SexyBlueGirl
Premiership Player
Sorry, are you saying Jobs invented the mouse? Lol, you need to do some research on that.
RIP Steve Jobs
- Thread starter seanoff
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Sorry, are you saying Jobs invented the mouse? Lol, you need to do some research on that.
SexyBlueGirl
Premiership Player
Xerox do.
Yet another idea Jobs stole from them wasn't it? Also got the idea for a GUI based OS from Xerox.
And Gates in turn stole it from Jobs.
Apple bought that access though (Xerox), it cost them $1 million in the late 70's.Xerox do.
Yet another idea Jobs stole from them wasn't it? Also got the idea for a GUI based OS from Xerox.
ManWithNoName
TheBrownDog
Where did I say he invented them?
SexyBlueGirl
Premiership Player
Yeah, wasn't sure, that's why I asked you if you were saying that.
Still, I can't see what the point of your mouse statement was.
SexyBlueGirl
Premiership Player
Bargain of the century was Gates buying DOS for 50,000. Can anyone name me a bigger bargain than that in the last 50 years?
Further to this, the GUI was inevitable regardless of who came up with it first. It was also inevitable that they looked similar as there is a fairly basic underlying structure to it that is hard to design around.Xerox do.
Yet another idea Jobs stole from them wasn't it? Also got the idea for a GUI based OS from Xerox.
It is similar to when the iphone came out in Jan 2007. A mere month later Samsung released the F700. Both were strikingly similar in design. Given both were strictly guarded secrets the only other reason for their similarities (lets assume there was no leaking involved) is that the basic design was the best design and two companies coming in from two different directions managed to come up with very similar products.
So as I see it, Xerox were first over the line but failed miserably to promote it, Apple marketed it (as they always do) very well, and Microsoft mass produced it.......as to who came up with the actual design first.......well they were all going to come up with a GUI in one way shape or form!!!!
ManWithNoName
TheBrownDog
The comment was "Convincing the public they needed them", implying he introduced mostly useless things.Yeah, wasn't sure, that's why I asked you if you were saying that.
Still, I can't see what the point of your mouse statement was.
SexyBlueGirl
Premiership Player
The mouse is not useless, the iphone is not useless, the ipod is not useless, just not original inventions.
Take the ipad. Up until the time it was released, tablet computing was seen as pretty much dead. It was Jobs and that shiny box that convinced the public they needed to have one. Now it's a multi billion dollar product line. However, functionality wise, the ipad does far less than alternative systems.
Crhferrari
All Australian
The very most incredible thing Jobs has done is not inventing something, but to turn the "concept", the raw idea, the imperfect but innovated product into the product that can be manufactured and sells to the general public and makes money on it.
Anyway, Jobs now gone, only left people unemployed.
Anyway, Jobs now gone, only left people unemployed.
That was/is par t of the JObs genious, though in the end, there were complex and very raw and undeveloped ideas he saw, and for what ever reason he saw how it could work by simplifying the idea, getting everything down until it worked. Steve Wozniak even said , when some new computer component came out (this being in the 1970's, early 80's), Jobs thought was what does this mean for a consumer and how could we use it that was, faster chips, again to Jobs was, how does that relate to a consumer - more than just do something faster.
The guy who developed Mathmatica, said Jobs advice fairly heavily influenced the GUI of Mathmatica (and in the end suggested the name for the program. Most of what Jobs suggested was getting rid of anything too complex, and unneeded, until you have just enough to make it work, and have people understand it.
ManWithNoName
TheBrownDog
That was my point...
The man changed the world and the entire IT industry. There's no two ways about that.
There were quite a few of his era that have done that. Apple/Jobs is extremely good at Marketing and knowing when to strike at the right moment, that's all!!
Agree, though I am an Apple fan, I think Jobs sits somewhere in the middle of the Apple fanboy, and windows camps opinion of him. The Apple side he almost did everything singlehandedly is rather wrong. However, the claims that he just stole/used 2nd hand/second rate technology and only sold it because of good marketing too is well off the point, no doubt the guy was a showman though. I think though the reason Jobs got the reputation in the end he has was he changed things over different areas (though,, I admit still tied in. Music, Mobile phones, Computers, Animated films, did he build/write the software behind any of those, no, he was often a massive guide in how to get it all to work though.
SexyBlueGirl
Premiership Player
Yeah, exactly right. I lol when people say stuff like, "he changed the way we communicate", or "he changed the world" etc etc.
