Standardised premiership tally

[Mr Meow]

Maybe we get Dangerfield (pick 10) instead of Cotchin.

Maybe we pick Fyfe (pick 20) instead of Dusty.

Menzel, Taylor and Dawson Simpson with Geelong's pick instead of Richmond's for Martin, Cotchin and Rance (priority). If Menzel didn't break that's actually not too bad.

 

[South of the Yarra]

Flags won with right to challenge or no grand final played(1924) should earn the lowest points possible.

War Premierships and COVID Premierships should receive even lower.

 

[Unpredictable]

We would've missed out on James Kelly and Selwood if we had to bid for Ablett, Hawkins and Scarlett. Selwood the big one obviously.

But you didn't have to, so like the Collingwood supporter said "lucky FS's" is how that team was built.

If Richmond weren't poor and you take out top 10 picks, what side would they have had?

Which picks shouldn't we of got, the pick 2 we used to pick Cotchin, should we not of got that pick? The pick 3 we used to pick Dustin, which pick would you of given us that year? Vlastuin was pick 9, should we not of got that pick?

 

[Mr Meow]

But you didn't have to, so like the Collingwood supporter said "lucky FS's" is how that team was built.

Which picks shouldn't we of got, the pick 2 we used to pick Cotchin, should we not of got that pick? The pick 3 we used to pick Dustin, which pick would you of given us that year? Vlastuin was pick 9, should we not of got that pick?

Lucky via a genetic pool is different to being rewarded for consistent time as a big fat loser. Like I said, as much as I respect Kelly, the only notable change would be no Selwood. He was a kid for the first two flags.

Richmond built up from being terrible. Two Brownlow medalists and arguably the second best defender of the century was a nice haul. But it does put them well behind Geelong even when it was 3 flags apiece this century.

 

[Unpredictable]

War Premierships and COVID Premierships should receive even lower.

Those premierships you won because of the sore loser challenge are the worst.

The war premierships are legit.

Covid premiership 2020 was the hardest premiership that's ever been won in the history of the game. The fact is we were the only strong team in the league from '17 to '20, so we were winning it even if it wasn't a covid season.

Lucky via a genetic pool is different to being rewarded for consistent time as a big fat loser.

We got the picks we deserved for where we finished.

But it does put them well behind Geelong even when it was 3 flags apiece this century.

Who gives a sh*t, we won 3 flags.

It's you that needs your 3 to better than ours, because in our 3 (before the stand rule) we beat you guys.

Imagine there was no stand rule introduced to take pressure out of the game for the handbaggers?

 

[Mr Meow]

Those premierships you won because of the sore loser challenge are the worst.

The war premierships are legit.

Covid premiership 2020 was the hardest premiership that's ever been won in the history of the game. The fact is we were the only strong team in the league from '17 to '20, so we were winning it even if it wasn't a covid season.

We got the picks we deserved for where we finished.

Who gives a sh*t, we won 3 flags.

It's you that needs your 3 to better than ours, because in our 3 (before the stand rule) we beat you guys.

Imagine there was no stand rule introduced to take pressure out of the game for the handbaggers?

But in ranking terms, being awful most of the century to eventually land superstar draftees and then 3 flags, is objectively worse than doing it the hard way while constantly contending.

Geelong didn't even miss finals more than once between flags 3 and 4 despite how far apart they were. Richmond quickly became irrelevant after the dynasty.

Anyway nice to see you again, Falcon. It's been too long.

 

[Unpredictable]

But in ranking terms, being awful most of the century to eventually land superstar draftees and then 3 flags, is objectively worse than doing it the hard way while constantly contending.

I don't see it that way lol! Let me tell ya, Geelong is irrelevant when winning flags even. Teams will send you a pick 7 after being gifted a flag because a Geelong flag is forgotten very quickly when no one gives a sh*t.

Geelong didn't even miss finals more than once between flags 3 and 4 despite how far apart they were. Richmond quickly became irrelevant after the dynasty.

