News Thomas and Keefe - 2 year ban - Trade, De-List, Rookie

[BEEG]

Dave the problem is that there are lots of footballers doing this 'stupid' behaviour.

IMO the problem here is that these guys will most likely lose their career for 'cheating' despite not doing so.

IMO the laws need changing. Recreational drug use does not equal cheating, it is not uncommon and it should be legal.

This is a society problem not an AFL problem i think some people need to understand AFL footballers are no different to your average joe who like a drink or a big night out

 

[BEEG]

By my definition 8 out of a list of 40 doing lines on the eve of a new season = 20% of players not 100% committed. Hmm that means by definition 80% are 100% committed so thanks for making me feel better.

Honestly this doesn't mean there not committed they came back from a brutal trip in NZ and had a day out after working there asses off

I am not saying its right they are paid to be professional but these athletes doing a bit of coke isn't going to affect there performance

 

[Old Spice]

What I'm wondering is, what is the penalty if the coke theory is right. I mean, if it was steak they would get off wouldn't they? But because it would be for an illicit drug, what would happen? They still wouldn't have done it deliberately, but my guess is they'd still get 2 years because it would be seen as reckless or something. Any ideas?

Stokes was busted years ago for cocaine possession, so if the defence - accidental taking of PED - then they might get some softer penalty in theory. But I just don't see the club condoning that type of thing.

 

[TradeDraft]

This is a society problem not an AFL problem i think some people need to understand AFL footballers are no different to your average joe who like a drink or a big night out

But when they Sign up to be a AFL Player. You sign that you can’t do that

 

[BEEG]

But when they Sign up to be a AFL Player. You sign that you can’t do that

You sign on your contract you can't go out?

 

[Giddy Up]

The other 6 whoever they are should consider themselves lucky. Thats not to say all 8 of them were doing coke either.

 

[TradeDraft]

You sign on your contract you can't go out?

Not that Specfic but you sign that during the Footy Season you don’t have any Social Life

 

[TradeDraft]

 

[Gymnorhina tibic]

Honestly this doesn't mean there not committed they came back from a brutal trip in NZ and had a day out after working there asses off

I am not saying its right they are paid to be professional but these athletes doing a bit of coke isn't going to affect there performance

If you are Ablett Snr or Buddy then by all means but if you spent most of your time in the VFL last year and this is your last chance then come home and work your ass off some more

 

[Chameleon75]

Let's deal in hypotheticals and maybe the coke dealer got their hands on a truckload of clen at a very cheap price
and needed to use it somehow.

I know what you are saying is logical but we are talking about illegal drugs an logic doesn't come into play with dealers.

Drug dealers are pretty logical when it comes to money, I posted a link on here earlier, there is more money in selling clen than selling coke, much greater margins, they're not going to forgo a larger profit for a smaller one.

 

[davywap]

Davywap taking drugs to cheat and get an advantage is a lot worse than illegal drug taking for personnel gratification......In my eyes anyway!

We still have got another 13 days of these rumours.......It's not a good situation for Collingwood to be placed in at all. April 14 cannot come around quick enough

taking drugs is taking drugs, both ways are illegal and both are damaging to your body. how can you think one is more acceptable than the other?

 

[davywap]

An enormous amount of young males do party drugs

and?

 

[Gone Critical]

Drug dealers are pretty logical when it comes to money, I posted a link on here earlier, there is more money in selling clen than selling coke, much greater margins, they're not going to forgo a larger profit for a smaller one.

I would think the complete opposite. As far as businesses goI think drug dealing would be one of the least based on logic. Crims make dumb decisions all the time. At the lower end of the chain we are not dealing with great intellects. They will be under all sorts of "unusual" pressures compared to the couple running your local milk bar. So while it may be an unusual occurrence that time to time drug mixes don't make total economic sense seems pretty logical to me. No one is proclaiming to know that cocaine and Clen are regularly mixed but to say it never happens is something no one can have a hope of knowing.

 

[davywap]

Dave the problem is that there are lots of footballers doing this 'stupid' behaviour.

IMO the problem here is that these guys will most likely lose their career for 'cheating' despite not doing so.

IMO the laws need changing. Recreational drug use does not equal cheating, it is not uncommon and it should be legal.

You're trolling right?

 

[davywap]

Yes. More people die from cigarettes and alcohol.