I do agree there SBG, I think thiug (as said above) Job's name to fame there is, he didn't do it once, he was the mind behind the first commercial GUI OS. The iPod, the iTunes Music store, the iPad, and the iPhone. Pixar (animaten film) none of them were the first to the be developed, but I think most of the time they were the first to be successfull, thaid is why I think Jobs sits where he does. Would have other competitors have came and taken the same place, probably. But I think it's too easy to say after ausccessfull product has been released and other largely copy the good ideas from it , I think that is an Apple point of difference .
Add above Apple and Xerox. I guess my point was, people mosty try to claim thas as Apple stole Xerox PRAC isn't correct when Apple paid for that right.
The problem with reductionism is that it almost invariably leads to stupid conclusions.
Claiming Jobs / Apple didn't have any original ideas is a half truth, probably similar to claiming Lennon and McCartney didn't have any extraordinary ideas because people were pioneering music at the same time they were.
The phrase, the whole is greater than the sum of its parts, rings true for many Apple products, and this drive came primarily from Jobs.
The genius isn't in "convincing the public they needed to have a product". The genius is in making a product that is top shelf. I've wanted a top notch tablet for work for 10 years, yet nobody went close to a decent solution. Then once the idea was being thrown to the scrapheap, Apple came out and smashed it.
Eventually, all technology is superseded and companies will degenerate and die. This will happen to Apple. But downplaying Jobs / Apple's vision, creativity and balls is *ed. You don't become the biggest company in the world selling nothing but hype.
Claiming Jobs / Apple didn't have any original ideas is a half truth, probably similar to claiming Lennon and McCartney didn't have any extraordinary ideas because people were pioneering music at the same time they were.
The phrase, the whole is greater than the sum of its parts, rings true for many Apple products, and this drive came primarily from Jobs.
The genius isn't in "convincing the public they needed to have a product". The genius is in making a product that is top shelf. I've wanted a top notch tablet for work for 10 years, yet nobody went close to a decent solution. Then once the idea was being thrown to the scrapheap, Apple came out and smashed it.
Eventually, all technology is superseded and companies will degenerate and die. This will happen to Apple. But downplaying Jobs / Apple's vision, creativity and balls is *ed. You don't become the biggest company in the world selling nothing but hype.
Apple did what most were doing at the time!
Apart from all of them being brilliant in their field, they explored new ground, created the wave and we all went along for the ride...!!!
There are many to thank for the current technology we are enjoying.....not just one.....!!!
I think thats pretty close to it FigJam. I still think the scary thing looking forward for Apple is, hw far they lapes for perfefection, and weather they releast too much 'almsot there software.
Reading of peoples opinion of Jobs now is, the guy was straight down the lin, he saw things in black and white and didn't comprimise, read a lot from him in the past week or so since his death, and he could be an arsehole, but he knew where he was going, IMO. As you said, I don't think you can become the biggest company in the world by selling hype alone, let alone being able to sell it over a single market. He by no means did it on his own, but he did connect the dots.
I agree, I just thing my point depends what side you take. Most see the Xerox point as Apple stole the GUI from Xeron, sure Jobs was wiser at the time then those in charge of Xerox, and someone would have stumbled apon it efore too long, I don't disagree with you there.
I think Jobs was just a mix of people - he was extremely quick to see positive and negative sides to new technology, and how to ge tit to work.
To cover what FIGJAM said above (I think) just because other were looking to to the same thing doesn'd mean to discredit Jobs/Apple, he didn't get to where he did byselling hype (weather you like apples ecosystem or not) he did it, hecause be was one of the crazy ones.
The same way Gates managed to get Windows to dominate the PC market for the better part of 30yrs with what can only be described as an average operating system at the time!!
It's all about the situation and circumstance, opportunity and chance!!
It took Apple and indeed Steve Jobs 35 years to get here,
Its time to see who starts painting the next canvas................??????
Walmart aren't even close to Apple by Market Cap (Mobil Exxon lead there) . My point was, as figjam said, Apple build a reputation but building well refined products.
Too easy to me to develop an idea once someone had lead the someone to copt the idea from there. I'm not actually trying to claim, depsite what it seems, Jobs was the only one who did it.
I do think it will be intetesting to see forward how Apple move over the next few years.
I think Windows beat Apple in the end, installbase shows that, to me at least, I think Jobs was in charge when Apple redefined most fields.
