WBD 2015 Pre-Season

[fronkalicious]

Same reason the drink plays Boyd in the ruck. He is clearly determined to develop versitile players that can cope with a number of positions if needed.

To the gamble - amen to that. We will see a whole new embellishment of the term "media attention" if, heaven forbid, Boyd's shoulder pops out playing ruck.

When was the last time a players shoulder popped out in a ruck contest??? The whole "it's far more dangerous playing in the ruck" thing is a myth.

 

[TempleKelvington]

Very interesting to read posts about Stringer spending time in mid field.
The whole of pre season Stringer and Crameri have both rotated through Mid field.
Beveridge wants it to happen, and it is going to happen. This was the case before Libba going down.
I don't think this is any secret to anybody watching pre season.

Exactly and indeed others will rotate through there too. Seems to me that Bev wants a lot of flexibility and all this was happening before LIbber went down.

 

[The Original Swooper]

When was the last time a players shoulder popped out in a ruck contest??? The whole "it's far more dangerous playing in the ruck" thing is a myth.

I think it's knee injuries that are more a concern. Not sure I subscribe to the cotton wool theory however.

 

[black pup]

I think it is about time a few posters on here let Beveridge coach the team, believe me he is no fool he has made these decision on what he has seen with the list.
Firstly I would seriously doubt the creditability of some of these post's, but surely Beveridge is entitled to the old Aussie FAIR GO.
One week into NAB games. RIDICULOUS.

 

[TempleKelvington]

I think it's knee injuries that are more a concern. Not sure I subscribe to the cotton wool theory however.

I think it's more can a player handle the physical requirements of rucking. It's a specialist role if done full time like Minson does. I'm not worried about injury so much, more wear and tear. Redpath and Boyd won't be spending loads of time there, just enough to give will a chop out.

That said, I'd rather a specialist do the chop out ruck work, but in order to do that they have to be able to be dangerous when forward.

 

[Easty]

When was the last time a players shoulder popped out in a ruck contest??? The whole "it's far more dangerous playing in the ruck" thing is a myth.

Didn't Minson punch a Port blokes shoulder out last year?

 

[Norm De Guerre]

I think it is about time a few posters on here let Beveridge coach the team, believe me he is no fool he has made these decision on what he has seen with the list.
Firstly I would seriously doubt the creditability of some of these post's, but surely Beveridge is entitled to the old Aussie FAIR GO.
One week into NAB games. RIDICULOUS.

I don't understand your point at all!

 

[Dazb86]

Is that Ayce Cordy? Think thats the first time I've seen him without his shoulders strapped.

 

[The Original Swooper]

I think it's more can a player handle the physical requirements of rucking. It's a specialist role if done full time like Minson does. I'm not worried about injury so much, more wear and tear. Redpath and Boyd won't be spending loads of time there, just enough to give will a chop out.

That said, I'd rather a specialist do the chop out ruck work, but in order to do that they have to be able to be dangerous when forward.

I've said it many times. Our ruck set up IS the biggest conundrum we have. Use Minno and get chop outs from Toyd, Red and/or Rough. That risks slowing the development of Ayce & TC, possibly making them seek greener pastures a priority (especially TC). Use the best of the 2 as 2nd ruck/forward is another. That would stymie Reds development, as I can't possibly see a forward line with a resting ruck, Toyd, Red, Stringer & Crameri working. With limits on rotations, teams simply cannot afford to have on of their 2 rucks permanently on the pine. The final option is to use Ayce and TC, (both who seem more likely to have some effect as forwards than big Will). When the Minno trade talk was flying around, and before Red surfaced as a legitimate forward option, I was thinking this year would see the last option transpire, and was ready for a make or break year to solve the ruck riddles.

Reality suggests we will see all of the above options in practice at some stage. I'm sure neither Red or Toyd will play all 22 games, and Minno may need a week or 2 off during the season. I just hope by the end of the season we have a clearer view of both short and long term ruck set up.

