Strategy Natural footballers. How many do we have and how many does a team need?

[Geoff]

Regarding the burst player from stoppages, could NOD be the answer here in 2 or 3 years??

Logue


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[Stinky Lomax]

Football is played between the ears for the most part, natural footballers is not what I’m after, but mentally strong footballers are preferable.
Dardy was a natural footballer but was weak between the ears.
Most natural footballers I see coming through development are not mentally strong as they’ve got by on ability, the players who have had to work at their game are ones who will push on & be the better player as they’ve had to work on their skills & application.
Get both, then your onto something. As you’ve mentioned Jye, he is both, particularly the mental strength to come back from his injury. He additionally worked hard at his game as a kid.

 

[Square Peg]

I disagree with your interpretation here. While I tend to agree with whoever above said that the game is moving slowly towards people who have above average athleticism there is still a range of 'natural footballers'.

There's natural footballers like Walters who seem to know where the goals are, know where to put the ball and have the skills to do it.

There's natural footballers like Serong or Brodie who can just pull the ball out of a pile of 5 blokes and ping out hands in a second.

And there's natural footballers like Brayshaw who have none of those gifts of mechanical skill but know when to work harder and when to push to get in the way or provide an option.

I contrast that to what frustrates me no end at the ammos level which is when you see a campaigner on the wing who runs up and down all day but never actually gets into a good spot to continually provide an option or effect the play because they simply have no feel for the game.

I agree there's guys who have all the physical gifts but no idea mentally and no real redeeming skill on top of it. Maybe a Hughes type, although I think that's a touch harsh on him.

Really what I think the title should be is 'natural goal kickers, how many do we have and how many does a team need?'

Well I think being able to kick goals is definitely one trait of a natural footballer but it's not a prerequisite. I already named Walters and Serong as amongst the few I think we have. But I also said Chapman, I agree with whoever said Young. Those two are not goalkickers but natural footballers IMO.

 

[TheMcManusNose]

Well I think being able to kick goals is definitely one trait of a natural footballer but it's not a prerequisite. I already named Walters and Serong as amongst the few I think we have. But I also said Chapman, I agree with whoever said Young. Those two are not goalkickers but natural footballers IMO.

Yeah I agree, I'm just quibbling around your definition. Ultimately I think the question for us isn't really natural footballers, it's more specific than that - natural goalkickers.

 

[Descent]

“Natural footballer” is a myth. There is nothing natural about kicking a ball around a field for 2 hours.

 

[drxce]

James Aish

Multiple players found. Use birthday to differentiate. eg [PLAYERCARD="23/11/1962"]Joe Smith[/PLAYERCARD]

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[ignoramus]

“Natural footballer” is a myth. There is nothing natural about kicking a ball around a field for 2 hours.

Hate the phrase. I appreciate that it speaks to the fact that some players seem more reliable at doing the right thing at the right time, and seemingly effortlessly so. But it’s not some inborn talent. It’s born out of practice and training, whether formal or informal. Which means there’s scope, however limited, for “not a footballers” to improve themselves.

No doubt, it’s far preferable to have players in the side who are already talented, but the way certain players are written off because “they’re athletes not footballers” bugs me no end.

 

[Purple Jesus]

Hate the phrase. I appreciate that it speaks to the fact that some players seem more reliable at doing the right thing at the right time, and seemingly effortlessly so. But it’s not some inborn talent. It’s born out of practice and training, whether formal or informal. Which means there’s scope, however limited, for “not a footballers” to improve themselves.

No doubt, it’s far preferable to have players in the side who are already talented, but the way certain players are written off because “they’re athletes not footballers” bugs me no end.

Trying to make it a binary thing shits me to tears.

 

[Cobbler]

It’s an interesting term.

Natural footballers you can find in D grade ammos. What you really seek are guys who can see plays unfold ahead of time. Then you also need certain physical attributes to play at AFL level.

Wayne Gretzky said he was one of the best because he skated to where the puck would end up, not where it’s been.

We need players that are simply better at reading the game.

Hayden Young

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is definitely one.

But we then have too many athletes that just happen to be ok at football.

