Western Bulldogs Limbo Club

[Mutt]

Makes sense with size he's put on, I'm on that train. I'm thinking Bonts will be our Pav.

I agree completely - from the first time I saw Bontempelli play in the seniors I've wondered whether he could be the mobile CHF we are hanging out for. If he ends up 195 or 196cm and retains the attributes he displayed in his rookie year, we may have a great pairing: Boyd and Bontempelli as the key forwards.

 

[Morris Major]

Yep understand fully, just we haven't drafted anyone over 192cm in the last three draft periods.

Convenient numbers because that's String's height? And Michael Talia was drafted 4 draft periods ago?

Where do we draw the line?

 

[TedDougChris]

Makes sense with size he's put on, I'm on that train. I'm thinking Bonts will be our Pav.

Stringer is Pav, Bontempelli is Kouta - esque.....

 

[doggies ftw]

I agree completely - from the first time I saw Bontempelli play in the seniors I've wondered whether he could be the mobile CHF we are hanging out for. If he ends up 195 or 196cm and retains the attributes he displayed in his rookie year, we may have a great pairing: Boyd and Bontempelli as the key forwards.

Throw in Stringer and we could actually have 3 elite tall forwards in the same team, thats unheard of for the Bulldogs. It makes me scared even just thinking about it tbh

 

[womble54]

Who was saying that, if you dont mind me asking?

Someone senior but not Beverage. In context of the conversation it was more in the vein of - haven't the guys all got bigger, stringer getting huge etc. Bonti has put on 6kg and "looks like he could even cope at CHF." It wasn't the coach though and it'll be his call ultimately how he structures. Think everyone both internal and external is just getting rightly excited about our guns

 

[doggies ftw]

Someone senior but not Beverage. In context of the conversation it was more in the vein of - haven't the guys all got bigger, stringer getting huge etc. Bonti has put on 6kg and "looks like he could even cope at CHF." It wasn't the coach though and it'll be his call ultimately how he structures. Think everyone both internal and external is just getting rightly excited about our guns

Cheers, yeah I'm bloody excited at how this team is shaping up. Its seriously the best list of kids I've seen at the club and probably at other clubs besides the expansion teams of course (although have never watched other teams as closely obviously) some seriously exciting times ahead. People rated us pretty highly for the future after the end of our 2013 season but after this year were flying under the radar a bit now, obviously from the outside looking in weve had our captain walk away and our coach sacked so of course you can understand that, but I'm very confident we are going to surprise a hell of a lot of people next year. Just waiting for that switch to be flicked now... It'll happen.

 

[Doggies7]

Can you imagine a forward line of:

Hunter --- Bont --- Stringer
Crameri --- Boyd --- Dahl

Would be absolutely incredible. So unique and tough to match up on, 4 big guys who can take grabs, but also kick goals on the run and pressure on the ground. Dahl and Hunter perfect agile small forwards who are both potential stars and may get to the Robbie Gray type FWD level with a bit of luck.

That. Is. Exciting.

 

[BRWB]

You are already at the point where you are concerned. I have stated for ages on here that our KPD's worry me. I am not having throw-offs yet though. Let's see how Talia, Roberts, Hamling, Roughead, Z.Cordy and perhaps Redpath go this next season and then pull all stops out to find a solution if we still think we have a problem.

Yep that is where its at I think.

Bontempelli is 194cm.

Yeah I wondered that to, then I checked the Bulldogs site and he was listed at 192cm. http://www.westernbulldogs.com.au/team/players/senior

If Bonts can play CHF well then we are sorted for KPFs. Then its up to Fletch, Talia and Hamling to grab their opportunity (and hope Rough stays fit)

Anyway what's done is done wish the boys well for next year.

And for those interested, really interesting post on our drafting approach on Woof http://www.woof.net.au/forum/showthread.php?14004-Our-Drafting-Philosophy

Makes a case that we are actually needs drafting as opposed to best available, really quite interesting.

 

[Mofra]

Bontempelli is 194cm.

He was 191cm or 192cm when drafted, considered a big raw mid. I'm not sure it was contemplated he'd grow that much bigger - he has a decent leap too doesn't he?

He'll be an interesting one to watch - we spent years wishing we had two Bob Murphys (forward and back) and I guess we'll be wanting two Bontis (forward & mid) for the next decade.

