What Is Different?

[_RT_]

OK there is plenty of talk at the moment about just what is wrong with us as we have slid from a 3-0 start to now being 3-3. So I thought I would take a look at the numbers and see if they can tell us anything.

End Of 2012 Season Averages Per Game:
Disposals - 380.7 ranked 1st
Contested Possession - 145.7 ranked 4th
Disposal Efficiency % - 73.6 ranked 4th
Clangers - 45.7 ranked equal 10th
Marks - 92.1 ranked 5th
Clearances - 38 ranked 9th
Centre Clearances - 14 ranked 3rd
Stoppages - 23.9 ranked 13th
Tackles - 62 ranked 10th
1% - 49.2 ranked 11th
I50 - 56.5 ranked 2nd
R50 - 33.4 ranked 17th

After 6 Rounds 2013 Averages Per Game
Disposals - 354.8 ranked 8th down 25.9
Contested Possessions - 140 ranked 14th down 5.7
Disposal Efficiency % - 71.7 ranked 5th down 1.9
Clangers - 51.2 ranked 4th up 5.5
Marks - 88.3 ranked equal 7th down 3.8
Clearances - 35.7 ranked 13th down 2.3
Centre Clearances - 14.8 ranked 5th up 0.8
Stoppages - 20.8 ranked 14th down 3.1
Tackles - 48.3 ranked 18th down 13.7
1% - 47.2 ranked 7th down 2
I50 - 52.7 ranked 10th down 3.8
R50 - 37 ranked 13th up 3.6

As you can see from the above, compared to how we finished the 2012 season to how we've started this season our numbers are down in all bar 2 areas. Given the drop off in some of the areas is it any wonder that the last 3 weeks have seen us struggle. One can only hope that things turn around soon or it could see us drop too far behind and unable to recover.

 

[rfctiger90]

Just as I read this I got an email from Dimma titled "we must get fundamentals right". I loled.

 

[_RT_]

Just as I read this I got an email from Dimma titled "we must get fundamentals right". I loled.

Just opened my email and saw the dissection video waiting for me after posting this. Like you I LOLed as well.

 

[Bojangles17]

With disposals and marks down, would appear to me we are a little more direct than last year, would love to see where the stats where 12 months ago compared to now

 

[WATiger86]

What's different? We went from playing the blues (first game with a new coach) Saints and Dogs (crap sides) to playing 3 preseason top 4 hopefuls in Collingwood, Freo (away) and Geelong.

We're beating the sides we should put away but yet to really pinch a scalp that proves we're ready to do more than make up the numbers in September.

 

[thecotch]

Just as I read this I got an email from Dimma titled "we must get fundamentals right". I loled.

Lol. We can't even get the fundamentals right. Marking, kicking, handballing, making right decisions. Train for 6 mths and still can't get it right. I'm starting have some doubts about dimmas technical coaching ability.

 

[_RT_]

What's different? We went from playing the blues (first game with a new coach) Saints and Dogs (crap sides) to playing 3 preseason top 4 hopefuls in Collingwood, Freo (away) and Geelong.

We're beating the sides we should put away but yet to really pinch a scalp that proves we're ready to do more than make up the numbers in September.

While it's true that our opponents have changed from being middle of the road sides to top 4 contenders our results against them are, in 2 of the 3 games, much worse than they were last year. I believe this is because we're not playing at the level we were playing at last year.

As the stats show, we're not getting as much ball, not using it as cleanly, making more mistakes and putting less defensive pressure on the opposition. These things are easily fixed as it's simply a change of mindset that will turn it around. We've seen the last 2 weeks that our tackle count has almost doubled from what it was. Unfortunately we're still making basic errors that are killing us for short periods of games that blow us away.

For mine the reason for this is an unwillingness to work by a number of players when things get a little tough. So far this year Cotchin is about the only player I've seen who busts a gut to try and turn things around when they aren't going his way. The rest of our senior players seem happy to just accept that it's not their day when they cop a little bit of attention. It was interesting watching AFL360 last night where both Eade and Thompson said that when they have certain players in their sides that are having off games they get the message around to teammates to make sure that they bring them into the game as much as possible, through feeding them the ball or blocking their opponents to try and get them free. They mentioned that we're good at doing it for Cotchin, but don't seem to do it each other when they are struggling. Perhaps that explains why our numbers are down across the board we're simply not working hard enough.

 

[Barry_Badrinath]

Compare the results too:

2012: Lost to Carlton by 44 and 4
2013: Beat Carlton by 5

2012: Beat St Kilda by 8
2013: Beat St Kilda by 17

2012: Beat Bulldogs by 70
2013: Beat Bulldogs by 67

2012: Lost to Collingwood by 21
2013: Lost to Collingwood by 34

2012: Lost to Freo by 12 and 22
2013: Lost to Freo by 1

2012: Lost to Geelong by 12
2013: Lost to Geelong by 44

Pretty similar results there with the big one being the win over Carlton. Against the teams we've played, based on last year, we'd be 2-4.

