Opinion Mick Malthouse

What is the next move on Mick?

  • Sack him immediately; replacement coach to see out the year.

    Votes: 192 48.9%

  • Let him coach out the year then show him the door.

    Votes: 70 17.8%

  • Sign him now to give coaches and players some direction.

    Votes: 81 20.6%

  • Not sure yet... still too angry to think clearly.

    Votes: 50 12.7%
  • Total voters
    393
  • Poll closed .

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I think the four weeks prior to last week's disaster showed there is absolutely nothing wrong with our list. Especially when you consider the injuries we had, there is plenty of depth there. It's just a matter of getting them to perform. Unless you think it was a fluke? Those four games?

I think we can all move on from this Ratts ruined the list boloney now can't we? It was two years ago. I'd venture to say our worst recruit we've had over the last 10 years on a pro-rata basis in terms of output for money paid is Daisy and we all know who got him.

Look at a bloke like Cachia, already delisted and Mick gets him back, plays him for a few games then drops him to the reserves for 18 months. That is poor list management. Or Mclean? Most would call him Ratts' greatest failure in terms of recruits but it seems Mick is going to sign him up again. Ellard, a bug bear of mine for years but no there he is playing for us week in week out.

Was Hendo a failure? Yarran? Garlett was great up until Betts left. Robbo still a real barometer for us to this day. How is Zac Tuohy going? Duigan was huge for us in a final. Laidler playing for the premiership favs. White I really don't rate but Mick is still playing him so you can't blame Ratts for that. Jamo developed under Ratten after not being given a go in his first year with Pagan. Bootsma a huge miss I agree but you can't get them all correct. That was a compromised draft anyway where pick 17 was effectively a mid 30 pick. Lucas has depression can't help that but he certainly had talent to burn. Watson was a bust I agree but plenty of sides miss with first round picks. Look at Hawthorn.

Time to let go of the past.
 
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Fair enough. So Hendo, Yazz et al no good? Four games prior to last week were a fluke? Daisy has been worth somewhere around 700k? At least you're honest.
 
There is no way you can honestly say that Daisy has been the worst recruit of the last 10 years.
Just read the list threads of the past 2 years and you will see quite a few other names that would hold that title.

Cachia Ellard McLean have all been retained because they have the traits that Malthouse wants, application. They put in and turn up (when not injured)

No disrepect to Nick but he only played one good game for us last year and that just happened to be a final.


...... Time to move on.
 
Are you serious re Daisy? Has played like a 200k player and he's on 700k. Pound for pound he's probably our worst recruit ever, not just the last 10 years. This isn't something you can move on from, he's still at our club. He has time to turn it around and I hope he does but as things stand we are a laughing stock re his recruitment. The only people that can't see this are some Carlton people.

Regardless, you haven't really addressed any of my points and that's fine, but you've done very little to convince me otherwise.
 
I've already said in this thread I'm happy with the direction Mick is taking the club now. I just think it's extremely hypocritical to blame Ratts for poor recruiting and then overlook the recruitment of a 27 yo player on 700k for 4 years that hadn't played for two years due to injury and is widely known to be our coach's pet, and that performed well below expectations this year. It was a massive punt that so far has not come off.
 
But that is just the point EE he has performed above our expectations this year.
Most supporters logically knew that Daisy would not be playing at his best this year as he was coming from a long way back from injury.
That he played nearly every game and was able to have an impact in about 50% of those early ones raised expectations a bit.
Most people did not even have him realistically starting until the later part of this year. Just prior to his injury the other week he had put in two performances that were reminisience of his better days.

His off field influence has been noted as well by our track watchers. Who have stated how he gets in and encourages our players.
He talks (which we have lacked) and provides leadership around the club.
These are some of those intangable things that Judd alluded to in his interview about why he is sticking around.
 
BluStreak said:
But that is just the point EE he has performed above our expectations this year.
Most supporters logically knew that Daisy would not be playing at his best this year as he was coming from a long way back from injury.
That he played nearly every game and was able to have an impact in about 50% of those early ones raised expectations a bit.
Most people did not even have him realistically starting until the later part of this year. Just prior to his injury the other week he had put in two performances that were reminisience of his better days.

His off field influence has been noted as well by our track watchers. Who have stated how he gets in and encourages our players.
He talks (which we have lacked) and provides leadership around the club.
These are some of those intangable things that Judd alluded to in his interview about why he is sticking around.
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so why the 625k a year then over 4. Are we the worst deal brokers ever? Donald trump would scoff at our poor bargaining skills, as we look like fools
 
AndrewVadermk2 said:
so why the 625k a year then over 4. Are we the worst deal brokers ever? Donald trump would scoff at our poor bargaining skills, as we look like fools
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i wish i could say to my boss, look boss this year im going to go home and get pissed everynight so i'll only be performing at 50 % but hey boss, what mate, i still want premium pay mate, yea sure mate, we are a big corp with a couple of high rollers as ceo, dont stress its chicken deed to them. Thanks mate,
 
AndrewVadermk2 said:
i wish i could say to my boss, look boss this year im going to go home and get pissed everynight so i'll only be performing at 50 % but hey boss, what mate, i still want premium pay mate, yea sure mate, we are a big corp with a couple of high rollers as ceo, dont stress its chicken deed to them. Thanks mate,
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Are you implying that Daisy's underperformance in his first year is due to him not giving 100%?

