of mids but lack of talls.

We should pick Black or Talia with pick 12. We should delist wiggins, johnson and fisher and add maguire ( will be 28 in 2012) also simpson from the cats and Temel, Shaw or Grimes

 

[shell23]

CARLTONS 2010 FORWARD LINE

Kreuzer: 200cm, 95kg, 20 years old

(if we get Maguire)Waite: 194cm, 95kg, 26 years old

Henderson: 196cm, 91kg, 19 years old



afaire bita height there

 

[Sin City]

So at the end of 2012 we'll have 6 good talls and our small man brigade will be 4 players and we should just chase talls this year?

 

[RuckRyder]

Question marks over Bower and Austin also.

 

[Ryan Dixon Webb]

Question marks of Bower? the guy's a proven gun. Very unique player as well.

Austin will come good, don't even worry about it - our talls will be fine.

 

[Sin City]

To the OP, this is what happens when you start terrible threads. Morons like RuckRyder finally get an opportunity to put a stupid argument forward as they don't understand the quality threads.

Bower is developing into one of the better backmen in the league and Austin is showing signs that he will become our CHB. I doubt you have watched any of his games RR.

 

[Sin City]

Question marks over Bower and Austin also.

Question marks over Neagle and Gumbleton that I'd be more concerned about if I was you ****head!

 

[Azul]

We also need midfielders to replace Hadley, Scotland and Carrazzo as they get older.

We also need a silky skilled rough as guts medium sized utility to replace Wiggins, Anderson, Houlihan and Johnson. (Grigg, O'Keeffe?)

Let's throw in a ruckman for good measure for when GC offer Hampson an offer he can't refuse and Warnock fails to get on the park.

So yes, key position players are a need but be mindful of other areas too. Best available...

 

[Blue and Silver]

For the purpose of this post i shall classify tall as above 190cm:

Current tall players on our list,

Mark Austin
Paul Bower
Cameron Cloke
Brad Fisher
Shaun Grigg
Richard Hadley
Shaun Hampson
Lachlan Henderson
Sam Jacobs
Micheal Jamison
Matthew Kreuzer
Setanta O'Halpin
Bret Thornton
Jarrad Waite
Andrew Walker
Robert Warnock

That is 16 players. Of those 3 play more as midfielders, 4 are regular rucks, and 2 should of departed by then that leaves 7 KP players. Of those Thornton, Waite and O'halpin will all be 29 in 2012 having all been born in 1983. Certainly the first two should still be useful at that time. So therefore in 2012 Carlton will have the following talls that play in KP's

Austin (23)
Bower (24)
Henderson (23)
Jamison (26)
O'Halpin (29)
Thornton (29)
Waite (29)

So we will actually still be alright for talls, of course we should probably draft one this year based on potential as this is a potential weakness if injuries affect the side, but overall there is no need for over-reaction particulary considering the youth of our ruck division and the potential of these guys to pinch hit around the ground

 

[Blue and Silver]

Also it is likely that Aaron Kite 190cm will be rookie listed this year, Peter Labi is 189cm and growing (his uncle is 207cm) Caleb Tiller is still growing and is 189cm. I would say it isn't an immediate problem

 

[HBF]

I still don't believe that we have a real pressing need for talls. I would have thought we would have at least 3 talls (Kreuzer, Waite & Austin) that can push forward should we need them to. All have shown that they can do pretty well up there when they are called upon to do so.

Just a question on the OP though - what happens if Black, Butcher & Talia are all gone by pick 12? Do we reach for a tall that say we have ranked at 20, or do we take the next best available on our rankings? Me, i'd take best available.

Also keep in mind that we have a heap of room in our salary cap, and we have already indicated that we will be able to make a MASSIVE play for an out of contract player in 12 months time.

 

[40yearBLUE]

I still don't believe that we have a real pressing need for talls. I would have thought we would have at least 3 talls (Kreuzer, Waite & Austin) that can push forward should we need them to. All have shown that they can do pretty well up there when they are called upon to do so.

Just a question on the OP though - what happens if Black, Butcher & Talia are all gone by pick 12? Do we reach for a tall that say we have ranked at 20, or do we take the next best available on our rankings? Me, i'd take best available.

Also keep in mind that we have a heap of room in our salary cap, and we have already indicated that we will be able to make a MASSIVE play for an out of contract player in 12 months time.

Definitely take best available, they have better currency. We can always trade for talls in coming years if we start to look thin for them and the better the players we draft the better placed we are whether for trading or building a better on field list.

We have a good mix now and that will continue well into the future. We ought to be planning a little shorter term now that the list has come together and we now only need to tweak to plug gaps, and you usually trade for that as development takes time and is more hit and miss.

 

[celtic_pride]

I wouldn't count on us finding decent talls under Wayne Hughes in the draft, WH has as much success as picking KPP's as Elizabeth Taylor is at picking husbands !!!

 

[Sin City]

I wouldn't count on us finding decent talls under Wayne Hughes in the draft, WH has as much success as picking KPP's as Elizabeth Taylor is at picking husbands !!!

Kreuzer, Hampson, Austin, Jacobs say differently.

Who do you suggest he takes, oh wise one?

 

[djw1952]

Question marks of Bower? the guy's a proven gun. Very unique player as well.

Austin will come good, don't even worry about it - our talls will be fine.

bower is like wiggins in mo .has lots of guts, good mark, but his kicking is dicey as he turns the ball over too much.also not strong enough for key pos as bradshaw showed on a couple of occasions.