I wish police would spend more time chasing real criminals.

 

[davywap]

Honestly this doesn't mean there not committed they came back from a brutal trip in NZ and had a day out after working there asses off

I am not saying its right they are paid to be professional but these athletes doing a bit of coke isn't going to affect there performance

Looks like it's affected their entire career if you ask me

 

[partylikeits1990]

If our boys win the flag this year I'll buy them an 8 ball myself, big difference doing on the eve of a new season.

How do i like this twice?

 

[Chameleon75]

I would think the complete opposite. As far as businesses goI think drug dealing would be one of the least based on logic. Crims make dumb decisions all the time. At the lower end of the chain we are not dealing with great intellects. They will be under all sorts of "unusual" pressures compared to the couple running your local milk bar. So while it may be an unusual occurrence that time to time drug mixes don't make total economic sense seems pretty logical to me. No one is proclaiming to know that cocaine and Clen are regularly mixed but to say it never happens is something no one can have a hope of knowing.

drug dealers are risk takers, they're not stupid though, and they certainly know how to make a buck, they're motivation is purely profit and they know the product. your looking at $1k/g vs $7k/g, if anything the coke would be used to cut the clen not the other way around.

 

[Heir_Apparent]

I've never had a bad experience with drugs, because I knew what I was doing.
So did the doctors that were doing Arnold Schwarzenegger's cycles and the countless other athletes that have won a gold or a championship, they all knew what they were doing. Drugs among athletes is huge and impossible to stop, because if they get away with it then they are elite physically, any body can be elite physically with drugs, why not let them?
I say let athletes use drugs. We will see freaks of nature far quicker rather than waiting for evolution.
I personally want to see genetically modified humans with wings or super strength and giants play AFL, a variety of freaks.
Since when did society become so uptight.
Buddy has been busted countless times with illicit drugs in his system. Why is it such a non issue? Coz he's Buddy.
Clen isn't even a steroid or anything worth caring about, sure it's potentially deadly, but that's the risk kids are willing to take, so why not let them?
I'm pretty sure in the 70's there weren't any rules, you had players have beers and smoke weed after games, these are the players I want to watch, no restrictions, if you're good enough you're gonna make it and if you're willing to risk your health by taking performance enhancers than go ahead.
Don't forget Cousins, no doubt he was slamming down lines at half-time during his career. Players knew he did it, but they let him, because he was freaking good and kept running all freaking day, he won a brownlow, a self confessed drug user, he still owns a brownlow and won a flag or two.
Let them do it, they get away with it anyway, win brownlows and flags, they are always and forever going to risk it, so let them do it.
Little bit of Clen didn't hurt anybody, just got them lean, so what, all of us eat our tortured drugged cow meat and chickens everyday, we don't care about that, but sportsman and athletes that perform to entertain us?? ohhh no, can't have any advantage except your born physical capabilities, don't restrict em, you are all brain washed just like valentines day buying s**t, this is no big deal, *in clen, seriously.

 

[nahnah]

I would think the complete opposite. As far as businesses goI think drug dealing would be one of the least based on logic. Crims make dumb decisions all the time. At the lower end of the chain we are not dealing with great intellects. They will be under all sorts of "unusual" pressures compared to the couple running your local milk bar. So while it may be an unusual occurrence that time to time drug mixes don't make total economic sense seems pretty logical to me. No one is proclaiming to know that cocaine and Clen are regularly mixed but to say it never happens is something no one can have a hope of knowing.

nope they are usually very smart, the dumb ones aren't successful in making or selling and get caught. Don't mistake a persons intelligence with their ethical standards. They know what they're selling and they know the market. They don't use the drug they sell, its purely money making and a lot of them are damn good at it. Think about it, they make their own product as cheap as possible, they identify their targets and then sell the drug. Whilst keeping it all hidden from the police/government. Thats not easy, no normal person can do that successfully. They also have a duty to themselves to make sure the drug won't kill the user so that they aren't killing off their own profits.
Of course there may be some dumb ass druggo that tries his hand at dealing and gets caught.

 

[partylikeits1990]

So how far do you want to take "side by side"… when they are proven guilty on the 14th of April do their 6 mates that were with them at St Kilda fest also own up to taking the same substance and out themselves because "side by side" or do they say ah bad luck lads you're on your own now? I'd expect the other 6 won't be saying too much about their use of substances, but i'm also pretty sure the club already knew by Monday's press conference exactly what had happened and who took what at St Kilda and also during their last night in Queenstown. Just maybe this didn't happen at St Kilda and it happened while "celebrating" the end of the NZ 'training' camp...