 

[Black Dog]

I yearn for the days of 2007 when our list profile for height was much better balanced. Twelve out of 36 players were 190cm or over. You'd probably have to discount shorties who didn't add much to the list like Hargrave (190), Morris (190) and that hack Grant (193) but it was more than made up for by the quality players like McDougall (197), Wight (200) and Street (211).

 

[Mofra]

I yearn for the days of 2007 when our list profile for height was much better balanced. Twelve out of 36 players were 190cm or over. You'd probably have to discount shorties who didn't add much to the list like Hargrave (190), Morris (190) and that hack Grant (193) but it was more than made up for by the quality players like McDougall (197), Wight (200) and Street (211).

Would that be the list that was about to appear in three prelims in a row?
One where we were, by all accounts, just one more KPP away from appearing in a GF?

 

[BRWB]

I yearn for the days of 2007 when our list profile for height was much better balanced. Twelve out of 36 players were 190cm or over. You'd probably have to discount shorties who didn't add much to the list like Hargrave (190), Morris (190) and that hack Grant (193) but it was more than made up for by the quality players like McDougall (197), Wight (200) and Street (211).

I yearn for the days when we drafted tall players who were any good.....

When were those days....?

Now I just want to see us try.....but hey if we end with the list above, as you seem to imply - best to not bother.

No doubt it will sort itself out and we won't have an undersized KPP group when we are good again........because that just wouldn't happen....

edit mofra beat me to it...

 

[Mattdougie]

So we take our best young midfielder with an absolutely unique skill set at that role and turn him into a CHF coz we need one??

Leaving our midfield to completely undersized guys who are all pretty similar?

Maybe just draft or trade for a bloody CHF and stop getting short people and keep Bonts where he will be best and I believe nearly unstoppable. And then he can "rest" in the forward line as the third option.

And my news is that at the end of 2015 we will have our chf so Bobts is not and shoild b it be the answer

 

[TempleKelvington]

Yep that is where its at I think.


Yeah I wondered that to, then I checked the Bulldogs site and he was listed at 192cm. http://www.westernbulldogs.com.au/team/players/senior

If Bonts can play CHF well then we are sorted for KPFs. Then its up to Fletch, Talia and Hamling to grab their opportunity (and hope Rough stays fit)

Anyway what's done is done wish the boys well for next year.

And for those interested, really interesting post on our drafting approach on Woof http://www.woof.net.au/forum/showthread.php?14004-Our-Drafting-Philosophy

Makes a case that we are actually needs drafting as opposed to best available, really quite interesting.

Thanks for the link to that it was an interesting point of view and I'm sure we have recruited this way for some players.

But even if it is needs based recruiting that we have been doing you won't be taking too many duds with a pick just to fix a need. The player still has to be the best available even if it for that need. I reckon it would be rare for a list not to have a couple of needs. I remain convinced that if we rated a KP defender ahead of the mids, we would have taken him. That's what best available means to me.

 

[BRWB]

So we take our best young midfielder with an absolutely unique skill set at that role and turn him into a CHF coz we need one??

Leaving our midfield to completely undersized guys who are all pretty similar?

Maybe just draft or trade for a bloody CHF and stop getting short people and keep Bonts where he will be best and I believe nearly unstoppable. And then he can "rest" in the forward line as the third option.

And my news is that at the end of 2015 we will have our chf so Bobts is not and shoild b it be the answer

Is your mate Liam coming back?

 

[Struggle]

He was 191cm or 192cm when drafted, considered a big raw mid. I'm not sure it was contemplated he'd grow that much bigger - he has a decent leap too doesn't he?

He'll be an interesting one to watch - we spent years wishing we had two Bob Murphys (forward and back) and I guess we'll be wanting two Bontis (forward & mid) for the next decade.

Only two?

 

[Mattdougie]

Is your mate Liam coming back?

Lol no although I had a massive go at him a couple weeks ago saying why didn't you do this much work extra work at the dogs.

He was honey and said first year he wasn't alloweed to due to injury and work load rates by sports science and last year he was mentally gone and broken. Can't be anymore honest that than

 

[stefoid]

Throw in Stringer and we could actually have 3 elite tall forwards in the same team, thats unheard of for the Bulldogs. It makes me scared even just thinking about it tbh

Or, the most brutally huge and talented midfield in the league.