 

[TempletonTheRat]

Can someone please give an update on how Fletcher Roberts is going in his preperation

 

[immortalmike]

Stringer will be a midfielder that rests forward, he has all the insticts of an attacking, clearance getting, goal kicking, beast mid.
To not play him there would be a travesty. He even plays forward like a mid in that he's more likely to goal from a stoppage or general play than a lead and mark.

 

[JJHunter]

Why rob Peter to pay Paul, by pushing Stringer into the midfield? Surely we have other midfielders worth developing.

Stringer's development as a power forward was one of the few positives to come out of last year. The combination of Stringer and Boyd looked an exciting pairing. Jake still has pace over a short distance but seems to lack endurance/mobility over longer distances and looks a lot better suited to being a forward than a midfielder.

He may benefit from the improved fitness, but the risk is he may also drop strength and be less effective in his forward role.
I am worried that this move is motivated by the desire to make room for Redpath, rather than Jake's potential to play further up the ground.
If Jake's confidence as a forward falls away, it is a move that could backfire. Let's hope the gamble pays off.

One of frustrations is great fwds that continually want to push into the midfield - not talking specifically about Stringer - but just generally with types like Breust and Le cras. These guys are gun small to mid forwards yet they want to move into an area where they are just another number or also ran.
Say what you like about Milne but he and St Kilda realised this and he proved himself as one of the modern day great small forwards.

On the flip side - If interchange caps come into play in future years I do see a need for all sides to be more flexible and rotate more numbers through the middle to play string transition footy for longer. Wonder whether that is one of the reasons behind Beveridge developing such flexibility in the side.

Personally like you I really think we are robbing peter to pay paul moving stringer into the midfiled - but as I understand it he has been keen to voice that he was drafted as a mid and wants to play as a mid so he may well not be happy as a predominate forward.

 

[JJHunter]

When was the last time a players shoulder popped out in a ruck contest??? The whole "it's far more dangerous playing in the ruck" thing is a myth.

Hmm tend to disagree a little there

Campbell and Cordy both had shoulder ops in the last few years at dogs - both rucks
Then I would also look at Redden at Port His popped in one of the easiest ways ive ever seen.
That was two years ago and we havent seen him since given his battles.

I think rucks and backman have the most stress on their shoulders.
Backs cause they punch with an elevated arm sending the force into their shoulders.
Rucks are at lesser risk IMO given they rarely go at the ball with the force that would pop a shoulder.
They generally are looking to ease a ball down to someone and the force of that action isnt generally as hard to force a dislocation

 

[fronkalicious]

Stringer will be a midfielder that rests forward, he has all the insticts of an attacking, clearance getting, goal kicking, beast mid.
To not play him there would be a travesty. He even plays forward like a mid in that he's more likely to goal from a stoppage or general play than a lead and mark.

Definitely has the instincts. Just can't run. Kind of a significant problem for a mid

 

[immortalmike]

Definitely has the instincts. Just can't run. Kind of a significant problem for a mid

At this stage...

 

[Dav1d]

Stringer is a game winner, he makes veterans look like first years

Too bad we couldn't have two of the guy, one for the midfield & one for the forward line

 

[fronkalicious]

At this stage...

Of course. If he develops the tank in a couple of years, I'm all for it.

 

[immortalmike]

Of course. If he develops the tank in a couple of years, I'm all for it.

He will. Cooney was in far worse a state when we drafted him. Watched Peter Street lap him in his second preseason.

 

[Roscoe_au]

Am with Fronk on the Stringer issue. No point playing him in the midfield and then expecting him to kick goals when resting. He hasn't got the tank to do both.

He needs to be on the ground and in our forward line - even if he's dragging guys away from Boyd and Redpath.

Could kick 40-50 as a full time forward.

Crameri is the man to play through the middle. From memory he came to the dogs to get more midfield time...I'll go find his interview

 

[Roscoe_au]

We have some definite starters in the guts and some guys with the tank to rotate through.

Moyd, Wallis, Hrovat, Bonti, Macrae, Jong, Crameri, Hunter, Dahlhaus and Picken all have pretty good tanks. We might be missing some speed in there, but it's certainly not a b-grade midfield.