 

[Square Peg]

Hate the phrase. I appreciate that it speaks to the fact that some players seem more reliable at doing the right thing at the right time, and seemingly effortlessly so. But it’s not some inborn talent. It’s born out of practice and training, whether formal or informal. Which means there’s scope, however limited, for “not a footballers” to improve themselves.

No doubt, it’s far preferable to have players in the side who are already talented, but the way certain players are written off because “they’re athletes not footballers” bugs me no end.

Well the truth bugs you then. Your idea that there's no inborn predisposition to talent, so genetics and early childhood are irrelevant, is just wrong.

 

[muckypup]

The brief bright cameo of Jye Amiss was nigh on the best thing about our finals campaign. I was struck by a description of him in the game thread - he's just a natural footballer.

For better or worse the AFL is the elite competition for our sport but is also a killing field for natural footballers, hundreds upon hundreds of more talented players discarded in favour of running machines doing pressure acts. And yet when one like Jye appears, we mostly all recognise a natural footballer when we see one and love the natural footballers more.

And more to the point, a team needs them. You can't have a team full of people who aren't natural footballers but have crucial attributes such as they can run all day {acres,schultz), are fast (frederick, walker), are strong (logue), are tall (lobb). There has to be a peak number of players that you look at and say, well he's just a natural footballer.

We lost a natural footballer to retirement yesterday, a guy who never would have made any team based on his running game or beep testing but who could do those things only natural footballers can do, make time stand still. How many more do we have left? Walters, Serong, Chapman has the potential, Amiss now, others? How many more, if any more, do we need?

Schultz is good! He kicks straight and has white line fever!

 

[muckypup]

The problems our club faces is twofold.

1. Our midfield is not big enough and lacks a dynamic bull. Serong is an honest operator who runs both ways, but he cannot burst through the front of stoppage, he is an extractor who releases runners laterally. Brayshaw is a winger, pretending to be a contested ball player, club needs to park him on the outside and let him blow up his opponents that way. Fyfe isn't going to be a burst through player anymore, he will crash and bash and hurt some bodies to create space, but he too can't exit the front door. Brodie doesn't have the leg speed to burst and so we win, funnel laterally and then try and play a game of keepy off.
2. Our forward line is utter garbage. We finished year 13th in points for, just piping Essendon in the Home and Away season. It lacks talent, first and foremost, but perhaps more evident and revealed last night in horrible clarity, was the ball movement employed by the brains trust at Freo Coaching HQ. The forward line is in the bottom third of the AFL, yet, we insist on building the ball up and allowing opposition defences to roll and set, forcing our non-competitive tall marking forwards to compete in crowds. Collingwood demonstrated that the worst your forwards are, the quicker the ball needs to arrive.

Someone, anyone with an ounce of foresight, needs to collar JLO and remind him that a style of football based on spreading, linking up with uncontested marking chains, became finals irrelevant when the AFL insisted on making the man on the mark, stand.

Speed on the ball will win flags, not the structured slow ball movement, "allowing us to set up behind the ball bullshit" just won't fly anymore.

It's not our forward line is garbage surely .. as you say it's method. Speed on the ball into F50 ..

 

[Righteo]

Yeah, you're not gonna convince me that Stephen Hill

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kicked a footy better than Matt De boer simply because he trained more. It might be overused but it's a valid term, some people are inherently better than others at certain things regardless of external factors or personal application. Life is unfair like that

 

[Purple Jesus]

Yeah, you're not gonna convince me that Stephen Hill kicked a footy better than Matt De boer simply because he trained more. It might be overused but it's a valid term, some people are inherently better than others at certain things regardless of external factors or personal application. Life is unfair like that

What I wouldn’t do to have a fit Hilly in our side right now.

 

[Ysaye]

It’s an interesting term.

Natural footballers you can find in D grade ammos. What you really seek are guys who can see plays unfold ahead of time. Then you also need certain physical attributes to play at AFL level.

Wayne Gretzky said he was one of the best because he skated to where the puck would end up, not where it’s been.

We need players that are simply better at reading the game.

Hayden Young is definitely one.

But we then have too many athletes that just happen to be ok at football.

Was Kepler Bradley a natural footballer?

