Past Ryan O'Keefe - 2012 Norm Smith medalist, retired 2014

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swansrule100 said:
True in a lot of ways

I guess i.dont want to see a star go out so poorly
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When Buddy was getting sucked up the ground I would have sent ROK to the goal square made Thompson(BOG) accountable instead of him hanging back for the easy ball, also freeing Buddy up more.
 

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skipper kelly said:
It's unreadable, but I have to remind myself that there are supporters of all ages and some haven't experienced hard times following Sydney.
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I cannot agree more with this point. I am 23 years old myself and my first Swans game was in 1999 against the Crows at the SCG (we thumped them by 100 odd points). A lot of the younger supporter base aren't used to seeing us struggle. Only missing the finals something like 2 times since 1996 is an incredible effort. Pretty lame effort by some supporters on here ripping into players especially like a club legend such as OKeefe particularly when more so called young and quicker players like Hanners, Mitchell, Parker, Jack didn't have much influence either. All round it was disappointing and the problem is clearly the game plan or lack of rather then just one individual. Effort and fitness also come into the equation and North simply wanted it more as did the Pies and Giants so far this year. There skill level and ability were no better than ours but they showed more effort. I remember Paul Roos said once that footy is a very simple game and the Swans aren't doing the simple things right. Could it be the playing roster simply isn't up to scratch or is there lack of hunger due to loads of success over the last couple of decades. I don't know. All I know is it's certainly not a crisis and just a bad patch for us which had been going on since mid last year. We just have to take the good with the bad.
 
Only goes out if someone better comes in. How many approx 7 possession games we see out of first gamers. If someone like Brandon Jack is ripping it apart in the ressies then yeah maybe otherwise coach should either rip into him or challenge him to go do a defensive forward role and play all over Scott Thompson like McGaffer on Cotchin style.

Baja beat me to it above
 
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Rhysswans13 said:
I cannot agree more with this point. I am 23 years old myself and my first Swans game was in 1999 against the Crows at the SCG (we thumped them by 100 odd points). A lot of the younger supporter base aren't used to seeing us struggle. Only missing the finals something like 2 times since 1996 is an incredible effort. Pretty lame effort by some supporters on here ripping into players especially like a club legend such as OKeefe particularly when more so called young and quicker players like Hanners, Mitchell, Parker, Jack didn't have much influence either. All round it was disappointing and the problem is clearly the game plan or lack of rather then just one individual. Effort and fitness also come into the equation and North simply wanted it more as did the Pies and Giants so far this year. There skill level and ability were no better than ours but they showed more effort. I remember Paul Roos said once that footy is a very simple game and the Swans aren't doing the simple things right. Could it be the playing roster simply isn't up to scratch or is there lack of hunger due to loads of success over the last couple of decades. I don't know. All I know is it's certainly not a crisis and just a bad patch for us which had been going on since mid last year. We just have to take the good with the bad.
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well said kid
 
To be fair the question of whether a champion's time is up is never an easy one to answer and in our hearts we are hoping the answer is not but in our heads most of us would probably be thinking yes at this point.
 
Rhysswans13 said:
I cannot agree more with this point. I am 23 years old myself and my first Swans game was in 1999 against the Crows at the SCG (we thumped them by 100 odd points). A lot of the younger supporter base aren't used to seeing us struggle. Only missing the finals something like 2 times since 1996 is an incredible effort. Pretty lame effort by some supporters on here ripping into players especially like a club legend such as OKeefe particularly when more so called young and quicker players like Hanners, Mitchell, Parker, Jack didn't have much influence either. All round it was disappointing and the problem is clearly the game plan or lack of rather then just one individual. Effort and fitness also come into the equation and North simply wanted it more as did the Pies and Giants so far this year. There skill level and ability were no better than ours but they showed more effort. I remember Paul Roos said once that footy is a very simple game and the Swans aren't doing the simple things right. Could it be the playing roster simply isn't up to scratch or is there lack of hunger due to loads of success over the last couple of decades. I don't know. All I know is it's certainly not a crisis and just a bad patch for us which had been going on since mid last year. We just have to take the good with the bad.
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Great post mate.:thumbsu:

The spark isn't there at the moment. Maybe, as you said, the hunger isn't there because of continued success. Maybe the players thought that by getting Franklin it would be easier and they have dropped off that little bit. We know they are good enough, but maybe not having Goodes out there is having the biggest impact of all. He is an absolute superstar who has lifted us with special moments more times than can be counted. Mumford is also a huge loss but we knew this. The loss of Bolton's onfield experience may also be understated.