Could even throw in JJ and Grant.

 

[Roscoe_au]

Of course. If he develops the tank in a couple of years, I'm all for it.

He's been in the system a while and I thought that J Grant had him covered for endurance?

 

[Libba39]

We have some definite starters in the guts and some guys with the tank to rotate through.

Moyd, Wallis, Hrovat, Bonti, Macrae, Jong, Crameri, Hunter, Dahlhaus and Picken all have pretty good tanks. We might be missing some speed in there, but it's certainly not a b-grade midfield.

Could even throw in JJ and Grant.

While I firmly believe that Bonti will be a top 10 player in the coming years I strongly disagree with your assessment. The above list IS the definition of a B-grade midfield.

 

[dogwatch]

While I firmly believe that Bonti will be a top 10 player in the coming years I strongly disagree with your assessment. The above list IS the definition of a B-grade midfield.

I agree. There is one former AA (Moyd) who is still pretty good but probably not A grade. Macrae is getting close. Bonti has had about a dozen good games in one season so way too early to say he's there yet. Dahlhaus is a solid B at this stage. Wallis shows some promise but has seldom dominated a match. Ditto Hrovat (further behind Wallis). Crameri is a solid B or B+ but has not proven anything in midfield yet. Apart from Boyd and Crameri they are all very young. Very few of them have had a BoG game at AFL level. Matt Boyd for sure and maybe Dahlhaus and Macrae. An A-grade midfield should have lots of players who have shown BoG form at some stage.

Now compare that list of midfielders to the Brisbane list posted the other day (and Brisbane isn't even a top 8 side). Most of theirs are 22-25yo IIRC.

Prepare for some pain in the midfield this year.

 

[fronkalicious]

Even watching gws yesterday. Griff just balances them out so well. Griff, ward, Treloar, Shiel in the guts. Whitfield, Kelly, WHE provide the run and class..........then there's Scully.

 

[BRWB]

I agree. There is one former AA (Moyd) who is still pretty good but probably not A grade. Macrae is getting close. Bonti has had about a dozen good games in one season so way too early to say he's there yet. Dahlhaus is a solid B at this stage. Wallis shows some promise but has seldom dominated a match. Ditto Hrovat (further behind Wallis). Crameri is a solid B or B+ but has not proven anything in midfield yet. Apart from Boyd and Crameri they are all very young. Very few of them have had a BoG game at AFL level. Matt Boyd for sure and maybe Dahlhaus and Macrae. An A-grade midfield should have lots of players who have shown BoG form at some stage.

Now compare that list of midfielders to the Brisbane list posted the other day (and Brisbane isn't even a top 8 side). Most of theirs are 22-25yo IIRC.

Prepare for some pain in the midfield this year.

This is spot on. Nearly every team has at least one A Grader or more. Brisbane now has at least two A Graders (Beams and Rockliff), GWS has also picked one up. We've lost our two A graders in Griffen and Libba. On exposed form (and when they've been a able to get a game in a bottom four side), its being generous to call our midfield B Grade (especially if you call Redden, Zorko, Christianson, Rich, etc B Graders). GWS and Brisbane should go past us this year, leaving Carlton, Melbourne and the Saints with us.

While I think and hope Wallis can kick on this year he still hadn't cemented his place last year and never took over a game. Wallis is also limited in pace and disposal.

Bonti could be anything but isn't yet.

I don't see the excitement on Hrovat who hadn't cemented his place, and when not injured (which is not often) looks undersized and average in pace and disposal.

Crameri has been tried in the midfield last year and didn't get enough of it and displayed ordinary vision and disposal at times.

Moyd has been flagged as backman pre Libba, but realistically is on his last legs with his speed being dodgy, and we know his disposal issues.

Dahl struggled in the midfield last year and has ordinary disposal.

Jong's disposal remains poor.

Macrae is nearly A Grade but is going to have the living s**t belted out of him this year with taggers and run with players - a massive ask for a young player.

Our midfield is in for a very, very tough year. If Stringer can play a few minutes there without compromising his forward work then he should because his class and explosiveness could be the difference in some matches.