Hawthorn’s 2019 Trade/FA - Targets/Incoming players discussion only

[HolyRioli]

Just a thought but if Coniglio doesn’t resign with GWS and also doesn’t sign with us then do reckon GWS would still trade Lachie to us? I find it hard to believe that they would. Has any team ever parted with 2 x A graders in the one offseason?

Could probably argue Gold Coast last year with Lynch and May

 

[tommyk72]

Question
Giving up picks and players (Known quantity) for one player Anderson in the draft (who is still an unknown quantity having not played AFL)

How is that better than Giving up picks or players for player (known quantity)

I think you're looking for this thread TheFourPillars: https://www.bigfooty.com/forum/thre...d-of-the-draft.1207618/page-207#post-61744338

 

[Brishawk]

Question
Giving up picks and players (Known quantity) for one player Anderson in the draft (who is still an unknown quantity having not played AFL)

How is that better than Giving up picks or players for player (known quantity)

Younger player = greater hope. I don’t subscribe to that but that seems to be the general sentiment.

 

[kirbatron]

Younger player = greater hope. I don’t subscribe to that but that seems to be the general sentiment.

+ organic selection (you drafted them) + you have them for longer (potentially)

 

[HODGEYROAD]

Jesus this off season is going to be interesting, everybody strap in as I get the feeling we're going to be in for one hell of a ride.

 

[tommyk72]

Younger player = greater hope. I don’t subscribe to that but that seems to be the general sentiment.

When you're a hope-based FC (Carlton, Melbourne, St's, etc.) it's all you've got. As opposed to us who deal in reality and premierships!

 

[halfback dasher]

Jesus this off season is going to be interesting, everybody strap in as I get the feeling we're going to be in for one hell of a ride.

Again

 

[TylerDurden]

Again

What's your mail great man? Paging HBD to this thread!

 

[TazHawk15]

Jesus this off season is going to be interesting, everybody strap in as I get the feeling we're going to be in for one hell of a ride.

I am off to Europe in 12 days for a 7 week holiday, I think I will need every second of it if I am going to survive the stress of the up coming trade period.

 

[Bugs1977]

I am off to Europe in 12 days for a 7 week holiday, I think I will need every second of it if I am going to survive the stress of the up coming trade period.

If you happen to be near Mykonos can you tell Tom to hurry the * up already

 

[sven_inc]

Question
Giving up picks and players (Known quantity) for one player Anderson in the draft (who is still an unknown quantity having not played AFL)

How is that better than Giving up picks or players for player (known quantity)

I think bringing in known quantities gives us the capacity to shoot for a genuine superstar. Even if it fails Noah would still be a solid AFL player youd think. Would have a very high floor I suspect.

 

[cryptor]

When you look at that list of players taken with the number 1 pick it doesn’t exactly reassure you that chucking a bunch of eggs into that basket is the best move.

Sure, there’s plenty of great names there, but equally a lot of disappointments. And I don’t mean like “oh they didn’t become a Brownlow/Norm Smith Medalist” kind of disappointing, I mean “Maybe he should play in the reserves for a couple weeks” kind of disappointing.

But maybe those players aren’t disappointing because clubs judged them wrong. Maybe they’ve just been let down by a s**t club in terms of their development. After all by design the worst clubs are going to have the most frequent access to the number 1 pick.

So maybe paying up big time to get pick 1 and Anderson would be worth it for this Hawthorn environment. Perhaps with us he reaches his potential and is winning a Brownlow at 22.

Or do we just accept he’s currently out of reach but keep in semi-frequent contact with him via his management. Just keeping an ear to the ground over the next 2-5 years waiting for his development to stall and his happiness to decline just enough that he asks for a trade away from Gold Coast.

 

[TazHawk15]

If you happen to be near Mykonos can you tell Tom to hurry the fu** up already

Will be in the UK,Spain and Holland.

Unless I see Tom in Amsterdam trying some cookies, I doubt if I will run into him.