And we have played s**t in the wet for many years. This is what I wish would be looked at. Why are we s**t in the wet?
 
RW said:
To be fair the question of whether a champion's time is up is never an easy one to answer and in our hearts we are hoping the answer is not but in our heads most of us would probably be thinking yes at this point.
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Its the vitriol from some 'supporters' and the "I told you so" from posters that make that many calls on everything that the law of averages makes them right now and then that shits me.
 
baja said:
Its the vitriol from some 'supporters' and the "I told you so" from posters that make that many calls on everything that the law of averages makes them right now and then that shits me.
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We all have high expectations of our team, and have different ways of expressing it when those expectations aren't realised.
 

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Sadly, and I say sadly, there comes a time of reality, not sure how long we hang on, however you need to make the hard decisions sometimes, let's take Geelong as an example, how hard is it for them to see Paul Chapman running around in a Bombers jumper, the guy was like a spiritual leader of the club, but the made the hard decision knowing full well the Chappy is and will always be a great player, but they've decided to invest 20+ games into the next generation, so do we bite the bullet now and follow suit? or do we tinker and hope, Ryno is not the only one here, Shaw needs to hurry back into form, some decisions today were perplexing,
Sadly there comes a time, perhaps this time is closer than we had all hoped for..
Yes clubs including ours have down patches, but there are still areas you can control and plan for,
Next few weeks are going to be very interesting...
I'm sure we'll turn it around,
 
Rhysswans13 said:
I cannot agree more with this point. I am 23 years old myself and my first Swans game was in 1999 against the Crows at the SCG (we thumped them by 100 odd points). A lot of the younger supporter base aren't used to seeing us struggle. Only missing the finals something like 2 times since 1996 is an incredible effort. Pretty lame effort by some supporters on here ripping into players especially like a club legend such as OKeefe particularly when more so called young and quicker players like Hanners, Mitchell, Parker, Jack didn't have much influence either. All round it was disappointing and the problem is clearly the game plan or lack of rather then just one individual. Effort and fitness also come into the equation and North simply wanted it more as did the Pies and Giants so far this year. There skill level and ability were no better than ours but they showed more effort. I remember Paul Roos said once that footy is a very simple game and the Swans aren't doing the simple things right. Could it be the playing roster simply isn't up to scratch or is there lack of hunger due to loads of success over the last couple of decades. I don't know. All I know is it's certainly not a crisis and just a bad patch for us which had been going on since mid last year. We just have to take the good with the bad.
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You have to ask why we were so bad ! There is a reason. But I dont know what it is.
 
After today's team performance, Rhino gets played every week because none of the others, apart from Smith gave 100% for the whole game.
A few weeks ago when I still thought we were going to be world beaters, I thought Rhino needed to have a break in the twos but he is still way ahead of some of the guys that were out there today after seeing how down we were.
If fit, we play him to 300 games. I don't care for finals unless we play better then today.
Finals take care of themselves when our players give their all. Today was well short of that.
Here are some players not even at 80% either through fitness, injury or effort.
K Jack, Hanners, Rohan, Shaw, Jetta.

If players made mistakes today well I can forgive for that. Rhino tried harder than most of the guys above.
It might not have been great but he had a crack to the best of his current ability.
 
Tedeski said:
After today's team performance, Rhino gets played every week because none of the others, apart from Smith gave 100% for the whole game.
A few weeks ago when I still thought we were going to be world beaters, I thought Rhino needed to have a break in the twos but he is still way ahead of some of the guys that were out there today after seeing how down we were.
If fit, we play him to 300 games. I don't care for finals unless we play better then today.
Finals take care of themselves when our players give their all. Today was well short of that.
Here are some players not even at 80% either through fitness, injury or effort.
K Jack, Hanners, Rohan, Shaw, Jetta.