Pressure was our 1 wood, and when they took pressure out the game it helped teams (like Geelong) that didn't like pressure. I don't rate the less pressure era as much as I do the previous era, but that's just me. You would like less pressure, and that's you.

 

[South of the Yarra]

Those premierships you won because of the sore loser challenge are the worst.

The war premierships are legit.

Covid premiership 2020 was the hardest premiership that's ever been won in the history of the game. The fact is we were the only strong team in the league from '17 to '20, so we were winning it even if it wasn't a covid season.

We got the picks we deserved for where we finished.

Who gives a sh*t, we won 3 flags.

It's you that needs your 3 to better than ours, because in our 3 (before the stand rule) we beat you guys.

Imagine there was no stand rule introduced to take pressure out of the game for the handbaggers?

COVID Premierships are the most tainted in the history of AFL/VFL

 

[South of the Yarra]

Those premierships you won because of the sore loser challenge are the worst.

The war premierships are legit.

Covid premiership 2020 was the hardest premiership that's ever been won in the history of the game. The fact is we were the only strong team in the league from '17 to '20, so we were winning it even if it wasn't a covid season.

We got the picks we deserved for where we finished.

Who gives a sh*t, we won 3 flags.

It's you that needs your 3 to better than ours, because in our 3 (before the stand rule) we beat you guys.

Imagine there was no stand rule introduced to take pressure out of the game for the handbaggers?

I know it does not fit your narrative due to your lack of understanding of the finals at the time but the team finishing top was severely disadvantaged. Let us look at 1930 for example. Firstly 1st plays 3rd when they should have played 4th. Secondly Geelong who finished 4th got a weeks extra break on Collingwood who finished on top despite both teams winning their first game. Ridiculous and a severe disadvantage to top.

 

[Carringbush2010]

Probably better to do an average per year, so that takes into account how long a club has been in the comp.

I did this not long after this years GF to get a gauge.

I've included these 4 metrics, these are without much argument the true measures of success.

• Premierships
• *GF's
• Finals won
• Finals played

*Draws not included coz they haven't been earned.

All averaged out on how long each club has been in the competition since the first flag in 1897 and then added up the averages to a total - how much has been achieved per year over the course of each clubs time in the comp. So the first average is Adelaide wins 0.0625 flags a year and so on.

North is surprisingly high as well. WC unsurprisingly is right at the top.

* Note GWS is a very high performer even though they haven't won a flag.

Source AFL tables.

	Flags	GF	Finals Won	Finals played	Years in comp	Total averages
Ade	2	3	18	36	32
Averages	0.0625	0.0937	0.5625	1.125		1.8437
Bris	3	5	20	32	36
Averages	0.083	0.1381	0.555	0.888		1.6441
Collingwood	16	43	84	190	126
Averages	0.126	0.341	0.666	1.507		2.64
Carlton	16	29	67	142	126
Averages	0.126	0.23	0.531	1.126		2.013
Essendong	16	28	69	132	126
Averages	0.126	0.222	0.547	1.047		1.942
Fremantle	0	1	7	17	28
Averages	0	0.0357	0.25	0.607		0.8927
Geelong	10	19	59	132	126
Averages	0.0793	0.1507	0.4862	1.047		1.7632
GC	0	0	0	0	12
Averages	0	0	0	0		0
GWS	0	1	9	16	11
Averages	0	0.0909	0.8181	1.4545		2.3635
Hawthorn	13	19	53	86	98
Averages	0.1326	0.1938	0.5408	0.8775		1.7447
Melbourne	13	18	54	94	126
Averages	0.1326	0.1428	0.4285	0.746		1.4499
North Melbourne	4	9	35	75	98
Averages	0.0408	0.0918	0.3571	0.7635		2.0794
Port Adelaide	1	2	13	29	26
Averages	0.0384	0.0769	0.5	1.1153		1.6153
Ricmond	13	24	56	94	115
Averages	0.113	0.2086	0.4869	0.8173		1.6258
St Kilda	1	7	22	55	126
Averages	0.0079	0.0634	0.0555	0.4365		0.6824
Syd / Sth Melb	5	18	42	94	126
Averages	0.0396	0.1428	0.3333	0.746		1.2617
West Coast	4	7	26	55	36
Averages	0.1111	0.1944	0.7222	1.5277		2.5554
WB / Footscray	2	4	21	56	98
Averages	0.0204	0.0408	0.2142	0.5714		0.8468
Fitzroy	8	13	34	59	99
	0.0808	0.1313	0.3434	0.5959		1.1514

If I've got any of these wrong, please link.