And whilst we have a debate on about it in another thread, I remember watching a Melbourne game where Luke Jackson consistently got ahead of his opponent and took about 3 marks in five minutes of play each in front of the goals. Of course, he totally screwed up every one of those shots at goal, but his ability to get to where the ball ended up was impressive. Does that make him a natural footballer?

 

[Cobbler]

Was Kepler Bradley a natural footballer?

And whilst we have a debate on about it in another thread, I remember watching a Melbourne game where Luke Jackson consistently got ahead of his opponent and took about 3 marks in five minutes of play each in front of the goals. Of course, he totally screwed up every one of those shots at goal, but his ability to get to where the ball ended up was impressive. Does that make him a natural footballer?

For me it’s a combination of talking AFL level.

Some our naturally skilful. Liam Henry probably fits this description.

Some are natural athletes. Luke Jackson.

At AFL level you need skills, athletic qualities then composure or as I put it earlier the ability to read the play.

There’s a reason the Ben Sokol’s of this world didn’t make it.

At the moment it’s the athletic qualities or physical traits that are underpinning requirements.

Give me the Michael Barlow, Paul Hasleby and Will Brodies off this world over Dylan Shields all day every day.

 

[kingswood71]

If you played junior footy and then advanced from that to the AFL, chances are you are a natural footballer.....

 

[The Round House Drunk]

Other sports use the term ‘game smarts’ to refer to a player’s ability to read and interpret patterns of play, and make the right decisions during the game.

I occasionally hear this rendered as ‘footy smarts’ in an AFL context.

It implies a spectrum, rather than a binary (as is the case with ‘natural footballer’). There’s also a parallel with the growth v fixed mindset here, in the sense that game smarts can be learnt and developed whereas being a natural footballer is somehow inherent and unchangeable.

And yes, I think collectively we were lacking in footy smarts against Collingwood on Saturday. Young list - we’ll get smarter in coming years.

 

[FDH16]

Other sports use the term ‘game smarts’ to refer to a player’s ability to read and interpret patterns of play, and make the right decisions during the game.

I occasionally hear this rendered as ‘footy smarts’ in an AFL context.

It implies a spectrum, rather than a binary (as is the case with ‘natural footballer’). There’s also a parallel with the growth v fixed mindset here, in the sense that game smarts can be learnt and developed whereas being a natural footballer is somehow inherent and unchangeable.

And yes, I think collectively we were lacking in footy smarts against Collingwood on Saturday. Young list - we’ll get smarter in coming years.

We lack genuine centre square dominance. Despite having one of the games leading ruckman.

That's an issue.

 

[A New Hope]

Looking into Taylor 's crystal ball it will be a big strong brute with minimal "footy smarts" thats busting out of packs to give us centre square dominance.

 

[Mk LXIII]

Was Kepler Bradley a natural footballer?

And whilst we have a debate on about it in another thread, I remember watching a Melbourne game where Luke Jackson consistently got ahead of his opponent and took about 3 marks in five minutes of play each in front of the goals. Of course, he totally screwed up every one of those shots at goal, but his ability to get to where the ball ended up was impressive. Does that make him a natural footballer?

Kepler was a natural born entertainer , a court jester who happened to play footy.

 

[Boomer93]

Athletism and football skill go hand in hand.

You guys calling fyfe a natural footballer, if anything it's his insane athletic ability that made him as good as he is.

Guys like Brayshaw amd Switta have far from an elite kick, and kicking is the most important skill in football. They make up for that with great ball winning ability (football skill) and agility (athletism).

Iv always thought this discussion was silly. To call Amiss a natural footballer and not acknowledge that hes 196cm and lightning fast is strange.

 

[Square Peg]

So hypothetically you can sign only one of Stengle or Blicavs. Both were awesome in their own way. Which do you want?

 

[Lach72]

Stengle everyday, twice on Tuesday but ten times on the weekend

 

[Wilksyy]

The term “Athlete” seems to be a derogatory word here and that’s a bummer.

One of my fav. players, Paul Kelly, was a great athlete. Explosive in the contests and just a hard as nails competitor.

Another favourite is Greg Williams. Who’s natural ability is noticed because he’s a 5’7 chonker but his balance was second to none. He did have a supernatural ability to know where the ball is going which you can’t teach. But his kicking ability on both feet!