 

[MrPremiership]

When you look at that list of players taken with the number 1 pick it doesn’t exactly reassure you that chucking a bunch of eggs into that basket is the best move.

Sure, there’s plenty of great names there, but equally a lot of disappointments. And I don’t mean like “oh they didn’t become a Brownlow/Norm Smith Medalist” kind of disappointing, I mean “Maybe he should play in the reserves for a couple weeks” kind of disappointing.

But maybe those players aren’t disappointing because clubs judged them wrong. Maybe they’ve just been let down by a s**t club in terms of their development. After all by design the worst clubs are going to have the most frequent access to the number 1 pick.

So maybe paying up big time to get pick 1 and Anderson would be worth it for this Hawthorn environment. Perhaps with us he reaches his potential and is winning a Brownlow at 22.

Or do we just accept he’s currently out of reach but keep in semi-frequent contact with him via his management. Just keeping an ear to the ground over the next 2-5 years waiting for his development to stall and his happiness to decline just enough that he asks for a trade away from Gold Coast.

Development ability is underestimated.

Every year only about 100 kids get taken. They're all talented, but only a few really make it.

Its part talent, but part environment. Its why Hawthorn can turn pick 56 James Sicily into a potential all australian, or pick 36 Sam Mitchell into a brownlow medalist, and then how Melbourne can get pick 1 Jack Watts as a dud, pick 3 Jimmy Toumpas a dud....etc etc

 

[Steven Tyler]

Will be in the UK,Spain and Holland.

Unless I see Tom in Amsterdam trying some cookies, I doubt if I will run into him.

If you're on the cookies yourself you'll probably think you saw him



Along with Jesus


And Elvis


And Santa

On SM-A205YN using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[Bugs1977]

When you look at that list of players taken with the number 1 pick it doesn’t exactly reassure you that chucking a bunch of eggs into that basket is the best move.

Sure, there’s plenty of great names there, but equally a lot of disappointments. And I don’t mean like “oh they didn’t become a Brownlow/Norm Smith Medalist” kind of disappointing, I mean “Maybe he should play in the reserves for a couple weeks” kind of disappointing.

But maybe those players aren’t disappointing because clubs judged them wrong. Maybe they’ve just been let down by a s**t club in terms of their development. After all by design the worst clubs are going to have the most frequent access to the number 1 pick.

So maybe paying up big time to get pick 1 and Anderson would be worth it for this Hawthorn environment. Perhaps with us he reaches his potential and is winning a Brownlow at 22.

Or do we just accept he’s currently out of reach but keep in semi-frequent contact with him via his management. Just keeping an ear to the ground over the next 2-5 years waiting for his development to stall and his happiness to decline just enough that he asks for a trade away from Gold Coast.

I feel the last paragraph is the way well go. If he goes to the Suns you just gotta hope they don't stunt his progress.

 

[thejockey]

If that's what you want we could have played Rough. Or recruit Casboult.

Honestly, Patton may very well move as well as Roughed has the past two years. Defensively, sides will clearly try and exploit his lack of mobility. This was never a strong area for him.

If we are relying on Patton, with additions of Coniglio and others, to be a key forward I have reservations. Personally, I'll wait to see how he returns before thinking he can take a contested mark consistently.

If all we want is a half contest, Nash has been doing this. And before people jump on, yes I know we want more. Point is, history tells us, unfortunately, Patton might not have that 'more' anymore.

If we are in contention due to other recruitment, save the cash and ask Saints about Bruce. Although his price may have gone up, they will surely look to play King and if fit McCartin with Memebery next year.

Patton and Rough are completely different players . At Roughs best he still never was a contested mark or park crasher type , Casboult has struggled to play consistently for the worst side in the comp and is now playing down back ( well mind you ). His as bigger risk and possible could be more risk then Patton given his erratic career form.