Bonts, Macrae and (eventually) Stringer will spend time resting forward, but charging forward from the midfield to get on the end of someone elses work is much more useful than stranding them in the forward line. By the same token, having three 192cm+ guys running back into defence from themidfield is just going to s**t the opposition off no end!

 

[immortalmike]

He was 191cm or 192cm when drafted, considered a big raw mid. I'm not sure it was contemplated he'd grow that much bigger - he has a decent leap too doesn't he?

He'll be an interesting one to watch - we spent years wishing we had two Bob Murphys (forward and back) and I guess we'll be wanting two Bontis (forward & mid) for the next decade.

Was taking the piss.
But it does illustrate a point now that I think about it. These guys are only kids/teens really. Some may still grow an inch or so.

I'm on record as saying I want three Bob Murphys. One in every region of the ground.

 

[immortalmike]

Would that be the list that was about to appear in three prelims in a row?
One where we were, by all accounts, just one more KPP away from appearing in a GF?

Not by all accounts!

 

[BRWB]

Convenient numbers because that's String's height? And Michael Talia was drafted 4 draft periods ago?

Where do we draw the line?

Not really mate just going with the thought that genuine KPPs are 195cm plus these days, setting the bar at 192cm was being generous, but many don't agree.

 

[dogwatch]

Lol no although I had a massive go at him a couple weeks ago saying why didn't you do this much work extra work at the dogs.

He was honey and said first year he wasn't alloweed to due to injury and work load rates by sports science and last year he was mentally gone and broken. Can't be anymore honest that than

Wait a minute, why was he "mentally gone and broken"? Is he the fragile type or was it the environment, or (I hesitate to mention his name) was it the coach? Or a bit of all three.

Surely we can learn a lesson from this, especially if it wasn't just the coach (now ex-coach) giving him a hard time.

 

[Black Dog]

Would that be the list that was about to appear in three prelims in a row?
One where we were, by all accounts, just one more KPP away from appearing in a GF?

We were a bit further away than that I would have thought, and you left out the key word "quality" in front of KPP. And McDougall, Wight, Street, Skipper, Everitt added precisely what? Mofra and BRWB I know you want more talls to our list but there is no point adding s**t ones (Not that you're advocating that). We have added Boyd, Hamling and Cordy this year, I don't completely understand why you guys are so focused on this tall thing. Looking at the make up of our list we are probably better off trading in quality talls rather than drafting marginal late draft prospects anyway.

 

[Mattdougie]

Wait a minute, why was he "mentally gone and broken"? Is he the fragile type or was it the environment, or (I hesitate to mention his name) was it the coach? Or a bit of all three.

Surely we can learn a lesson from this, especially if it wasn't just the coach (now ex-coach) giving him a hard time.

He just didn't like Macca mate

Don't actually think either are 2 blame just 2 blokes that didn't like the way each operated

 

[Mofra]

We were a bit further away than that I would have thought, and you left out the key word "quality" in front of KPP. And McDougall, Wight, Street, Skipper, Everitt added precisely what? Mofra and BRWB I know you want more talls to our list but there is no point adding s**t ones (Not that you're advocating that). We have added Boyd, Hamling and Cordy this year, I don't completely understand why you guys are so focused on this tall thing. Looking at the make up of our list we are probably better off trading in quality talls rather than drafting marginal late draft prospects anyway.

I understand your point that crap talls are not worth the space - but drafting is a numbers game, and not every kid you draft is going to make it. Unfortunately if you want 2 KPDs you probably have to draft 4 and have a number of them developing at any one time. E.g. in 2007 we had Wight & McDougall on the list - but also Lake, Morris & Williams. Our KPD nucleus was on the list at the time (as was our rebounding power from the defensive half).

Consider at our ruck stocks - Minno is a clear no 1, but we have 2 developing and some suggest that's a bit thin (although Roughy can pinch hit if we get desperate).

We have addressed a few of our list concerns this off-season (big fan of the Boyd deal, ditto Biggs, happy enough we've got good ball users at the draft) but I would have liked us to find a genuine KPD - of course that's predicated on my doubts about our current stocks which are doubts not everyone will agree on.
In addition, I think we have an over-abundance of a specific type on our list (small midfielder/forward) and this represents a list imbalance - again, that is conjecture as others will disagree.