 

[Unpredictable]

COVID Premierships are the most tainted in the history of AFL/VFL

That's your opinion not mine.

I believe the challenge ones are joke, and the ones won with less pressure in the game are sad.

 

[Unpredictable]

I know it does not fit your narrative due to your lack of understanding of the finals at the time but the team finishing top was severely disadvantaged. Let us look at 1930 for example. Firstly 1st plays 3rd when they should have played 4th. Secondly Geelong who finished 4th got a weeks extra break on Collingwood who finished on top despite both teams winning their first game. Ridiculous and a severe disadvantage to top.


View attachment 1828804

Are you listening to yourself lol!

You lost to them because they had a week off, but then you beat them on the sore loser challenge after neither of you had a week off, shouldn't they of still been fresher for the sore loser challenge?

 

[South of the Yarra]

Are you listening to yourself lol!

You lost to them because they had a week off, but then you beat them on the sore loser challenge after neither of you had a week off, shouldn't they of still been fresher for the sore loser challenge?

Come you can do better than that. Your insane Collingwood jealousy usually drives you to far better comments than ‘sore loser challenge’.
Everything about Collingwood hurts you
Keep it up please. We are consuming you.

 

[Fadge]

Probably better to do an average per year, so that takes into account how long a club has been in the comp.

I did this not long after this years GF to get a gauge.

I've included these 4 metrics, these are without much argument the true measures of success.

• Premierships
• *GF's
• Finals won
• Finals played

*Draws not included coz they haven't been earned.

All averaged out on how long each club has been in the competition since the first flag in 1897 and then added up the averages to a total - how much has been achieved per year over the course of each clubs time in the comp. So the first average is Adelaide wins 0.0625 flags a year and so on.

North is surprisingly high as well. WC unsurprisingly is right at the top.

* Note GWS is a very high performer even though they haven't won a flag.

Source AFL tables.

	Flags	GF	Finals Won	Finals played	Years in comp	Total averages
Ade	2	3	18	36	32
Averages	0.0625	0.0937	0.5625	1.125		1.8437
Bris	3	5	20	32	36
Averages	0.083	0.1381	0.555	0.888		1.6441
Collingwood	16	43	84	190	126
Averages	0.126	0.341	0.666	1.507		2.64
Carlton	16	29	67	142	126
Averages	0.126	0.23	0.531	1.126		2.013
Essendong	16	28	69	132	126
Averages	0.126	0.222	0.547	1.047		1.942
Fremantle	0	1	7	17	28
Averages	0	0.0357	0.25	0.607		0.8927
Geelong	10	19	59	132	126
Averages	0.0793	0.1507	0.4862	1.047		1.7632
GC	0	0	0	0	12
Averages	0	0	0	0		0
GWS	0	1	9	16	11
Averages	0	0.0909	0.8181	1.4545		2.3635
Hawthorn	13	19	53	86	98
Averages	0.1326	0.1938	0.5408	0.8775		1.7447
Melbourne	13	18	54	94	126
Averages	0.1326	0.1428	0.4285	0.746		1.4499
North Melbourne	4	9	35	75	98
Averages	0.0408	0.0918	0.3571	0.7635		2.0794
Port Adelaide	1	2	13	29	26
Averages	0.0384	0.0769	0.5	1.1153		1.6153
Ricmond	13	24	56	94	115
Averages	0.113	0.2086	0.4869	0.8173		1.6258
St Kilda	1	7	22	55	126
Averages	0.0079	0.0634	0.0555	0.4365		0.6824
Syd / Sth Melb	5	18	42	94	126
Averages	0.0396	0.1428	0.3333	0.746		1.2617
West Coast	4	7	26	55	36
Averages	0.1111	0.1944	0.7222	1.5277		2.5554
WB / Footscray	2	4	21	56	98
Averages	0.0204	0.0408	0.2142	0.5714		0.8468
Fitzroy	8	13	34	59	99
	0.0808	0.1313	0.3434	0.5959		1.1514

If I've got any of these wrong, please link.