Should Kruezer not get a salary this year?
 

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slashin_velvet said:
Are you implying that Daisy's underperformance in his first year is due to him not giving 100%?

Should Kruezer not get a salary this year?
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also completely different scenario, kreuz was contracted and got injured , so thats just football, we deliberately went after a FA and paid way way way overs knowing what was going to be in first , second year back from injury. Do you get what i'm saying. Would you go and buy a car with dents and scratches dodgy gearbox but will get a service soon, for a brand new car of same type? no is that what you whispered, well that what carlton did.
 
AndrewVadermk2 said:
no not at all, i am saying his 4 year deal maybe should of been- 300k, 400k, 650k, 650k retire.
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Assuming it is $2.5 over 4 years, then Its likely to be more like 325, 725, 725, 725.

If he plays for us like he did in his premiership year at Collingwood - he will be an AA outside mid....which is a role we are screaming out for. Worth 725 without a shadow of doubt.
 
AndrewVadermk2 said:
also completely different scenario, kreuz was contracted and got injured , so thats just football, we deliberately went after a FA and paid way way way overs knowing what was going to be in first , second year back from injury. Do you get what i'm saying. Would you go and buy a car with dents and scratches dodgy gearbox but will get a service soon, for a brand new car of same type? no is that what you whispered, well that what carlton did.
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GWS just gave Patton a contract extension the week after doing his knee....sometimes you need to take a punt when you weigh up the expected performance over the life of the contract.

Of course i'd buy a car with a few dints and scratches and a potentially suspect gearbox (as long as I know ive got a mechanic who i'm confident can keep it running at optimal level).

Tell me who the "new" player we could have gotten for the same price as Daisy last year....who could deliver what he can over the next 3 years.
 
Stig O'Hara said:
He's got a fair way to catch McGuane and O'Reilly.
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Haha got me there! But they weren't on as much coin.

blue streak

Yep that is certainly the glass half full way to look at things and there's nothing wrong with that at all. Let's all pray that Daisy gets back to his best next year because if he does then he may very well match his price tag.
 
How do we even know the details of Daisy's contract? Do we know about any fine print relating to his ability to get on the park etc?
 
pepalenko said:
How do we even know the details of Daisy's contract? Do we know about any fine print relating to his ability to get on the park etc?
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This.

There's a lot being thrown out as 'fact' when it's likely far from it.

Ellas Ellas said:
I think the four weeks prior to last week's disaster showed there is absolutely nothing wrong with our list. Especially when you consider the injuries we had, there is plenty of depth there. It's just a matter of getting them to perform. Unless you think it was a fluke? Those four games?
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Absolutely nothing wrong with our list? Mate, you are officially the most optimistic poster on BF! Congrats! lol

Ellas Ellas said:
I think we can all move on from this Ratts ruined the list boloney now can't we? It was two years ago. I'd venture to say our worst recruit we've had over the last 10 years on a pro-rata basis in terms of output for money paid is Daisy and we all know who got him.
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1. The message from Carlton was 100% clear - they were not even expecting Thomas to play senior footy until the back half of 2014. He was clearly unfit and out of touch, but the fact he has played the majority of the season is pretty fantastic.
2. If you want someone via free agency, you pay over and above what they are worth. That's why he is on so much coin. The idea is that from 2015, the next three years will see the return on investment. Judging the transfer on this year alone is completely out of scope.

Ellas Ellas said:
Or Mclean? Most would call him Ratts' greatest failure in terms of recruits but it seems Mick is going to sign him up again. Ellard, a bug bear of mine for years but no there he is playing for us week in week out.
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Consistently being top 10 in the club's B&F is a failure? Sure, he missed a lot of game time, but if he has kept getting games, the club clearly wants him there for a reason. Just because us supporters who look in from the outside decide that he can't run 100m in 11 seconds and therefore is spudz, does not make it true.

Ellas Ellas said:
Was Hendo a failure? Yarran? Garlett was great up until Betts left. Robbo still a real barometer for us to this day. How is Zac Tuohy going? Duigan was huge for us in a final. Laidler playing for the premiership favs. White I really don't rate but Mick is still playing him so you can't blame Ratts for that. Jamo developed under Ratten after not being given a go in his first year with Pagan. Bootsma a huge miss I agree but you can't get them all correct. That was a compromised draft anyway where pick 17 was effectively a mid 30 pick. Lucas has depression can't help that but he certainly had talent to burn. Watson was a bust I agree but plenty of sides miss with first round picks. Look at Hawthorn.
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All of those examples there pretty much mitigate your earlier points by showing that nobody has a crystal ball.


Ellas Ellas said:
Time to let go of the past.
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Word.
 
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