From all reports and there are people on here that know better then me , we would get him cheap . Even with the weight stripped off he is a big frame who would attract defenders and create chances for us. I think if our forwardline was asked if they would want to take a punt on Patton I think they would tell Clarko and GW to pull the trigger and quickly.

We might have to agree to disagree on this one

 

[Bugs1977]

Patton and Rough are completely different players . At Roughs best he still never was a contested mark or park crasher type , Casboult has struggled to play consistently for the worst side in the comp and is now playing down back ( well mind you ). His as bigger risk and possible could be more risk then Patton given his erratic career form.

From all reports and there are people on here that know better then me , we would get him cheap . Even with the weight stripped off he is a big frame who would attract defenders and create chances for us. I think if our forwardline was asked if they would want to take a punt on Patton I think they would tell Clarko and GW to pull the trigger and quickly.

We might have to agree to disagree on this one

Bringing in Patton might also be done to appease Coniglio. I doubt it but they are good mates.

 

[TylerDurden]

Bringing in Patton might also be done to appease Coniglio. I doubt it but they are good mates.

They live together mate.

 

[Bugs1977]

They live together mate.

Would sharing a removalist count under the TPP

 

[cryptor]

Development ability is underestimated.

Every year only about 100 kids get taken. They're all talented, but only a few really make it.

Its part talent, but part environment. Its why Hawthorn can turn pick 56 James Sicily into a potential all australian, or pick 36 Sam Mitchell into a brownlow medalist, and then how Melbourne can get pick 1 Jack Watts as a dud, pick 3 Jimmy Toumpas a dud....etc etc

So true. Though I'd argue Sam Mitchell was so driven that he'd have succeeded no matter where he went. What Hawthorn did was be the one club willing to give him that chance he needed to show it. Sicily - definitely credit to Hawthorn there. At a lesser club I reckon he'd have peaked as a good but very inconsistent 3rd tall forward who'd barely get a game because he'd constantly be suspended or stuck in the seconds for not following team rules. The Hawks have helped him focus his aggression and found him a role down back that has made him one of our most important players and pretty much a lock for the AA team. He'd never have been tried down back at a crap club as they'd be too impressed by the fact he could kick goals to even think of it.

 

[cryptor]

They live together mate.

O'Meara dislikes this.

 

[Kinghts 24]

Development ability is underestimated.

Every year only about 100 kids get taken. They're all talented, but only a few really make it.

Its part talent, but part environment. Its why Hawthorn can turn pick 56 James Sicily into a potential all australian, or pick 36 Sam Mitchell into a brownlow medalist, and then how Melbourne can get pick 1 Jack Watts as a dud, pick 3 Jimmy Toumpas a dud....etc etc

yeah agree.

I think (coz i don't have the data to prove) that 17 year old kids, whether they are drafted ~pick 15 or pick 55, how much difference in ability can there really be? So many variables head of them.

On the flip side, i also think that the top bracket of the draft is far more scientific or certain than it was in the past, all else being equal.

Nailing a top 10 pick should be almost a certainty today, given the resources Clubs invest in the process.

After the first 10 to 15, i reckon you can throw a blanket over the rest and a Club's development program will be the difference.

 

[wizzard400]

Question
Giving up picks and players (Known quantity) for one player Anderson in the draft (who is still an unknown quantity having not played AFL)

How is that better than Giving up picks or players for player (known quantity)

Proven talent > speculative picks

It's not even an opinion, it's logic.

 

[wizzard400]

Development ability is underestimated.

Every year only about 100 kids get taken. They're all talented, but only a few really make it.

Its part talent, but part environment. Its why Hawthorn can turn pick 56 James Sicily into a potential all australian, or pick 36 Sam Mitchell into a brownlow medalist, and then how Melbourne can get pick 1 Jack Watts as a dud, pick 3 Jimmy Toumpas a dud....etc etc

It's not just that.

It's also part luck and quite frankly a lottery.

As good as Sicily and S. Mitchell are, they are outliers, not the norm.