Great analysis.

As to your comment 'Unsurprisingly, West Coast are right at the top', this is a fair comment even though they're second, because it's a given who the team with the best record in the history of the competition is.

 

[Fadge]

Pressure was our 1 wood, and when they took pressure out the game it helped teams (like Geelong) that didn't like pressure. I don't rate the less pressure era as much as I do the previous era, but that's just me. You would like less pressure, and that's you.

Are you suggesting there's less pressure in the game now than there was 5 years ago?

Wowee.

 

[Mr Meow]

I don't see it that way lol! Let me tell ya, Geelong is irrelevant when winning flags even. Teams will send you a pick 7 after being gifted a flag because a Geelong flag is forgotten very quickly when no one gives a sh*t.

Pressure was our 1 wood, and when they took pressure out the game it helped teams (like Geelong) that didn't like pressure. I don't rate the less pressure era as much as I do the previous era, but that's just me. You would like less pressure, and that's you.

The reasons Geelong won in 2022 where they couldn't in 2020 (or the previous few years):

Out: Ablett (old/cooked/injured), Taylor (old/cooked), Henderson (old/cooked), Dahlhaus (no good), Menegola (slow wingman), Simpson (not AFL standard)

in: Cameron (near league MVP forward), Smith (gun senior wingman), Stengle (AA small forward), Close (massive Dahlaus upgrade, quick), Holmes (breakout season, lightning winger), SDK (top 10 BnF, agile KPD), Atkins (tough defensive midfielder, allow Selwood/Dangerfield rotation), Z.Guthrie (a more mobile defender than Henderson - we went smaller but were quicker)

Career best seasons: Kolo, O'Connor, Blicavs (inside midfield new role), Guthrie (BnF), Miers (creative half forward linkman), Z.Guthrie

Veterans were all near their best from being managed and rotated properly, with better support from mid tier players.

Dangerfield/Selwood heavily managed until finals so entered them fresh.

Stacked forward line for first time in over a decade, and a much speedier set of players to allow rapid transition to isolated 1v1s. Deadly combination. No more mindless bombing down the line and losing the footy when it hits the desk before opponent delivers a rapid counter attack.

Good injury run, especially over the last 3 months where it was almost flawless.

 

[Unpredictable]

Come you can do better than that. Your insane Collingwood jealousy usually drives you to far better comments than ‘sore loser challenge’.
Everything about Collingwood hurts you
Keep it up please. We are consuming you.

I was happy for Collingwood. If you look at the Collingwood list it's nowhere near as good as Melbourne (even a drunk Steven May can see that), Brisbane & Carlton, so it really was a great underdog story that other teams can use to motivate themselves, if Collingwood can do it, they can do it.

If I hear tommorrow that Cripps is going to start laughing like an absolute idiot while leading his team down the race and onto the field of battle, then I'd say Carlton are the clear favourites for next season, wouldn't you?

Are you suggesting there's less pressure in the game now than there was 5 years ago?

That's a fact. A man moving laterally on the mark brought too much pressure, that's according to Steven Hocking. You think Hocking didn't know what he was talking about?

 

[Unpredictable]

The reasons Geelong won in 2022 where they couldn't in 2020 (or the previous few years):

Out: Ablett (old/cooked/injured), Taylor (old/cooked), Henderson (old/cooked), Dahlhaus (no good), Menegola (slow wingman), Simpson (not AFL standard)

in: Cameron (near league MVP forward), Smith (gun senior wingman), Stengle (AA small forward), Close (massive Dahlaus upgrade, quick), Holmes (breakout season, lightning winger), SDK (top 10 BnF, agile KPD), Atkins (tough defensive midfielder, allow Selwood/Dangerfield rotation), Z.Guthrie (a more mobile defender than Henderson - we went smaller but were quicker)

Career best seasons: Kolo, O'Connor, Blicavs (inside midfield new role), Guthrie (BnF), Miers (creative half forward linkman), Z.Guthrie

Veterans were all near their best from being managed and rotated properly, with better support from mid tier players.