If players made mistakes today well I can forgive for that. Rhino tried harder than most of the guys above.
It might not have been great but he had a crack to the best of his current ability.
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Just not true.

Here's the figures for the players named (Left Rohan out as he was sub... not fair to compare him).
rok.jpg
of the players you named, ROK has the lowest number of possessions, worst effective disposal ratio, equal most clangers, equal least inside 50s, only Jetta got less clearances, he had zero 1%ers, and had the most time on ground out of all of them. Basically he was bottom in pretty much every single stat.

He can run around and show all the effort in the world, but he's just not affecting the game.
 
Tedeski said:
After today's team performance, Rhino gets played every week because none of the others, apart from Smith gave 100% for the whole game.
A few weeks ago when I still thought we were going to be world beaters, I thought Rhino needed to have a break in the twos but he is still way ahead of some of the guys that were out there today after seeing how down we were.
If fit, we play him to 300 games. I don't care for finals unless we play better then today.
Finals take care of themselves when our players give their all. Today was well short of that.
Here are some players not even at 80% either through fitness, injury or effort.
K Jack, Hanners, Rohan, Shaw, Jetta.

If players made mistakes today well I can forgive for that. Rhino tried harder than most of the guys above.
It might not have been great but he had a crack to the best of his current ability.
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I will respectfully disagree. Trotting around 5-10 metres behind your opponent for the whole match and jumping 10 cm off the ground in a smothering "attempt" is not trying hard. His opponents had little to no physical pressure put on them at all. He looked slow and he looked lazy.
 
As a neutral, it is a shame. Loved his game in the grand final (jeez I should I had $200 on him for the Norm Smith that day lol), but it comes a time where unfortunately some calls need to be made. Replacing O'Keefe with a 'runner' is not a bad thing, you guys have enough grunt in Kennedy, etc. O'Keefe wasn't the worst but he is probably the most expendable. Either that or perhaps he plays forward full time. He is not physically able to play in the middle (and at 33 that isn't that much of a surprise to be fair). I hope he gets to 300, you could even just have him as the sub in your easier games.
 
bombersno1 said:
As a neutral, it is a shame. Loved his game in the grand final (jeez I should I had $200 on him for the Norm Smith that day lol), but it comes a time where unfortunately some calls need to be made. Replacing O'Keefe with a 'runner' is not a bad thing, you guys have enough grunt in Kennedy, etc. O'Keefe wasn't the worst but he is probably the most expendable. Either that or perhaps he plays forward full time. He is not physically able to play in the middle (and at 33 that isn't that much of a surprise to be fair). I hope he gets to 300, you could even just have him as the sub in your easier games.
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I'm not sure we are going to have many "easy games" the way we are playing.
 
db swannie said:
I'm not sure we are going to have many "easy games" the way we are playing.
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That is true but you can at least try. You will be better once Kurt Tippett, Brandon Jack and Goodes come back. Still a LONG way to go.
 
replicant said:
Just not true.

Here's the figures for the players named (Left Rohan out as he was sub... not fair to compare him).
View attachment 51517
of the players you named, ROK has the lowest number of possessions, worst effective disposal ratio, equal most clangers, equal least inside 50s, only Jetta got less clearances, he had zero 1%ers, and had the most time on ground out of all of them. Basically he was bottom in pretty much every single stat.

He can run around and show all the effort in the world, but he's just not affecting the game.
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Straight back at ya, just not true.

If you just wanna talk stats, Derickx, LRT, BUDDY FRANKLIN, and Rohan all faired worst than ROK in the stats dept., with players like Grundy, Jetta, Cunningham, Pyke smashed in the ruck and all just a kick or handball or a couple of eff% points and/or ranking points away from ROK..
Can you show me a stat from the last player up from the bottom of a pack on the rare occasions it was in ROKS area?

Im not disputing he is well off his best but give him a break its the whole team that needs to be addressed.
 
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