Sounds like you're having a bob each way mate.

Any one else know anything about the "end of NZ training camp" theory?

If not it's possible that Lachlan & Josh are trying to implicate their own team mates in a scandal to protect themselves. That's not side by side......

 

[mike123]

I've never had a bad experience with drugs, because I knew what I was doing.
So did the doctors that were doing Arnold Schwarzenegger's cycles and the countless other athletes that have won a gold or a championship, they all knew what they were doing. Drugs among athletes is huge and impossible to stop, because if they get away with it then they are elite physically, any body can be elite physically with drugs, why not let them?
I say let athletes use drugs. We will see freaks of nature far quicker rather than waiting for evolution.
I personally want to see genetically modified humans with wings or super strength and giants play AFL, a variety of freaks.
Since when did society become so uptight.
Buddy has been busted countless times with illicit drugs in his system. Why is it such a non issue? Coz he's Buddy.
Clen isn't even a steroid or anything worth caring about, sure it's potentially deadly, but that's the risk kids are willing to take, so why not let them?
I'm pretty sure in the 70's there weren't any rules, you had players have beers and smoke weed after games, these are the players I want to watch, no restrictions, if you're good enough you're gonna make it and if you're willing to risk your health by taking performance enhancers than go ahead.
Don't forget Cousins, no doubt he was slamming down lines at half-time during his career. Players knew he did it, but they let him, because he was freaking good and kept running all freaking day, he won a brownlow, a self confessed drug user, he still owns a brownlow and won a flag or two.
Let them do it, they get away with it anyway, win brownlows and flags, they are always and forever going to risk it, so let them do it.
Little bit of Clen didn't hurt anybody, just got them lean, so what, all of us eat our tortured drugged cow meat and chickens everyday, we don't care about that, but sportsman and athletes that perform to entertain us?? ohhh no, can't have any advantage except your born physical capabilities, don't restrict em, you are all brain washed just like valentines day buying s**t, this is no big deal, ****in clen, seriously.

Because clubs may pressure players into taking potential harmfull drugs. Once some people start taking it, other also may feel that they have to take the risk in order to compete. Once this starts happening soon all players will be forced to do drugs. Once all players start doing drugs then no one gains an advantage. When no one gains an advantage, people are just putting them selves at risk for no reason.

 

[partylikeits1990]

They will be under all sorts of "unusual" pressures compared to the couple running your local milk bar.

This would apply to a footballer in and out of an AFL senior side.

 

[Heir_Apparent]

Because clubs may pressure players into taking potential harmfull drugs. Once some people start taking it, other also may feel that they have to take the risk in order to compete. Once this starts happening soon all players will be forced to do drugs. Once all players start doing drugs then no one gains an advantage. When no one gains an advantage, people are just putting them selves at risk for no reason.

We have the technology to create specialized drugs, from the atom up, drugs that have zero harmful side effects.
I don't understand why society is brainwashed to believe this is a bad thing.... A pill that repairs your organs and a pill that replenishes your blood. We are already making pills to cure certain cancers and these are being suppressed, this world is seriously upside down sometimes.
As if clubs and players would want to smash harmful substances into the players. It more harmful if the players are getting the drugs from unknown sources, they are always going to risk it, baseball players, swimmers, boxers you name it, literally any athlete benefits from taking performance enhancers.
Let's take our Christianised society glasses off for 1 minute.

 

[mike123]

We have the technology to create specialized drugs, from the atom up, drugs that have zero harmful side effects.
I don't understand why society is brainwashed to believe this is a bad thing.... A pill that repairs your organs and a pill that replenishes your blood. We are already making pills to cure certain cancers and these are being suppressed, this world is seriously upside down sometimes.
As if clubs and players would want to smash harmful substances into the players. It more harmful if the players are getting the drugs from unknown sources, they are always going to risk it, baseball players, swimmers, boxers you name it, literally any athlete benefits from taking performance enhancers.
Let's take our Christianised society glasses off for 1 minute.

"but that's the risk kids are willing to take, so why not let them?"

Your the one who brought up risk in the first place now your taking it down on the fly just to suit your argument.