 

[theflea]

Just as an aside. I think those numbers from 2012 are differentials(when applicable) while at the moment the 2013 are raw figures and not differentials which are miss leading until we are further into the season.

 

[Mr Magic]

OK there is plenty of talk at the moment about just what is wrong with us as we have slid from a 3-0 start to now being 3-3. So I thought I would take a look at the numbers and see if they can tell us anything.

End Of 2012 Season Averages Per Game:
Disposals - 380.7 ranked 1st
Contested Possession - 145.7 ranked 4th
Disposal Efficiency % - 73.6 ranked 4th
Clangers - 45.7 ranked equal 10th
Marks - 92.1 ranked 5th
Clearances - 38 ranked 9th
Centre Clearances - 14 ranked 3rd
Stoppages - 23.9 ranked 13th
Tackles - 62 ranked 10th
1% - 49.2 ranked 11th
I50 - 56.5 ranked 2nd
R50 - 33.4 ranked 17th

After 6 Rounds 2013 Averages Per Game
Disposals - 354.8 ranked 8th down 25.9
Contested Possessions - 140 ranked 14th down 5.7
Disposal Efficiency % - 71.7 ranked 5th down 1.9
Clangers - 51.2 ranked 4th up 5.5
Marks - 88.3 ranked equal 7th down 3.8
Clearances - 35.7 ranked 13th down 2.3
Centre Clearances - 14.8 ranked 5th up 0.8
Stoppages - 20.8 ranked 14th down 3.1
Tackles - 48.3 ranked 18th down 13.7
1% - 47.2 ranked 7th down 2
I50 - 52.7 ranked 10th down 3.8
R50 - 37 ranked 13th up 3.6

As you can see from the above, compared to how we finished the 2012 season to how we've started this season our numbers are down in all bar 2 areas. Given the drop off in some of the areas is it any wonder that the last 3 weeks have seen us struggle. One can only hope that things turn around soon or it could see us drop too far behind and unable to recover.

you have to take account of the opposition.

EG, we have not played GWS, GC, Melb etc.. yet!!

 

[CoggaRules]

What's different? We went from playing the blues (first game with a new coach) Saints and Dogs (crap sides) to playing 3 preseason top 4 hopefuls in Collingwood, Freo (away) and Geelong.

We're beating the sides we should put away but yet to really pinch a scalp that proves we're ready to do more than make up the numbers in September.

and that is what I think it the basis for the dissapointment in here and especially in the coach's box...the Freo game was the one that got away big time, that game would have afforded the plan a hiccup down the track.

Dont know it has been discussed, but to we really want to be the next Kangaroos? I mean, they have made September action and having their arses reamed an art form in the last few years..

 

[1980GFVideo]

you have to take account of the opposition.

EG, we have not played GWS, GC, Melb etc.. yet!!

I do it too mate. Still refer to Gold Coast as easy beats. Bloody embarrassing when someone asks me how much we beat them by.

 

[Bazzar]

Round 6 2012 - 12 th 2 wins 4 losses 531 For 520 Agn 102.12 %
Round 6 2013 - 9 th 3 wins 3 Losses 586 For 576 Agn 101.74 %

Tracking similar on the ladder.

 

[nobulltiger]

What's different? We went from playing the blues (first game with a new coach) Saints and Dogs (crap sides) to playing 3 preseason top 4 hopefuls in Collingwood, Freo (away) and Geelong.

We're beating the sides we should put away but yet to really pinch a scalp that proves we're ready to do more than make up the numbers in September.

I thought beating carlton, finally, was a scalp!!?

 

[Bazzar]

I thought beating carlton, finally, was a scalp!!?

Would be beat Carlton if we played them this Saturday? Some how with the form both teams are in i would doubt it.

 

[tigers_of_old_08]

The stat that I find most glaring is our I50s, from 2nd in 2012, to ranked 10th so far this season.

 

[tunksy]

The stat that I find most glaring is our I50s, from 2nd in 2012, to ranked 10th so far this season.

we are now very conscious of how we go into 50. a fair few of our attempts have been cut off just short of our 50. freo game is the perfect example. so many entries cut off.

 

[Madison]

You need to post differentials for stats like clearances and contested possessions. I saw in the age yesterday we are 7th and 5th I think it was for the those two.

Raw stats are misleading, differentials are a much much better indicator.