Dangerfield/Selwood heavily managed until finals so entered them fresh.

Stacked forward line for first time in over a decade, and a much speedier set of players to allow rapid transition to isolated 1v1s. Deadly combination. No more mindless bombing down the line and losing the footy when it hits the desk before opponent delivers a rapid counter attack.

Good injury run, especially over the last 3 months where it was almost flawless.

I didn't read all that, but I bet you didn't mention the real reason, that Richmond was emasculated?

 

[Mr Meow]

I didn't read all that, but I bet you didn't mention the real reason, that Richmond was emasculated?

There's no point conversing if you have a pre recorded answer and are too upset to acknowledge reality.

Conspiracy nonsense.

Same old Falcon stuff.

 

[Unpredictable]

There's no point conversing if you have a pre recorded answer and are too upset to acknowledge reality.

Conspiracy nonsense.

Same old Falcon stuff.

Emasculated -
made weaker or less effective.

Pressure was our 1 wood, take pressure out of the game, Richmond less effective. Richmond v Geelong last season, no stand rule, and it's that same movie we all seen before. Let's not kid ourselves guys.

 

[Mr Meow]

Emasculated -
made weaker or less effective.

Pressure was our 1 wood, take pressure out of the game, Richmond less effective. Richmond v Geelong last season, no stand rule, and it's that same movie we all seen before. Let's not kid ourselves guys.

How many flags would Richmond have cleaned up without the stand rule? 5 ya reckon? Or even 6?

And why are the AFL trying to emasculate them? Is there something we don't know about, like alien overlords that are allergic to black and yellow?

 

[Unpredictable]

How many flags would Richmond have cleaned up without the stand rule? 5 ya reckon? Or even 6?

Now you're being stupid.

The fact is our system took a hit when Steven Hocking took some pressure out of the game, that made our system less effective, we couldn't raise the fight like we used to, but you know that.

 

[Mr Meow]

Now you're being stupid.

The fact is our system took a hit when Steven Hocking took some pressure out of the game, that made our system less effective, we couldn't raise the fight like we used to, but you know that.

So still 3 flags but Geelong wouldn't have had one?

Why would they let an ex Geelong man in like Hocking when they knew the Cats were desperate for a flag?

 

[South of the Yarra]

I was happy for Collingwood. If you look at the Collingwood list it's nowhere near as good as Melbourne (even a drunk Steven May can see that), Brisbane & Carlton, so it really was a great underdog story that other teams can use to motivate themselves, if Collingwood can do it, they can do it.

If I hear tommorrow that Cripps is going to start laughing like an absolute idiot while leading his team down the race and onto the field of battle, then I'd say Carlton are the clear favourites for next season, wouldn't you?

That's a fact. A man moving laterally on the mark brought too much pressure, that's according to Steven Hocking. You think Hocking didn't know what he was talking about?

Every little dig, every little comment just intensifies your Collingwood jealousy and hurt. It is beautiful. Carlton, oh please. I suggest Melbourne are rating their list a little high as we have beaten them 8 of the last 10 times we have played them. One of the Dees wins was with several key Pies out. Maybe May is not up to it, maybe Oliver causes to much trouble, maybe Petracca can't hit a target. Maybe and most probably they are just not good enough. Maybe except for a tainted COVID Cup they just choke. Keep under rating our list Pleaseeeeeeeeee. COLLINGWOOD PREMIERS 2023. Oh your pain.

 

[Unpredictable]

Oh your pain.

Maybe you need to believe that, but there is genuinely no pain here. Let me tell ya, I'm very happy we won our flags before the era of less pressure. Melbourne, Geelong & Collingwood won after the emasculation, and that's a fact.