 

[Blue and Silver]

Bower has done the job on Franklin, Bradshaw (round 2 last year, he was injured in the finals) and Riedwoldt before, I think they are some fairly good scalps. His kicking has improved, not excellent, but more than serviceable, provides great run out of defence. Considerably better than Wiggins IMO

 

[Gibbs_09]

Question marks over Bower and Austin also.

People who live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones....

 

[BeligerentBlue]

I watch a fair bit of TAC games and have a mate who does scouting for the blues. I suggested they look at a certain player for the Pioneers and the message came back from Hughes as "too small, too slow". This player is neither too slow and is 184 cm. This suggests we are looking for a superquick tall this draft.

 

[Dramoth]

bower is like wiggins in mo .has lots of guts, good mark, but his kicking is dicey as he turns the ball over too much.also not strong enough for key pos as bradshaw showed on a couple of occasions.

I think that you will find is that he is actually an attacking HBF who was shunted into the role of a KPP because we lost Waite and Jammo to injuries and he had to fill in.

IMHO, I thought that he did a reasonable job on most of the opponents he was given and it was only Bradshaw's experience and bigger body that allowed him to take the points over Bower.

Also, there is nothing wrong with his kicking... he just needs to learn the right moment to get rid of the ball instead of waiting until the last minute before disposing of it to a team mate.

 

[Jeremias]

bower is like wiggins in mo .has lots of guts, good mark, but his kicking is dicey as he turns the ball over too much.

Ah yes, this complete and utter myth has reared its ugly head once again.

Bower has elite disposal efficiency rates and is one of the safest users of the ball at the Carlton Football Club.

In 2008 Bower had a disposal efficiency rate of 86%

In 2009 Bower had a disposal efficiency rate of 84%

Yet his kicking is dicey as he turns the ball over too much

What a crock of shit.

Bower is nothing like Wiggins.

 

[HBF]

I watch a fair bit of TAC games and have a mate who does scouting for the blues. I suggested they look at a certain player for the Pioneers and the message came back from Hughes as "too small, too slow". This player is neither too slow and is 184 cm. This suggests we are looking for a superquick tall this draft.

No necessarily. It could just mean that this is how WH rates this player. Everyone that watches footy, or any sport for that matter, forms different views of the players. Some are more lenient, some rate players harshly. It's what makes discussing sport so intriging - everyone has a different view.

 

[BlueGibbs2011]

It takes at least 3 years to develop talls. So at the end of the 2012 season cloke and fisher will be gone O'hAilpin will more than likely be gone or he will 30yo. Thornton and Waite will also be 30. So that leaves us with Jamison (26), Bower (24), Austin (23) and Henderson (23)

Judd, Murphy, Gibbs and McLean will all be at there peak and I don't want us to turn out like the bulldogs they have one of the best list of mids but lack of talls.

We should pick Black or Talia with pick 12. We should delist wiggins, johnson and fisher and add maguire ( will be 28 in 2012) also simpson from the cats and Temel, Shaw or Grimes

I'm with you true blue. A lot of people on here just quote centimeters but miss the issue of quality and being able to play the KPP is question. Hampson is tall and an athletic freak but it doesnt mean he can play FF or CHF like a Pav/Franklin/Reiwoldt/Fev/Brown! Hampson spills 7 out of 8 passes at the minute and needs further development!

We need to invest high draft picks in KPP due to the amount of time they take the develop. Yes we have needs elsewhere but mids and medium sized players take less time to develop with a couple of exceptions (Russell).

Another issue people should be aware of...it is much easier to pick up mids in trade week over KPP if you go back over the last 3 years.

Best available with a hint of list strategy gets my vote!

 

[Salaryman]

nah, just get the best with 12.... building a freaky talented list, the game is won between the arcs....with blokes who can run and carry, and kick accurately over 50m and break zones......lets not stop now

 

[DarkTint]

bower is like wiggins in mo .has lots of guts, good mark, but his kicking is dicey as he turns the ball over too much.also not strong enough for key pos as bradshaw showed on a couple of occasions.

not strong enough? bradshaw is a 30 y.o man who has been in the system for 10+ years pb ... give him some time mate. oh yeah and a knee injury he carried for nearly half a season wouldnt of helped much

Turns the ball over to much? I could be wrong but i believe he has very decent disposal which will jsut get better, i see the problem more to be he has no options to kick it to up the field which turns into a decision error rather than a disposal error ... e.g kicking to a 2 on 1, handballing to a team mate under pressure. IMO with a new forward structure next season some high leading half forward flankers will do wonders for us.

when we have such a high number of top 20 draft picks on our list i actually think 'disposal' will be one of our strentgths once we're up and running.

we dont need talls. we need a gameplan that will define this squad/group of players the club has put together. There is just to much talent on this list to not be succesfull. I'm down to follow a similar sort of game that geelongs got. basically as simple as I can put it, its back urself and your teamates and take the opposition on. They just believe they are the best.
They have an exc def, great mids and a servicable forward line.
Our team fully developed (i dont know when that will be 1-2-3-4 years?) we should match the current gellong team in all areas prob even surpassing their forward line. think of a 24 y.o yaz and a 25 y.o lachie.


imo we dont 'need' talls. no more than any other afl club.

 

[dumb]

a bit late if we want to avoid the bulldogs problem, we should have already picked them in a previous year. unless we go with waite, we'll have a merely serviceable, star-less/unproven forward line. cloke, fisher, austin, henderson, oh'ailpin. but then this is what people have said would be better, more options. mind you, finishing the year in the bulldogs position isn't that bad a problem to have.