 

[Del65166]

To quote a bit from The Age
"It's not about the clearance it is about retaining it or the quality of your exit from the clearance. The Bulldogs are the perfect example, they clear it with a hacked kick forward but the opposition marks it and the Dogs don't have the leg speed to spread and cover the ground," a coach said.
"It's about putting enough pressure on the clearance kick and then on the ball carrier once it comes out of the clearance. So it is about the quality of possession or quality of clearance and the first possession after a clearance."
Clubs have therefore increasingly focused on the number of unbroken chains of play in moving the ball from defence to attack, and then to score. Consequently they also measure themselves on their ability to break opposition transitions to attack.


Read more: http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/the-contest-is-up-20130506-2j3p2.html#ixzz2SgCBdDOq

Sounds like there is a new stat in town....first possession after a clearance

 

[Bazzar]

Sounds like there is a new stat in town....first possession after a clearance

CH Data has been using this one for a few years now.

 

[Tzatziki_Man]

Player dissection.

2013 compared to 2012

MOST IMPORTANT PLAYERS
Trent Cotchin - same 2012 -
Jack Riewoldt - same 2012 -
Brett Deledio - same 2012 -
Dustin Martin - up 2012 -
Ivan Maric - down
Shane Tuck - down

B GRADERS
Shaun Grigg - down
Alex Rance - down
Bachar Houli - same/down
Jake Bachelor - down
Chris Newman - down
Robin Nahas - BIG down
Steve Morris - down
Brandon Ellis - up
Shane Edwards - up
Reece Conca - up (INJURED)
Jake King - same
Tyrone Vickery - same (as of 2011 form)
Dylan Grimes - same


C GRADERS
Luke McGuane - up
Matt White - up
Daniel Jackson - same

NEW RECRUITS
Chris Knights - up
Troy Chaplin - down (INJURED)
Ricky Pettard - same
Orren Stephenson - VFL
Sam Lonergan - VFL
Aaron Edwards - VFL

DEVELOPING PLAYERS
Tom Derickx - gone
Matt Arnot - up
Liam McBean - good
Todd Elton - good
Nick Vlastuin - good
Ben Griffiths - down
Matt Dea - same/up
Ben Darrou - same/up
Steven Verrier - same/up
Brett O'Hanlon - same/down
Cadeyn Williams - ???
Matthew McDonough - ???
Kamdyn McIntosh - ???

Nathan Foley LTI List
Nathan Foley - VFL (INJURED)
David Astbury - VFL (INJURED)
Brad Helbig - VFL (INJURED)

12 players are DOWN
8 players are UP
13 players are SAME as 2012
Some are VFL specialists
1's GONE already
Nathan Foley has claimed a couple on his LTI list.
We have way to many 'developing' players for my liking. I think we're still way to young to be thinking about top 8. We're relying on guys like McBean, Elton, Vlastuin, Ellis, Conca and Arnot to become players. We're not ready yet for the 8. We're not like any other club, we had nothing at the beginning of 2010, no senior players or anything now.
Basically, if the actual players on your list haven't improved by much, than how will a 12th placed finish in 2012 improve to anything more in 2013??? Our players haven't gotten much better if the first 1/4 of the year is what we're basing this on.

 

[chargers 09]

Edwards has certainly improved a tonne. Knights and Chaplin have clearly improved your side, I think the blokes that you've been picking up in second and third rounds in the past few years need to start making a name for themselves to improve more rapidly than the like of North and Essendon.

 

[TiggerMan22]

Player dissection.

2013 compared to 2012

MOST IMPORTANT PLAYERS
Trent Cotchin - same 2012 -
Jack Riewoldt - same 2012 -
Brett Deledio - same 2012 -
Dustin Martin - up 2012 -
Ivan Maric - down
Shane Tuck - down

I would say Cotchin is down on last year. He gets more of it but not many inside 50's, not as damaging and not as clean.
Also think Jack is playing much better than last year, especially his defensive efforts.

 

[docko911]

This is going to sound a bit positive but we are where we need to be.

If we had of beaten Collingwood or Geelong the roof would be off and we'd be thinking our shit didn't stink. Instead we have lost and have been found out in multiple areas.

BUT

Our form has been down and our best players have been woeful. Everyone now thinks we are not good enough so our players work harder and our opposition don't show as much respect. This is the right time to be underperforming and looking for our best team. Lets not forget when Foley, Tuck, Conca are all back with the rest of our team we will look very different. Our season starts this weekend and we will see how well we play with our backs to the wall I think we will put on a clinic especially lids and Jack.

 

[AstroboyUK]

There were definitely good signs against Freo: havent watched the Geelong game so cant comment on that.. but Im not losing any confidence yet. A win will help with supporters nerves a hell of alot though!